Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot

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Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#3,821
Jul 18, 2017
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#3,821
Grandpa said:
John 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
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This verse needs to be properly interpreted in the light of all Gospel truth. It does NOT imply that God shut some people out of the Kingdom of God arbitrarily therefore they could not believe. Rather it says that BECAUSE they chose to be wilfully blind, they could not believe, and therefore they were not the sheep of Christ.

When we take the context of this verse, it becomes very clear that in spite of all the words and miracles of Christ, they accused Him of being possessed with a demon. That was wiful blindness, since they did not want to repent and submit to Christ,

And those who are wilfully blind are then blinded by God. This would appear to be the condition of Calvinists. You can show them a hundred verses which refute their claims, but it is of no consequence. The Word of God has become meaningless to them.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#3,822
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#3,822
Blue_Of_Lake said:
there seem to be Many gospels, Many Flavors, so to Speak. the Wise thing to Do would be to Ask God's view on the Gospel and to Seek the 'Real' Truth -- from God-- through the Spirit, and to Keep seeking Truth and He may reveal it Yet,


"... if you seek Me with all your heart ..." not some -- but with all our heart.


Isaiah 45:19
I have not spoken in secret, from a place in a land of darkness. I did not say to the descendants of Jacob: 'Seek Me in a wasteland.' I, the LORD, speak the truth; I say what is right.

Jeremiah 24:7
I will give them a heart to know Me, that I am the LORD. They will be My people, and I will be their God, for they will return to Me with all their heart.

Amos 5:4
For this is what the LORD says to the house of Israel: "Seek Me and live!

Deuteronomy 4:29-31
But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul…

Matthew 7:7
Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.
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God has already spoken in his word and the gospel is clear.
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,823
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,188
113
#3,823
Nehemiah6 said:
This verse needs to be properly interpreted in the light of all Gospel truth. It does NOT imply that God shut some people out of the Kingdom of God arbitrarily therefore they could not believe. Rather it says that BECAUSE they chose to be wilfully blind, they could not believe, and therefore they were not the sheep of Christ.

When we take the context of this verse, it becomes very clear that in spite of all the words and miracles of Christ, they accused Him of being possessed with a demon. That was wiful blindness, since they did not want to repent and submit to Christ,

And those who are wilfully blind are then blinded by God. This would appear to be the condition of Calvinists. You can show them a hundred verses which refute their claims, but it is of no consequence. The Word of God has become meaningless to them.
Click to expand...
John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

All you have shown are verses that you have misinterpreted. If you interpret them correctly they don't refute Calvinism.

This would mean that the Word of God was probably never understood by the free willer in the first place. But all those verses that you purposefully misinterpret, I'm sure they have meaning for you. Otherwise, you might stop doing it.
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,824
Jun 24, 2011
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#3,824
dcontroversal said:
You know.....it really sank home today....Calvinists are exactly like the Pharisees of old.....

Hyper religious

Full of misplaced zeal

Think they are more righteous than others

Claim to be of God

Skew scripture

Believe they have a grasp on scripture

Believe they are the chosen ones

Reject all truth that proves their error

Yes, yes indeed.....a modern version of a Pharisee with a different name.....

My bible is clear....

God would have ALL MEN be saved and come to repentance....NOT JUST THE CALVINISTS that peddle a doctrine formed by a man from the mid 1500's!
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I'd rather have a God that is able to save.


Instead of one that wants to but can't quite summon up the strength to do it.


But, by all means, continue to worship your own will that has brought your salvation.

Calvinists would rather worship the True God.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#3,825
#3,825
Grandpa said:
John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

All you have shown are verses that you have misinterpreted. If you interpret them correctly they don't refute Calvinism.

This would mean that the Word of God was probably never understood by the free willer in the first place. But all those verses that you purposefully misinterpret, I'm sure they have meaning for you. Otherwise, you might stop doing it.
Click to expand...

"Draw" is not by force as per your doctrine of irresistible grace.

Romans 13:2 – Whosoever therefore resists the power, resists the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
#3,826
#3,826
Grandpa said:
I'd rather have a God that is able to save.


Instead of one that wants to but can't quite summon up the strength to do it.


But, by all means, continue to worship your own will that has brought your salvation.

Calvinists would rather worship the True God.
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Straw man.
No one argues our will saves us.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#3,827
#3,827
dcontroversal said:
God has already spoken in his word and the gospel is clear.
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Amen,

As you have repeatedly stated..

If “many are called but few are chosen” (Matthew 22:14), then why is the number chosen less than the number called.

