CAN IT BE PROVED?

[luciddream1982]

I wasnt trying to avoid this verse....Isa 14:16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

Angelic beings have been called men in scripture...

Gen 19:1 And there came two ANGELS to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;
Gen 19:2 And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.
Gen 19:3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.
Gen 19:4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:
Gen 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the MEN which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

The fourth "man" was obviously Angelic

Dan 3:25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

and this....

Luk 1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,

Dan 9:21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the MAN Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.

 

[luciddream1982]

Ask yourself this, if Satan was the first one to sin and he was an Angel, then Why didn't Christ come as an Angel, instead of Man? Scripture is very clear on this that He took on the Nature of man, not Angels.

Because Christ didnt come to save the fallen angels, he came to save mankind

 

[luciddream1982]

Do you even know what a covering Cherub is? It's an imaginary Figure

I disagree

Gen 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

 

[jandian]

so......Eve then gave to Adam to have sexual relations with?

 

[jandian]

sorry that question was in relation to disshat earlier statement?

 

[2knowhim]

Do you even know what a covering Cherub is? It's an imaginary Figure

I disagree

Gen 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

ker-oob'
Of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure: - cherub, [plural] cherubims.

These cherubims are symbolic for something mighty Great, I've been asking The Lord for understanding on this for yrs. but I don't know.

They were of one beaten work with The Mercy Seat all of Gold, and this is where
God met with the High Priest in the Tabernacle. In fact they were all over the tabernacle.

"He dwells between the Cheribums of Glory" is seen in scripture several times, so I know
that they must be important, but I don't know as of yet.

 

[2knowhim]

so......Eve then gave to Adam to have sexual relations with?

NO, not sexual relations, seeds can be planted in our thoughts and in our hearts and
take root, it happens all the time.

Look at the Parable of the Seed and the Sower, Jesus said The Word of God is the Seed, so also
The enemy has Seed also. One is Truth and one is deception.

 

[dishchat]

yes jandian.the body of a person is like a garden; songs of Salomon 4 vs 12etc....Now in proverb 30 vs 20: the adultary woman eat,clean hermouth and said"i've done anything wrong".So Eve commited adultary. The serpent was on his feet. He looked absolutely like a man.He is the only animal whose blood is compatible to human race.Satan use the serpent to deceive Eve. God created Man in his own image but not satan.Adam and Eve were like God.The image of God is Male and female.[Genesis ch 1 vs 27].Adam should reproduce by speaking the word but God permit him to fall because God is our saviour.He had a plan for us before the foundation of the world.you can read in ephesiens book. Now, anyfruit can't open the eyes of a person to make him know that he is naked or to make Eve and the serpent to have get a posterity. The sperm of the serpent was already in Eve and then Adam introduced his in her.Caïn and Abel were twins. 1st caïn 2nd Abel. Gen 4 vs 1 ,2 do not means that Cain was son of Adam. Adam knew his wife just one time not 2 time to give birth to Abel. So Abel's father was Adam and Caïn's father was the serpent. Abel had the revelation of what happen.He offered to God a sacrifice of blood because their was a sexual affair in the garden, but Caïn offered fruit to God because he had no revelation of what happenned. He thought that Eve and Adam ate a real fruit.If it was not a sexual act, why did Jesus came on earth by a virgin? by the way, David commented also on his birth in psaumes 51 vs 7. The serpent seed is a deep subject and i am sad for those who can't see it.

 

[jandian]

So you are saying when the bible said that she gave to her husband to eat, she gave him the snake to have relations with?

And when God talks about the" tree of the knowledge of good and evil" that was in the midst of the garden; it was the snake?

 

[2knowhim]

yes jandian.the body of a person is like a garden; songs of Salomon 4 vs 12etc....Now in proverb 30 vs 20: the adultary woman eat,clean hermouth and said"i've done anything wrong".So Eve commited adultary. The serpent was on his feet. He looked absolutely like a man.He is the only animal whose blood is compatible to human race.Satan use the serpent to deceive Eve. God created Man in his own image but not satan.Adam and Eve were like God.The image of God is Male and female.[Genesis ch 1 vs 27].Adam should reproduce by speaking the word but God permit him to fall because God is our saviour.He had a plan for us before the foundation of the world.you can read in ephesiens book. Now, anyfruit can't open the eyes of a person to make him know that he is naked or to make Eve and the serpent to have get a posterity. The sperm of the serpent was already in Eve and then Adam introduced his in her.Caïn and Abel were twins. 1st caïn 2nd Abel. Gen 4 vs 1 ,2 do not means that Cain was son of Adam. Adam knew his wife just one time not 2 time to give birth to Abel. So Abel's father was Adam and Caïn's father was the serpent. Abel had the revelation of what happen.He offered to God a sacrifice of blood because their was a sexual affair in the garden, but Caïn offered fruit to God because he had no revelation of what happenned. He thought that Eve and Adam ate a real fruit.If it was not a sexual act, why did Jesus came on earth by a virgin? by the way, David commented also on his birth in psaumes 51 vs 7. The serpent seed is a deep subject and i am sad for those who can't see it.

