Good Friday and Easter Sunday

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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Jesus' death burial and resurrection has to match Exodus 12:26 through Exodus 15:25.

Exodus 12:26-28
26 And it shall come to pass, when your children shall say unto you, What mean ye by this service?
27 That ye shall say , It is the sacrifice of the LORD'S passover, who passed over the houses of the children of Israel in Egypt, when he smote the Egyptians, and delivered our houses. And the people bowed the head and worshipped .
28 And the children of Israel went away , and did as the LORD had commanded Moses and Aaron, so did they.

Exodus 15:22-25
22 So Moses brought Israel from the Red sea, and they went out into the wilderness of Shur; and they went three days in the wilderness, and found no water.
23 And when they came to Marah, they could not drink of the waters of Marah, for they were bitter: therefore the name of it was called Marah.
24 And the people murmured against Moses, saying , What shall we drink ?
25 And he cried unto the LORD; and the LORD shewed him a tree, which when he had cast into the waters, the waters were made sweet : there he made for them a statute and an ordinance, and there he proved them,

It also has to match Jonah's time in the fish according to the words of Jesus Himself.

Matthew 12:40
40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
there is no evidence in scripture that the three days in the desert of shur were ever understood as corresponding with the burial of jesus...

jonah's time in the fish would be subject to the same biblical timekeeping convention in which partial days were counted as days in their own right...so there is no reason to insist that jonah was in the fish for seventy-two hours either...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Ok, so the actual details of the passover sadar are not mentioned in the Bible, but the act of celebrating it is.One can easily do a bit of research to find out the details
it is not quite as simple as that...many of the details of the passover seder as it is celebrated today not only aren't mentioned in the bible...they are post new testament inventions that jesus would not have practiced...let alone moses...

for example the salt water dates to some time after the ashkenazic jewish community was established...around 1,000 years after jesus' times...
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
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many of the details of the passover seder as it is celebrated today not only aren't mentioned in the bible...they are post new testament inventions that jesus would not have practiced...let alone moses...
Funny, Easter isn't mentioned in the Bible AT ALL, and itself is a "post new testament invention."

If you're going to criticize Passover for some of its un-Biblical traditions, you better be criticizing Easter by the exact same standard.
 
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obviously you only read about a quarter of my first post...because if you had read it all then you would have seen that your objections were anticipated and refuted...

jesus died on the fifteenth day of the month...not the fourteenth...as i proved in my first post...

furthermore there are numerous scriptures establishing that jesus rose on the 'third day'...namely matthew 16:21...matthew 17:23...matthew 20:19...matthew 27:64...luke 9:22...luke 18:33...luke 24:7...luke 24:21...luke 24:46...acts 10:40...and 1 corinthians 15:4...none of these scriptures use the 'three days and three nights' formula that you naively insist must be seventy-two hours...

yet under the biblical convention of timekeeping that i proved in my second post...the unnecessary seventy-two hour scenario you propose would have jesus rising on the -fourth- day instead of the third...

but your scenario has an even bigger problem than that...because scripture clearly states that jesus rose on the first day of the week...

mark 16:9..."Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons."

so your insistence on modern unbiblical timekeeping conventions ultimately results in a scripture defying mess...
Yes, we mustn't let facts get in the way must we? The timekeeping you say is unbiblical. Where do you think my source is that I arrive at my deductions? All you wrote is correct except for the absolute fact that the Hebrew idiom ceases to be when including the night as well as the day, which is a 24hr period, Ah, which changes things. Because you have never heard of certain things, or bothered to seek out truth because the majority is on your side - well I would have been among the minority when the majority was slathering the golden calf with more gold. I have more to say about "Easter" and you will not like it, because it will rain on your parade. Keep daubing the wall. I know you do not know what I meant by that, which is why I said it.
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Then simply count three days AND three nights from Friday Sunset to Sunday morning before daylight for me.



