Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

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Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
1,342
587
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#41
Your lady friend would be shocked to read about President Trump in Daniel 4:17;

17 "This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men."

Don't get me wrong. I think Mr. Trump was good for America, but "man of God" should rather say; "man because of God". I'm under no illusion that Mr. Trump was a saint, but I think that God gave the USA one last chance to thwart the establishment. But the 4 solid years of the press bashing him had its effect. Woe to the nation that reads the news and not the Bible.
The point I'm trying to get across is that things change for the better when the hearts of people change and Jesus brings about that change one by one.

You are right that God raises up leaders. The leaders who first formed the USA recognized this and spoke of God given rights, yet owned slaves. I wonder if their thinkimg on this would have changed if their topic of conversation was that they would all, one by one, stand before the judgement seat of Christ.
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
16,189
3,934
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#42
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2Tim 2:3-7 . . No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs--
he wants to please his commanding officer.


A soldier's primary responsibility is to accomplish the mission assigned by
their commanders. They don't give themselves leave to abandon their posts
to go off on their own personal agenda doing other stuff. Desertion and
dereliction of duty are courts martial offenses.


Christian men, ordained to serve Christ as per the epistles of Titus,
1&2Timothy and to some extent 1Peter, have no business involving
themselves in the world's affairs and or using their pulpits for any other
purpose than what Christ expects.


1Tim 4:13 . . Focus on reading the Scriptures to the church, encouraging
the believers, and teaching them.


According to Eph 4:11-15 God gives ministers to the churches for the
express purpose of building them up in the faith, NOT for leading them into
secular causes.


I truly believe that if Dr. Martin Luther King Jr had stayed in church and
complied with the Bible's instructions for ordained Christian ministers as per
the epistles of Titus, 1&2Timothy, and to some extent 1Peter instead of
getting involved in political activism, social justice, and/or civil disobedience,
he could have served Christ another thirty-five years instead of getting
himself assassinated when he was only 39 years old.


Was Dr. King a martyr? Well, if he was, it certainly wasn't in a cause for
Christ. No, it was for a worldly cause. Dr. King marginalized his pastoral
responsibilities. He put duty to the color of his skin first, and duty to Christ
second. That was a very bad move for an ordained Christian minister.


Moral of the story is: nobody is twisting anybody's arm to commit to a
ministry; but once the commitment is made: then they'd do well to hold
fast, stay the course, and not get distracted.


Luke 9:62 . . No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit
for service in the kingdom of God.
_

Ok, first off you're using verses to back your POV that have nothing whatever to do with what you're saying. What is more a cause of Christ than that all men be free?! What is more the cause of Christ than chains being broken, shackles falling off, families reunited? How is that a "secular" cause? Had people not taken up that cause we would still have men, women and children in slavery in this country today? But men of God stood in the pulpit and preached against it. Why would it not be a cause of Christ that men and women have the right to vote in their own country?! No, his cause was not a secular one in the least. If anything we need MORE pastors willing to preach and stand up in the streets and call this nation to God. We need more men and women of God in the streets saying abortion is murder, from the pastor to the pews. Before this election churches all over my city met at our capitol. Our pastors gave a call to prayer and repentance and called sin, sin. We marched around the building singing and praying for our nation. No!! We need more of this!! We don't need the pastor hidden away in the church house. Jesus commands us to GO! That's for the pastor and the people. MLK wasn't doing anything wrong by taking to the streets and talking about injustices. Would to God that more pastors would have the backbone to step out of the church and speak to the nations ills.
 
Jun 11, 2020
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#43
Civil rights were addressed in the Civil Law in Moses day and carried through. Three laws provided :

1. Moral law the 10
2.Civil law lev
3. Ceremonial law lev & Deut.


Now Jesus addressed the laws of moral and civil laws in Matthew chapter 5 - 7 and in Matthew chapter 23.

When Jesus said " You have heard it said " in context to divorce Jesus said BUT I say into you " raised the standard of the Law. In Matthew 23 Jesus brought down the hammer on those Pharisees who abused both moral and civil law to control the people, yet they would not live under the something they put on the people. Woe to you hypocrites! he said many times.
Aaahhh. Civil Law. But did not Mr. King teach Civil RIGHTS? But no matter. I'm glad to her that Mr. King taught, "turn the other cheek". And that he taught his fellows that it was blessed to be persecuted and downtrodden ... or?

Nebertheless, I respect your view.
 
