Are Former Christians Who Later Became Murderers and Anti-Christians Still Saved?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#41
#41
ResidentAlien said:
Eternal security is Gnostic. Eternal security people will deny this rabidly but this only demonstrates their ignorance of church history, the scriptures and Gnosticism itself. Early church heresy hunters wrote about the heretical teachings of the Gnostics on eternal security.

The doctrine isn't found in God's word. Modern doctrines on eternal security are distortions of the truth and are based on Gnosticism.
Click to expand...
Shoot, I did it again. :eek::eek::eek:
 
F

FreeGrace2

Banned
#42
Jan 31, 2021
8,658
1,064
113
#42
Evmur said:
The words "in vain" means they received the knowledge of the truth but were not saved by it ... lot of folks like that
Click to expand...
Did you find that in a Greek lexicon? It means "without reason".
 
F

FreeGrace2

Banned
#43
Jan 31, 2021
8,658
1,064
113
#43
ResidentAlien said:
Eternal security is Gnostic. Eternal security people will deny this rabidly but this only demonstrates their ignorance of church history, the scriptures and Gnosticism itself. Early church heresy hunters wrote about the heretical teachings of the Gnostics on eternal security.

The doctrine isn't found in God's word.
Click to expand...
It is found in the Bible. It's just that your biased eyes are closed tightly so that no light can enter.

Jesus taught that recipients of eternal life shall never perish. Why does this seem like gnosticism to you?

Do you know WHEN a person receives eternal life? John 5:24 says that believers possess it. That would obviously mean that the MOMENT of saving faith is WHEN a person receives eternal life. iow, WHEN they become a believer.

But you are free to reject that truth and make up whatever you want to believe.

Modern doctrines on eternal security are distortions of the truth and are based on Gnosticism.
Click to expand...
Go tell Jesus that. I dare you.
 
ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
#44
Apr 21, 2021
8,432
3,684
113
#44
FreeGrace2 said:
Why does this seem like gnosticism to you?

Do you know WHEN a person receives eternal life? John 5:24 says that believers possess it. That would obviously mean that the MOMENT of saving faith is WHEN a person receives eternal life. iow, WHEN they become a believer.
Click to expand...
Whether you realize it or not you just made the case for Gnosticism.

It doesn't seem like Gnosticism to me, it is Gnosticism; you just don't know enough about Gnosticism or the early writings to know it.

The information is out there and easy to find if a person really wants it. I just post this to give people a heads-up, not cite sources. I know how that goes: People ask for sources then trash them when you do. I'm not here to convince anyone; if a person loves the truth they'll find it.
 
A

arthurfleminger

Well-known member
#45
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
780
113
#45
ResidentAlien said:
Eternal security is Gnostic. Eternal security people will deny this rabidly but this only demonstrates their ignorance of church history, the scriptures and Gnosticism itself. Early church heresy hunters wrote about the heretical teachings of the Gnostics on eternal security.

The doctrine isn't found in God's word. Modern doctrines on eternal security are distortions of the truth and are based on Gnosticism.
Click to expand...
The doctrine of OSAS was invented by Calvin, not biblical, just a man made tradition.
 
Blade

Blade

Well-known member
#46
Nov 19, 2019
1,801
631
113
#46
"So, the question is, are these examples of peoples who once were true Christians and turned anti-Christ and murderers still saved because they once believed in Jesus?"

All of this no one can answer. Its just going to be speculation since as Samuel (sweet holy Spirit) said God does not see as man does. Man only sees the flesh but God sees the heart "For the LORD does not see as man sees; for man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart.”

So I won't be much fun here. We should not be the ones answering it other then saying John 3:16-17. Look how we have treated and what we have said about those that fall or walked away then those groups that teach something that does not touch salvation just some doctrine we personally don't like.

So back to the start.. For the LORD does not see as man sees; for man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#48
Jul 3, 2015
61,147
30,295
113
#48
kaylagrl said:
Rofl. I think I'm going to be one of those old ladies that bite people in
the old age home. I'm not yet 50 and I'm already cranky too often.
Click to expand...
Try evening primrose oil and cut back of sugar and caffeine ;):D

This too shall pass :geek:
 
F

FreeGrace2

Banned
#49
Jan 31, 2021
8,658
1,064
113
#49
ResidentAlien said:
Whether you realize it or not you just made the case for Gnosticism.
Click to expand...
Keep your day job. You'll never make it as a comedian.

