Conflicts between Genesis 1 & 2

[garee]

Genesis 2:19, And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Notice the verse starts out by merely stating a fact that out of the ground God formed the animals. It doesn't state then God formed out of the ground...

Exactly, no order of events. Chapter two is more to describe the difference and the reason in regard to the two different kinds of creations as pertaining to the image of God. Two entities of one Creation

Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

The first time he created something that he declared was not good was for man to be alone. Only God can be alone and find perfect satisfaction.

Gen 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.

 

[Adstar]

In regards to the order of creation for humans & animals, Genesis 1 says that animals are created on day 6 followed by humans, while Genesis 2 says that animals are created to be companion for Adam after he is created.

I did alot of research in the internet but none has given yet a satisfactory response. The findings are below:

1) The animals mentioned in Genesis 2 may be another special group of animals for naming purpose (this doesn sounds valid to me, then what about the initial group of animals, doesn this mean they're unnamed?)

2) The hebrew word may possibly be translated wrongly, which should be 'had formed' instead of 'formed' in Genesis 2:19 (it doesn make any difference to me as it has been clearly stated that this 'batch' of animals are created in an attempt to become comparable helpers for Adam, which is the realization of God after Adam's creation)

3) Genesis 1 is in chronological order while 2 is solely for elaboration. (I think this doesn sound convincing which appears to be the last resort of force explaining the way out of the conflict)

Im not bias nor trying to prove the invalidity of the bible, rather hoping to see validity in this situation to help boosting my faith so to speak.

Anyone care care to share your view on this matter pls, thanks alot.

Genisis 1 is giving a daily account in order..

Genesis 2 simply giving and accout of what God did.. In truth Genisis 2 19 is in Order..
Genisis 2
19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

So did God form every animal out of the ground first in the above verse... Yes..
And did God later take those animals to Adam to have them named.... Yes...

So this verse does not state when God created Adam.. There are no Day designations in this verse.. It is simply dealing with how the animals came to have their names..

 

[oldhermit]

Perhaps this will help.

By oldhermit

[FONT=Georgia, serif]Chapter Two[/FONT]


[FONT=Georgia, serif]I. And God Rested, 1-3. How is 'rested' defined by the text?[/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, serif]A. The completion of the hosts of heaven. This disavows any notion of progressive creation. Example: The star nursery theory. Natural processes do not overturn the operation of God and continue the process on their own. New star development is non-observable. Unlike animate life, stars do not produce after their own kind. All stars were created in a single point in time. When this work was completed and God was satisfied, HE STOPPED MAKING THEM.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
B. The completion of earthly life – No room for the theory of bio-evolution.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
C. God celebrated the completion of the creation process.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

1. He ceased from his work. When he stopped, it stopped.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
2. He blessed the day as the end of the act of creation.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
3. He set that day apart from the rest.[/FONT]


[FONT=Georgia, serif]II. The Vegetation Conundrum, 5-9.[/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, serif]A. How does verse 5 harmonize with 1:12?[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
In 1:12 the complete catalog of mature vegetation has already appeared 'ON' the earth. In verse 5, no shrub of the earth was yet 'IN' the earth, i.e. no plant “of the field” had yet sprouted. This is limiting. “Of the field” refers to those things that are intended for cultivation and harvest. This is confirmed by the requisite statement “for there was no man to till the ground.”[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

1. This is not a barren earth but an earth that is protected from over-growth due to the lack of human involvement.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
2. Grass is still growing, fruits are seeds are still being produced. The food chain is in tact. “They shall be food for you and all the animals,” 1:30.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

B. Two necessary ingredients for second generational growth – rainfall and a caretaker.[/FONT]


[FONT=Georgia, serif]III. The Formation of Man and the Planting of the Garden, 7-9, 15-17.[/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, serif]A. Man was formed outside the garden and brought into the garden. [/FONT] [FONT=Georgia, serif]
B. The garden environment[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

1. Aesthetic – pleasing to the senses.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
2. Protective – no dangers, nothing to harm, no fears.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
3. Controlled – every conceivable need is supplied – food, a helper, and responsibility.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

C. The sole prohibition: [/FONT]
“[FONT=Georgia, serif]Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall not eat of it: for in the day that you eat thereof you shall surely die. And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him.”[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

The epistemological standard for regulating human reason and behavior is forever set forth in this single text. “And the Lord God said...” No other considerations are relevant. Violation of this standard will prove fatal. “You shall surely die.” [/FONT]


[FONT=Georgia, serif]IV. Creation of Woman, 18-25.[/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, serif]A. Man is in need of a helper that is compatible and suitable to man.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
B. The presentation and naming of the animals. “To see what he would call them.” This is about more than Adam simply assigning names to the animals. In his naming of the animals, Adam calls none of them helper.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

1. There is no compatibility.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
2. They are not suited to satisfy man's physiological, or psychological, or emotional needs.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]

C. Formed out of Adam thus, not an independent creation. This makes woman unique among all created beings. [/FONT] [FONT=Georgia, serif]

1. Presented to man[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
2. Name and declaration of relationship [/FONT] [FONT=Georgia, serif]

a. Woman - because she is taken out of man.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
b. Wife – the two shall become one flesh.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
c. Satisfied all compatibility issues - physiologically, or psychologically, and emotionally.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, serif]
d. Suitable as a helper.[/FONT]

 

[trofimus]

[SUP]18 [/SUP]And the Lord God said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him.” [SUP]19 [/SUP]Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them.

