Calvinism Critiqued

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Dec 28, 2016
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It is popcorn time watching eternally-gratefull <sic> and john146 preach their own false version of the gospel.

#fakegospel

Just because a person has been taught by another, and are able to say "Jesus is the only way!" does not necessitate that they're preaching Gospel truth. That's about as far as these two go, yet john146 is probably the most heretical of the two.

The girl in Acts 16:17 comes to mind for some reason due to this. I suppose as proof that being able to say something true is no indicator of holding sound doctrine, or preaching a sound Gospel, or being endorsed by God.

Man exalting, God debasing gospel of Pelagian style choosing ones self into heaven. Unreal.
 

GraceAndTruth

Junior Member
Sep 28, 2015
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Calvin followed the bible, along with all of the reformers or "protestants" in that time. The Roman Catholic religion gave us the name "protetant" because we protested their apostasy/hersies.

Hate Calvin? Do you also hate Wycliffe, Tinsdale, Zwengli, Luther, and Augustine? How about Jonathan Edwards or George Whitefield?
Maybe you'd like to consign to hell the author of Amazing Grace and the author of Pilgrim's Progress, along with Spurgeon, Boettner, and John Gill!! Or back further to Irenaeus, Ignatius, Tertullian Polycarp and Clement. "calvinists" or "doctrineof grace" believers every one of them. The list is enormous, just about every person in Christian history that had a voice.

Yes there were also the apostates like Montanus and Arminius, the heretics like Origen and Joseph Smith, they have been with us in every age since the snake in the garden.

Know who the enemy really is. Do you see yourself as the master of your ship? OR, do you see God's magnificent characteristics in His Omnipotence, Omnipresence, Omniscience and Immutablity? Do you see unsaved people as just sick and weren't you so clever to cure yourself and so smart to "accept Christ" and walk that aisle. OR do you see yourself as God sees you, a dead stinking corpse that needs to be made alive by God's grace??
 

GraceAndTruth

Junior Member
Sep 28, 2015
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Here ya go! Didn't realize John Calvin was actually quoted by King Jimmy, but here goes:

Matthew 23
13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

Now why is this? Is it because of man's pride, or ego? Or, more like "Walter Ego", that keeps a man so hesitant in its relentless attacks upon one's spirit? Browbeatings! Saying: "I can't enter in!" "NEITHER, can you!" "Or, YOU, either!" "Just REMAIN a "good sheep" will ya?"

Wished I had a nickel, for every time I heard that betweenst my ears, for the past 30 years er so! I could have retired way earlier! :cool:

Matthew 23
24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.


And here Jesus...Oops? Did I say that out loud? :p I meant John Calvin is talking about himself:

Matthew 7
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Here, is where Jesus...DANGIT?....did it again! :p I meant John Calvin put forth his John Calvin 2.0 doctrine, as I have learned to calls it:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


And here, John Calvin is addressing those who were seduced/beguiled, by the spirit of anti christ, and, oppressed by sons of darkness, yet, found the "saving grace" in Calvin. Yet? Contented? Never picked up their cross!



23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.



As you can see? I'm a faithful disciple of John Calvin!.....NOT!!!! :p
Calvin did not start the "tulip thingy". Theodore Beza did as the response to Jacob Arminius' "Remonstrances"
c
 
Mar 14, 2011
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My friend, I am done with this with you. You are starting with man and reasoning up to God. I start with God and reason down to man. I have shown you our view and you will not accept it. Thanks for the conversation my friend.
Fine so be it.

I should have known though, Like many calvinists, You attack the person, instead of actually trying to sit for a minute and trying to see there way.

I am not coming from Mans perspective, I am coming from Gods. I posted Gods word. I posted his own words in what his will is. And shared my view openly. Yet as a respons you belittle me, and lie about my motive..

Which is sad.. I was hoping to have a normal conversation But I guess with the exception of a few (PennEd and Grandpa are two I can think of, who disagree with me, but have never attacked me or said I believe thins I do not, and I love dearly as brothers in christ) it usually comes to this.


Good day.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I think you might be eternally grateful that we do not know one another. I know I am.:)
Another one, To go this low. Do you all think maybe this is why you are attacked so hard? People get sick of your pridefull attitude?

