Dispensationalism...
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Please point to where it says Enoch lived during the "great tribulation".
If this isn't the pot callin the kettle black I don't know what is.
Yes. I have said REPEATEDLY that we will have tribulation from the World and men. You seem to not be able to distinguish between tribulations of the World, and God's Tribulation HE will bring on the World.
Seriously?
Think how self serving this post is. No matter WHAT Scripture I post, or say, you wouldn't accept it. So in essence you have no intention of donating $1000 to VMM.
Why not just donate it REGARDLESS of ANY debate or "proof"?
If it is a good ministry, and you have the means, why not just give it to them?
If this isn't the pot callin the kettle black I don't know what is.
Yes. I have said REPEATEDLY that we will have tribulation from the World and men. You seem to not be able to distinguish between tribulations of the World, and God's Tribulation HE will bring on the World.
Seriously?
Think how self serving this post is. No matter WHAT Scripture I post, or say, you wouldn't accept it. So in essence you have no intention of donating $1000 to VMM.
Why not just donate it REGARDLESS of ANY debate or "proof"?
If it is a good ministry, and you have the means, why not just give it to them?
It is not wise to exalt your words above the LORD's words = "Saints are RAP TURED BEFORE the Great Tribulation."
the LORD says: "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
the Holy Spirit says stop being ignorant:
"But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words."
the LORD again says:
"And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened."
the Holy Spirit says: "Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith...."
the Holy Spirit (thru Apostle Paul) says: "Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
Changing scripture to fit your lie = changing the Wrath of God to "God's Tribulation"
You have yet to post a single scripture showing 'pre-tribulation rapture'.
Enoch, Noah, Daniel, Job and Elijah all suffered tribulation but were delivered from God's wrath.
You do not understand the life and meaning of Enoch.
CLUE: He does not represent the Church.
Study to show thyself approved = before GOD
Right now, your pre-trib rapture error is only approved by man = for it never came from the Mouth of God, nor His Spirit nor His Prophets nor His Apostles.
Enoch, Noah, Daniel, Job and Elijah all suffered tribulation but were delivered from God's wrath.
You do not understand the life and meaning of Enoch.
CLUE: He does not represent the Church.
Study to show thyself approved = before GOD
Right now, your pre-trib rapture error is only approved by man = for it never came from the Mouth of God, nor His Spirit nor His Prophets nor His Apostles.
It is not wise to exalt your words above the LORD's words = "Saints are RAP TURED BEFORE the Great Tribulation."
the LORD says: "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
the Holy Spirit says stop being ignorant:
"But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words."
the LORD again says:
"And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened."
the Holy Spirit says: "Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith...."
the Holy Spirt (thru Apostle Paul) says: "Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
You have yet to post a single scripture showing 'pre-tribulation rapture'.
Enoch, Noah, Daniel, Job and Elijah all suffered tribulation but were delivered from God's wrath.
You do not understand the life and meaning of Enoch.
CLUE: He does not represent the Church.
Study to show thyself approved = before GOD
Right now, your pre-trib rapture error is only approved by man = for it never came from the Mouth of God, nor His Spirit nor His Prophets nor His Apostles.
"Woe to you when all men speak well of you,
For so did their fathers to the false prophets."
i have been pouring out the love of Christ by warning everyone of the lie of pre-trib rapture that never came from the Mouth of God.
My Brethren who hold the idol of pre-trib rapture are the ones who give the hate, instead of aligning their heart with the Word of Truth.
You and others go so far as changing scripture to support a lie by changing 'God's wrath' to "God's Tribulation."
AND
changing "the departure from the faith" to meaning "departure of the church" = 2 Thess ch2, 1 Timothy 4:1 , 1 John chapters 1-3
You reject the very words of the LORD Jesus Christ who repeated HIMSELF by saying: "in the world you will have tribulation" and again "immediately after the tribulation HE will gather His elect".
You create another lie by saying "Christ was not speaking to His Bride/the Church /His Elect/His Saints in Matthew ch24.
You create even more diabolical lies by separating Jew from Gentile in the Body of Christ = His Bride/His Church
The pre-trib rapture lies never stop but grower darker each day we approach His Second Coming.
Pre-trib rapture is the approval of men and doctrines of demons in the churches.
This is Great Love for you to turn your heart away from the lies and turn toward the Truth by accepting = "It is written"
My Brethren who hold the idol of pre-trib rapture are the ones who give the hate, instead of aligning their heart with the Word of Truth.
You and others go so far as changing scripture to support a lie by changing 'God's wrath' to "God's Tribulation."
AND
changing "the departure from the faith" to meaning "departure of the church" = 2 Thess ch2, 1 Timothy 4:1 , 1 John chapters 1-3
You reject the very words of the LORD Jesus Christ who repeated HIMSELF by saying: "in the world you will have tribulation" and again "immediately after the tribulation HE will gather His elect".
You create another lie by saying "Christ was not speaking to His Bride/the Church /His Elect/His Saints in Matthew ch24.
