Do I have the wrong idea of God?

[Jesus4ever]

why do you guess you react that way when many other Christians don't?

Because since I love God, I don´t want to fail Him. Every time I sin, I despise Jesus´ sacrifice. And yes, somehow I fear God may be angry and punish me.

I´m pretty confident about the gift God gave me, that I use in my work.

I guess I´m to glued to the Law, mostly because I fear God´s reaction if I brake it. For example, I´m not used to drink, in fact I rarely do it. However, if in one occasion with some friends I drink more than I should, I feel really bad about that, because I got drunk and the Lord doesn´t want that. I sinned! The same as watching with lust for a woman I don´t know, or have immoral thoughts about lust.

If going by the Law doesn´t lead us to Salvation, will braking it lead us to Hell?

I will ask this: Each time a man marries, he commits adultery and divorces her wife. Plus, he drinks very much, in spite of being a christian. He loves God, but simply can´t stop sinning. He´s braking God´s order not no commit adultery and not to get drunk. So, by his actions, will he not be saved?

 

[Jesus4ever]

Like I said, God is not dealing with us on the basis of our sins. He settled the sin issue between Himself and us 2000 years ago. Learn who you now are in Christ and your behavior will reflect that reality. When we sin we should feel sad, but we should not feel fear or condemnation. There is no condemnation in Christ, so if you feel condemnation it is the adversary attempting to keep you from freely approaching God in your time of need.

I see, brother. To be honest, I fear that this confusion I have regarding this matter, the fear I have from God´s wrath/punishment, the lack of peace I feel, may be the work of the enemy...

 

[FreeNChrist]

I see, brother. To be honest, I fear that this confusion I have regarding this matter, the fear I have from God´s wrath/punishment, the lack of peace I feel, may be the work of the enemy...

It is. God loves you. That fear of punishment is caused by failing to accept His love for you, and we fail to accept His love for us when we fail to believe He accepts us. God totally accepts you. Not because of what you do or don't do, but because of what His Son has done. Love apart from acceptance becomes practically meaningless. God loves and accepts you. Believe it.

 

[Dan_473]

Because since I love God, I don´t want to fail Him.

do you know of other christians who love God and don't want to fail him? do they react the same way you see yourself reacting?

So, by his actions, will he not be saved?

I don't know. God decides who will be saved.

 

[DP]

Dear brothers and sisters,

I´m sorry to bring this subject again, but I believe I need help figuring this out, that it, the way I try by all means, to behave toward our Lord. And yes, this keeps leading to "Should I do this?", "Shouldn´t I do that?", etc...

I´m feeling somehow trapped in my own thoughts/analysis of want God wants from me. God´s divine Grace tells me that faith, love Him above all things and our neighbors as ourselves, is the right way to go. It also tell me that works/Law will not lead me to Salvation. However, Grace is not a license to sin!

NT is clear about many things a christian shouldn´t do. Drunkenness, adultery, sexual immorality, dissensions, lying, etc, etc, are some of many more. In the OT we get the "Do/don´t this" list, but the NT is also clear about things one shouldn´t do.

The question is bothering me very much, because I feel no peace with my relationship with the Lord. I really love Him, and nothing is more important than Him to me. However, I want to obey Him and please Him so much, that I carry a "I should do this!" and (MOSTLY) "I shouldn´t do this!" list of things, every day! And worse of all, I carry a feeling that IF I do something I feel I shouldn´t do, God will punish me! So, yeah, I fear His "wrath" toward me, somehow, every time I sin...!

But at the same time, I know He loves me, and that He will forgives me, if I truly repent, but still, I fear that He will forgive me, but will punish me, still...!

Yes, the dietetic laws are one thing that bother me. I find aspects that lead me to agree that christians are free from that laws (and sometimes from the Law), but since I want to obey Him and please Him so much, I fear He may us/me to obey those laws...!