Why would I be eternally grateful I do not know someone, The bible tells me to love all people. Even my enemies, and I do nto even consider you an enemy. So why would you want me to sin by puffing myself up and saying I am glad I do not know you? Why would I think I am
so great that I think I am above others, that to eben bellitle myself to know them because they are so far below me, so I am grateful for that?

You do not know me one iota if you even think for a second I would be this way

But sadly, I think you just exposed yourself. And your pride. Which is fine, But God said he will humble you one day. So I will pray for you, because I love you.
 
Oct 25, 2018
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Fine so be it.

I should have known though, Like many calvinists, You attack the person, instead of actually trying to sit for a minute and trying to see there way.

I am not coming from Mans perspective, I am coming from Gods. I posted Gods word. I posted his own words in what his will is. And shared my view openly. Yet as a respons you belittle me, and lie about my motive..

Which is sad.. I was hoping to have a normal conversation But I guess with the exception of a few (PennEd and Grandpa are two I can think of, who disagree with me, but have never attacked me or said I believe thins I do not, and I love dearly as brothers in christ) it usually comes to this.

Good day.
I never belittled you my friend. I spoke the truth when I said you start with man and reason up to God. It seeps through in every post you post.

You said I thought I was special. Not in the least. I deserved hell. I hated God. Did not want to serve Him. Yet, it was His electing love that drew me to Him. He did not drag me kicking and screaming to Him. He placed His love around me and brought me to Him.
 
Oct 25, 2018
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Fine so be it.

I should have known though, Like many calvinists, You attack the person, instead of actually trying to sit for a minute and trying to see there way.

I am not coming from Mans perspective, I am coming from Gods. I posted Gods word. I posted his own words in what his will is. And shared my view openly. Yet as a respons you belittle me, and lie about my motive..

Which is sad.. I was hoping to have a normal conversation But I guess with the exception of a few (PennEd and Grandpa are two I can think of, who disagree with me, but have never attacked me or said I believe thins I do not, and I love dearly as brothers in christ) it usually comes to this.

Good day.
Here’s the thing my friend, I was once where you are at right now. I know your system every bit as well as you do. However, you do not know my systematic theology at all my friend.
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
3,410
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here is something to lighten the mood. I find this parody hilarious.


I must admit, I can see myself in option #5 :D
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
4,739
868
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Calvin followed the bible, along with all of the reformers or "protestants" in that time. The Roman Catholic religion gave us the name "protetant" because we protested their apostasy/hersies.

Hate Calvin? Do you also hate Wycliffe, Tinsdale, Zwengli, Luther, and Augustine? How about Jonathan Edwards or George Whitefield?
Maybe you'd like to consign to hell the author of Amazing Grace and the author of Pilgrim's Progress, along with Spurgeon, Boettner, and John Gill!! Or back further to Irenaeus, Ignatius, Tertullian Polycarp and Clement. "calvinists" or "doctrineof grace" believers every one of them. The list is enormous, just about every person in Christian history that had a voice.

Yes there were also the apostates like Montanus and Arminius, the heretics like Origen and Joseph Smith, they have been with us in every age since the snake in the garden.

Know who the enemy really is. Do you see yourself as the master of your ship? OR, do you see God's magnificent characteristics in His Omnipotence, Omnipresence, Omniscience and Immutablity? Do you see unsaved people as just sick and weren't you so clever to cure yourself and so smart to "accept Christ" and walk that aisle. OR do you see yourself as God sees you, a dead stinking corpse that needs to be made alive by God's grace??
Who gets the credit? The student, or the teacher? Does not the Spirit of God convict the world of sin, righteousness and judgement? So then men are drawn and then repent, no? So then who can boast of repentance, when it is yet God who convinced them? This is like a lawyer and jury, the jury reaches a verdict but only after having heard the argument.

I believed God's report of His Son, that in Him is eternal life (1 John 5:9-13). Yet, what boast can be made when God has convicted me of the truth? God draws and man repents. It is impossible to please God without faith, yea? Yet how dependent our faith is on the revelation that God gives, and through His providence.
 

GraceAndTruth

Junior Member
Sep 28, 2015
1,108
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Who gets the credit? The student, or the teacher? Does not the Spirit of God convict the world of sin, righteousness and judgement? So then men are drawn and then repent, no? So then who can boast of repentance, when it is yet God who convinced them? This is like a lawyer and jury, the jury reaches a verdict but only after having heard the argument.

