Do You see Evil being called Good

[JaumeJ]

It happens all around us. 1984 doublethink is rampant. As in the Psalms, deceit is framed by decree, or in plain terms, laws are made to support lies.

In the UK, Prime Minister Cameron declared he is cutting social aid as a moral duty.

Many refer to those who wish to help the needy communists. Does this mean the teachings of the Lord are communist?

I am blessed and cursed to live in my time. I have lived in a time when the law assured all to have access to health care, access to education, and access to housing. There was a government department dedicated to such called Health, Education and Welfare, for short HEW.

There were welfare frauds, but this did not dissuade the majority from continuing to help those in need.

Today such ideas are labeled left wing, socialist, communist or worse.

Oh how people love to learn to pervert justice, judment and equity, while losing sight of the teachings of our Lord.

Then they say, "We want prayer back in our schools," demonstrating just how righteous they see themselves. I never had a problem praying in my schools, not when it was legal, and not when it was banned.

Oh that people would hear Yeshua, Jesus in the heart, soul, and mind, and not just in their ears.

 

[loveme1]

Oh, the day man realizes his way will never work.....

 

[David_1]

Great post JaumeJ!

 

[jag1977]

EL is God!

 

[p_rehbein]

Please don't confuse Christian "charity" with Social Welfare........that is a common mistake these days.

It is actually quite easy to distinguish between the two...........If one is assisting those in need out of Christian love and kindness, then they are obeying the teachings of Jesus.

However, IF the Government takes from one to give to another, this is not according to the teachings of Jesus is it.......

Now, Social Welfare certainly has a place in society, but when it gets to the point that the Government is creating a multi generational lifestyle of poverty dependent on the Government for their existence, this is better described as Social/Economical slavery is it not?

The Social Welfare Programs here in the U.S. were INTENDED to be a "helping hand up" for those in need of such, NOT a lifestyle to be passed on from generation to generation.

 

[pickles]

There is scripure that spaks to these times, where eveil will be called goood, and good will be called evil.
Every day that passes one sees these seeds growing, and over shadowing the truth.
What breaks my heart the most is our young, who are being decieived and do not know it, simply because what is good is hidden from them, and evil uses every trick of emotion to bring sympathy to condoning what is wrong as being an act of good.
In many ways this shows how close the harvest is.
A good thread Jaume, as we need to remain diligent to witness to the truth in Jesus.

God bless
pickles

 

[JaumeJ]

The OP addresses evil desguised as good. Those who believe in the Love of Yeshua are never against any giving for helping the helpless, whether it be via taxes or direct contributions.........these may both be views as holy Love. As in the OP the desire for so many to have prayer reinstated in public schools, which is not their business, demonstrates their own piety, while turning on non-believing populace by denying them aid is justifiable because it is extending to those in need via their government. On the one hand, they wish to govern government, and when it comes to the pocket book, they deny Christ in wanting always to let the left hand know what the right is doing. Give whenever possible, and however possible to those in need, it is the Yeshua way.

Please don't confuse Christian "charity" with Social Welfare........that is a common mistake these days.

It is actually quite easy to distinguish between the two...........If one is assisting those in need out of Christian love and kindness, then they are obeying the teachings of Jesus.

However, IF the Government takes from one to give to another, this is not according to the teachings of Jesus is it.......

Now, Social Welfare certainly has a place in society, but when it gets to the point that the Government is creating a multi generational lifestyle of poverty dependent on the Government for their existence, this is better described as Social/Economical slavery is it not?

The Social Welfare Programs here in the U.S. were INTENDED to be a "helping hand up" for those in need of such, NOT a lifestyle to be passed on from generation to generation.

