Daniel Chapter Three

[CS1]

Jerusalem was besieged three times...and my problem is the following statement.....DANIEL was alive and WELL in the Kingdom, He was over ALL the provinces of Babylon and served Nebuchadnezzar personally.....I like everything you have said, I disagree with the following....and for the record....again I say the following....there were three times captives were carried away captive...The first time Nebuchadnezzar besieged Jerusalem that led to captives being taken was in 605 B.C before Nebuchadnezzar was crowned King, the second in 597 B.C., the third was in 587 B.C. which resulted in the complete destruction of Jerusalem and Jeremiah's Book of Lamentations....in the latter some 50,000 Jews were carried away captive.

In the first event some 10,000 were carried away captive "2nd Kings 24:12-16"

Note....in the Second it mentions 10,000 of the Goodly men....this does not include women and children..

Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon, spoiled Jerusalem and took treasures from Solomon’s Temple. Ten thousand of the leading men of Judah were taken into captivity to Babylon. The national leadership in Jerusalem continued to follow their wicked ways until Nebuchadnezzar laid siege of the city and a breach was made into the city wall. King Zedekiah (Mattaniah, 597-586 B.C.) attempted to escape, but was captured and taken to Babylon in chains. The Babylonians killed his sons in his sight and then blinded him. The walls of Jerusalem were destroyed and the temple burned to the ground. All of the city’s treasurers were taken to Babylon. The remaining leaders of Judah were killed and the rest of the people were carried into captivity to Babylon. Only the very poorest people remained in Judah in the hills who later fled to Egypt (2 Kings 25:23-30).

From study and history it seems Daniel, Hanniah, Mishael and Azariah were carried away around 601 B.C. with a small number of goodly children....then the carrying away captive of 10,000 in 597 and then 10,000 men PLUS women and children in 586 when Jerusalem was destroyed. My only problem with what you have said is the following statement of fact which seems to contradict in the very minimum DANIEL'S faithfulness.

Why did the King only throw three people in the fiery furnace?

Well it is clear, they were the only ones who would not bow. Remember this verse

That is your assumption. I never heard anyone ever assume Daniel was not faithful. You read into the application, why I don't know.

The question why did the King only throw three in was rhetorical yet we still have the context in verse 27 that says All bowed . By your human reasoning you assumed it meant Daniel bowed. Also by your assumption I guess we can say Peter was not only one who denied Christ even though we know all left HIM.

 

[CS1]

Jerusalem was besieged three times...and my problem is the following statement.....DANIEL was alive and WELL in the Kingdom, He was over ALL the provinces of Babylon and served Nebuchadnezzar personally.....I like everything you have said, I disagree with the following....and for the record....again I say the following....there were three times captives were carried away captive...The first time Nebuchadnezzar besieged Jerusalem that led to captives being taken was in 605 B.C before Nebuchadnezzar was crowned King, the second in 597 B.C., the third was in 587 B.C. which resulted in the complete destruction of Jerusalem and Jeremiah's Book of Lamentations....in the latter some 50,000 Jews were carried away captive.

In the first event some 10,000 were carried away captive "2nd Kings 24:12-16"

Note....in the Second it mentions 10,000 of the Goodly men....this does not include women and children..

Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon, spoiled Jerusalem and took treasures from Solomon’s Temple. Ten thousand of the leading men of Judah were taken into captivity to Babylon. The national leadership in Jerusalem continued to follow their wicked ways until Nebuchadnezzar laid siege of the city and a breach was made into the city wall. King Zedekiah (Mattaniah, 597-586 B.C.) attempted to escape, but was captured and taken to Babylon in chains. The Babylonians killed his sons in his sight and then blinded him. The walls of Jerusalem were destroyed and the temple burned to the ground. All of the city’s treasurers were taken to Babylon. The remaining leaders of Judah were killed and the rest of the people were carried into captivity to Babylon. Only the very poorest people remained in Judah in the hills who later fled to Egypt (2 Kings 25:23-30).

From study and history it seems Daniel, Hanniah, Mishael and Azariah were carried away around 601 B.C. with a small number of goodly children....then the carrying away captive of 10,000 in 597 and then 10,000 men PLUS women and children in 586 when Jerusalem was destroyed. My only problem with what you have said is the following statement of fact which seems to contradict in the very minimum DANIEL'S faithfulness.