I am very familiar with The Serpent Seed doctrine, I studied with Arnold Murray for yrs.
And would preach it and teach it to anyone that would listen. But when The Lord opened my
eyes to see in the Spirit the Word, my foundation was shaken to the core.

Now, with that being said I just want you to honestly ask The Lord to show you The Truth, because that ain't
it. God's word is Spirit, just because it's easier to believe in a natural, literal story, don't make it
Truth, we must go higher in Him, not bring Him down to our level so we can understand something.
First the natural, then the Spiritual, this goes for our understanding too.

There is no doubt a serpent seed, but he don't have to have sex with someone to cause them to err.
There is a Spiritual conception that has taken place and is just as much Adultry, as the literal.

Blessings

 

[Israel]

ker-oob'
Of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure: - cherub, [plural] cherubims.

These cherubims are symbolic for something mighty Great, I've been asking The Lord for understanding on this for yrs. but I don't know.

They were of one beaten work with The Mercy Seat all of Gold, and this is where
God met with the High Priest in the Tabernacle. In fact they were all over the tabernacle.

"He dwells between the Cheribums of Glory" is seen in scripture several times, so I know
that they must be important, but I don't know as of yet.

The first thing we must remember is that they PREVENTED the way back to the tree of life. They turn every which way the flaming sword.

It's not about what bible you use, what concordance you have, or how much greek and hebrew one may know, the way is hidden.

Look at the effects. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE on this site with bible knowledge can base what and why they believe as they do with SCRIPTURE. There are MANY paths upon which to take that end in destruction.

Jesus said it pleased the Father to hide it from the wise and prudent. Even in us who believe in the salvation of all, always remain humble in understanding that we have not yet striven unto blood.

 

[luciddream1982]

I am very familiar with The Serpent Seed doctrine, I studied with Arnold Murray for yrs.
And would preach it and teach it to anyone that would listen. But when The Lord opened my
eyes to see in the Spirit the Word, my foundation was shaken to the core.

Now, with that being said I just want you to honestly ask The Lord to show you The Truth, because that ain't
it. God's word is Spirit, just because it's easier to believe in a natural, literal story, don't make it
Truth, we must go higher in Him, not bring Him down to our level so we can understand something.
First the natural, then the Spiritual, this goes for our understanding too.

There is no doubt a serpent seed, but he don't have to have sex with someone to cause them to err.
There is a Spiritual conception that has taken place and is just as much Adultry, as the literal.

Blessings

I still watch Shepherds Chapel from time to time, but I do not hold to a lot of their views (Serpent Seed Doctrine). I think Arnold Murray tries to hard to make scripture fit his preconceived ideas.

There is a danger in spiritualizing everything in scripture though. Unless the scripture demands otherwise, we should take it literally.

 

[2knowhim]

I still watch Shepherds Chapel from time to time, but I do not hold to a lot of their views (Serpent Seed Doctrine). I think Arnold Murray tries to hard to make scripture fit his preconceived ideas.

There is a danger in spiritualizing everything in scripture though. Unless the scripture demands otherwise, we should take it literally.

I agree with you on Shepherds Chapel, but with the spiritualizing scripture not at all.

There is no way man can do this, it is impossible, only The Holy Spirit interprets the Word.

Do you understand that His Word IS SPIRIT, God's ways and His thoughts are so much higher
than ours, it takes Him to give us understanding.

To take the word Literal is a Huge mistake, if that is all we have, then we might as well read it
as any other book. But it's not. We must seek Him in everyword for understanding.

Blessings

 

[luciddream1982]

I agree with you on Shepherds Chapel, but with the spiritualizing scripture not at all.

There is no way man can do this, it is impossible, only The Holy Spirit interprets the Word.

Do you understand that His Word IS SPIRIT, God's ways and His thoughts are so much higher
than ours, it takes Him to give us understanding.

To take the word Literal is a Huge mistake, if that is all we have, then we might as well read it
as any other book. But it's not. We must seek Him in everyword for understanding.

Blessings

Sometimes scripture does have a deeper spiritual meaning but if you go overboard with it your imagination can run wild and you can come up with almost anything. Over spiritualizing gives birth to a lot of strange doctrines. You just gotta stay balanced....you dont want to become too literal, but you dont want to over spiritualize either.

 

[dishchat]

So you are saying when the bible said that she gave to her husband to eat, she gave him the snake to have relations with?