 

[p_rehbein]

The OP addresses evil desguised as good. Those who believe in the Love of Yeshua are never against any giving for helping the helpless, whether it be via taxes or direct contributions.........these may both be views as holy Love. As in the OP the desire for so many to have prayer reinstated in public schools, which is not their business, demonstrates their own piety, while turning on non-believing populace by denying them aid is justifiable because it is extending to those in need via their government. On the one hand, they wish to govern government, and when it comes to the pocket book, they deny Christ in wanting always to let the left hand know what the right is doing. Give whenever possible, and however possible to those in need, it is the Yeshua way.

Giving to those in need is certainly the Christian thing to do........yet, when the Government holds a "gun" to your head and takes what you have to give to someone else.............well........not so much...... )

People do err in my opinion when they look to the Government............

 

[jag1977]

The OP addresses evil desguised as good. Those who believe in the Love of Yeshua are never against any giving for helping the helpless, whether it be via taxes or direct contributions.........these may both be views as holy Love. As in the OP the desire for so many to have prayer reinstated in public schools, which is not their business, demonstrates their own piety, while turning on non-believing populace by denying them aid is justifiable because it is extending to those in need via their government. On the one hand, they wish to govern government, and when it comes to the pocket book, they deny Christ in wanting always to let the left hand know what the right is doing. Give whenever possible, and however possible to those in need, it is the Yeshua way.

Those in, who, Yeshua are against any helping the helpless, it be taxes or direct contributions.........these may both be as holy.

 

[JaumeJ]

If we give only to those whom we love, what credit is that to us as believers, even sinners do this.

As for the US government holding a gun to our heads, well, maybe. I do remember how everything worked quite well in the US during the cold war years. Is it possible the US needs a clear and present danger in order for its people to behave in good conduct?

There was health, education and welfare availed to all with no questions. I never minded if there were some welfare cheats as long as the needy were helped by my tax dollars. I still would not mind were I living in the States.

As believers one should give whenever possible and not look at whom it is receiving. It is better to be foolish in the eyes of man for the sake of Yeshua than to be foolish in the eyes of our Everlasting Father for the sake of man.

These attitudes are basic for believers to practice. If we suffer for doing what is right for the sake of the Kingdom of God, it is to His glory, but woe to any who find fault in suffering for what is wrong, for the chastisement of our Father is to those He loves.

Giving to those in need is certainly the Christian thing to do........yet, when the Government holds a "gun" to your head and takes what you have to give to someone else.............well........not so much...... )

People do err in my opinion when they look to the Government............

 

[pickles]

The thing is, the problem with looking to or relying on the goverment to take care of the needs of others, removes one from the Responcibuility and act of faith, hope and love of careing for others.
It is in the faith, hope and love of Jesus that we help others, serve those in need around us.
BY relying or designating such to the goverment, we dont have to have the personal responcibuility or act of faith and mercy for others needed.
Im not against taxes or for them, for as Jesus said, give unto ceazar what is His.
But to serve is what we are to do in our walk in Jesus, somehow giving it to or relying on the goverment to do, leaves ones hands empty in what we are called to.

God bless
pickles

 

[jag1977]

The thing is, the problem with looking to or relying on the goverment to take care of the needs of others, removes one from the Responcibuility and act of faith, hope and love of careing for others.
It is in the faith, hope and love of Jesus that we help others, serve those in need around us.
BY relying or designating such to the goverment, we dont have to have the personal responcibuility or act of faith and mercy for others needed.
Im not against taxes or for them, for as Jesus said, give unto ceazar what is His.
But to serve is what we are to do in our walk in Jesus, somehow giving it to or relying on the goverment to do, leaves ones hands empty in what we are called to.

God bless
pickles

One can only find hope that faith and love are removed.

 

[JaumeJ]

If it is possible, please get back to the OP, though I wandered also. Forgive that please.+

 

[MrsRoseTreasure]

The difference between programs like food stamps and other entitlement programs and the example of Yeshua is very important. The entitlement programs in the government are forced. As in, the government forcibly removes food from my table and place it on another's table whether I choose to do so or not. Yeshua and the OT taught voluntary sacrifices, voluntary sharing. Yahweh does indeed list ways that we are supposed to be kind to others, such as not plowing the corners of the field and tithing. However, these were mostly voluntary, as is all things in belief of him. Certainly kings taxed, but it was still forcibly taken. It was also assumed that they who could do for themselves would. Me, myself I give voluntarily out of faith and the desire to be good to my fellow man. The fact that I am also taxed (forced) on top of that is a little galling, since random individuals without my best interest at heart are spending that money as they will.