I believed God's report of His Son, that in Him is eternal life (1 John 5:9-13). Yet, what boast can be made when God has convicted me of the truth? God draws and man repents. It is impossible to please God without faith, yea? Yet how dependent our faith is on the revelation that God gives, and through His providence.
I don't think that is the point of this forum
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
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Gotta disagree with some of this.

We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because are sinners. There is a distinction there. We were dead because we are sinners. And as such we sin. The fact that we were dead, because we were sinners remains. And therefore being dead, we CANNOT in our physical flesh choose to born ourself.

Scripture says we are not even capable of understanding the Gospel in our flesh.

I mean, you say you are spiritually dead and cannot make yourself alive, and then in the very next breath say that you can, in your flesh, choose to make yourself alive by entering the Narrow Gate.

This might be the final barrier of ourself we have to yield to Jesus. It's a tough one brother. But if we could choose Him, without God quickening us, then we can also choose to not sin BEFORE we are born again. And we know that can't happen.
Are you implying that God created Adam as a sinner (as opposed to a free will agent)? So Adam sinned by necessity, not choice? Or are you saying all of creation afterwards fell under this original sin, tainted by sin, and therefore are born sinners and therefore will sin?

Just trying to understand PennEd.
 

GraceAndTruth

Junior Member
Sep 28, 2015
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HEVOSMIES..........THAT VIDEO IS HILARIOUS! LOVE IT. And ain't it the truth?
 

GraceAndTruth

Junior Member
Sep 28, 2015
1,108
320
83
Are you implying that God created Adam as a sinner (as opposed to a free will agent)? So Adam sinned by necessity, not choice? Or are you saying all of creation afterwards fell under this original sin, tainted by sin, and therefore are born sinners and therefore will sin?

Just trying to understand PennEd.
Adam just might be the only human that was created with a free will.........except his free will got him in huge trouble.
Then of course, there is that pesky truth that the CROSS was predestined. No sin no cross. It's a conundrum.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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Are you implying that God created Adam as a sinner (as opposed to a free will agent)? So Adam sinned by necessity, not choice? Or are you saying all of creation afterwards fell under this original sin, tainted by sin, and therefore are born sinners and therefore will sin?

Just trying to understand PennEd.
Adam was a direct creation of God, a son in a sense. We are sons of Adam not God.

We become a son of God when we are born again. Then we are His children.

I'm fine with the term original sin. I believe we are born sinners, S-I-N POSITIVE upon birth! Although I don't believe that sin is imputed to us until we reach the age of accountability.

I do not believe we have the free will to NOT sin. If we did, then Jesus didn't have to die. I think Adam did have free will to NOT sin.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I never belittled you my friend. I spoke the truth when I said you start with man and reason up to God. It seeps through in every post you post.
Thats your opinion. And I will grant you, you are allowed to have it.

You said I thought I was special. Not in the least. I deserved hell. I hated God. Did not want to serve Him. Yet, it was His electing love that drew me to Him. He did not drag me kicking and screaming to Him. He placed His love around me and brought me to Him.
You do.

God chose you. Not some one else. Even though you BOTH deserve hell. That makes you special. Whether you believe it or not.


He came with Love to Israel. Even stated it was his will that his love for them would be like a mother hen who gathers her chick, But they were not willing.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Here’s the thing my friend, I was once where you are at right now. I know your system every bit as well as you do. However, you do not know my systematic theology at all my friend.
lol. So typical. You do not know me at all my friend, Or what I know about your theology.

What is it with you people who think you know it all? You have one person who is glad he does not know me, and you who thinks you knw me.

Again, It is no wonder you people get treated the way you do. Your pride is deep. So deep you can not even see it.
 
Oct 25, 2018
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lol. So typical. You do not know me at all my friend, Or what I know about your theology.

What is it with you people who think you know it all? You have one person who is glad he does not know me, and you who thinks you knw me.

Again, It is no wonder you people get treated the way you do. Your pride is deep. So deep you can not even see it.
My friend, seeing you are on attack mode, it is time for me to put you on my ignore list. So long my friend. I tried to be civil, but alas...