Why would God call a large number of people to the wedding feast, yet only choose some of them?
How can this be explained without man being able to resist grace?
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#3,828
Dec 12, 2013
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#3,828
EleventhHour said:
Amen,

As you have repeatedly stated..

If “many are called but few are chosen” (Matthew 22:14), then why is the number chosen less than the number called.

Why would God call a large number of people to the wedding feast, yet only choose some of them?
How can this be explained without man being able to resist grace?
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In the same flavor they explain everything else....skewed truth, denied definitions, changed definitions, conflated truth etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. <<-One redundant twist after another!
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,831
Jun 24, 2011
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#3,831
EleventhHour said:
"Draw" is not by force as per your doctrine of irresistible grace.

Romans 13:2 – Whosoever therefore resists the power, resists the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
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Romans 13:1-3
1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:


Why do you keep doing that with the bible? Do you know you have to misinterpret and hide the true meaning because it doesn't say what you want it to say?
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,832
Jun 24, 2011
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#3,832
Duskey said:
God is unable to save someone He created for destruction because He would be going against His own will. See how stupid that sounds?
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The really stupid thing about that post is the people who agreed with it and liked it...:ROFL::ROFL:
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,833
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#3,833
dcontroversal said:
In the same flavor they explain everything else....skewed truth, denied definitions, changed definitions, conflated truth etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. <<-One redundant twist after another!
Click to expand...
Its explained in the very parable you two "scholars" are fumbling with.

Those who choose themselves don't make it.

Only those who God chooses make it.


You HAVE to come to Christ in order to be saved. Only those drawn by God come to Christ.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
 
Camess

Camess

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Aug 11, 2020
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#3,834
Seems to me you, like so many other "christians" like to pick and choose the scriptures to fit an agenda. That is, i don't know u, only God knows if you're truly his child or not, Thats between you and Him. Remember God's warning to not take away from nor add to His word. Always read everything IN CONTEXT.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#3,836
#3,836
Grandpa said:
Romans 13:1-3
1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:


Why do you keep doing that with the bible? Do you know you have to misinterpret and hide the true meaning because it doesn't say what you want it to say?
Click to expand...
I seem to have missed the part where you explain it to me?
Seems to me to be clear the power of God can be resisted.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#3,838
Jul 18, 2017
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#3,838
Grandpa said:
But all those verses that you purposefully misinterpret, I'm sure they have meaning for you.
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I don't need to purposefully misrepresent anything. When you take all Gospel truth together, the Bible is very clear and plain -- God will have ALL MEN TO BE SAVED and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim 2:4)

That one Scripture totally DEMOLISHES Calvinism, as well as your misunderstanding of John 10:26. Therefore those who were not Christ's sheep chose to willfully reject Him. And they could not believe because firstly they would not believe. As Paul says "But they have not all obeyed the Gospel" (Rom 10:16).

And it is Calvinists who wilfully and deliberately (1) misrepresent, or (2) misinterpret, or (3) misunderstand Scripture. John Calvin himself is the best example. First his commentaries give a proper exposition of what is in the Bible (since he had no choice or else would be outed), but then he contradicted those same Scriptures with his own WARPED THEOLOGY (which you have unfortunately adopted, rather than reject it out of hand).
 
G

garee

Banned
#3,839
Mar 28, 2016
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#3,839
dcontroversal said:
God has already spoken in his word and the gospel is clear.
Click to expand...
Amen. As many that could receive Him to them he gave His power .

By whose power do you believe God not seen?

2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
 
F

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#3,840
Jul 8, 2018
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#3,840
Nehemiah6 said:
This verse needs to be properly interpreted in the light of all Gospel truth. It does NOT imply that God shut some people out of the Kingdom of God arbitrarily therefore they could not believe. Rather it says that BECAUSE they chose to be wilfully blind, they could not believe, and therefore they were not the sheep of Christ.

When we take the context of this verse, it becomes very clear that in spite of all the words and miracles of Christ, they accused Him of being possessed with a demon. That was wiful blindness, since they did not want to repent and submit to Christ,

And those who are wilfully blind are then blinded by God. This would appear to be the condition of Calvinists. You can show them a hundred verses which refute their claims, but it is of no consequence. The Word of God has become meaningless to them.
Click to expand...
Matt 25:32. Sheep are God's regenerated believers who can hear his voice and understand it. Goats are all the rest of mankind who are not his sheep and cannot hear to understand his voice. God is a Spirit. The natural man (goat) cannot discern spiritual things, and thinks them to be foolishness, 1 Cor 2:14.

You said that "this verse needs to be interpreted in light of all gospel truth." Let's hear your interpretation of it, in light of harmonizing all of the other scriptures, like Book, chapter, and verse.
 
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