It doesn't seem like Gnosticism to me, it is Gnosticism; you just don't know enough about Gnosticism or the early writings to know it.
Click to expand...
Are you acknowledging that you really don't understand what Jesus taught in John 10:28??

The information is out there and easy to find if a person really wants it.
Click to expand...
Sure is. Eternal life is given WHEN a person believes in Christ. John 5:24 Recipients of eternal life shall never perish. John 10:28

I just post this to give people a heads-up, not cite sources.
Click to expand...
Having NO sources sinks your boat. There is NO reason to believe your opinion.

I know how that goes: People ask for sources then trash them when you do.
Click to expand...
OK, fair enough. You're either ashamed of your sources or you're afraid of being refuted by legitimate sources, like the Lord Jesus Christ Himself.

I'm not here to convince anyone; if a person loves the truth they'll find it.
Click to expand...
I'm GIVING them the truth, to refute your opinion.
 
F

FreeGrace2

Banned
#50
Jan 31, 2021
8,658
1,064
113
#50
arthurfleminger said:
The doctrine of OSAS was invented by Calvin, not biblical, just a man made tradition.
Click to expand...
Go ahead and just try to pile on Jesus. His words are clear enough for grade schoolers understand.

Eternal life is given WHEN a person believes in Christ. John 5:24 Recipients of eternal life shall never perish. John 10:28

Go ahead and try to refute these truths.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#53
Jul 3, 2015
61,147
30,295
113
#53
ResidentAlien said:
Eternal security is Gnostic. Eternal security people will deny this rabidly but this only demonstrates their ignorance of church history, the scriptures and Gnosticism itself. Early church heresy hunters wrote about the heretical teachings of the Gnostics on eternal security.

The doctrine isn't found in God's word. Modern doctrines on eternal security are distortions of the truth and are based on Gnosticism.
Click to expand...

John 17:2-3~ You granted Him authority over all people, so that He may give eternal life to all those You
have given Him. Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, Whom You have sent. :)
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#54
Jul 3, 2015
61,147
30,295
113
#54

1 John 5:11-13 + John 6:47
:)
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#55
#55
Magenta said:
Try evening primrose oil and cut back of sugar and caffeine ;):D

This too shall pass :geek:
Click to expand...
Lol thank you for that advice. I never have caffeine, I began having heart palpitations and stopped drinking or eating it years ago. Not much for sugar either. But I will check out that primrose. Sorry for derailing the thread with old lady problems. :censored:
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#56
Jul 3, 2015
61,147
30,295
113
#56
kaylagrl said:
Lol thank you for that advice. I never have caffeine, I began having heart palpitations and stopped drinking or eating it years ago. Not much for sugar either. But I will check out that primrose. Sorry for derailing the thread with old lady problems. :censored:
Click to expand...
Wait'll you hit sixty! :LOL: ;):giggle:
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#57
Jul 3, 2015
61,147
30,295
113
#57
kaylagrl said:
Lol thank you for that advice. I never have caffeine, I began having heart palpitations and stopped drinking or eating it years ago. Not much for sugar either. But I will check out that primrose. Sorry for derailing the thread with old lady problems. :censored:
Click to expand...
Another suggestion: have your GP check for osteoporosis :) I'd lost over 2 inches before
getting on osteo meds :oops: You can check for yourself by keeping an eye on your height ;)
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#58
#58
Magenta said:
Another suggestion: have your GP check for osteoporosis :) I'd lost over 2 inches before
getting on osteo meds :oops: You can check for yourself by keeping an eye on your height ;)
Click to expand...

Oh no, I'm not that tall to begin with! I will check that out too, thank you for the info. Getting older is not fun, but it's better than the alternative I suppose. lol
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#60
Jul 3, 2015
61,147
30,295
113
#60
kaylagrl said:
Well, there is a lot of cancer in my family, so I will be happy to make it there. But I will still be cranky. lol
Click to expand...
Every day is a gift :D

Never say never ;)

Except when saying, "Never say never." :giggle:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.