Baptism Question

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Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#1
How should a church leader treat baptism? This is not about water but the act itself. As in the responsibility behind being the one to baptize.

For example, my nephew wanted to be baptized. But my pastor who I typically agree with has me trying to figure out the Biblical way of baptism.

My pastor told my nephew to memorize 5 scriptures and to learn what sacrificial love means.

Not a bad thing in itself but is this Biblical for baptism? I do not see where there this is needed but I also see the importance of conviction and the owning of one's faith.

He believes in Christ but has never been baptized. He was asked to memorize the scriptures 2 months ago with no effort towards it.

Another question. If this is justified of the pastor the ask my nephew before being baptized. Should I as his spiritual leader push him to memorize 5 scriptures? Part of me says no because he has to own his own faith and it must be real to him. If I force him then does that make it of his will?

But I also read to take our kids to church even if they do not want to go because the Holy Spirit will if you will plant seeds within their minds that will not only affect future thought but will make them in better understanding and acceptable to put faith in Christ as they mature.

So maybe lighting a fire under his rear to get in motion may just be the motivation needed to uncover conviction as he grows closer to God even if it is under guided leadership.

Thank you for your input.
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
6,789
1,258
113
#2
How should a church leader treat baptism? This is not about water but the act itself. As in the responsibility behind being the one to baptize.

For example, my nephew wanted to be baptized. But my pastor who I typically agree with has me trying to figure out the Biblical way of baptism.

My pastor told my nephew to memorize 5 scriptures and to learn what sacrificial love means.

Not a bad thing in itself but is this Biblical for baptism? I do not see where there this is needed but I also see the importance of conviction and the owning of one's faith.

He believes in Christ but has never been baptized. He was asked to memorize the scriptures 2 months ago with no effort towards it.

Another question. If this is justified of the pastor the ask my nephew before being baptized. Should I as his spiritual leader push him to memorize 5 scriptures? Part of me says no because he has to own his own faith and it must be real to him. If I force him then does that make it of his will?

But I also read to take our kids to church even if they do not want to go because the Holy Spirit will if you will plant seeds within their minds that will not only affect future thought but will make them in better understanding and acceptable to put faith in Christ as they mature.

So maybe lighting a fire under his rear to get in motion may just be the motivation needed to uncover conviction as he grows closer to God even if it is under guided leadership.

Thank you for your input.
It would be good to first ask him why he wants to be water baptized. Let him give his frank answer.
 

Runningman

Well-known member
Mar 4, 2020
1,003
879
113
#3
How should a church leader treat baptism? This is not about water but the act itself. As in the responsibility behind being the one to baptize.

For example, my nephew wanted to be baptized. But my pastor who I typically agree with has me trying to figure out the Biblical way of baptism.

My pastor told my nephew to memorize 5 scriptures and to learn what sacrificial love means.

Not a bad thing in itself but is this Biblical for baptism? I do not see where there this is needed but I also see the importance of conviction and the owning of one's faith.

He believes in Christ but has never been baptized. He was asked to memorize the scriptures 2 months ago with no effort towards it.

Another question. If this is justified of the pastor the ask my nephew before being baptized. Should I as his spiritual leader push him to memorize 5 scriptures? Part of me says no because he has to own his own faith and it must be real to him. If I force him then does that make it of his will?

But I also read to take our kids to church even if they do not want to go because the Holy Spirit will if you will plant seeds within their minds that will not only affect future thought but will make them in better understanding and acceptable to put faith in Christ as they mature.

So maybe lighting a fire under his rear to get in motion may just be the motivation needed to uncover conviction as he grows closer to God even if it is under guided leadership.

Thank you for your input.
Matthew 28:19-20
19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Memory verses could fall under the scope of teaching all nations and "teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you." But it is much more than just putting information into long-term memory. This is about discipleship, where someone is actually observing the teachings of Christ in behavior and sincere belief in addition to baptism.