Regardless, the UK PM is not stating what the US leadership is also not stating, and that's the real reason for ending these programs. The US and the UK have over-spent their budgets for so long that our children's children's children cannot pay it off. China owns most of these debts. Should they announce they want full payment right now both governments are going to be bankrupt overnight, unable to pay government salaries and relying on foreign aid. While the US has been caught up in what Lady Gaga is singing this week, and the Harlem Shuffle, China has been quietly building up arms, buying up debt and gold, and is now dumping US Dollars. They have openly declared that they seek to replace the US dollar as the global trade standard, and since the yuan is 6 times more valuable than US money, many countries have already agreed to deal with them in yuan, including the UK. Since most of what we use in this country is manufactured over there, you really begin to see the scope.

It's too little too late, either way. Yahweh has them with a hook in their jaws. The time is soon.

 

[4enlightment]

It happens all around us. 1984 doublethink is rampant. As in the Psalms, deceit is framed by decree, or in plain terms, laws are made to support lies.

In the UK, Prime Minister Cameron declared he is cutting social aid as a moral duty.

Many refer to those who wish to help the needy communists. Does this mean the teachings of the Lord are communist?

I am blessed and cursed to live in my time. I have lived in a time when the law assured all to have access to health care, access to education, and access to housing. There was a government department dedicated to such called Health, Education and Welfare, for short HEW.

There were welfare frauds, but this did not dissuade the majority from continuing to help those in need.

Today such ideas are labeled left wing, socialist, communist or worse.

Oh how people love to learn to pervert justice, judment and equity, while losing sight of the teachings of our Lord.

Then they say, "We want prayer back in our schools," demonstrating just how righteous they see themselves. I never had a problem praying in my schools, not when it was legal, and not when it was banned.

Oh that people would hear Yeshua, Jesus in the heart, soul, and mind, and not just in their ears.

Proverbs 17:13
Evil will never leave the house of one who pays back evil for good.

Deuteronomy 32:41
when I sharpen my flashing sword and my hand grasps it in judgment, I will take vengeance on my adversaries and repay those who hate me.
Matthew 5:44
But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

 

[posthuman]

Please don't confuse Christian "charity" with Social Welfare........that is a common mistake these days.

It is actually quite easy to distinguish between the two...........If one is assisting those in need out of Christian love and kindness, then they are obeying the teachings of Jesus.

However, IF the Government takes from one to give to another, this is not according to the teachings of Jesus is it.......

Now, Social Welfare certainly has a place in society, but when it gets to the point that the Government is creating a multi generational lifestyle of poverty dependent on the Government for their existence, this is better described as Social/Economical slavery is it not?

The Social Welfare Programs here in the U.S. were INTENDED to be a "helping hand up" for those in need of such, NOT a lifestyle to be passed on from generation to generation.

is it the government with it's open hand to the poor that's at fault,
or the greed & sloth in the heart of the people that abuse the system?

the law given through Moses had many provisions for the poor. Christ certainly taught us to take care of the needy. personally i think it's noble for the country as a body to do charitable work - and that if i give a hungry man $$$ to eat with, but he spends it on liquor or crack, the reason his stomach is empty is the choice he made, not the gift i gave him.

if Christ gives us freedom, and we use it as occasion to sin, is it Christ to be blamed?

certainly social welfare abuse is a problem, but i disagree that it's the government - especially not any specific president - that "causes" a culture of freeloading. that's sin in the heart of men. to me it's more important for the government to focus on identifying and cutting off abusers of social welfare programs than to, say, destroy the food stamp or WIC programs.

that makes me a terrible republican, lol.

