Biblical Eternal Security vs 'Calvinistic Eternal Security' -by Gregg Jackson
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What does this mean? And please define what "grace" means.
Where do you find "works" in Eph 2:8? Nowhere. And words "this is not of yourselves" shows that works aren't involved. And v.9 says "NOT of works". Very clear.
Since you seem to be promoting the notion that salvation involves works, show me a verse.
Where do you find "works" in Eph 2:8? Nowhere. And words "this is not of yourselves" shows that works aren't involved. And v.9 says "NOT of works". Very clear.
Since you seem to be promoting the notion that salvation involves works, show me a verse.
FreeGrace2 said:
So, can you use the Bible to refute my explanation of the verses I have provided?
Apparently you are failing to understand the words "this is not from yourselves" and in v.9 "NOT of works" then.
Please explain what you think "grace" means then.
This is typically employed when a poster has no answer and knows it.
So explain the word "grace". It's all through the Bible.
Exactly. But it seems you have no understanding of the meaning of "grace".
So, can you use the Bible to refute my explanation of the verses I have provided?
Apparently you are failing to understand the words "this is not from yourselves" and in v.9 "NOT of works" then.
Please explain what you think "grace" means then.
This is typically employed when a poster has no answer and knows it.
So explain the word "grace". It's all through the Bible.
Exactly. But it seems you have no understanding of the meaning of "grace".
Where do you get that idea from?
No, you haven't.
You make no sense.
However, I proved that both salvation and regeneration occur THROUGH FAITH, from Eph 2:5 and 8.
Faith precedes both salvation and regeneration.
You have not provided any verse that shows regeneration causes, leads to, or precedes faith.
If you are satisfied with a view that has no biblical support, whatever.
No, you haven't.
You make no sense.
However, I proved that both salvation and regeneration occur THROUGH FAITH, from Eph 2:5 and 8.
Faith precedes both salvation and regeneration.
You have not provided any verse that shows regeneration causes, leads to, or precedes faith.
If you are satisfied with a view that has no biblical support, whatever.
FreeGrace2 said:
Can you provide any verse that says election is to salvation? No, there aren't any.
Nope. The purpose of this election is clearly stated in the purpose clause of "that we should be". And it's subjunctive mood, meaning it's something believers (us) OUGHT/SHOULD do.
Huh? We ARE elected. TO service.
I said:
"No again. To be "holy and blameless" speaks of service to the King. In fact, Paul clarified in Eph 5 the issue of being holy and blameless."
Then why did Paul tell us that we were chosen to be holy and blameless in 1:4 and that God wants to present the church holy and blameless?
It appears that you have no understanding of sanctification during our life on earth then.
I love what Jesus taught.
What post can you cite where "all I speak about is works"? When I speak of works, I point out that works are NOT a part of getting saved, but works done in the Spirit are rewarded. All of which is biblical.
As to your second question, please be a bit more honest. My claim is that whoever HAS believed in Christ possesses eternal life from John 5:24 and shall never perish from John 10:28.
The beginning of what?
Since you are in disagreement then address my points and show HOW they are in error.
Can you provide any verse that says election is to salvation? No, there aren't any.
Nope. The purpose of this election is clearly stated in the purpose clause of "that we should be". And it's subjunctive mood, meaning it's something believers (us) OUGHT/SHOULD do.
Huh? We ARE elected. TO service.
I said:
"No again. To be "holy and blameless" speaks of service to the King. In fact, Paul clarified in Eph 5 the issue of being holy and blameless."
Then why did Paul tell us that we were chosen to be holy and blameless in 1:4 and that God wants to present the church holy and blameless?
It appears that you have no understanding of sanctification during our life on earth then.
I love what Jesus taught.
What post can you cite where "all I speak about is works"? When I speak of works, I point out that works are NOT a part of getting saved, but works done in the Spirit are rewarded. All of which is biblical.
As to your second question, please be a bit more honest. My claim is that whoever HAS believed in Christ possesses eternal life from John 5:24 and shall never perish from John 10:28.
The beginning of what?
Since you are in disagreement then address my points and show HOW they are in error.
FreeGrace2 said:
Actually, John 15 is about fellowship, not salvation. It seems a lot of believers are confused about that. Before Jesus said to abide in Him and He chose the 11, He began ch 15 by assuring the 11 that they were already saved (clean). This proves that "abiding" is not about staying saved.
This is gonna need some explanation. I have no idea what you are trying to communicate.
Are you confused about the concept of fellowship, like so many believers today?
Actually, John 15 is about fellowship, not salvation. It seems a lot of believers are confused about that. Before Jesus said to abide in Him and He chose the 11, He began ch 15 by assuring the 11 that they were already saved (clean). This proves that "abiding" is not about staying saved.
sometimes a picture really is worth 1000 words
Are you confused about the concept of fellowship, like so many believers today?
Every human being is born under the penalty of sin. Condemned is the biblical word.
John 3:18 - Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
Every human is born an unbeliever. Condemned.
John 3:18 - Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
Every human is born an unbeliever. Condemned.
E
You make up your own stuff
thats why no one can discuss things with you
you ask for proof, when it is given to you you reject it a d twist it to fit Your own belief.
your NOT holy based on how good you are, so beng chosen or elect to be holy is NOT SERVICE
You are NOT without blame based on your service, apart from grace, if God demanded you pay your own sin debt, yu would be guilty as charged,l so that is NOT about service.
twist it however you want, YOUR WRONG!
it seems everyone sees this but you
thats why no one can discuss things with you
you ask for proof, when it is given to you you reject it a d twist it to fit Your own belief.
your NOT holy based on how good you are, so beng chosen or elect to be holy is NOT SERVICE
You are NOT without blame based on your service, apart from grace, if God demanded you pay your own sin debt, yu would be guilty as charged,l so that is NOT about service.
twist it however you want, YOUR WRONG!
it seems everyone sees this but you
FreeGrace2 said:
Actually, John 15 is about fellowship, not salvation. It seems a lot of believers are confused about that. Before Jesus said to abide in Him and He chose the 11, He began ch 15 by assuring the 11 that they were already saved (clean). This proves that "abiding" is not about staying saved.
Your judgment of my statement is unjustified. I don't come to John 15 with anything to defend. I simply explain the meaning of "abiding".
Would you care to try to explain what Jesus meant by "abiding"?
I didn't say "we". I said ALL of who Jesus was talking to. Do you know who they were? The 11. Jesus was affirming their security.
Jesus said that to the 11.
Actually, John 15 is about fellowship, not salvation. It seems a lot of believers are confused about that. Before Jesus said to abide in Him and He chose the 11, He began ch 15 by assuring the 11 that they were already saved (clean). This proves that "abiding" is not about staying saved.
Your judgment of my statement is unjustified. I don't come to John 15 with anything to defend. I simply explain the meaning of "abiding".
Would you care to try to explain what Jesus meant by "abiding"?
I didn't say "we". I said ALL of who Jesus was talking to. Do you know who they were? The 11. Jesus was affirming their security.
Jesus said that to the 11.
E
I did already
the penalty (wage) of sin is death (see gods warning to Adam and Romans 5)
the gift of God is life
the gift of God is justification
we are justified by faith (Romans 3, 4)
hence sanctification can not occure before justification, and justification can not occur before faith.
Whether you see it or not is beside the point, I proved it with scripture.
the penalty (wage) of sin is death (see gods warning to Adam and Romans 5)
the gift of God is life
the gift of God is justification
we are justified by faith (Romans 3, 4)
hence sanctification can not occure before justification, and justification can not occur before faith.
Whether you see it or not is beside the point, I proved it with scripture.