You really need to look into Semiramis, Nimrod and Tammuz, later identified as Isis, Osiris and Horus. She is also identified as Astarte in the Greek...

"The first thing we must understand is that professing Christians were not the only ones who celebrated a festival called "Easter."
"Ishtar", which is pronounced "Easter" was a day that commemorated the resurrection of one of their gods that they called "Tammuz", who was believed to be the only begotten son of the moon-goddess and the sun-god.
In those ancient times, there was a man named Nimrod, who was the grandson of one of Noah's son named Ham.
Ham had a son named Cush who married a woman named Semiramis.Cush and Semiramis then had a son named him "Nimrod."
After the death of his father, Nimrod married his own mother and became a powerful King.
The Bible tells of of this man, Nimrod, in Genesis 10:8-10 as follows: "And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord: wherefore it is said, even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord. And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad,and Calneh, in the land of Shinar."
Nimrod became a god-man to the people and Semiramis, his wife and mother, became the powerful Queen of ancient Babylon.
Nimrod was eventually killed by an enemy, and his body was cut in pieces and sent to various parts of his kingdom.
Semiramis had all of the parts gathered, except for one part that could not be found.
That missing part was his reproductive organ. Semiramis claimed that Nimrod could not come back to life without it and told the people of Babylon that Nimrod had ascended to the sun and was now to be called "Baal", the sun god.
Queen Semiramis also proclaimed that Baal would be present on earth in the form of a flame, whether candle or lamp, when used in worship.
Semiramis was creating a mystery religion, and with the help of Satan, she set herself up as a goddess.
Semiramis claimed that she was immaculately conceived.
She taught that the moon was a goddess that went through a 28 day cycle and ovulated when full.
She further claimed that she came down from the moon in a giant moon egg that fell into the Euphrates River.
This was to have happened at the time of the first full moon after the spring equinox.
Semiramis became known as "Ishtar" which is pronounced "Easter", and her moon egg became known as "Ishtar's" egg."
Ishtar soon became pregnant and claimed that it was the rays of the sun-god Baal that caused her to conceive.
The son that she brought forth was named Tammuz.
Tammuz was noted to be especially fond of rabbits, and they became sacred in the ancient religion, because Tammuz was believed to be the son of the sun-god, Baal. Tammuz, like his supposed father, became a hunter.
The day came when Tammuz was killed by a wild pig.
Queen Ishtar told the people that Tammuz was now ascended to his father, Baal, and that the two of them would be with the worshippers in the sacred candle or lamp flame as Father, Son and Spirit.
Ishtar, who was now worshipped as the "Mother of God and Queen of Heaven", continued to build her mystery religion.
The queen told the worshippers that when Tammuz was killed by the wild pig, some of his blood fell on the stump of an evergreen tree, and the stump grew into a full new tree overnight. This made the evergreen tree sacred by the blood of Tammuz.
She also proclaimed a forty day period of time of sorrow each year prior to the anniversary of the death of Tammuz.
During this time, no meat was to be eaten.
Worshippers were to meditate upon the sacred mysteries of Baal and Tammuz, and to make the sign of the "T" in front of their hearts as they worshipped.
They also ate sacred cakes with the marking of a "T" or cross on the top.
Every year, on the first Sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox, a celebration was made.
It was Ishtar's Sunday and was celebrated with rabbits and eggs.
Ishtar also proclaimed that because Tammuz was killed by a pig, that a pig must be eaten on that Sunday.
By now, the readers of this tract should have made the connection that paganism has infiltrated the contemporary "Christian" churches, and further study indicates that this paganism came in by way of the Roman Catholic System.
The truth is that Easter has nothing whatsoever to do with the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ.
We also know that Easter can be as much as three weeks away from the Passover, because the pagan holiday is always set as the first Sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox.
Some have wondered why the word "Easter" is in the the King James Bible.
It is because Acts, chapter 12, tells us that it was the evil King Herod, who was planning to celebrate Easter, and not the Christians.
The true Passover and pagan Easter sometimes coincide, but in some years, they are a great distance apart.
So much more could be said, and we have much more information for you, if you are a seeker of the truth.
We know that the Bible tells us in John 4:24, "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."
The truth is that the forty days of Lent, eggs, rabbits,hot cross buns and the Easter ham have everything to do with the ancient pagan religion of Mystery Babylon.These are all antichrist activities!
Satan is a master deceiver, and has filled the lives of well-meaning, professing Christians with idolatry.
These things bring the wrath of God upon children of disobedience, who try to make pagan customs of Baal worship Christian.
You must answer for your activities and for what you teach your children.
These customs of Easter honor Baal, who is also Satan, and is still worshipped as the "Rising Sun" and his house is the "House of the Rising Sun."
How many churches have "sunrise services" on Ishtar's day and face the rising sun in the East?
How many will use colored eggs and rabbit stories, as they did in ancient Babylon.
These things are no joke, any more than Judgement day is a joke.
I pray to God that this tract will cause you to search for more truth.
We will be glad to help you by providing more information and by praying for you. These are the last days, and it is time to repent, come out and be separate" - David Meyer