 

[JaumeJ]

When the needy are provided for, and I have contributed via taxes, I am happy. It is sad indeed that there are people who collect fraudulently, but this has been true since year zero.

To punish the innocents in need because of the cheats is unfair to say the least. It is better to suffer the harm than to cause further despair and oppression of the truly destitute.

This too is calling evil good to say damn the programs just because some of the recipients are cheats. Even some who beg on the streets are cheats, shall we recommend not giving alms because some are bad? Shall we say none go to Heaven because some are bad?

Again I ask, let us stick to the OP as best possible..........any argument against helping the needy in any manner is not only moot, it is a cruel stance.

 

[jag1977]

Proverbs 17:13
Evil will never leave the house of one who pays back evil for good.

Deuteronomy 32:41
when I sharpen my flashing sword and my hand grasps it in judgment, I will take vengeance on my adversaries and repay those who hate me.
Matthew 5:44
But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Let me get that for you....

Proverbs 17:13
The house pays back good.

Deuteronomy 32:41
on my hate me.
Matthew 5:44
Ye thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.But I say unto you, your is in he, maketh his sun to rise on the

 

[john832]

God's method for dealing with the needy is the third tithe system...

Deu 14:28 At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates:
Deu 14:29 And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

This was done two years out of seven. In the seven year financial cycle of Israel, one gave an extra tithe, a third tithe, for the needy on the third and sixth years.

When one had honestly tithed that third tithe in the third and sixth year, then that person could claim a blessing form God and God was obliged to bless. Not because of the person, but because God says He will and He does what He says He will do...

Deu 26:12 When thou hast made an end of tithing all the tithes of thine increase the third year, which is the year of tithing, and hast given it unto the Levite, the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, that they may eat within thy gates, and be filled;
Deu 26:13 Then thou shalt say before the LORD thy God, I have brought away the hallowed things out of mine house, and also have given them unto the Levite, and unto the stranger, to the fatherless, and to the widow, according to all thy commandments which thou hast commanded me: I have not transgressed thy commandments, neither have I forgotten them:
Deu 26:14 I have not eaten thereof in my mourning, neither have I taken away ought thereof for any unclean use, nor given ought thereof for the dead: but I have hearkened to the voice of the LORD my God, and have done according to all that thou hast commanded me.
Deu 26:15 Look down from thy holy habitation, from heaven, and bless thy people Israel, and the land which thou hast given us, as thou swarest unto our fathers, a land that floweth with milk and honey.

 

[posthuman]

This too is calling evil good to say damn the programs just because some of the recipients are cheats. Even some who beg on the streets are cheats, shall we recommend not giving alms because some are bad? Shall we say none go to Heaven because some are bad?

^^ i agree - i was about to post something to that effect.
it seems to me like calling "good", "evil" to condemn social welfare because some abuse it.

socially in the world too, people call "tolerance" the highest virtue, even to the point that a person with strong convictions, if he voice them, is called a "bigot"
this is an evil called "good" - the watchman on the wall today is publicly condemned as a fanatically intolerant & backwards thinking, un-enlightened fool.
the obvious example of this is calling homosexuality, fornication and other sexual perversion "sin" -- while the world considers our moral decline & licentiousness to be a great advancement in free thinking, in reality it's a reversion to the oldest pagan religions - where "worship" meant cavorting with temple prostitutes and celebrating all kinds of sexual decrepitude.

i don't think its the church's business to try to purify the lost, secular world - but to put out the Word so that the elect can be called out of it. at the same time though, there is a difference in accepting those lost in sin and accepting or condoning the sin itself. not one of us come to Christ being already purified, but in Him we put on righteousness.
this too is an evil called "good" - when we refuse to forgive the world even while they sin only against themselves. won't we be judged by the same measure we judge others? it's one thing to encourage the saints to be pure, and another to spit on those dead in sin, having no hope. we ought to offer them life, and not merely remind them of their death.