Why did the King only throw three people in the fiery furnace?

Well it is clear, they were the only ones who would not bow. Remember this verse

wow you know I posted This thread in about 30 minutes after prayer and many have saw it to be edifying. You have went back and did an exhausted historical narrative that still does not address the application or context of why only there would not bow? As you assume or we agree Daniel did not bow even though the chapter doesn't mention Daniel not bowing it is contextually appropriate to believe daniel did not bow because of later situation in the Lions den .

 

[Lafftur]

Do you believe Daniel bowed?

I do not believe Daniel bowed.....

I bet God conveniently placed Daniel down in the King’s cellar taking inventory, he heard the music and simply thought to himself, “Whew! I escaped that persecution....thanks Lord!”

 

[dcontroversal]

I do not believe Daniel bowed.....

I bet God conveniently placed Daniel down in the King’s cellar taking inventory, he heard the music and simply thought to himself, “Whew! I escaped that persecution....thanks Lord!”

I agree on your first statement...100%

 

[dcontroversal]

wow you know I posted This thread in about 30 minutes after prayer and many have saw it to be edifying. You have went back and did an exhausted historical narrative that still does not address the application or context of why only there would not bow? As you assume or we agree Daniel did not bow even though the chapter doesn't mention Daniel not bowing it is contextually appropriate to believe daniel did not bow because of later situation in the Lions den .

I done nothing....I studied this in seminary under O.T. Survey, Major Prophets, Minor Prophets and the Heart of Hebrew History.....remember....the seminary you accused me of not attending... ..... I am not in any way, shape or form mouthing your thread migo or you.....I simply pointed out that this whole context was directed at these three, I do not believe they were the only ones to not bow, but that for some reason these three were singled out by the Babylonian counselors for a particular reason migo.

 

[Lafftur]

Jerusalem was besieged three times...and my problem is the following statement.....DANIEL was alive and WELL in the Kingdom, He was over ALL the provinces of Babylon and served Nebuchadnezzar personally.....I like everything you have said, I disagree with the following....and for the record....again I say the following....there were three times captives were carried away captive...The first time Nebuchadnezzar besieged Jerusalem that led to captives being taken was in 605 B.C before Nebuchadnezzar was crowned King, the second in 597 B.C., the third was in 587 B.C. which resulted in the complete destruction of Jerusalem and Jeremiah's Book of Lamentations....in the latter some 50,000 Jews were carried away captive.

In the first event some 10,000 were carried away captive "2nd Kings 24:12-16"

Note....in the Second it mentions 10,000 of the Goodly men....this does not include women and children..

Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon, spoiled Jerusalem and took treasures from Solomon’s Temple. Ten thousand of the leading men of Judah were taken into captivity to Babylon. The national leadership in Jerusalem continued to follow their wicked ways until Nebuchadnezzar laid siege of the city and a breach was made into the city wall. King Zedekiah (Mattaniah, 597-586 B.C.) attempted to escape, but was captured and taken to Babylon in chains. The Babylonians killed his sons in his sight and then blinded him. The walls of Jerusalem were destroyed and the temple burned to the ground. All of the city’s treasurers were taken to Babylon. The remaining leaders of Judah were killed and the rest of the people were carried into captivity to Babylon. Only the very poorest people remained in Judah in the hills who later fled to Egypt (2 Kings 25:23-30).

From study and history it seems Daniel, Hanniah, Mishael and Azariah were carried away around 601 B.C. with a small number of goodly children....then the carrying away captive of 10,000 in 597 and then 10,000 men PLUS women and children in 586 when Jerusalem was destroyed. My only problem with what you have said is the following statement of fact which seems to contradict in the very minimum DANIEL'S faithfulness.

Why did the King only throw three people in the fiery furnace?

Well it is clear, they were the only ones who would not bow. Remember this verse

Hold on @dcontroversal - it was me that brought up Daniel...it’s just something I’ve always wondered....where was Daniel?!

Daniel always was faithful, Daniel always stood up..... I think God was proofing the faith of the other 3. God already knew Daniel’s faith would stand.

As children we often stand in the faith of our parents or mentors but, eventually God “conveniently” makes them unaccessible and we have to stand for what we believe on our own.

