Catholicism vs Protestantism

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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
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Has anyone here actually BEEN to the vatican.
what is it like...what do you who are spiritually discerning sense from a place like that?
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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https://www.quora.com/Why-is-the-Vatican-s-largest-telescope-named-Lucifer-Is-that-a-joke

Vatican have the biggest telescope in mount Graham the Indian holy place and she name it LUCIFER

With this telescope They try to watch alien activities.

1. The name may tell that Vatican work for lucifer.

2. Alien activities is devil activities to deceive us
as I'm sure you know, "lucifer" just means "light bringer".

in a liturgical procession (Catholic or Protestant), the person carrying the candle is called the lucifer,
just like the person carrying the cross is called the crucifer.

I myself have been a lucifer.

the name "Lucifer" occurs only once in the Bible, and then only in the King James and closely related translations.

Isaiah 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

I think this is a better translation:
Your pride has been sent down to Sheol.
The music from your harps announces the coming of your proud spirit.
Maggots will be the bed you lie on,
and other worms will cover your body like a blanket.
12 You were like the morning star,
but you have fallen from the sky.
In the past, all the nations on earth bowed down before you,
but now you have been cut down.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Isaiah+14&version=ERV

I think it's referring to the king of Babylon and comparing him to the planet Venus, which is also called the morning star or Lucifer.

Jesus calls himself the morning Star
“I, Jesus, have sent my angel to tell you these things for the churches. I am the descendant from the family of David. I am the bright morning star.”
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+22&version=ERV

so it's not surprising at all to me that the Vatican has a telescope named Lucifer.

when you say they use it to watch satanic alien activities, are you looking for the best in other people?
or assuming the worst?

Love never gives up.
Love cares more for others than for self.
Love doesn’t want what it doesn’t have.
Love doesn’t strut,
Doesn’t have a swelled head,
Doesn’t force itself on others,
Isn’t always “me first,”
Doesn’t fly off the handle,
Doesn’t keep score of the sins of others,
Doesn’t revel when others grovel,
Takes pleasure in the flowering of truth,
Puts up with anything,
Trusts God always,

Always looks for the best,

Never looks back,
But keeps going to the end.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+13&version=MSG
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
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as I'm sure you know, "lucifer" just means "light bringer".

in a liturgical procession (Catholic or Protestant), the person carrying the candle is called the lucifer,
just like the person carrying the cross is called the crucifer.

I myself have been a lucifer.

the name "Lucifer" occurs only once in the Bible, and then only in the King James and closely related translations.

Isaiah 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

I think this is a better translation:
Your pride has been sent down to Sheol.
The music from your harps announces the coming of your proud spirit.
Maggots will be the bed you lie on,
and other worms will cover your body like a blanket.
12 You were like the morning star,
but you have fallen from the sky.
In the past, all the nations on earth bowed down before you,
but now you have been cut down.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Isaiah+14&version=ERV

I think it's referring to the king of Babylon and comparing him to the planet Venus, which is also called the morning star or Lucifer.

Jesus calls himself the morning Star
“I, Jesus, have sent my angel to tell you these things for the churches. I am the descendant from the family of David. I am the bright morning star.”
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+22&version=ERV

so it's not surprising at all to me that the Vatican has a telescope named Lucifer.

when you say they use it to watch satanic alien activities, are you looking for the best in other people?
or assuming the worst?

Love never gives up.
Love cares more for others than for self.
Love doesn’t want what it doesn’t have.
Love doesn’t strut,
Doesn’t have a swelled head,
Doesn’t force itself on others,
Isn’t always “me first,”
Doesn’t fly off the handle,
Doesn’t keep score of the sins of others,
Doesn’t revel when others grovel,
Takes pleasure in the flowering of truth,
Puts up with anything,
Trusts God always,

Always looks for the best,

Never looks back,
But keeps going to the end.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+13&version=MSG
Most people think lucifer is Satan, why Vatican named that telescope lucifer?
And one of they do with that telescope is to watch alien
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
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Most people think lucifer is Satan, why Vatican named that telescope lucifer?
And one of they do with that telescope is to watch alien
I believe what you are experiencing is "confirmation bias".

"For example, a person may cherry-pick empirical data that supports one's belief, ignoring the remainder of the data that is not supportive."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

we may wish to
"Stop judging by the way things look. Be fair and judge by what is really right."
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John 7:23-25&version=ERV
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
113
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-the-Vatican-s-largest-telescope-named-Lucifer-Is-that-a-joke

Vatican have the biggest telescope in mount Graham the Indian holy place and she name it LUCIFER
some interesting quotes in the link from your post

"A: The telescope is actually called Large Binocular Telescope (LBT), and is a cooperation by a lot of people including the universities of Virginia, Notre Dame, Minnesota, Ohio State, and Arizona, the Italian National Astrophysics Institute, Leibniz and Max Planck institute, and a lot of others including companies.

