All things James

[Tinkerbell725]

Romans 4:5 KJV - spoken to Christians/faith alone

But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

James 2:24 KJV - spoken to Jews/faith and works

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

James 5:3 KJV - spoken to Jews during the tribulation (last days)

Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days.


Revelation 7:4‭, ‬14 KJV - Jews came out of the tribulation

And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Revelation 14:12 KJV - faith and works/Jews/Tribulation

Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

 

[Guojing]

Romans 4:5 KJV - spoken to Christians/faith alone

But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

James 2:24 KJV - spoken to Jews/faith and works

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

James 5:3 KJV - spoken to Jews during the tribulation (last days)

Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days.


Revelation 7:4‭, ‬14 KJV - Jews came out of the tribulation

And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Revelation 14:12 KJV - faith and works/Jews/Tribulation

Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Well said, notice James 2:24 is very similar to Rev 14:12, so you could also say that James was urging the Jews during the Tribulation to not just have the faith of Jesus, they need to reject the mark of the beast (which is a work) in order to be justified.

 

[Blik]

John146 already stated that, once Jews believed, they are no longer Jews but in the Body of Christ. In God's eyes, Jews are those who do not believe.

So in the church, there is only 1 gospel, which is the one the ascended Christ given to Paul.

John 14:6 tells us that our salvation comes from Christ, because God gave His Son to be bear our sins. It does not mentions Paul, it does not say God was thinking of race distinctions when He gave salvation. It is speaking of salvation that was a fact from the time of the fall of man. There was never any salvation without blood.

God is God who rules the world with spiritual truths. In the spiritual dimension there is no time as there is in our physical world, time is eternal time. Spiritual truths are eternal truths, they never change.

 

[Guojing]

John 14:6 tells us that our salvation comes from Christ, because God gave His Son to be bear our sins. It does not mentions Paul, it does not say God was thinking of race distinctions when He gave salvation. It is speaking of salvation that was a fact from the time of the fall of man. There was never any salvation without blood.

God is God who rules the world with spiritual truths. In the spiritual dimension there is no time as there is in our physical world, time is eternal time. Spiritual truths are eternal truths, they never change.

I am talking about the forum participant John146

 

[Blik]

I am talking about the forum participant John146

Oops, sorry.

John146, with his understanding of dividing the word of God so it doesn't speak to humans, as I believe it does, but picks out different groups and is different for each group is something I feel certain is wrong. It would make God not a universal God at all, there would be no universal eternal spiritual truth.

I feel certain that God sees us through spiritual eyes only, and we are divided by those who believe in God as their savior and Father and those who don't.

 

[Guojing]

Oops, sorry.

John146, with his understanding of dividing the word of God so it doesn't speak to humans, as I believe it does, but picks out different groups and is different for each group is something I feel certain is wrong. It would make God not a universal God at all, there would be no universal eternal spiritual truth.

I feel certain that God sees us through spiritual eyes only, and we are divided by those who believe in God as their savior and Father and those who don't.

Jesus said he was only sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel, and commanded the 12 disciples not to go to the Gentiles with the gospel that he had given them to preach (Matthew 10:5)

If Jesus himself gave those instructions to separate people into Jews and Gentiles, I can't see how in the world can you be "certain is wrong".

As Paul reminded us in Ephesians 2:11-12, there WAS a time where we gentiles were excluded from anything concerning God.

 

[John146]

amazing you admit that a jew becoming born again would need to avoid the non pauline books.

This is a false accusation, never said that. If a Jew gets saved, he’s no longer a Jew but part of the body of Christ where there is no Jew or Gentile.

 

[John146]

James writes to unsaved Jews (according to you) James gives them a boggus gospel(according to you)

James is writing to the entire nation of Israel, thus the address “to the twelve tribes.” He’s writing them with instruction on how to live during the tribulation. James is not preaching a gospel message. You see, the tribulation (Jacob’s trouble) was at hand in that day and 70th week of Daniel could have been fulfilled if Israel would have accepted their Messiah. They did not, so everything was postponed and the truth of the gospel would be taken to the Gentiles.

 

[John146]

Oops, sorry.

John146, with his understanding of dividing the word of God so it doesn't speak to humans, as I believe it does, but picks out different groups and is different for each group is something I feel certain is wrong. It would make God not a universal God at all, there would be no universal eternal spiritual truth.

I feel certain that God sees us through spiritual eyes only, and we are divided by those who believe in God as their savior and Father and those who don't.

I agree now that we’re in the Church age, one gospel message for all, Jew and Gentile.

 

[bud62]

The book of James contains doctrinal truths for the Jews living in the last days of the tribulation as they will be scattered and will face all kinds of trouble.