 

[Lafftur]

I done nothing....I studied this in seminary under O.T. Survey, Major Prophets, Minor Prophets and the Heart of Hebrew History.....remember....the seminary you accused me of not attending... ..... I am not in any way, shape or form mouthing your thread migo or you.....I simply pointed out that this whole context was directed at these three, I do not believe they were the only ones to not bow, but that for some reason these three were singled out by the Babylonian counselors for a particular reason migo.

Oh goodness, if I went to seminary....they’d kick me out for talking about the Holy Spirit! Lol!

 

[apostlez]

I find many of the Psalms to be comforting and inspirational in relation to persecution, but this one I cherish. We need not fear, our Father is greater than our enemies

[2] Yahweh is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, my God, my rock in whom I have taken refuge, my shield and the horn of my deliverance, my stronghold. [3] I called upon Yahweh, who is worthy to be praised, and I was saved from my enemies.

(Psalms 18:2-3 [LEB])

​

 

[Lafftur]

I find many of the Psalms to be comforting and inspirational in relation to persecution, but this one I cherish. We need not fear, our Father is greater than our enemies

[2] Yahweh is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, my God, my rock in whom I have taken refuge, my shield and the horn of my deliverance, my stronghold. [3] I called upon Yahweh, who is worthy to be praised, and I was saved from my enemies.

(Psalms 18:2-3 [LEB])

​

Hello apostlez,

Welcome to @CS1’s thread on standing for Christ in midst of persecution......3 Hebrews in fiery furnace.

 

[dcontroversal]

Hold on @dcontroversal - it was me that brought up Daniel...it’s just something I’ve always wondered....where was Daniel?!

Daniel always was faithful, Daniel always stood up..... I think God was proofing the faith of the other 3. God already knew Daniel’s faith would stand.

As children we often stand in the faith of our parents or mentors but, eventually God “conveniently” makes them unaccessible and we have to stand for what we believe on our own.

Their faith can be seen in chapter one and their refusal to eat the king's meat....a study of their real names gives insight as well......I have said in the past that when one understands the meaning of their Hebrew names as well as Daniel's name it gives the trials they endured a whole new light....

 

[Lafftur]

Their faith can be seen in chapter one and their refusal to eat the king's meat....a study of their real names gives insight as well......I have said in the past that when one understands the meaning of their Hebrew names as well as Daniel's name it gives the trials they endured a whole new light....

Share with us the meaning of there true Hebrew names....

 

[dcontroversal]

I would also like to point out that the record of this event and what took place with these three are the DIRECT WORDS OF THOSE that sought to have these three killed....We must grasp this truth....the narrative and the bible records the words of men....even when they may have lied and or EMBELLISHED the actual events of what took place.

12 There are certain Jews whom you have set over the affairs of the province of Babylon: Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego; these men, O king, have not paid due regard to you. They do not serve your gods or worship the gold image which you have set up.”
13 Then Nebuchadnezzar, in rage and fury, gave the command to bring Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego. So they brought these men before the king. 14 Nebuchadnezzar spoke, saying to them, “Is it true, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego, that you do not serve my gods or worship the gold image which I have set up?

 

[dcontroversal]

Share with us the meaning of there true Hebrew names....

Daniel -->God is my judge
Hannaniah-->God (YAHWEH) is gracious
Mishael--> Who is like God
Azariah--> YAH (God) has helped

Now think about their trials, what they went through etc.....Takes on a whole new light.

MANY NAMES of the O.T. tell a story or add to the narrative

 

[Lafftur]

Daniel -->God is my judge
Hannaniah-->God (YAHWEH) is gracious
Mishael--> Who is like God
Azariah--> YAH (God) has helped

Now think about their trials, what they went through etc.....Takes on a whole new light.

MANY NAMES of the O.T. tell a story or add to the narrative

How does the meaning of their Hebrew names compare to their Babylonian names?