One recent example: I always loved to see "X-Files", in fact, I bought the all series some years ago (before I was born again). Yes, we all know what "X-Files" deal about, and that are even some episodes that discredit Bible origin (God´s Word), as in one, it suggests that the Word of God was given by aliens. But, in spite of this one episode, all we have is conspiracy with Government, aliens, paranormal activity, etc. So, recently, I putted somehow in my head and started to feel that I shouldn´t see it (in spite of wishing to do it very much), because if I do it, God will be angry and will punish me somehow.

All I know is that, in spite of loving Him very much, I feel anxious/scared of committing sin, with my "I shouldn´t do this" every day list, fearing God´s punishment...!

I guess I can´t really live and a true christian would. Do I really live by the Grace? Do I have the wrong idea about God?


Please, comments and help would be really appreciated.


Thank you!


God bless you all!

Don't beat yourself up.

1 John 2:1-6
2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
KJV

This is one of the main reasons we are to study (not just read) all... of God's Word. That way we learn what sin is, and the things God approves of and what He doesn't approve of. And even if we wrote all the different ways to sin down in a notebook and carried it with us, we still... are going to slip up at times, because we all, except our Lord Jesus, were concluded under sin so that Salvation could by by Faith for those who believe (Gal.3).

If you sin, The Holy Spirit will show you, if you listen to Him in your conscience. That then means opportunity to go into God's Word and learn about it, and asking our Lord Jesus forgiveness to cleanse you of it, and get back to serving Him (see 1 John 1).

So if you haven't been through all of God's Word in your own Bible study, that is why you're feeling unsure of what His righteousness is.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

Maybe I condemn myself too much, but my desire to obey God and please and serve Him is so big that I simply feel really bad every time I sin. But still, I believe I´m a sinner. We all are, in my opinion.

God is merciful, good, but He is also a God of justice, agreed?

But again, could you please clarify me about this:

- God is merciful, good, but He is also a God of justice, agreed? So, a christian can´t stop sinning, because he can´t stop drinking or can´t stop cheating each spouse he (re)marries. Won´t he/she stop being blessed by God eventually, and will he/she be saved?

Do you think that you are the only one who "falls off the wagon" (not just talking about drinking!)? Do you think that you are the only one who desires to serve God but fails? I was going to say "we" but I will stick to speaking for myself - I know that I fail miserably at times in serving God. There are times when I could have said some encouraging words for someone but fall right into their negative way of seeing things . . . There are things that I struggle with at times but the one thing I know - I am a child of God. God will never leave me or forsake me. Just because I sin - I am not a sinner for I do not live in that sin daily . . . . A sinner is someone who doesn't care if they are sinning or not - A child of God will feel remorse and have the desire to do better -

A child of God will pick themselves up and move on - Psalm 37:23,24 The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD: and he delighteth in his way. Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the LORD upholdeth him with his hand. .

Each new day is a new beginning - Lamentations 3:22,23 It is of the LORD's mercies that we are not consumed, because his compassions fail not. They are new every morning: great is thy (God's) faithfulness.

 

[Jesus4ever]

do you know of other christians who love God and don't want to fail him? do they react the same way you see yourself reacting?

I don´t know, brother. I can´t speak for every christian in the World, and is more than probable that others may feel the way I feel.

I thank you for trying to help me, and please don´t feel offended, but...do you have any thoughts or opinions regarding this matter, or will you just keep answering me asking more questions?


God bless you!

 

[Jesus4ever]

Do you think that you are the only one who "falls off the wagon" (not just talking about drinking!)? Do you think that you are the only one who desires to serve God but fails? I was going to say "we" but I will stick to speaking for myself - I know that I fail miserably at times in serving God. There are times when I could have said some encouraging words for someone but fall right into their negative way of seeing things . . . There are things that I struggle with at times but the one thing I know - I am a child of God. God will never leave me or forsake me. Just because I sin - I am not a sinner for I do not live in that sin daily . . . . A sinner is someone who doesn't care if they are sinning or not - A child of God will feel remorse and have the desire to do better -

A child of God will pick themselves up and move on - Psalm 37:23,24 The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD: and he delighteth in his way. Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the LORD upholdeth him with his hand. .