And when God talks about the" tree of the knowledge of good and evil" that was in the midst of the garden; it was the snake?

No, it was sexual act.Eve had sex with serpent and then with adam. the sex of a person is in the middle of his body.Sex opened there intelligence and they knew that they were naked.If that act was only spiritual and not sex; why did Jesus came through a virgin and not by sex? Why did David said that his mother conceived him by sin in psalms 51 vs 5?

 

[luciddream1982]

No, it was sexual act.Eve had sex with serpent and then with adam. the sex of a person is in the middle of his body.Sex opened there intelligence and they knew that they were naked.If that act was only spiritual and not sex; why did Jesus came through a virgin and not by sex? Why did David said that his mother conceived him by sin in psalms 51 vs 5?

So, if eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil was sex, then I guess they could freely have sex with every other tree in the graden?

Gen 2:16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
Gen 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

...And knowing they were naked (yes, I'm about to spiritualize here ) was sybolic of spiritual adultery even though I believe they literally knew they were naked. God has always liken idolatry to adultery. Adam and Eve allowed the serpent to come between them and God, which made the serpent their idol.

Lam_1:8 Jerusalem hath grievously sinned; therefore she is removed: all that honoured her despise her, because they have seen her nakedness: yea, she sigheth, and turneth backward.

Eze 16:36 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thy filthiness was poured out, and thy nakedness discovered through thy whoredoms with thy lovers, and with all the idols of thy abominations, and by the blood of thy children, which thou didst give unto them;
Eze_16:37 Behold, therefore I will gather all thy lovers, with whom thou hast taken pleasure, and all them that thou hast loved, with all them that thou hast hated; I will even gather them round about against thee, and will discover thy nakedness unto them, that they may see all thy nakedness.

Nah 3:5 Behold, I am against thee, saith the LORD of hosts; and I will discover thy skirts upon thy face, and I will shew the nations thy nakedness, and the kingdoms thy shame.

 

[2knowhim]

No, it was sexual act.Eve had sex with serpent and then with adam. the sex of a person is in the middle of his body.Sex opened there intelligence and they knew that they were naked.If that act was only spiritual and not sex; why did Jesus came through a virgin and not by sex? Why did David said that his mother conceived him by sin in psalms 51 vs 5?

Again I humbly Pray that you come out of this type of thinking.

The reason they knew they were naked, is because they partook of the tree,
Which was the Law.

Rom_3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Eve was said to be the Mother of all living by Adam, but living in What?
The sinful nature is not really living now is it?

But she is a picture of something for sure, through Mary a virgin, was the Union
between God and mankind, Now in her is found to be the Mother of All living in and
through The Son of God. Really Living. It was the Woman that was deceived, it was
also a Woman that brought forth The Living Word.

First the natural then the Spiritual.

1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

The fact that God was able to bring forth His Son, through a Woman ought
to show you, that physical sex, is not necessary.

God is Spirit and Life.

 

[2knowhim]

So, if eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil was sex, then I guess they could freely have sex with every other tree in the graden?

Gen 2:16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
Gen 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

...And knowing they were naked (yes, I'm about to spiritualize here ) was sybolic of spiritual adultery even though I believe they literally knew they were naked. God has always liken idolatry to adultery. Adam and Eve allowed the serpent to come between them and God, which made the serpent their idol.

Lam_1:8 Jerusalem hath grievously sinned; therefore she is removed: all that honoured her despise her, because they have seen her nakedness: yea, she sigheth, and turneth backward.

Eze 16:36 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thy filthiness was poured out, and thy nakedness discovered through thy whoredoms with thy lovers, and with all the idols of thy abominations, and by the blood of thy children, which thou didst give unto them;
Eze_16:37 Behold, therefore I will gather all thy lovers, with whom thou hast taken pleasure, and all them that thou hast loved, with all them that thou hast hated; I will even gather them round about against thee, and will discover thy nakedness unto them, that they may see all thy nakedness.

Nah 3:5 Behold, I am against thee, saith the LORD of hosts; and I will discover thy skirts upon thy face, and I will shew the nations thy nakedness, and the kingdoms thy shame.

Yes, and also:

Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
Rev 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

 

[dishchat]

if it wasn't sex, then why Jesus came by a virgin? Why did David said that he had been conceived by sin?

 

[jandian]

No, it was sexual act.Eve had sex with serpent and then with adam. the sex of a person is in the middle of his body.Sex opened there intelligence and they knew that they were naked.If that act was only spiritual and not sex; why did Jesus came through a virgin and not by sex? Why did David said that his mother conceived him by sin in psalms 51 vs 5?

God told them to go forth and multiply which was b4 the fall , how were they going to do that ?

and just to add to that; sex is not sin