By Works

[Chester]

5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

Adam was true son of God and his offspring was and will, but when he not obey, God drive out from the garden of Eden.

1 cor 6

9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

No thieves inherit kingdom, is that mean except His son?
You have to add the Word to come to that conclusion, you have to change.

If I can, I like to make it easy, but no body able to change the Word

The Word is very easy, you are right - and yet it is beyond human comprehension -- but of course as believers we have the Spirit living in us so we can understand these things at least to a certain extent.

If I understand what you are trying to say, I think I agree . . .

The one who is born and again, and believing and living out his faith is righteous and saved and will enter heaven.
The one who is not born again, and is not believing, and who is not living our his faith is unrighteous - and the unrighteous will not get into heaven and are not a part of God's Kingdom.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

No
he was sent to the whole world so
Whoever believes in him Might be saved
Your right he will never lose one. Who is born again. But that does
Not mean he did not die for all
As he said he did

There are many scriptures that affirms that God accomplishes his will, and no man can stop him. For instance, Dan 4:35; And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing; and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth; and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?

Christ did not die in vain. every one that he did for will be in heaven with him.

It is a shame that men, like yourself, does not give God, and his Son, the credit and honor that they deserve.

I believe that God gave mankind the free will to choose how they want to live their lives as they sojourn here on earth, But their eternal destiny is determined by God's sovereign grace, without the help of menkind.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

There are many scriptures that affirms that God accomplishes his will, and no man can stop him. For instance, Dan 4:35; And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing; and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth; and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?

Christ did not die in vain. every one that he did for will be in heaven with him.

It is a shame that men, like yourself, does not give God, and his Son, the credit and honor that they deserve.

I believe that God gave mankind the free will to choose how they want to live their lives as they sojourn here on earth, But their eternal destiny is determined by God's sovereign grace, without the help of menkind.

Your right, no one can stop him, but he will also not overrule anyone free will. Look at what he said to,jerusalem. They did not Let him take her under his wing they were not willing

his will is all who see and BELIEVE shall have eternal life.

yet he died for all

 

[Guojing]

Not sure what the fuss is?? Works are not a problem for me: I like doing good works for the Lord!

I am sure that if I "continue in the faith" that I will be doing works that show my faith.

It feels a little to me like as if someone told me "you need to eat in order to live" -- well, eating is not a problem for me: I sort of enjoy it!

So because you enjoy the work, you have no problem believing it’s also necessary for salvation?

What if it’s a work that you don’t enjoy, like not being able to buy and sell stuff?

 

[Bbrdrd]

There are many scriptures that affirms that God accomplishes his will, and no man can stop him. For instance, Dan 4:35; And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing; and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth; and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?

Christ did not die in vain. every one that he did for will be in heaven with him.

It is a shame that men, like yourself, does not give God, and his Son, the credit and honor that they deserve.

I believe that God gave mankind the free will to choose how they want to live their lives as they sojourn here on earth, But their eternal destiny is determined by God's sovereign grace, without the help of menkind.

While you believe you're giving God credit and honor you do exactly the opposite. You rob God of His justice by making salvation an arbitrary decree. You rob God of His love by making Him capricious. You make God a liar sending out a call to repentance to men He himself prevents from repenting.

In asserting the absolute sovereignty of God you dishonor Him and neglect the attributes that truly bring Him glory. His majesty is not purely in His power, it is far more evident in His mercy.

The God you present is so divorced from the ordinary sense we use for His attributes that He is absolutely unknowable. Simply a caricature of wrath and judgment, nothing like the God that revealed Himself in the person of Jesus.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

He, himself, is the only man that has no sin.

Why?

Upon believing the gospel all our sins are taken away; resulting in us not presently having any sin.

This is why it is written, What then? shall we sin...God forbid (Romans 6:15)... Do not let sin reign in your mortal body that you should obey it in the lusts of it (Romans 6:12).

Jesus said that the works that he did shall we do also (John 14:12).

 

[Jackson123]

The Word is very easy, you are right - and yet it is beyond human comprehension -- but of course as believers we have the Spirit living in us so we can understand these things at least to a certain extent.

If I understand what you are trying to say, I think I agree . . .

The one who is born and again, and believing and living out his faith is righteous and saved and will enter heaven.
The one who is not born again, and is not believing, and who is not living our his faith is unrighteous - and the unrighteous will not get into heaven and are not a part of God's Kingdom.

What I try to say is jesus never lie, I know it is not easy to honestly interprate because we like to hear, what ever you do you go to heaven.

But Jesus say if branch not bear fruit, will be cut and burn into fire or hell or not go to heaven.