Jun 11, 2020
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#44
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The OP doesn't pertain to nondescript Christians, rather, it specifically
pertains to Christian men ordained to serve Christ per the epistles of Titus,
1&2Timothy, and to some extent 1Peter. (Third paragraph down from the
top in post No.1)


For example: President Biden is a Christian; but to my knowledge he is not
ordained to serve Christ per the epistles of Titus, 1&2Timothy, and to some
extent 1Peter.


Seeing as how the President is basically a rank and file pew warmer, then
he is not required to comply with the rules in those sections of the Bible
pertaining to clergy.
_
I think we have just discovered how far apart we are. I find only Christians or non Christians in the New Testament. And ALL are to be about building the Church and not a political state. 1st Corinthians 3:9–16;

9 "For we are labourers together with God: ye are God’s husbandry, ye are God’s building. 10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. 14 If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

The letter is written to;

2 "Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours" (1st Corinthians 1:2).
 
Jun 11, 2020
1,371
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#46
The point I'm trying to get across is that things change for the better when the hearts of people change and Jesus brings about that change one by one.

You are right that God raises up leaders. The leaders who first formed the USA recognized this and spoke of God given rights, yet owned slaves. I wonder if their thinkimg on this would have changed if their topic of conversation was that they would all, one by one, stand before the judgement seat of Christ.
I'm personally glad that slavery has somewhat been abandoned (it is alive and well in many countries). And I value my status as a free man. So don't get me wrong when I report that the Bible regulates slavery - not abolishes it. Under Law the release of slaves was only on the fiftieth years - the Jubilee - and that, only Israelites. The word for "servant" in the new Testament Greek is actually "bond-servant" - a slave without rights or claims. You and I are both "bond-slaves". You are not your own - having been bought (1st Cor.6:19-20).
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
1,342
587
113
#47
I'm personally glad that slavery has somewhat been abandoned (it is alive and well in many countries). And I value my status as a free man. So don't get me wrong when I report that the Bible regulates slavery - not abolishes it. Under Law the release of slaves was only on the fiftieth years - the Jubilee - and that, only Israelites. The word for "servant" in the new Testament Greek is actually "bond-servant" - a slave without rights or claims. You and I are both "bond-slaves". You are not your own - having been bought (1st Cor.6:19-20).
I agree and 1Cor.7:21-22 also shows us how we should think of ourselves.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
6,460
1,800
113
#48
Aaahhh. Civil Law. But did not Mr. King teach Civil RIGHTS? But no matter. I'm glad to her that Mr. King taught, "turn the other cheek". And that he taught his fellows that it was blessed to be persecuted and downtrodden ... or?

Nebertheless, I respect your view.
a right is law
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
1,958
303
83
Oregon
#49
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Christian men ordained to serve Jesus Christ are, first and foremost,
bought and paid for.

2Tim 2:24-26 . . And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he
must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. Those who oppose
him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them
repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, and that they will
come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken
them captive to do his will.

The Greek word translated "servant" in that passage basically identifies
slaves; both voluntary and involuntary.

If perchance someone reading this is considering preparing for "the ministry"
be forewarned that in order to serve Christ faithfully, effectively, and loyally;
you'll have to accept the status of a slave; i.e. you cannot be Christ's
minister as a free agent. Should you choose to go off on your own agenda as
Dr. King did, you'll be charged with dereliction of duty and branded a
deserter. (cf. John 15:4-11)

Christian men ordained to serve Jesus Christ, are shepherds whose
responsibility is the care of Christ's sheep-- not the world's sheep nor the
world's problems. In other words: it is Christ's expectations that his
ministers be congregational leaders rather than social leaders.

1Pet 5:1-4 . . To the elders among you, I appeal as a fellow elder, a
witness of Christ's sufferings and one who also will share in the glory to be
revealed: Be shepherds of God's flock that is under your care, serving as
overseers-- not because you must, but because you are willing, as God
wants you to be; not greedy for money, but eager to serve; not lording it
over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock.

People are easily fooled into believing Dr. King was a successful minister
because they're inadequately catechized; i.e. they're unaware that the Bible
contains specific instructions for ordained Christian ministers; and failure to
comply with those instructions leads to unsatisfactory performance ratings.

2Tim 2:5 . . If anyone competes as an athlete, he does not receive the
victor's crown unless he competes according to the rules.
_
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
4,651
3,900
113
#50
We are of a higher Kingdom.

2 Corinthians
6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
6:15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in [them]; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean [thing]; and I will receive you,
6:18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.