creationist debate?

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miknik5

miknik5

Senior Member
#521
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
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#521
I don´t believe that....I believe that when HE descended and went by THE SPIRIT, HIS purpose was to free those who had died who had not had the benefit of being alive at HIS FIRST coming, therefore had not heard THE GOSPEL preached..and I believe hat these benefitted more than the men today (this generation who had the benefit of hearing THE GOSPEL preached), but who continue in disbelief....

Which is why they will rise in the judgment and condemn this generation (that is, those who had the benefit of HIS coming but did not believe)

the men of ninevah will stand in the judgment and condemn this generation for they listened to the words of Jonah...yet now ONE GREATER than Jonah has come....
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#522
#522
miknik5 said:
Then all the OT people, who were not saints, were lost?

Yet CHRIST is ETERNAL and HIS SACRIFICE stretches backwards, to present, to forwards?

Yet these who were unfortunately not present to repent, having not heard THE GOSPEL, having not benefitted by HIS COMING, are lost

Is this what you are saying?
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All OT and NT people who were not saved by faith are lost.

All OT and NT people who came to God in faith are saved.

the gospel is the same by grace through faith..

The only benefit we have is we know HOW God saved us, they looked forward without knowing the particulars, But trusted God anyway
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#523
#523
miknik5 said:
So Adam and every other man who died prior to Christś coming, along with the men present and the future who do not believe the GOSPEL are waiting for the resurrection...but the OT saints will be caught up with everyone else who has believed.
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This is what I mean when I say you are not understanding me
Adam, who is the first man, who through his disobedience, though GOD already knew that Adam would sin, has to wait until the day of Judgment...
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what?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#524
#524
miknik5 said:
I don´t believe that....I believe that when HE descended and went by THE SPIRIT, HIS purpose was to free those who had died who had not had the benefit of being alive at HIS FIRST coming, therefore had not heard THE GOSPEL preached..and I believe hat these benefitted more than the men today (this generation who had the benefit of hearing THE GOSPEL preached), but who continue in disbelief....

Which is why they will rise in the judgment and condemn this generation (that is, those who had the benefit of HIS coming but did not believe)

the men of ninevah will stand in the judgment and condemn this generation for they listened to the words of Jonah...yet now ONE GREATER than Jonah has come....
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Well that means they get a chance which no other man, who has seen eternity as they have, that no other person who ever lived will get. And they are not punished like all people on earth are punished for the sin of unbelief.

I can not buy this..
 
miknik5

miknik5

Senior Member
#525
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#525
eternally-gratefull said:
what?
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Yes. GOD knew Adam would fall...please read GODŚ directive to ¨Adam/Man...

HE gave Adam/mankind one command...which was not to eat from one particular tree...
But, HE didn say if you eat of it, maybe you will eat of it, possibly or perchance you eat of it.

HE said this....IN THE DAY YOU EAT OF IT, YOU WILL SURELY DIE...

IN THE DAY...that means GOD knew there would be THAT DAY
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#526
#526
miknik5 said:
Yes. GOD knew Adam would fall...please read GODŚ directive to ¨Adam/Man...
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Yes he did, He knew we all would sin. But I am not sure what that has to do with out discussion. God already made a way.

HE gave Adam/mankind one command...which was not to eat from one particular tree...
But, HE didn say if you eat of it, maybe you will eat of it, possibly or perchance you eat of it.

HE said this....IN THE DAY YOU EAT OF IT, YOU WILL SURELY DIE...

IN THE DAY...that means GOD knew there would be THAT DAY
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yep. And he died spiritually as did all mankind after him, Requiring mankind to have faith in God by admitting their sinfulness and total failure and how they deserve their fate, and call out for God to have mercy on them

Just like the tax collector did..

Tax collector did not call out to Jesus. He called out to God. and God saved him.. Just like he did all in the OT who did the same
 
JeremiahsCup

JeremiahsCup

Banned
#527
Feb 1, 2020
725
225
43
35
#527
dcontroversal said:
116 days 18 hours is one earth day right now on Venus....can anyone prove by the text of Genesis that an evening and morning = one 24 hour period?

