All the evidence you will ever need to trash the false pre-trib rapture

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AtonedFor

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john832

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Jason0047

Jason0047

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AtonedFor said:
WOW ... another one who can't seem to understand simple English!
Just how does SOME get understood to mean EVERYONE?
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I cannot read your thoughts when you post. I don't know what your mind was thinking was when you wrote that; But I do know what the English language plainly says. I know that the quote above in no way says that the group you mentioned are currently saved. For you said there salvation is past tense. Meaning some have been born again at one time but now they are living a life of habitual sin. I sinceriley hope that is not what you mean in regards to all Pre-Trib Rapture believers.
 
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kennethcadwell

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#64
#64
The thing that some people need to get over is rather you believe a pre-trib, mid-trip, or even a post-trib. It is not a salvation issue, for your salvation is not based on your belief in the rapture but your belief in the Lord.
If you believe with all your heart, soul, and mind in the Lord and think the rapture is post trib, but it happens pre-trip you will still be pulled up with the rest for your faith was still in the Lord.
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

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kennethcadwell said:
The thing that some people need to get over is rather you believe a pre-trib, mid-trip, or even a post-trib. It is not a salvation issue, for your salvation is not based on your belief in the rapture but your belief in the Lord.
If you believe with all your heart, soul, and mind in the Lord and think the rapture is post trib, but it happens pre-trip you will still be pulled up with the rest for your faith was still in the Lord.
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No, God's not going to reward a person's unbelief. There will be many believers left behind because they were not actually looking for Him at any hour or any day for His return. They were not watchful.

Would you be upset if you were left behind?

Well, nobody shouldn't be. Everyone who is left behind will only have themselves to blame.
 
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kennethcadwell

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#66
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Jason0047 said:
No, God's not going to reward a person's unbelief. There will be many believers left behind because they were not actually looking for Him at any hour or any day for His return. They were not watchful.
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That does not mean that you are literally suppose to look all around trying to see Him come down in the clouds, this means that you believe in Him and be ready by living the way God is willing you to live.

God shows know personally favoritism.........................

If you believe in Him you will be raptured, no matter when you believe that rapture will happen. Because the belief in rapture is not the factor to be raptured. It is your belief and faith in the Lord.

If you believe He will leave some believers behind, and only take part of the believers then you are saying God shows favoritism. Which the scriptures clearly state in three places in the NT that He doesn't.
The scripture that says two will be in the field one will be taken and the other left, is speaking that the one taken is the one who believes in Him, and the one left is the one who doesn't believe in Him.
Not about one believe the rapture to happen then, but the other didn't. As long as you believe in Him when it happens you will be called.......
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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kennethcadwell said:
That does not mean that you are literally suppose to look all around trying to see Him come down in the clouds, this means that you believe in Him and be ready by living the way God is willing you to live.

God shows know personally favoritism.........................

If you believe in Him you will be raptured, no matter when you believe that rapture will happen. Because the belief in rapture is not the factor to be raptured. It is your belief and faith in the Lord.

If you believe He will leave some believers behind, and only take part of the believers then you are saying God shows favoritism. Which the scriptures clearly state in three places in the NT that He doesn't.
The scripture that says two will be in the field one will be taken and the other left, is speaking that the one taken is the one who believes in Him, and the one left is the one who doesn't believe in Him.
Not about one believe the rapture to happen then, but the other didn't. As long as you believe in Him when it happens you will be called.......
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Paul said it best....

The dead in Christ will rise...(THE DEAD) being indicative of ALL the dead in Christ
We which are alive and remain...being indicative of all which believe and are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord

Another thought....

Jesus states clearly that if he did not step in when he does there would be NO FLESH LEFT ALIVE...but for the sake of the ELECT and there being SOME THAT REMAIN UNTO the BODY PRSENCE of Christ...he will step in so as to preserve SOME FLESH LEFT ALIVE!.......logically answer WHY he would say that and jive with a world rolling along just fine and POOF the believers just disappear en masse......!
 
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john832

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dcontroversal said:
Paul said it best....

The dead in Christ will rise...(THE DEAD) being indicative of ALL the dead in Christ
We which are alive and remain...being indicative of all which believe and are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord

Another thought....

Jesus states clearly that if he did not step in when he does there would be NO FLESH LEFT ALIVE...but for the sake of the ELECT and there being SOME THAT REMAIN UNTO the BODY PRSENCE of Christ...he will step in so as to preserve SOME FLESH LEFT ALIVE!.......logically answer WHY he would say that and jive with a world rolling along just fine and POOF the believers just disappear en masse......!
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When do the dead in Christ rise FIRST?

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

At His coming.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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john832 said:
When do the dead in Christ rise FIRST?

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

At His coming.
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No doubt and then we which are alive and remain will be caught up TOGETHER with those who have been resurrected....and yes most definitely at his PAROUSIA (COMING).......

Was, IS and IS TO COME!
 
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kennethcadwell

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#70
#70
john832 said:
When do the dead in Christ rise FIRST?

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

At His coming.
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dcontroversal said:
No doubt and then we which are alive and remain will be caught up TOGETHER with those who have been resurrected....and yes most definitely at his PAROUSIA (COMING).......

Was, IS and IS TO COME!
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I believe the rapture happens at the 7th trumpet of Revelation, right before God's bowl judgments are poured out on the earth. Because the Word of God says we will not endure God's wrath, and God's wrath according to Revelation is poured out in the bowls ( vials ) after the 7th trumpet.
This and 1 Cor. says this;

1 Corinthians 15:52
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
 
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Anonimous

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#71
#71
dcontroversal said:
No doubt and then we which are alive and remain will be caught up TOGETHER with those who have been resurrected....and yes most definitely at his PAROUSIA (COMING).......

