M
Uh...because that was what I was interested in commenting on. (?) I'm not a "Berean" because I haven't commented on some particular topic you have dictatorially stipulated?
There you go again. You simply 'announce' your conclusions. You impose your views. You don't 'discuss'. You don't 'argue'. You don't 'reason'. You have this incredibly strange mindset...that you are 'entitled' to hand down the "correct" views from your pedestal on high. It is so very strange. And as others have obsrved...it is absolutely a classic "cultic" mindset. It would be interesting to know how you fell into such a thing.
But meanwhile...yes, you are absolutely "begging the question" of whether God's wrath spans the entire 7 years of the 70th Week...or whether God's wrath only begins deep inside that period of time, past the mid-point and AFTER the appearance of the cosmic signs JUST AS JOEL 2:31 STATES and as is resoundingly echoed in Rev. 6.
You WILL NOT TOUCH a discussion of these evidences. Instead, you simply hand down the "correct" views from your imagined perch on high...and with ZERO discussion of other folks' countering arguments and evidence.
Now..you see, this is where I get in trouble with a couple of your PreTrib compatriots:
You just told a lie. You said that I "proclaim that the Lord is going to put his church through his wrath". That is a blatant lie. I have told you repeatedly, I believe God's people do NOT go through God's wrath. Now, all the PreTribbers here are going to say I'm mean and unfriendly and discourteous - LOL. Can you explain this lie, Ahwatukee? A point-blank lie? I say to you yet again (for the tenth time, is it?): I believe God's people are removed from earth before God's wrath.
Why are you bothering with this lecture? How very odd. There is already a full agreement that God's people do not experience God's wrath.
The only area of disagreement with this aspect of Bible prophecy is...WHEN does God's wrath begin? I see the scriptures clearly indicating it begins at the time of the cosmic disturbances. You claim something else.
One of your many problems with this "gathering" is...whether these are your so-called "tribulation saints" who are on earth at the very end of the 7 years, or not...Jesus' stipulation still stands...that, according to Him, "no one knows the day or hour". But these believers would, in your mistaken scenario, know the very day! That can't be. This "gathering" would happen after exactly 1260 days. And that would contradict Jesus' words.
My, how lovely. This "garbage" I have been presenting is the simple fact that Jesus told Peter, James and John to expect the Abomination of Desolation, and the simple fact that they went out from their hearing of Jesus' Olivet Disocurse believing what Jesus had told them...
...at which point PreTrib is forced to assert...that Peter, James and John were mistaken...that they believed wrongly...that they believed and held to false doctrine...the founding leaders of the Christian era held to erroneous doctrine...
...and therefore they would have obviously also passed along erroneous, false doctrine...and that furthermore (and worst of all) Jesus had delivered that false doctrine and wrongful belief into the hands of Peter, James and John.
And therefore (as I have previously said) is PreTrib an absolutely invalidated and utter absurdity in the extreme.
There you go again. You simply 'announce' your conclusions. You impose your views. You don't 'discuss'. You don't 'argue'. You don't 'reason'. You have this incredibly strange mindset...that you are 'entitled' to hand down the "correct" views from your pedestal on high. It is so very strange. And as others have obsrved...it is absolutely a classic "cultic" mindset. It would be interesting to know how you fell into such a thing.
But meanwhile...yes, you are absolutely "begging the question" of whether God's wrath spans the entire 7 years of the 70th Week...or whether God's wrath only begins deep inside that period of time, past the mid-point and AFTER the appearance of the cosmic signs JUST AS JOEL 2:31 STATES and as is resoundingly echoed in Rev. 6.
You WILL NOT TOUCH a discussion of these evidences. Instead, you simply hand down the "correct" views from your imagined perch on high...and with ZERO discussion of other folks' countering arguments and evidence.
Now..you see, this is where I get in trouble with a couple of your PreTrib compatriots:
You just told a lie. You said that I "proclaim that the Lord is going to put his church through his wrath". That is a blatant lie. I have told you repeatedly, I believe God's people do NOT go through God's wrath. Now, all the PreTribbers here are going to say I'm mean and unfriendly and discourteous - LOL. Can you explain this lie, Ahwatukee? A point-blank lie? I say to you yet again (for the tenth time, is it?): I believe God's people are removed from earth before God's wrath.
Why are you bothering with this lecture? How very odd. There is already a full agreement that God's people do not experience God's wrath.
The only area of disagreement with this aspect of Bible prophecy is...WHEN does God's wrath begin? I see the scriptures clearly indicating it begins at the time of the cosmic disturbances. You claim something else.
One of your many problems with this "gathering" is...whether these are your so-called "tribulation saints" who are on earth at the very end of the 7 years, or not...Jesus' stipulation still stands...that, according to Him, "no one knows the day or hour". But these believers would, in your mistaken scenario, know the very day! That can't be. This "gathering" would happen after exactly 1260 days. And that would contradict Jesus' words.
My, how lovely. This "garbage" I have been presenting is the simple fact that Jesus told Peter, James and John to expect the Abomination of Desolation, and the simple fact that they went out from their hearing of Jesus' Olivet Disocurse believing what Jesus had told them...
...at which point PreTrib is forced to assert...that Peter, James and John were mistaken...that they believed wrongly...that they believed and held to false doctrine...the founding leaders of the Christian era held to erroneous doctrine...
...and therefore they would have obviously also passed along erroneous, false doctrine...and that furthermore (and worst of all) Jesus had delivered that false doctrine and wrongful belief into the hands of Peter, James and John.
And therefore (as I have previously said) is PreTrib an absolutely invalidated and utter absurdity in the extreme.