Once God stopped the rotation of the earth (Joshua)

Once God reversed the rotation of the earth (Isaiah)

Point being....NO one can prove one 24 hour period per creation day in Genesis by the text alone and an evening and a morning COULD HAVE BEEN 24 hours or 10 million (earth years now) and still be ONE EVENING AND ONE MORNING

Just saying.....to make a fair point!
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I would like to see the scripture which says the earth's rotation was stopped and the earth's rotation was reversed. I am pretty sure that there is no scripture that says this.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#528
#528
JeremiahsCup said:
I would like to see the scripture which says the earth's rotation was stopped and the earth's rotation was reversed. I am pretty sure that there is no scripture that says this.
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he extended a day for an hour I think in joshuas case. The only way to do that is to stop the earths rotation for one hour
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#530
#530
JeremiahsCup said:
Well then it should be pretty easy to post the scripture that says this.
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well forgive me, it was more than just an hour

Josh 10:
“Sun, stand still over Gibeon;
And Moon, in the Valley of Aijalon.”
13 So the sun stood still,
And the moon stopped,
Till the people had revenge
Upon their enemies.
Is this not written in the Book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and did not hasten to go down for about a whole day. 14 And there has been no day like that, before it or after it, that the Lord heeded the voice of a man; for the Lord fought for Israel.
 
JeremiahsCup

JeremiahsCup

Banned
#531
Feb 1, 2020
725
225
43
35
#531
eternally-gratefull said:
well forgive me, it was more than just an hour

Josh 10:
“Sun, stand still over Gibeon;
And Moon, in the Valley of Aijalon.”
13 So the sun stood still,
And the moon stopped,
Till the people had revenge
Upon their enemies.
Is this not written in the Book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and did not hasten to go down for about a whole day. 14 And there has been no day like that, before it or after it, that the Lord heeded the voice of a man; for the Lord fought for Israel.
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This scripture says that Joshua told the Sun to stand still over Gibeon and the Moon in the valley of Aijalon. It then says the Sun stood still and the Moon stopped. It additionally says that the Sun stood still in the midst of the heavens and didn't make haste to go down for about a day.
 
miknik5

miknik5

Senior Member
#532
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#532
eternally-gratefull said:
Yes he did, He knew we all would sin. But I am not sure what that has to do with out discussion. God already made a way.



yep. And he died spiritually as did all mankind after him, Requiring mankind to have faith in God by admitting their sinfulness and total failure and how they deserve their fate, and call out for God to have mercy on them

Just like the tax collector did..

Tax collector did not call out to Jesus. He called out to God. and God saved him.. Just like he did all in the OT who did the same
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I would like you to explain to me Isaiah 61, referring back to Luke 4 as this is the scripture which CHRIST read from declaring HIS PRESENT MINISTRY...and that the words which HE read were fulfilled in HIS coming....

I know that CHRIST has a two fold ministry....so, are you then suggesting that CHRIST, by the SPIRIT, actually changed HIS MINISTRY as the lamb of GOD, to the LION when HE went to preach to those spirits in prison?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#533
#533
JeremiahsCup said:
This scripture says that Joshua told the Sun to stand still over Gibeon and the Moon in the valley of Aijalon. It then says the Sun stood still and the Moon stopped. It additionally says that the Sun stood still in the midst of the heavens and didn't make haste to go down for about a day.
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ok so lets think of this, The sun sat still. And the earth still rotates..

The land still would have went dark.. It is the rotation of the earth, Not the sun that causes day and night

Yes, In joshua's day, it appeared the sun stood still.. and if I was him, I would have thought the same and wrote the same

But we know better today.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#534
#534
miknik5 said:
I would like you to explain to me Isaiah 61, referring back to Luke 4 as this is the scripture which CHRIST read from declaring HIS PRESENT MINISTRY...and that the words which HE read were fulfilled in HIS coming....

I know that CHRIST has a two fold ministry....so, are you then suggesting that CHRIST, by the SPIRIT, actually changed HIS MINISTRY as the lamb of GOD, to the LION when HE went to preach to those spirits in prison?
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I am gonna be honest sis

I have no Idea what you are trying to say and all this ministry stuff. The way your trying to present it makes no sense.