Daniel vs. Belteshazar
Hananiah vs. Shadrach
Mishael vs. Meshach
Azariah vs. Abednego

Interesting.....this is what I found on google:

Among them, from the descendants of Judah, were Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah. The chief official gave them other names: he gave the name Belteshazzar to Daniel, Shadrach to Hananiah, Meshach to Mishael, and Abednego to Azariah.
Daniel 1:6-7 (HCSB)

The purpose of changing the young men’s names was to help erase their attachment to their own nation and religion. Thus, Daniel and his three friends were given Babylonian names. Note how each Hebrew name includes a reference to the only true and living God, whereas the Babylonian name points to a false god worshipped by the Babylonians.​

Daniel, whose name meant “God is my judge” received the name Belteshazzar (“Bel protects his life”).​

It was Babylonian policy that all those selected for re-education and special training should have their names changed. Daniel (which means 'God has judged') became Belteshazzar ('Keeper of the hidden treasures of Bel'). Hananiah ('Jehovah has been gracious') became Shadrach. We do not know what that name means, but it contains the name of the pagan deity Marduk. Mishael ('Who is like God?') became Meshach—a name which contains one of the ancient forms of the name for the deity Venus. Azariah ('Jehovah has helped') became Abed-nego ('the servant of Nebo').

When we look at the four original names we find that two of them end in 'el', which is one of the names of God; and two of them end in 'iah' or 'jah', which is a shorthand version of 'Jehovah'. These names are changed by the Babylonians to names which refer to the pagan deities of Bel, Marduk, Venus and Nebo. The four boys would have been fourteen years old when their names were changed, for this was the age at which the Babylonians entered young people upon their programme of re-education. They were to be given no rest until they had a thorough grasp of all that was required of them. That would be three years later. Stolen from their homes, told to forget their God, intensively re-educated in a pagan culture—how would these young boys fare? Would they remain true to their God, and to what they knew to be right? Or would they capitulate?​

​

God has proven over and over - He is the ONLY TRUE GOD - The God of the Hebrews - Salvation is of the Jew - Yeshua/Jesus Christ is the Messiah- there is NO OTHER!

 

[CS1]

I done nothing....I studied this in seminary under O.T. Survey, Major Prophets, Minor Prophets and the Heart of Hebrew History.....remember....the seminary you accused me of not attending... ..... I am not in any way, shape or form mouthing your thread migo or you.....I simply pointed out that this whole context was directed at these three, I do not believe they were the only ones to not bow, but that for some reason these three were singled out by the Babylonian counselors for a particular reason migo.

You study in your seminary? Ok great they you should know what application is? Have you heard of authorial Intent? Many of us have studied O.T. Survey. I did mine back in 1985 the first time i went to Bible school and again in 2018 along with Major and Minor Prophets which inhale done more than once and even teach. If I accused of not attending and you have come to this thread to grind and axe. Please forgive me, I do not remember saying that. Nor do I remember why I said it.

 

[CS1]

Hold on @dcontroversal - it was me that brought up Daniel...it’s just something I’ve always wondered....where was Daniel?!

Daniel always was faithful, Daniel always stood up..... I think God was proofing the faith of the other 3. God already knew Daniel’s faith would stand.

As children we often stand in the faith of our parents or mentors but, eventually God “conveniently” makes them unaccessible and we have to stand for what we believe on our own.

I think I mentioned Daniel was preparing for the lions den?

 

[CS1]

I do not believe Daniel bowed.....

I bet God conveniently placed Daniel down in the King’s cellar taking inventory, he heard the music and simply thought to himself, “Whew! I escaped that persecution....thanks Lord!”

amen I do not believe Daniel bowed accept after opening the window to face Jerusalem to Pray I believe he was on his knee's but don't quote me on it I don't want to be thrown in the fiery furnace LOL

 

[Lafftur]

How does the meaning of their Hebrew names compare to their Babylonian names?

Daniel vs. Belteshazar
Hananiah vs. Shadrach
Mishael vs. Meshach
Azariah vs. Abednego

Interesting.....this is what I found on google:

Among them, from the descendants of Judah, were Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah. The chief official gave them other names: he gave the name Belteshazzar to Daniel, Shadrach to Hananiah, Meshach to Mishael, and Abednego to Azariah.
Daniel 1:6-7 (HCSB)

The purpose of changing the young men’s names was to help erase their attachment to their own nation and religion. Thus, Daniel and his three friends were given Babylonian names. Note how each Hebrew name includes a reference to the only true and living God, whereas the Babylonian name points to a false god worshipped by the Babylonians.​

Daniel, whose name meant “God is my judge” received the name Belteshazzar (“Bel protects his life”).​

It was Babylonian policy that all those selected for re-education and special training should have their names changed. Daniel (which means 'God has judged') became Belteshazzar ('Keeper of the hidden treasures of Bel'). Hananiah ('Jehovah has been gracious') became Shadrach. We do not know what that name means, but it contains the name of the pagan deity Marduk. Mishael ('Who is like God?') became Meshach—a name which contains one of the ancient forms of the name for the deity Venus. Azariah ('Jehovah has helped') became Abed-nego ('the servant of Nebo').