You create even more diabolical lies by separating Jew from Gentile in the Body of Christ = His Bride/His Church
The pre-trib rapture lies never stop but grower darker each day we approach His Second Coming.
Pre-trib rapture is the approval of men and doctrines of demons in the churches.
This is Great Love for you to turn your heart away from the lies and turn toward the Truth by accepting = "It is written"
It's not my opinion. I am a serious student of God's word. Thirty-eight years of studying God's word should count for something. I heavily rely on the Holy Spirit to teach me His word and help me understand how things really are. Dispensationalism is a doctrine that began 200 years ago. I go back to the beginning, but if you don't agree or reject "my opinion", is fine with me.
Truth has to be learned by having Christ at the center of it all.
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Ahhh I see your so accustomed to the fun of debating that you perceive every question that is ask has to be coming from someone defending pre tribulation rapture and that they are all dispinsationist so you answer everyone as such. Then afterward you give Scriptures and suggest that I don't take them seriously,... lol,,,anyway if your curious in the least I have never been an Dispy nor do I adhere to pre-trib thinking...
Within Every one of your posts is scattering of accusations, slander, and other things directed at those who believe different than you. Yet you hold yourself out as some kind of authority, as if NO ONE else has ever read the Bible, or deeply studied these issues.
Then you smatter in a “Dear brother “ here and there as if that excuses your accusations and hubris.
The Great Tribulation is widely referred to as 7 yrs. 3.5 yrs of which are filled with tribulation from men toward the saved.
The second 3.5 yrs, kicked off by the Antichrist sitting in the temple, starts Gods tribulations and wrath toward the unsaved.
We will NOT be here for that.
So I’d recommend you keep studying. You might finally get there.
Then you smatter in a “Dear brother “ here and there as if that excuses your accusations and hubris.
The Great Tribulation is widely referred to as 7 yrs. 3.5 yrs of which are filled with tribulation from men toward the saved.
The second 3.5 yrs, kicked off by the Antichrist sitting in the temple, starts Gods tribulations and wrath toward the unsaved.
We will NOT be here for that.
So I’d recommend you keep studying. You might finally get there.
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In my mind it was clear reading your reply shows me i was not. Yes, he and family were in the Ark through the rain and flood . I do not see the Ark as some form of rapture or heaven i see the Ark as being safe in Jesus . sorta like walking through the valley of the shadow if death i fear no evil for Thou art with me kinda thing
Brother wake UP to His Righteousness and the Truth
SEE Here =
At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.
And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope. For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have died in Him.
"Gathered together from one end of heaven to the other" = 1 Thess 4:15-17
By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God,
and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise.
After that,
we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.
Within each of my posts are the corrections of God's words upon the error/lie of pre-trib rapture which you detest.
Because you have embraced a lie in your heart you become angry and accusatory against me when i have not spoken against you, but only against the lie.
The last 3.5 years begin (only God knows the exact hour starting point) with the "man of sin" whom the LORD Jesus Christ, the Prophets and the Apostles all said that the Saints of that Era would be on earth to face with no pre-trib rapture.
1 Thessalonians, 2 Thessalonians, 1 John, Gospels, Genesis, Job, James, Daniel, Noah
Since pre-trib never came out of the Mouth of God, cannot be found in Scripture = means only one thing = whoever speaks/teaches or prophesies pre-trib rapture is lying and opposing the words of Christ, the Prophets and the Apostles.
To date, you have not been able to bring forth a single scripture that says: God will rapture His Elect before the Second Coming of Christ.
The LORD Jesus Christ and the Apostles said the man of sin comes BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ.
Choose truth or speak a lie and remember this: "no lie comes from the truth" = 1 John
SEE Here =
At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.
And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope. For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have died in Him.
"Gathered together from one end of heaven to the other" = 1 Thess 4:15-17
By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God,
and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise.
After that,
we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.
Within each of my posts are the corrections of God's words upon the error/lie of pre-trib rapture which you detest.
Because you have embraced a lie in your heart you become angry and accusatory against me when i have not spoken against you, but only against the lie.
The last 3.5 years begin (only God knows the exact hour starting point) with the "man of sin" whom the LORD Jesus Christ, the Prophets and the Apostles all said that the Saints of that Era would be on earth to face with no pre-trib rapture.
1 Thessalonians, 2 Thessalonians, 1 John, Gospels, Genesis, Job, James, Daniel, Noah
Since pre-trib never came out of the Mouth of God, cannot be found in Scripture = means only one thing = whoever speaks/teaches or prophesies pre-trib rapture is lying and opposing the words of Christ, the Prophets and the Apostles.
To date, you have not been able to bring forth a single scripture that says: God will rapture His Elect before the Second Coming of Christ.
The LORD Jesus Christ and the Apostles said the man of sin comes BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ.
Choose truth or speak a lie and remember this: "no lie comes from the truth" = 1 John