1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

The term twelve tribes is used all throughout Scripture, and is always a reference to the nation of Israel as a whole and never to a called out group from that nation. Genesis 49:28, Exodus 24:4, 28:21, Ezekiel 47:13. And the NT is no different: Matt 19:28, Luke 22:30, Acts 26:7, Revelation 21:12. There is no justification for taking this as anything other than an address to the twelve tribes of Israel. In order to make James a Christian epistle would mean to contradict every other usage of this term in Scripture. It is certainly not a reference to the diaspora.

In the last day it will be spiritual Jews , not the flesh Jews , The Jews as a nation was cut off , when they stone Steven , JESUS preached 3&haft years & was crucified , &3&half years later they stone Steven , & JESUS was cut off in the middel of the week .Now it is who so ever will let him come . They come just like we do now . GOD BLESS AS HE SEES FIT

 

[John146]

In the last day it will be spiritual Jews , not the flesh Jews , The Jews as a nation was cut off , when they stone Steven , JESUS preached 3&haft years & was crucified , &3&half years later they stone Steven , & JESUS was cut off in the middel of the week .Now it is who so ever will let him come . They come just like we do now . GOD BLESS AS HE SEES FIT

The saved Jews will be caught up by Christ with the rest of the Church. They won’t be around for the time of Jacob’s trouble. Yes, they come as we do now.

 

[garee]

John146 said:
No Jew or Gentile in the body of Christ. To suggest James is writing to Christians would be contradicing Paul’s writings to the Church.

You did not get the information you stated from Scripture. If you were only going by Scripture, you would never come away with that twelve tribes refers to Christians. When reading every other usage, you would determine that twelve tribes describes the whole nation of Israel, not Jewish Christians. Let the Scripture be honest.

Tribes are used to represent gates as a description of the one bride of Christ .It represents all the born again saints on the other side of the reformation. Apostles as sent ones part of the same description represents all the born again saints on this side of the reformation.

Let God be true and every man a liar.The truth sets free

And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. Revelation21: 9-14

Why 12 apostles a remnant of the 27 listed?

 

[John146]

Does anyone take the following verse literally applied to the body of Christ? If so, how?

James 5
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith SHALL save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

 

[Tinkerbell725]

How about this verse? This sounds like works. Jesus must be preaching to the Jews and healing the sick because the Jews need proof to believe.


Matthew 7:21 KJV

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

 

[presidente]

The book of James contains doctrinal truths for the Jews living in the last days of the tribulation as they will be scattered and will face all kinds of trouble.

1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

The term twelve tribes is used all throughout Scripture, and is always a reference to the nation of Israel as a whole and never to a called out group from that nation. Genesis 49:28, Exodus 24:4, 28:21, Ezekiel 47:13. And the NT is no different: Matt 19:28, Luke 22:30, Acts 26:7, Revelation 21:12. There is no justification for taking this as anything other than an address to the twelve tribes of Israel. In order to make James a Christian epistle would mean to contradict every other usage of this term in Scripture. It is certainly not a reference to the diaspora.

In chapter 2, he says do not have the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ with respect of persons, so it is a 'Christian epistle' even if there were very few or no Gentile Christians at that time. James could be a very early epistle.

 

[John146]

In chapter 2, he says do not have the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ with respect of persons, so it is a 'Christian epistle' even if there were very few or no Gentile Christians at that time. James could be a very early epistle.

In the tribulation, one has to live by faith and keep the commandments of God. James is warning them not to have this faith with respect of persons. In the tribulation, they must rely on each other and have all things in common to endure to the end.

Here’s how a tribulation saint must live:

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

 

[John146]

Romans 4:5 KJV - spoken to Christians/faith alone

But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

James 2:24 KJV - spoken to Jews/faith and works

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

James 5:3 KJV - spoken to Jews during the tribulation (last days)

Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days.


Revelation 7:4‭, ‬14 KJV - Jews came out of the tribulation

And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Revelation 14:12 KJV - faith and works/Jews/Tribulation

Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Right on! Where did you learn to rightly divide the word? Just curious.

 

[Absolutely]

John146 already stated that, once Jews believed, they are no longer Jews but in the Body of Christ. In God's eyes, Jews are those who do not believe.

So in the church, there is only 1 gospel, which is the one the ascended Christ given to Paul.

Peter was given the the revelation b4 paul.

There are no "2 gospels" in the nt

 

[Absolutely]

The same Holy Spirit wrote the entire bible.

He did not give 2 gospels to 2 groups.

You guys claim the Holy Spirit inspired peter and others to proclaim a different gospel.

But to think peter and co. Preached another gospel to the jews,and then they get saved INSPITE OF the Holy Spirits false leading????

AND THEN WHAT?? Are they then somehow enlightened to stay away from peters false gospel??????

 

[Absolutely]

Right on! Where did you learn to rightly divide the word? Just curious.

So did paul keep the commandments?