Hi @trofimus, initially I was agreeable to the speculation that God might had created the animals not just once (before & after Adam). However; because Genesis 2:19 states that God formed every beast and bird, am I not right to interpret that "every" refers to "all" the animals that were supposed to be created, were only created after Adam based on the meaning of this verse?

God is guiding every process, indeed. So every creature is formed by Him. But I do not suppose Adam was seeing dinosaurs or trilobits and naming them in paradise.

So the creation of animals started long time ago before Adam. In the time of Adam, the animals we are living with today, was coming to scene.
So when we read "God Lord formed every beast" it means from the first simple life to the last breed of dog... which are various periods of time.

Thats why I think the 2) was the right one. From the past to the Adam's day.

I hope I can be understood.

 

[trofimus]

[SUP]18 [/SUP]And the Lord God said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him.” [SUP]19 [/SUP]Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them.

Hi @trofimus, initially I was agreeable to the speculation that God might had created the animals not just once (before & after Adam). However; because Genesis 2:19 states that God formed every beast and bird, am I not right to interpret that "every" refers to "all" the animals that were supposed to be created, were only created after Adam based on the meaning of this verse?

To your question, shortly - every beast, bird etc living in the time of Adam (logically).

 

[Tintin]

Genesis 2:19, And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Notice the verse starts out by merely stating a fact that out of the ground God formed the animals. It doesn't state then God formed out of the ground...

True, John. This bit used to stump me, but it's fairly straight-forward if you read the verse within the context of Chapter 2.

 

[Tintin]

Exactly, no order of events. Chapter two is more to describe the difference and the reason in regard to the two different kinds of creations as pertaining to the image of God. Two entities of one Creation

Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

The first time he created something that he declared was not good was for man to be alone. Only God can be alone and find perfect satisfaction.

Gen 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.

You're right about your latter point. But for your first point, that's not quite true. There aren't two different kinds of creation recorded in Genesis. There is one creation given two different focuses. Genesis 1 provides a general overview of Creation Week and Genesis 2 zeroes in on the creation of Adam and Eve and the geography of the garden of Eden.

 

[Bladerunner]

Hi @Bladerunner, yes I would agree on that to a certain extend. But you can't dismiss that Genesis 2:18 - 20, is clearly a chronological event, about the realization of God for getting him comparable helpers, which then He made beasts, but Adam found none suitable, then God created Eve. In these 2 verses, it is clearly not a summary but chronological event.

Ivon:

First as I have already stated in my first posting on this thread, creation week was the first 6 days of Genesis 1. Chapter 2 contains the Sabbath and a summary of what happened during creation week. If one tried hard enough, one could insert the verses of chapter 2 within Chapter 1s corresponding verses.

But to answer you question:

In Genesis 2: 18 "And the Lord God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him."

(Heb. 'ezer ke-negdo; i.e., "a help as his counterpart" = a help suitable to him), a wife (Gen 2:18-20). In Hebrew the two words that "help meet" are derived from are the words "ezer" and the word 'k’enegdo".

The Hebrew word "Ezer" (strongs H5828) with a primitive root: " " עָזַר ʻâzar, aw-zar'; to surround, i.e. protect or aid:—help, succour."

The Hebrew word " 'K' enegdo" (Strongs H5046) neged, neh'-ghed; a front, i.e. part opposite; specifically a counterpart, or mate; usually (adverbial, especially with preposition) over against or before:—about, (over) against, × aloof, × far (off), × from, over, presence, × other side, sight,

Now that the Defs are out of the way:

Genesis 2: 18 (KJV) states: "And the Lord God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him."

Genesis 2:19 is simply a chore given to Adam by God to name all of the animals that God had created up to this point in time.


Genesis 2:20 reads a little different. "And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him."

*Here it is Adam (not God) who sees there is NO "Help Meet" for him.


Genesis 2:21-22.."21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;22 And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man."

Thereby the Lord created Woman from Adam as his "Help Meet"

Ivon: All of the above the whole chapter 2 of Genesis except the first 3 verses happened during the first six days of creation week.