On this telescope, there is an instrument for near infrared studies formerly called LUCIFER (Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Spectroscopic Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research) – and of course it is a joke. Every time you see an acronym that spells out into a word, it is either a joke or a political pun."

"However, the Vatican is not involved. They have the telescope next door, VATT; Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope. If you stand on the balcony of the LBT and have this view:"
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-the-Vatican-s-largest-telescope-named-Lucifer-Is-that-a-joke

are you sure it's in India?
this website talks about it being in Arizona, USA
https://www.catholic.com/qa/relax-the-vatican-didnt-name-a-telescope-lucifer
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
I believe what you are experiencing is "confirmation bias".

"For example, a person may cherry-pick empirical data that supports one's belief, ignoring the remainder of the data that is not supportive."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

we may wish to
"Stop judging by the way things look. Be fair and judge by what is really right."
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John 7:23-25&version=ERV
I don't know what is your definition of judging?
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
some interesting quotes in the link from your post

"A: The telescope is actually called Large Binocular Telescope (LBT), and is a cooperation by a lot of people including the universities of Virginia, Notre Dame, Minnesota, Ohio State, and Arizona, the Italian National Astrophysics Institute, Leibniz and Max Planck institute, and a lot of others including companies.

On this telescope, there is an instrument for near infrared studies formerly called LUCIFER (Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Spectroscopic Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research) – and of course it is a joke. Every time you see an acronym that spells out into a word, it is either a joke or a political pun."

"However, the Vatican is not involved. They have the telescope next door, VATT; Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope. If you stand on the balcony of the LBT and have this view:"
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-the-Vatican-s-largest-telescope-named-Lucifer-Is-that-a-joke



are you sure it's in India?
this website talks about it being in Arizona, USA
https://www.catholic.com/qa/relax-the-vatican-didnt-name-a-telescope-lucifer
I say Indian/ Native American, not India

Quote

For the Apache in Arizona, one of these sacred places is Mount Graham: this place is called Dzil Nchaa Si An (Big Seated Mountain) and is mentioned in 32 of the sacred songs which have been handed down through the oral tradition for many generations. It is here that the Ga'an, the guardian spirits of the Apache, live.

End quote
 
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
2,972
113
I believe what you are experiencing is "confirmation bias".

"For example, a person may cherry-pick empirical data that supports one's belief, ignoring the remainder of the data that is not supportive."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

we may wish to
"Stop judging by the way things look. Be fair and judge by what is really right."
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John 7:23-25&version=ERV
==========================================================================================
oh my,
the vamp is so sly - she will deny the 'blood' on her hands - she will stand-up and 'lie' with ease,
because her disease is in her 'soul'...
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
some interesting quotes in the link from your post

"A: The telescope is actually called Large Binocular Telescope (LBT), and is a cooperation by a lot of people including the universities of Virginia, Notre Dame, Minnesota, Ohio State, and Arizona, the Italian National Astrophysics Institute, Leibniz and Max Planck institute, and a lot of others including companies.

On this telescope, there is an instrument for near infrared studies formerly called LUCIFER (Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Spectroscopic Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research) – and of course it is a joke. Every time you see an acronym that spells out into a word, it is either a joke or a political pun."

"However, the Vatican is not involved. They have the telescope next door, VATT; Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope. If you stand on the balcony of the LBT and have this view:"
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-the-Vatican-s-largest-telescope-named-Lucifer-Is-that-a-joke

are you sure it's in India?
this website talks about it being in Arizona, USA
https://www.catholic.com/qa/relax-the-vatican-didnt-name-a-telescope-lucifer
There are working together

MGIO is a division of Steward Observatory, the research arm for the Department of Astronomy at the University of Arizona. Scientific researchers from around the world make use of MGIO facilities. We serve this community, operating and maintaining facilities at the remote observing site located in the Pinaleño Mountains in southeast Arizona. This area is part of the Coronado National Forest -- administered by the Safford Ranger District, U.S. Forest Service. Our office, the MGIO Base Camp, is located at the eastern base of Mount Graham, six miles south of Safford, Arizona.

Research telescopes at MGIO are:

Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope

Heinrich Hertz Submillimeter Telescope

The Large Binocular Telescope
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
This quote is from the directors of Vatican astronomy

Quite

Corbally said the Vatican`s telescope on Mount Graham, with a 6-foot-diameter mirror, is expected to be one of the most accurate in the world.

Of the search for extraterrestrial life, Corbally said, ''We would be open to that sort of thing. Certainly, some of our efforts should be directed toward that.''

End quote
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
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I don't know what is your definition of judging?
well, looking at the entire chapter 7 in John,
I think the judgment that Jesus is talking about is deciding whether a person's ministry is good or evil.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,779
29,156
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Mark 1:8 I baptized you in water, but he will baptize you in the Holy Spirit."