Each new day is a new beginning - Lamentations 3:22,23 It is of the LORD's mercies that we are not consumed, because his compassions fail not. They are new every morning: great is thy (God's) faithfulness.

I see. Thank you, dear sister!

 

[MarcR]

Maybe I condemn myself too much, but my desire to obey God and please and serve Him is so big that I simply feel really bad every time I sin. But still, I believe I´m a sinner. We all are, in my opinion.

God is merciful, good, but He is also a God of justice, agreed?

But again, could you please clarify me about this:

- God is merciful, good, but He is also a God of justice, agreed? So, a christian can´t stop sinning, because he can´t stop drinking or can´t stop cheating each spouse he (re)marries. Won´t he/she stop being blessed by God eventually, and will he/she be saved?

Brother,

Rom 8:1 says there is now NO CONDEMNATION for them who are in Christ Jesus.

By your testimony, it is evident that you are in Christ Jesus.

When you condemn yourself, you are arguing against what God Said! By your testimony, it appears that you don't want to argue against God's Word! Why not STOP?

 

[Jesus4ever]

Brother,

Rom 8:1 says there is now NO CONDEMNATION for them who are in Christ Jesus.

By your testimony, it is evident that you are in Christ Jesus.

When you condemn yourself, you are arguing against what God Said! By your testimony, it appears that you don't want to argue against God's Word! Why not STOP?

Yes...! I simply can´t understand will I feel this way, to be honest.

 

[shotgunner]

I see you point, brother. But how can God not punish, if one has a life of sin? The NT refers several times that God will show His wrath toward sinners...!

Are you suggesting that sin has only effects in our life and not in God´s actions toward us?


God bless you!

If you are born again, you are no longer a sinner. You are a new creation(II Cor.5:17). You are a saint that still sins, because you are still in a flesh and blood body. Your Spirit is the part of you that is born again but that perfect Spirit still lives in a flesh and blood unrenewed body. The real you,your Spirit doesn't want to sin. The very fact that you started this thread shows that. Look at these scriptures showing how Paul viewed this situation.

Romans 7:15-25King James Version (KJV)[SUP]15 [/SUP]For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
[SUP]21 [/SUP]I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
[SUP]25 [/SUP]I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Romans 8:10King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

No one who is born again wants to sin. Every time you do your Spirit hates it. The way to be free from sin though is to identify yourself as one with Christ. Right now you see yourself as a sinner hoping God can forgive you. Because of that you will only do what a sinner does. You have to see yourself as already forgiven, one with Christ. You have to loose any identity you have that isn't intertwined with Christ.

The closest thing we can relate it to is a marriage. When you are married you can't see yourself as still single. A married person has no single identity any longer and so they act as if they are married rather than acting single. Likewise a man who sees himself as righteous by faith will act righteous. Because of your new identity sin will loose it's hold. You see sin had a hold on the sinner but you are no longer that same person. By embracing your new identity you take on it's characteristics.

 

[shotgunner]

Well, brother, I have to be honest with you, as I should say that I´ve never heard another christian saying we are not sinners, simply from the fact we´re in Christ...! In my opinion, were are all sinners.

Don´t you agree that every time you commit sin, we step apart from God? Why did He forsake Christ when He was on the cross? Wasn´t it because God is too Holly to be where sin is?

Let´s imagine, for example that a christian has a drug addiction problem (not my case, thank God). He tries by all means to quit it, but eventually, he falls and sticks to a life of drugs. Of course, we know that he will have serious problems with his life, and eventually he dies. He disobeyed God. Will he be saved?

You are not a sinner any longer. You are a fellow citizen with the saints and of the household of God.(Eph.2:19)

God turned his back on Jesus so that he could say to you: "I'll never leave you nor forsake you." Jesus paid that price too.

 

[popeye]

I see you point, brother. But how can God not punish, if one has a life of sin? The NT refers several times that God will show His wrath toward sinners...!

Are you suggesting that sin has only effects in our life and not in God´s actions toward us?


God bless you!