 

[OneFaith]

Genesis 2:19, And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Notice the verse starts out by merely stating a fact that out of the ground God formed the animals. It doesn't state then God formed out of the ground...

I guess I don't understand what your point is, or question. God made birds and animals on different days, therefore this is a summery of events. Is your point that God made both humans and animals out of the ground? We are still made in God's image, and they are not. Maybe you can be more specific.

 

[Ivon]

To your question, shortly - every beast, bird etc living in the time of Adam (logically).

After further thoughts, I don't agree that the animals in Genesis 2 is referring to those that He created. It seems to me that God is letting us know that by forming the animals out of the ground was the result after He felt the need for Adam to have a comparative helper. If not, that statement of getting a comparative helper wouldn't have been mentioned and preceded the forming of beasts out of the ground.

And I suspect that these animals that are formed again may be some specimens or sort of representative group of the animals that He had created. I may be wrong on this but I thought its highly possible.

 

[Ivon]

Ivon:

First as I have already stated in my first posting on this thread, creation week was the first 6 days of Genesis 1. Chapter 2 contains the Sabbath and a summary of what happened during creation week. If one tried hard enough, one could insert the verses of chapter 2 within Chapter 1s corresponding verses.

But to answer you question:

In Genesis 2: 18 "And the Lord God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him."

(Heb. 'ezer ke-negdo; i.e., "a help as his counterpart" = a help suitable to him), a wife (Gen 2:18-20). In Hebrew the two words that "help meet" are derived from are the words "ezer" and the word 'k’enegdo".

The Hebrew word "Ezer" (strongs H5828) with a primitive root: " " עָזַר ʻâzar, aw-zar'; to surround, i.e. protect or aid:—help, succour."

The Hebrew word " 'K' enegdo" (Strongs H5046) neged, neh'-ghed; a front, i.e. part opposite; specifically a counterpart, or mate; usually (adverbial, especially with preposition) over against or before:—about, (over) against, × aloof, × far (off), × from, over, presence, × other side, sight,

Now that the Defs are out of the way:

Genesis 2: 18 (KJV) states: "And the Lord God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him."

Genesis 2:19 is simply a chore given to Adam by God to name all of the animals that God had created up to this point in time.


Genesis 2:20 reads a little different. "And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him."

*Here it is Adam (not God) who sees there is NO "Help Meet" for him.


Genesis 2:21-22.."21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;22 And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man."

Thereby the Lord created Woman from Adam as his "Help Meet"

Ivon: All of the above the whole chapter 2 of Genesis except the first 3 verses happened during the first six days of creation week.

@Bladerunner, can you share exactly how you harmonize Genesis 2:18-20 into the day 6 creation of animals in day 1?

 

[Tintin]

After further thoughts, I don't agree that the animals in Genesis 2 is referring to those that He created. It seems to me that God is letting us know that by forming the animals out of the ground was the result after He felt the need for Adam to have a comparative helper.

And I suspect that these animals that are formed again may be some specimens or sort of representative group of the animals that He had created. I may be wrong on this but I thought its highly possible.

I think you're wrong. God created animals on day six, then Adam and later, Eve. He didn't recreate any animal.

 

[Tintin]

@Bladerunner, can you share exactly how you harmonize Genesis 2:18-20 into the day 6 creation of animals in day 1?

No animals were created on day 1. Adam named the animals later on in the day on day 6.

 

[Bladerunner]

@Bladerunner, can you share exactly how you harmonize Genesis 2:18-20 into the day 6 creation of animals in day 1?

Ivon:

I referred to Genesis 1 not day one?

 

[Ivon]

I think you're wrong. God created animals on day six, then Adam and later, Eve. He didn't recreate any animal.

So then what is your understanding of the verses below and why. The sentence structure seems implying that as a result of God realizing that it wasn't good for a man to be alone, God formed the beast.

[SUP]18 [/SUP]And the Lord God said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him.” [SUP]19 [/SUP]Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them.

 

[Ivon]

Ivon:

I referred to Genesis 1 not day one?

Sorry it was a typo, I meant day 6 in Genesis 1.

 

[Bladerunner]

@Bladerunner, can you share exactly how you harmonize Genesis 2:18-20 into the day 6 creation of animals in day 1?

Simple....Genesis 2: 4-25 is a summary.......

I know what you are doing for in genesis 2:19..."And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof."

This simply shows you how he created them by pulling them out of the ground...In other words they too are made of dust just like Adam was. "formed" is not "made or Created"

As far as justifying it with Genesis 1: 24-27...God created the beast, fowls, etc (verse 25) and created man and woman (verse 26-27) afterwards.