I haven't researched this, but I think that may be the only saying that is in all four Gospels and the book of Acts (twice).
Two of the gospels also add, "and with fire." :)
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
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I say Indian/ Native American, not India

Quote

For the Apache in Arizona, one of these sacred places is Mount Graham: this place is called Dzil Nchaa Si An (Big Seated Mountain) and is mentioned in 32 of the sacred songs which have been handed down through the oral tradition for many generations. It is here that the Ga'an, the guardian spirits of the Apache, live.

End quote
ahh, yes, now I understand.
the telescope is in Arizona.

as I'm sure you already know,
Indian
can mean from India or native American.
(as I understand it, when Columbus landed in the Americas, he thought he was in the East Indies!)
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
113
I say Indian/ Native American, not India

Quote

For the Apache in Arizona, one of these sacred places is Mount Graham: this place is called Dzil Nchaa Si An (Big Seated Mountain) and is mentioned in 32 of the sacred songs which have been handed down through the oral tradition for many generations. It is here that the Ga'an, the guardian spirits of the Apache, live.

End quote
one other thought,
my guess is that they probably chose a mountain in Arizona because of atmospheric conditions there, not because it was a holy place for the natives.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
113
==========================================================================================
oh my,
the vamp is so sly - she will deny the 'blood' on her hands - she will stand-up and 'lie' with ease,
because her disease is in her 'soul'...
hi oldethennew!

does your reply relate to my post?

if so, how? :)
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
113
There are working together

MGIO is a division of Steward Observatory, the research arm for the Department of Astronomy at the University of Arizona. Scientific researchers from around the world make use of MGIO facilities. We serve this community, operating and maintaining facilities at the remote observing site located in the Pinaleño Mountains in southeast Arizona. This area is part of the Coronado National Forest -- administered by the Safford Ranger District, U.S. Forest Service. Our office, the MGIO Base Camp, is located at the eastern base of Mount Graham, six miles south of Safford, Arizona.

Research telescopes at MGIO are:

Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope

Heinrich Hertz Submillimeter Telescope

The Large Binocular Telescope
yes, the Vatican shares the facility with several other groups. I think this is very common.

it looks like the "Lucifer" telescope was basically a joke perpetrated by the Max Planck institute.

Christian chat itself shares facilities at cloudflare.com, which probably serves many sites we would find objectionable.

https://www.whoishostingthis.com/#search=christianchat.com
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
113
This quote is from the directors of Vatican astronomy

Quite

Corbally said the Vatican`s telescope on Mount Graham, with a 6-foot-diameter mirror, is expected to be one of the most accurate in the world.

Of the search for extraterrestrial life, Corbally said, ''We would be open to that sort of thing. Certainly, some of our efforts should be directed toward that.''

End quote
many Protestants search for extraterrestrial life, as well.

if I follow your reasoning, it's that aliens aren't mentioned in creation, therefore they must be Satan in disguise.

bacteria aren't mentioned in the creation story, either.
a bacterium is neither a plant from day 3 nor an animal from day 5 or 6.
I don't think we even knew they existed until microscopes were invented that were good enough to see them.
of course, a microscope is similar to a telescope.

so if people using a telescope one day see extraterrestrial life, to me that would be very similar to when humans first saw bacteria!

(of course "extraterrestrial life" doesn't necessarily imply "intelligent extraterrestrial life".)
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
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many Protestants search for extraterrestrial life, as well.

if I follow your reasoning, it's that aliens aren't mentioned in creation, therefore they must be Satan in disguise.

bacteria aren't mentioned in the creation story, either.
a bacterium is neither a plant from day 3 nor an animal from day 5 or 6.
I don't think we even knew they existed until microscopes were invented that were good enough to see them.
of course, a microscope is similar to a telescope.

so if people using a telescope one day see extraterrestrial life, to me that would be very similar to when humans first saw bacteria!

(of course "extraterrestrial life" doesn't necessarily imply "intelligent extraterrestrial life".)
Bactery and viruse not mention in the Bible, but Satan mention in the Bible and Satan is liar

This qoute make me think alien is Satan and Vatican promote Satan agenda

Vatican theologians consider the possibility that Jesus was a 'star child' and the immaculate conception was one of the earliest documented cases of alien abduction/visitation. Thus the Second Coming of Christ is expected to confirm that Jesus was in fact an extraterrestrial, or a human-alien hybrid.
Preparations for an alien 'god' are well on the way. The Church plans to reassure the faithful that the new ET reality doesn't negate the word of the Bible and Jesus Christ as the son of God. The Catholic Church will embrace the new 'savior' and encourage religious people everywhere to do the same.

End quote

https://exemplore.com/ufos-aliens/An-Alien-God-is-Coming-and-Vatican-is-Ready-for-Him