Bible also say thieves, liar, adulterer killer not go to heaven

I know it is scary to me, who able bear fruit, who free from the list of sin above.

Only if we abide in Him, that is what Jesus say.

To make it easy, I like to hear the doctrine that say, what ever you do, kill, rob the bank etc go to heaven.

But it is not what the Bible say.

This is information from Jesus, only few will go to heaven. Remember Jesus never lie, only few will go to heaven, it is scary me but it is true.

Matt 7

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Read full chapter

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Your right, no one can stop him, but he will also not overrule anyone free will. Look at what he said to,jerusalem. They did not Let him take her under his wing they were not willing

his will is all who see and BELIEVE shall have eternal life.

yet he died for all

So, you believe God wants all mankind to live with him in heaven, but he does not get he wants. The God that I read about has power over everything. Parts the Red sea, calms the dangerous waves of the ocean, heals the sick, raises men up from the dead. And you limit his power to not have what he wants. He has power over all the inhabitants of earth, Dan 4:35, but he can not save them, no matter how bad he wants to.

Your belief paints a pitcher of a very weak God.

Mankind must hear the gospel, before he can believe the gospel. Only his sheep (those who are already born again) can hear his voice.

Jona's will was not to go to Nineveh, but God overroad Jonah's will, but you say that God will not override man's will.

Pharaoh's will was to not let Israel leave Egypt, but God overrode Pharaoh's will.

King Nebuchadnezzar's will was to continue to be king of Israel, but God overrode Nebuchadnezzar's will.

Eph 2 explains that mankind is spiritually dead and does not have a will to be quickened to a spiritual life, but God quickens him whether he agrees to it or not.

There are too many scriptures that do not harmonize with your belief. and if they do not harmonize, you are not believing the true doctrine of Jesus.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Why?

Upon believing the gospel all our sins are taken away; resulting in us not presently having any sin.

This is why it is written, What then? shall we sin...God forbid (Romans 6:15)... Do not let sin reign in your mortal body that you should obey it in the lusts of it (Romans 6:12).

Jesus said that the works that he did shall we do also (John 14:12).

1 John 1:8, If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. It is true, that when we walk in the light, we are not sinning, but no one walks in the light continually, that is why we are always having to repent. When we sin, we separate ourselves from God's fellowship, temporarily, but not our eternal inheritance, until we repent, and he forgives us.

Do you truly believe that after you have been born again, that you never commit another sin? I understand the scriptures to teach that no sin that we commit will be held against us, as far as our eternal inheritance is concerned.

 

[Guojing]

What I try to say is jesus never lie, I know it is not easy to honestly interprate because we like to hear, what ever you do you go to heaven.

But Jesus say if branch not bear fruit, will be cut and burn into fire or hell or not go to heaven.

Bible also say thieves, liar, adulterer killer not go to heaven

I know it is scary to me, who able bear fruit, who free from the list of sin above.

Only if we abide in Him, that is what Jesus say.

To make it easy, I like to hear the doctrine that say, what ever you do, kill, rob the bank etc go to heaven.

But it is not what the Bible say.

This is information from Jesus, only few will go to heaven. Remember Jesus never lie, only few will go to heaven, it is scary me but it is true.

Matt 7

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Read full chapter

You like to think that going to heaven works like the following scene from a TV drama?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So, you believe God wants all mankind to live with him in heaven, but he does not get he wants. The God that I read about has power over everything. Parts the Red sea, calms the dangerous waves of the ocean, heals the sick, raises men up from the dead. And you limit his power to not have what he wants. He has power over all the inhabitants of earth, Dan 4:35, but he can not save them, no matter how bad he wants to.

Your belief paints a pitcher of a very weak God.

Mankind must hear the gospel, before he can believe the gospel. Only his sheep (those who are already born again) can hear his voice.

Jona's will was not to go to Nineveh, but God overroad Jonah's will, but you say that God will not override man's will.

Pharaoh's will was to not let Israel leave Egypt, but God overrode Pharaoh's will.

King Nebuchadnezzar's will was to continue to be king of Israel, but God overrode Nebuchadnezzar's will.

Eph 2 explains that mankind is spiritually dead and does not have a will to be quickened to a spiritual life, but God quickens him whether he agrees to it or not.

There are too many scriptures that do not harmonize with your belief. and if they do not harmonize, you are not believing the true doctrine of Jesus.

God will not force anyone to revive him against his will

That would make him a dictator not a god of love

 

[Guojing]

So, you believe God wants all mankind to live with him in heaven, but he does not get he wants. The God that I read about has power over everything. Parts the Red sea, calms the dangerous waves of the ocean, heals the sick, raises men up from the dead. And you limit his power to not have what he wants. He has power over all the inhabitants of earth, Dan 4:35, but he can not save them, no matter how bad he wants to.