So I would say I am in agreement with you. While verses about sacrificial love are a great part of discipleship they aren't prerequisites to baptism. Maybe that isn't what he was trying to say though. I wouldn't prevent him from memorizing the verses.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
10,036
3,651
113
#4
Maybe instead of just memorizing five verses actually doing them by asking your nephew to give up or give away five things he loves to others.

It could be his favourite t-shirt or toy, or a flower, or his share of food...(I dont know how old your nephew is...) a video game...?

The thing with baptism is in scripture its 'repent and be baptized'. That is the keyword 'repent'.

He needs to understand what repentence means.

when I did it, I remember saying to God I will give up my pride. Yep that was hard to give up but Im so glad I did.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#5
It would be good to first ask him why he wants to be water baptized. Let him give his frank answer.
It came after a talk where I explained what baptism meant symbolically and he shared with me that he has never been baptized but wanted to be. Even after me explaining that he must be responsible for his faith and this step must be a true inward need for the believer. He still wants to be baptized.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#6
Matthew 28:19-20
19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Memory verses could fall under the scope of teaching all nations and "teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you." But it is much more than just putting information into long-term memory. This is about discipleship, where someone is actually observing the teachings of Christ in behavior and sincere belief in addition to baptism.

So I would say I am in agreement with you. While verses about sacrificial love are a great part of discipleship they aren't prerequisites to baptism. Maybe that isn't what he was trying to say though. I wouldn't prevent him from memorizing the verses.
If we teach and feel as if someone's conviction isn't true or acting in mere charismatic ideals as if they are doing it in search of some grand experience, then should the leader withhold baptism until they understand or mature?

For example, I was baptized as a young child. I barely remember it and I suppose I said I believed in Jesus probably because it was what my parents taught me or wanted me to believe. I never owned it though for a long time. Me and the Spirit wrestled for decades until I gave in, in my mid-twenties. I had the Holy Spirit guiding me for all those years I wrestled with God but the baptism was done while I was an infant in theology and it took years to finally submit to God.

So maybe baptism doesn't need too much teaching beforehand.

Discipleship is extremely important. He will be getting that.

It wasn't really about preventing him but more of was it necessary for baptism. I believe my pastor wants to test his sincerity.

I'm trying to wrestle my thoughts and see is this justified in scripture to have this in place before baptism. My wife was baptized a year ago and she didn't have to remember 5 scriptures. So why my nephew in less he feels he isn't sincere which may or may not be true.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#7
Maybe instead of just memorizing five verses actually doing them by asking your nephew to give up or give away five things he loves to others.

It could be his favourite t-shirt or toy, or a flower, or his share of food...(I dont know how old your nephew is...) a video game...?

The thing with baptism is in scripture its 'repent and be baptized'. That is the keyword 'repent'.

He needs to understand what repentence means.

when I did it, I remember saying to God I will give up my pride. Yep that was hard to give up but Im so glad I did.
This sounds like a good training to do. Thanks. It would be good to set the environment so commitment would be easier. Less distractions if we choose to let go of certain things.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
13,575
6,215
113
#8
My pastor told my nephew to memorize 5 scriptures and to learn what sacrificial love means.
This is definitely UNBIBLICAL. So now you will have to teach your pastor from Scripture how Christian baptism was (and should be) conducted. Also, it is not a biblical requirement that only a pastor should baptize. Ananias who baptized Paul was not a church leader so far as we can see. In fact you could baptize if you so decided.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
35,008
12,581
113
#9
While I do not see the harm in asking someone to memorize a few Scriptures, it is not a requirement for baptism. Does your nephew understand the Gospel? And agree with God's assessment of his condition as a human being before Him? Most agree that full immersion is the way to go :) Baptized in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, as per Jesus' instructions in Matthew. 28:19.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#10
While I do not see the harm in asking someone to memorize a few Scriptures, it is not a requirement for baptism. Does your nephew understand the Gospel? And agree with God's assessment of his condition as a human being before Him? Most agree that full immersion is the way to go :) Baptized in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, as per Jesus' instructions in Matthew. 28:19.
He does understand.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
27,176
4,382
113
#11
He believes in Christ but has never been baptized. He was asked to memorize the scriptures 2 months ago with no effort towards it.
If this is your Pastor you are speaking of, then your Congregation is being pastored by the wrong person IMO. This Pastor has disobeyed Jesus directly, and should NOT pastor any Congregation, again IMO.