I only read about half of the 1st page and I had enough.

What you are seeing is 2 fold.
1) Christianity won't get you very far halfheartedly dabbling in it.
We are saved into the most radical movement the world has ever known,and you parked outside lazy acres.

He said he would spew us out,vomit us like a slime ball,unless we were white hot,or so dead we were out of the way of the hot ones.

2)The whole reason you feel tormented is to move you forward.Get moving man!!!!


(I need this too,.....glad I can preach to myself like that)

 

[Dan_473]

I don´t know, brother. I can´t speak for every christian in the World, and is more than probable that others may feel the way I feel.

I thank you for trying to help me, and please don´t feel offended, but...do you have any thoughts or opinions regarding this matter, or will you just keep answering me asking more questions?


God bless you!

do you seriously not know of any christians that love God? or that don't want to fail him?

is it your impression that most christians have lots of fears and lack of peace in their relationship with God?

I have strong opinions regarding this matter. in your OP, you say that you're bringing this up again, so it sounded to me like something you wrestle with a lot. you also say that you are "feeling somehow trapped in my own thoughts/analysis". in my experience, just giving an answer to someone who feels trapped usually doesn't work well... do you feel that you've received a sufficient answer here on this thread yet?

 

[Jesus4ever]

do you seriously not know of any christians that love God? or that don't want to fail him?

is it your impression that most christians have lots of fears and lack of peace in their relationship with God?

Like I said, brother, I can´t speak for all christians in the world. What I think is that there are many so-called christians that do not love Him...! I ask you this, then:

- Are you sure every christian or all christians besides me, don´t feel the way I do?

I have strong opinions regarding this matter. in your OP, you say that you're bringing this up again, so it sounded to me like something you wrestle with a lot. you also say that you are "feeling somehow trapped in my own thoughts/analysis". in my experience, just giving an answer to someone who feels trapped usually doesn't work well...

Ok, I understand your point now, brother. But do you agree that your opinion regarding how to deal with a person feeling "trapped" may not work with everybody...? If you have strong opinions regrading this matter, I´d honestly prefer a straight answer (or several, like some fellow brothers/sisters kindly gave), instead of answering with questions for me to answer. I do, however, do thank your concern and kindness.

do you feel that you've received a sufficient answer here on this thread yet?

Yes, brother, I think I have. Thank you for you help.


God bless you.

 

[damombomb]

Are you putting God first though.Obedient, abiding in the vine? Condemnation will get the best of you of your not. Plus if you stay in church where you hear the word and fellowship that yoke will be destroyed off of you. That is where you find rest for your soul. You will be focused on things above.

 

[atwhatcost]

I only read about half of the 1st page and I had enough.

What you are seeing is 2 fold.
1) Christianity won't get you very far halfheartedly dabbling in it.
We are saved into the most radical movement the world has ever known,and you parked outside lazy acres.

He said he would spew us out,vomit us like a slime ball,unless we were white hot,or so dead we were out of the way of the hot ones.

2)The whole reason you feel tormented is to move you forward.Get moving man!!!!


(I need this too,.....glad I can preach to myself like that)

Your problem, (Not Jesus4ever's problem), is you didn't read the full thing he wrote. So don't posit on laziness of others when you show yours, because you couldn't be more wrong about Jesus4ever if you tried.

 

[atwhatcost]

Jesus4ever,
You don't know this, but something strange is happening on your thread and it has little to do with what you asked.

There's been an argument going on for a couple of months now on this particular forum. It's "legalists"/"children of obedience" against "grace-only"/"children of God." (The first side of the equation is what the other side calls "their kind." The second side is what they call themselves.) The fighting doesn't stop. The agendas are locked and loaded. So, the obvious outcome is the same agenda spills on to as many posts as they feel comfortable entering into and can figure out a way to start it up again.

With this knowledge, look back at the answers you're getting and notice some are more loaded for the argument than actually entering into helping you. (You're free to notice more than that, but the rest isn't related to your question either.)