Was, IS and IS TO COME!
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AND REMAIN...( or survive)
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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kennethcadwell said:
I believe the rapture happens at the 7th trumpet of Revelation, right before God's bowl judgments are poured out on the earth. Because the Word of God says we will not endure God's wrath, and God's wrath according to Revelation is poured out in the bowls ( vials ) after the 7th trumpet.
This and 1 Cor. says this;

1 Corinthians 15:52
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
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I agree and have been teaching that since I changed my mind from imminent to post tribulation/pre-wrath resurrection/change in 1992
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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Anonimous said:
AND REMAIN...( or survive)
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I agree for sure.....NO flesh left alive unless Jesus steps in early...which he does so there will be a few left alive and remain.....post tribulation/pre-wrath resurrection/change
 
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kennethcadwell

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#74
#74
dcontroversal said:
I agree and have been teaching that since I changed my mind from imminent to post tribulation/pre-wrath resurrection/change in 1992
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Same here, I believed in a pre-trib rapture tell 2005.
That is when I started studying the word for myself, instead of listening to the main stream group of bible teachers out there. And saw how scriptures point to a post tribulation rapture........
 
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biscuit

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#75
#75
LOL!! I have never, ever seen so many crybabies so intimidated by the pre-trib doctrine. Some of you guys just simply have too much time on your hand.
 
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AtonedFor

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#76
#76
kennethcadwell said:
Same here, I believed in a pre-trib rapture tell 2005.
That is when I started studying the word for myself,
instead of listening to the main stream group of bible teachers out there.
And saw how scriptures point to a post tribulation rapture........
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Yes, and after 100 million hours of research, Jason became convinced that pre-trib was true!

I'd say a lot of studying doesn't make much difference.
The Lord must reveal spiritual Truth to the BAC in order for him/her to have spiritual Truth.

Basically, all spiritual Truth must be revealed spiritually.
Because man is an absolute and total spiritual idiot.
BACs are not quite as much so!

E.G. Muslims read the NT and think they understand some things! lol
 
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kennethcadwell

Guest
#77
#77
AtonedFor said:
Yes, and after 100 million hours of research, Jason became convinced that pre-trib was true!

I'd say a lot of studying doesn't make much difference.
The Lord must reveal spiritual Truth to the BAC in order for him/her to have spiritual Truth.

Basically, all spiritual Truth must be revealed spiritually.
Because man is an absolute and total spiritual idiot.
BACs are not quite as much so!

E.G. Muslims read the NT and think they understand some things! lol
Click to expand...

I see where you are going with this, because that would be their debate back that their studying showed differently....
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

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Jul 22, 2014
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#78
kennethcadwell said:
That does not mean that you are literally suppose to look all around trying to see Him come down in the clouds, this means that you believe in Him and be ready by living the way God is willing you to live.

God shows know personally favoritism.........................

If you believe in Him you will be raptured, no matter when you believe that rapture will happen. Because the belief in rapture is not the factor to be raptured. It is your belief and faith in the Lord.

If you believe He will leave some believers behind, and only take part of the believers then you are saying God shows favoritism. Which the scriptures clearly state in three places in the NT that He doesn't.
The scripture that says two will be in the field one will be taken and the other left, is speaking that the one taken is the one who believes in Him, and the one left is the one who doesn't believe in Him.
Not about one believe the rapture to happen then, but the other didn't. As long as you believe in Him when it happens you will be called.......
Click to expand...
Actually, God Word says that person who says the Lord is delaying his coming is compared to being like an evil servant. In other words, when the Pre-Trib Rapture takes place; And it will. Many who did not believe in Christ taking his body of believers home at any moment will repent of their unbelief because they have been left behind.
 
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kennethcadwell

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#79
Jason0047 said:
Actually, God Word says that person who says the Lord is delaying his coming is compared to being like an evil servant.
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This still does not say that not all believers will be pulled up at the rapture, even if they don't believe it will happen then.
Go back and reread the context of this chapter. It is talking about those who use His delay as an excuse to keep walking in unrepented sinful ways. They are pretty much saying I have time, I can continue not to obey the Lord's teachings and walk by His will, but continue to do what I want to do......
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

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Jul 22, 2014
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#80
AtonedFor said:
Yes, and after 100 million hours of research, Jason became convinced that pre-trib was true!

I'd say a lot of studying doesn't make much difference.
The Lord must reveal spiritual Truth to the BAC in order for him/her to have spiritual Truth.

Basically, all spiritual Truth must be revealed spiritually.
Because man is an absolute and total spiritual idiot.
BACs are not quite as much so!

E.G. Muslims read the NT and think they understand some things! lol
Click to expand...
First, stop referring to Christians as BAC's. It is impersonal and disrespectful. I do not call myself a BAC and nobody else does, either. It is not an accepted term amongst the body of Christ. Second, I can say the same for you. After many hours of your own research, you are unwilling to see what the Scriptures say plainly in regards to the Lord's return. Jesus said you will not know the day or the hour of His coming. A church was told to repent or they were going to go thru the tribulation. How else is a church going to miss out on the Tribulation? Are they going to be killed? Taken to an underground safe house hiding in the shadows? Third, I would encourage you to talk to the Lord about this topic again. Ask Him one more time (Jeremiah 33:3).

For I used to be Pre-Wrath for a short time. But you know what convinced me to come back to the Pre-Trib Rapture view?

Scripture; And lots of it.
 
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