Memorizing Scriptures is IN NO WAY required for a person to be baptized. Be it by water OR by the Holy Spirit.

But I also read to take our kids to church even if they do not want to go because the Holy Spirit will if you will plant seeds within their minds that will not only affect future thought but will make them in better understanding and acceptable to put faith in Christ as they mature.
Yes. You should take your children to Church/teach them about Jesus and God at home if you do not have a home church. "raise them up in the way....." says Scripture...... Children do not always know what they NEED verses what they want......as to which is best for them. New Christians.......who are as children....are the same way. God gives us what we NEED..............to grow spiritually in Him. Now, sometimes, He gives us what we desire as well, but only if that thing does not lessen our love of Him.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
14,878
2,451
113
#12
I suggest that you follow the example established in scripture. Phillip and the eunuch in Acts 8:36-39. Testimony of salvation folowed by immersion in water.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

pottersclay

Senior Member
Aug 13, 2015
4,408
1,040
113
#13
Roughsoul why don't you baptise him?
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#14
If this is your Pastor you are speaking of, then your Congregation is being pastored by the wrong person IMO. This Pastor has disobeyed Jesus directly, and should NOT pastor any Congregation, again IMO.

Memorizing Scriptures is IN NO WAY required for a person to be baptized. Be it by water OR by the Holy Spirit.



Yes. You should take your children to Church/teach them about Jesus and God at home if you do not have a home church. "raise them up in the way....." says Scripture...... Children do not always know what they NEED verses what they want......as to which is best for them. New Christians.......who are as children....are the same way. God gives us what we NEED..............to grow spiritually in Him. Now, sometimes, He gives us what we desire as well, but only if that thing does not lessen our love of Him.
He is normally solid on scripture, very studied. I feel this was because of a personal feeling against my nephew due to stories about his behavior issues. I feel he may be thinking my nephew isn't sincere.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
5,960
2,783
113
#15
I suggest that you follow the example established in scripture. Phillip and the eunuch in Acts 8:36-39. Testimony of salvation folowed by immersion in water.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
I'll ask him his testimony and go from there.
 

pottersclay

Senior Member
Aug 13, 2015
4,408
1,040
113
#17
I have never entertained the thought. I'll think on that.
Is that not part of the commission you were left with according to jesus?
Is that not what authority he has given to those that believe and walk in his way?
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
10,036
3,651
113
#18
yea nothíng stopping you from baptising him if you know hes repented and believes.
 
Nov 15, 2020
1,897
352
83
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
#20
How should a church leader treat baptism? This is not about water but the act itself. As in the responsibility behind being the one to baptize.

For example, my nephew wanted to be baptized. But my pastor who I typically agree with has me trying to figure out the Biblical way of baptism.

My pastor told my nephew to memorize 5 scriptures and to learn what sacrificial love means.

Not a bad thing in itself but is this Biblical for baptism? I do not see where there this is needed but I also see the importance of conviction and the owning of one's faith.

He believes in Christ but has never been baptized. He was asked to memorize the scriptures 2 months ago with no effort towards it.

Another question. If this is justified of the pastor the ask my nephew before being baptized. Should I as his spiritual leader push him to memorize 5 scriptures? Part of me says no because he has to own his own faith and it must be real to him. If I force him then does that make it of his will?

But I also read to take our kids to church even if they do not want to go because the Holy Spirit will if you will plant seeds within their minds that will not only affect future thought but will make them in better understanding and acceptable to put faith in Christ as they mature.

So maybe lighting a fire under his rear to get in motion may just be the motivation needed to uncover conviction as he grows closer to God even if it is under guided leadership.

Thank you for your input.
what age is your nephew ?
I haven't heard anything about memorising 5 scriptures for baptism.