Your belief paints a pitcher of a very weak God.

Mankind must hear the gospel, before he can believe the gospel. Only his sheep (those who are already born again) can hear his voice.

Jona's will was not to go to Nineveh, but God overroad Jonah's will, but you say that God will not override man's will.

Pharaoh's will was to not let Israel leave Egypt, but God overrode Pharaoh's will.

King Nebuchadnezzar's will was to continue to be king of Israel, but God overrode Nebuchadnezzar's will.

Eph 2 explains that mankind is spiritually dead and does not have a will to be quickened to a spiritual life, but God quickens him whether he agrees to it or not.

There are too many scriptures that do not harmonize with your belief. and if they do not harmonize, you are not believing the true doctrine of Jesus.

To me, everyone, whether TULIP or otherwise, subscribed to some form of limited atonement.

For the otherwise group, our view of the atonement is that, it is unlimited in scope but limited by our free choice. Every human can be saved but not everyone will be saved because we still need to exercise faith to accept the gift, thus we rule out the concept of universal salvation.

Those from the TULIP group, however, believes that Jesus only died for a limited group that was chosen by God the Father, before the foundation of the world. This is called the elected group and they believe that only this group of people can respond to the preaching and accept Jesus as their savior.

If you are not part of the elected group, you have no ability to respond to the message. Seen from this perspective, the idea of limited atonement has the view that atonement is unlimited in the sense that the grace is irresistible to the elect, but limited in its scope as it applies only to the elected group

 

[Jackson123]

You like to think that going to heaven works like the following scene from a TV drama?

I like to think going to heaven easy, you can do what ever you want, stealing, lying etc.
but Jesus say

Matt 7
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Read full chapter

Another verse say

Thieve, liar, adulterer not inherit kingdom.

I wich bible lie. Jesus lie, but He is not.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

1 John 1:8, If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Look at what this is in reference to:

It is written, That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us (1 John 1:3).

What did they see?

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9).

And verse 8 was written for those who would deny having any sin to need to be cleansed by Christ.

I have not done so.

I have confessed my sins and he was faithful and just to forgive me of my sins.

Now I can claim this scripture as a faithful obedient follower:

We know that everyone who has been born of God does not sin (1 John 5:18).

 

[Guojing]

I like to think going to heaven easy, you can do what ever you want, stealing, lying etc.
but Jesus say

Matt 7
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Read full chapter

Another verse say

Thieve, liar, adulterer not inherit kingdom.

I wich bible lie. Jesus lie, but He is not.

I actually prefer it to be all about what Christ did for me at the cross.

I can imagine that, when we are in heaven, how irritating it must be, instead, to keep having people coming up to me unsolicited and telling me "Guess what I have done on earth, in order for me to get into heaven? Yada yada yada. Now what did you do?"

 

[Jackson123]

I actually prefer it to be all about what Christ did for me at the cross.

I can imagine that, when we are in heaven, how irritating it must be, instead, to keep having people coming up to me unsolicited and telling me "Guess what I have done on earth, in order for me to get into heaven? Yada yada yada. Now what did you do?"

So you don't believe what Christ say?

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Read full chapter

And you don't believe what Paul say


1 Corinthians 6:9-11

King James Version


9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

And you accused apostle john lie

Rev 21

8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Read full chapter

 

[Guojing]

So you don't believe what Christ say?

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Read full chapter

And you don't believe what Paul say


1 Corinthians 6:9-11

King James Version


9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

And you accused apostle john lie

Rev 21

8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Read full chapter

No, I just have a different understanding about scripture than you.

But that is fine, all of us were taught differently, based on our own individual background.

 

[Jackson123]

No, I just have a different understanding about scripture than you.

But that is fine, all of us were taught differently, based on our own individual background.

So Bible say killer not go to heaven and your understanding is killer go to heaven? Because Jesus die for you?
I believe killer must repent, than go to heaven.

 

[Guojing]

So Bible say killer not go to heaven and your understanding is killer go to heaven? Because Jesus die for you?
I believe killer must repent, than go to heaven.

A killer must believe that Jesus died for his sins and rose again for his justification.

He of course may still end up in a jail cell because there is still legal consequences for his sins on earth.

As far as God is concerned however, his murder is paid for by Christ death on the cross.

 

[Jackson123]

A killer must believe that Jesus died for his sins and rose again for his justification.

He of course may still end up in a jail cell because there is still legal consequences for his sins on earth.

As far as God is concerned however, his murder is paid for by Christ death on the cross.

Is killer need to repent to be forgiven or not?