I am just saying what I see, that the people who died. Died knowing that they were in sin, Died knowing who God was. and died knowing they willfully rejected God (see romans 1) and as suck, they will have no excuse on judgment day

God did not give them a second chance

If you think he did. Well that's fine.. I disagree, and think if that is true, God is not fair.

But that is me

it is not worth fighting over any more sis. So will agree to disagree..

Thanks for honest discussion. I appreciate it
 
miknik5

miknik5

Senior Member
#535
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#535
eternally-gratefull said:
I am gonna be honest sis

I have no Idea what you are trying to say and all this ministry stuff. The way your trying to present it makes no sense.

I am just saying what I see, that the people who died. Died knowing that they were in sin, Died knowing who God was. and died knowing they willfully rejected God (see romans 1) and as suck, they will have no excuse on judgment day

God did not give them a second chance

If you think he did. Well that's fine.. I disagree, and think if that is true, God is not fair.

But that is me

it is not worth fighting over any more sis. So will agree to disagree..

Thanks for honest discussion. I appreciate it
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Why not? Read the scripture that JESUS read from when HE closed the books in Luke 4 and said...today, scripture has been fulfilled in your hearing...
CHRIST has two ministries:

THE LAMB Of GOD - A MINISTRY of RECONCILIATION
THE LION of the TRIBE of JUDAH - the day of vengeance of our GOD (as Per Isaiah, and the very verse HE did not repeat when HE stood in the temple and declared HIS MINISTRY)
 
miknik5

miknik5

Senior Member
#536
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#536
You are right...It is NOT worth fighting over...and we are not to even say who will ascend or who will descend.
So, yes...I want to drop this discussion too....
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#537
#537
miknik5 said:
Why not? Read the scripture that JESUS read from when HE closed the books in Luke 4 and said...today, scripture has been fulfilled in your hearing...
CHRIST has two ministries:

THE LAMB Of GOD - A MINISTRY of RECONCILIATION
THE LION of the TRIBE of JUDAH - the day of vengeance of our GOD (as Per Isaiah, and the very verse HE did not repeat when HE stood in the temple and declared HIS MINISTRY)
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I do not see how this has any bearing on our discussion

We are talking about unbelievers in the OT, who when they died, ended up in prison (hades) and Jesus going to preach to them

did Jesus offer them salvation again? I say no, it appears you say yes.

I disagree..
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#538
#538
miknik5 said:
You are right...It is NOT worth fighting over...and we are not to even say who will ascend or who will descend.
So, yes...I want to drop this discussion too....
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Love ya sis, DO not want to put any enmity between us because we disagree here. Not that it would. But you know how things get sometimes..lol
 
JeremiahsCup

JeremiahsCup

Banned
#539
Feb 1, 2020
725
225
43
35
#539
eternally-gratefull said:
ok so lets think of this, The sun sat still. And the earth still rotates..

The land still would have went dark.. It is the rotation of the earth, Not the sun that causes day and night

Yes, In joshua's day, it appeared the sun stood still.. and if I was him, I would have thought the same and wrote the same

But we know better today.
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Pretty sure it doesn't say the earth rotates in that passage. Pretty sure it says the Sun stopped moving, and even says the Sun didn't make haste to go down. For that matter it even says the Moon stopped moving.

So does this mean that Joshua is lying or else a moron? Or perhaps God deceived Joshua? Or maybe it is that the people today are so much smarter than God and Joshua?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#540
#540
JeremiahsCup said:
Pretty sure it doesn't say the earth rotates in that passage. Pretty sure it says the Sun stopped moving, and even says the Sun didn't make haste to go down. For that matter it even says the Moon stopped moving.

So does this mean that Joshua is lying or else a moron? Or perhaps God deceived Joshua? Or maybe it is that the people today are so much smarter than God and Joshua?
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Prety sure you are just here to argue

Joshua wrote down what he saw and thought. Again, If I was him, I would think the sun stopped to,

Again, We know today that is not true. But if you want to keep this up Well I can not help you
 
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