Add to that, you're getting a bit of pop-psychology too. (In all of God's word, have you ever seen him expounding on "self-esteem?" Our esteem in God is obvious -- we're forever needy and he gives us what we truly need, not what we want. We want self-esteem, but our esteem comes through him.)

So you're being agendaed on more than one account. (I gave up counting after three.) You really have received good answers. Didn't your gut, your spirit and your being shout "Yes, that's it" more than once? Those are the posts that gave you answers.

Notice you're now trying to clarify what others are talking about and never really getting clear answers from them? There's a logical reason for that. They're locked and loaded for their agendas, not locked and loaded to help anyone. What's happening now is some are trying to get an old argument (and that's all it is) restarted because they're bored with the posts they've been arguing in for too long. This can go on for a very long time and you walk away dazed trying to figure out what their point was.

Just a heads-up, since you are smart enough to avoid this forum most of the time. But do notice, you really did get some wonderful answers in here too, so it's not like BDF is a total loss.

 

[Dan_473]

Like I said, brother, I can´t speak for all christians in the world. What I think is that there are many so-called christians that do not love Him...! I ask you this, then:

- Are you sure every christian or all christians besides me, don´t feel the way I do?




Ok, I understand your point now, brother. But do you agree that your opinion regarding how to deal with a person feeling "trapped" may not work with everybody...? If you have strong opinions regrading this matter, I´d honestly prefer a straight answer (or several, like some fellow brothers/sisters kindly gave), instead of answering with questions for me to answer. I do, however, do thank your concern and kindness.



Yes, brother, I think I have. Thank you for you help.


God bless you.

you don't need to speak for all christians... like this: do you know any people who excersize and sometimes are sweaty afterwards? I'm asking if you know of any...

I think some christians do feel like you do... do you know of some that are making progress?

of course my approach may not work with everybody... is there an approach that has worked with helping you? I'm interested...

from the end of your post, it looks like you have an answer that you're satisfied with. of course, at the time I read this post

Yes...! I simply can´t understand will I feel this way, to be honest.

my impression was you were still looking.

so, if you're satisified, great!... if you want to talk about it more, let me know...

God bless you, too!

 

[Jesus4ever]

Your problem, (Not Jesus4ever's problem), is you didn't read the full thing he wrote. So don't posit on laziness of others when you show yours, because you couldn't be more wrong about Jesus4ever if you tried.

Jesus4ever,
You don't know this, but something strange is happening on your thread and it has little to do with what you asked.

There's been an argument going on for a couple of months now on this particular forum. It's "legalists"/"children of obedience" against "grace-only"/"children of God." (The first side of the equation is what the other side calls "their kind." The second side is what they call themselves.) The fighting doesn't stop. The agendas are locked and loaded. So, the obvious outcome is the same agenda spills on to as many posts as they feel comfortable entering into and can figure out a way to start it up again.

With this knowledge, look back at the answers you're getting and notice some are more loaded for the argument than actually entering into helping you. (You're free to notice more than that, but the rest isn't related to your question either.)

Add to that, you're getting a bit of pop-psychology too. (In all of God's word, have you ever seen him expounding on "self-esteem?" Our esteem in God is obvious -- we're forever needy and he gives us what we truly need, not what we want. We want self-esteem, but our esteem comes through him.)

So you're being agendaed on more than one account. (I gave up counting after three.) You really have received good answers. Didn't your gut, your spirit and your being shout "Yes, that's it" more than once? Those are the posts that gave you answers.

Notice you're now trying to clarify what others are talking about and never really getting clear answers from them? There's a logical reason for that. They're locked and loaded for their agendas, not locked and loaded to help anyone. What's happening now is some are trying to get an old argument (and that's all it is) restarted because they're bored with the posts they've been arguing in for too long. This can go on for a very long time and you walk away dazed trying to figure out what their point was.

Just a heads-up, since you are smart enough to avoid this forum most of the time. But do notice, you really did get some wonderful answers in here too, so it's not like BDF is a total loss.

Thank you for your kind words and for letting me know something I wasn´t aware of, sister!

May the Lord bless you.