When we look at the four original names we find that two of them end in 'el', which is one of the names of God; and two of them end in 'iah' or 'jah', which is a shorthand version of 'Jehovah'. These names are changed by the Babylonians to names which refer to the pagan deities of Bel, Marduk, Venus and Nebo. The four boys would have been fourteen years old when their names were changed, for this was the age at which the Babylonians entered young people upon their programme of re-education. They were to be given no rest until they had a thorough grasp of all that was required of them. That would be three years later. Stolen from their homes, told to forget their God, intensively re-educated in a pagan culture—how would these young boys fare? Would they remain true to their God, and to what they knew to be right? Or would they capitulate?​

​

God has proven over and over - He is the ONLY TRUE GOD - The God of the Hebrews - Salvation is of the Jew - Yeshua/Jesus Christ is the Messiah- there is NO OTHER!

The more I ponder, understanding just goes so much deeper.....

Israel vs. Babylon
Freedom vs. Captivity
True God vs. False gods
Truth vs. Lies
Life vs. Death
Light vs. Darkness

STAND for Israel, freedom, the True God, Truth, Life, Light, etc.

It is important to be ready at all times....to STAND....even if it means death to our bodies. Man can only kill the body, God can destroy the soul.......

I choose to STAND.

 

[SoulWeaver]

How does the meaning of their Hebrew names compare to their Babylonian names?

Daniel vs. Belteshazar
Hananiah vs. Shadrach
Mishael vs. Meshach
Azariah vs. Abednego

Interesting.....this is what I found on google:

Among them, from the descendants of Judah, were Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah. The chief official gave them other names: he gave the name Belteshazzar to Daniel, Shadrach to Hananiah, Meshach to Mishael, and Abednego to Azariah.
Daniel 1:6-7 (HCSB)

The purpose of changing the young men’s names was to help erase their attachment to their own nation and religion. Thus, Daniel and his three friends were given Babylonian names. Note how each Hebrew name includes a reference to the only true and living God, whereas the Babylonian name points to a false god worshipped by the Babylonians.​

Daniel, whose name meant “God is my judge” received the name Belteshazzar (“Bel protects his life”).​

It was Babylonian policy that all those selected for re-education and special training should have their names changed. Daniel (which means 'God has judged') became Belteshazzar ('Keeper of the hidden treasures of Bel'). Hananiah ('Jehovah has been gracious') became Shadrach. We do not know what that name means, but it contains the name of the pagan deity Marduk. Mishael ('Who is like God?') became Meshach—a name which contains one of the ancient forms of the name for the deity Venus. Azariah ('Jehovah has helped') became Abed-nego ('the servant of Nebo').

When we look at the four original names we find that two of them end in 'el', which is one of the names of God; and two of them end in 'iah' or 'jah', which is a shorthand version of 'Jehovah'. These names are changed by the Babylonians to names which refer to the pagan deities of Bel, Marduk, Venus and Nebo. The four boys would have been fourteen years old when their names were changed, for this was the age at which the Babylonians entered young people upon their programme of re-education. They were to be given no rest until they had a thorough grasp of all that was required of them. That would be three years later. Stolen from their homes, told to forget their God, intensively re-educated in a pagan culture—how would these young boys fare? Would they remain true to their God, and to what they knew to be right? Or would they capitulate?​

​

God has proven over and over - He is the ONLY TRUE GOD - The God of the Hebrews - Salvation is of the Jew - Yeshua/Jesus Christ is the Messiah- there is NO OTHER!

P.S. I don't like their new names , if I had to choose I'd be Abednego

 

[Lafftur]

P.S. I don't like their new names , if I had to choose I'd be Abednego

It’s getting late for me...”A bed I go”! Lol! zzz