Again Genesis 2:4-25 is a simple summary (the whats and hows) of creation week !

if you still think that God created animals to be a "Help Meet" then it is evident you did not agree with my last post. I can offer nothing more to help you.
http://christianchat.com/images/icons/icon7.png

 

[posthuman]

In regards to the order of creation for humans & animals, Genesis 1 says that animals are created on day 6 followed by humans, while Genesis 2 says that animals are created to be companion for Adam after he is created.

i have this habit of responding to the originating post before reading the replies. Sorry if this is previously covered and the repetition of the explanation is bothersome. Call it reinforcement, if that's the case.
i guess i kind of like to reply sometimes without my thoughts being 'tainted' by the answers others give, and then later see how my own understanding might change by what else has been said.

[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]

​

The Lord God said,
“It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him.”
Now the Lord God had formed out of the ground all the wild animals and all the birds in the sky. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name. So the man gave names to all the livestock, the birds in the sky and all the wild animals.
But for Adam no suitable helper was found.
(Genesis 2:18-19)
​

[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]
This does not say that the animals were created expressly to be Adam's companion. i don't know where you get that notion from. It says that the Lord God decided to make a companion for the man, and His way of going about it was to bring the animals which He had ((specifically)) already created to the man, among which none were found suitable, and ((in the verses not quoted, which follow)) then to create the woman.
The purpose of the manner in which He carried these things out is not expressed, so you have to read it into the text. two possibilities here:

(1) God didn't know whether any of the animals would be suitable, so He organized a test to determine which, if any were. This understanding has a couple of problems: for one, it assumes a Creator who is ignorant of the intricacies of His creation. For another, it is in conflict with the text, which says the Lord God determined aforehand that He "will create" an helpmate, and the text next specifically restates that the animals were all already in existence. By saying that He determined to create a companion, it is inferred that His understanding was already that no existing creature would be suitable for this purpose.

(2) God knew that none of the creatures He had already creates would be suitable, but Adam didn't know this. So the Lord God organized a test to demonstrate this fact, and then Adam too would know that in all of creation, nothing was suitable as a companion to Him, and so the necessity of woman would be established. This completely jives with the text, and also illustrates a truth about the the nature of man: his understanding comes by experience, if it is not divinely given. Adam had to "see for himself" that he needed woman, who did not even yet exist.

 

[Ivon]

i have this habit of responding to the originating post before reading the replies. Sorry if this is previously covered and the repetition of the explanation is bothersome. Call it reinforcement, if that's the case.
i guess i kind of like to reply sometimes without my thoughts being 'tainted' by the answers others give, and then later see how my own understanding might change by what else has been said.

[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]

​

The Lord God said,
“It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him.”
Now the Lord God had formed out of the ground all the wild animals and all the birds in the sky. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name. So the man gave names to all the livestock, the birds in the sky and all the wild animals.
But for Adam no suitable helper was found.
(Genesis 2:18-19)
​

[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]
This does not say that the animals were created expressly to be Adam's companion. i don't know where you get that notion from. It says that the Lord God decided to make a companion for the man, and His way of going about it was to bring the animals which He had ((specifically)) already created to the man, among which none were found suitable, and ((in the verses not quoted, which follow)) then to create the woman.
The purpose of the manner in which He carried these things out is not expressed, so you have to read it into the text. two possibilities here:

(1) God didn't know whether any of the animals would be suitable, so He organized a test to determine which, if any were. This understanding has a couple of problems: for one, it assumes a Creator who is ignorant of the intricacies of His creation. For another, it is in conflict with the text, which says the Lord God determined aforehand that He "will create" an helpmate, and the text next specifically restates that the animals were all already in existence. By saying that He determined to create a companion, it is inferred that His understanding was already that no existing creature would be suitable for this purpose.

(2) God knew that none of the creatures He had already creates would be suitable, but Adam didn't know this. So the Lord God organized a test to demonstrate this fact, and then Adam too would know that in all of creation, nothing was suitable as a companion to Him, and so the necessity of woman would be established. This completely jives with the text, and also illustrates a truth about the the nature of man: his understanding comes by experience, if it is not divinely given. Adam had to "see for himself" that he needed woman, who did not even yet exist.

Hi Posthuman, I totally agree with what you all said, but why do you think it is referring to animals He already created in Genesis 1?

 

[Ivon]

Simple....Genesis 2: 4-25 is a summary.......

I know what you are doing for in genesis 2:19..."And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof."

This simply shows you how he created them by pulling them out of the ground...In other words they too are made of dust just like Adam was. "formed" is not "made or Created"

As far as justifying it with Genesis 1: 24-27...God created the beast, fowls, etc (verse 25) and created man and woman (verse 26-27) afterwards.

Again Genesis 2:4-25 is a simple summary (the whats and hows) of creation week !

if you still think that God created animals to be a "Help Meet" then it is evident you did not agree with my last post. I can offer nothing more to help you.
http://christianchat.com/images/icons/icon7.png

@Bladerunner, you mean God created animals in Genesis 1, but only formed them in Genesis 2?