I don't know this guy, but he has the history correct.
so we finally get to the root of the matter...in your gullibility you have fallen for misinformation and pseudohistory...

i am familiar with the claims about nimrod and 'semiramis' and tammuz...and having studied the bible and majored in history with a concentration on the ancient middle east i know better than to believe any of that nonsense...


first of all 'ishtar' is not pronounced 'easter'...that could only be said by someone who doesn't know the first thing about semitic languages...

the death of tammuz was observed in june or july...he was believed to stay dead for half of the year...much like the later legend of pluto and persephone...six months after his death in the summer would put tammuz' mythical rebirth in december or january...nowhere near easter...

there is no mention of 'semiramis' anywhere in scripture...and there are no references in ancient writings to a 'semiramis' married to a cush or a nimrod... the only 'semiramis' mentioned in ancient history is shammuramat...wife of king shamshiadad v of assyria...who lived about 1,500 years too late to have had anything to do with cush or nimrod...

in fact there is no reference whatsoever to nimrod in -any- ancient writings...the only information we have about nimrod is in scripture...anything about nimrod that is not in scripture is -made up-

so all of this stuff about nimrod marrying his mother...being worshipped as a god...being killed and cut to pieces...and so on...is pure fabrication with absolutely no biblical or historical basis...

the part about nimrod being cut to pieces and reassembled by semiramis is just a phony rewrite of the story of osiris and isis...

'baal' was not actually a single god but actually a title applied to many ancient semitic deities...so to say anyone claimed nimrod 'became the god baal' is a sign that someone doesn't actually know anything about ancient middle eastern mythologies...

also the primary baal was not a sun or a fire god...the sun god was shemesh...baal hadad was a storm god similar to zeus or set...

ishtar was the daughter of the war god ninurta...so there is no claim of immaculate conception in her mythology...

the moon was actually worshipped as a god named nanna or sin...not a goddess...

tammuz was associated with sheep and fish and birds with broken wings...not rabbits...the easter 'bunny' was actually -hare- by the way...

tammuz was regarded as a shepherd god...not a hunter...

according to the pic of gilgamesh tammuz was killed by ishtar herself...not a wild pig...

next your source claims that the trinity is pagan...so your source is not only misinformed but also blatantly heretical...

the 'queen of heaven' was actually anath...not ishtar...

conifer trees didn't even grow in ishtar-land...

the mourning for tammuz lasted six days...not forty...and unlike lent the mourning for tammuz took place in june or july...

the claim that the 'T' or cross is the sign of tammuz shows a total ignorance of ancient middle eastern mythology and linguistics...because the -actual- name of 'tammuz' was dumuzid...which doesn't start with a 'T'...also they used cuneiform in ancient mesopotamia...the cuneiform sign for the 'T' sound doesn't even look like the modern 'T'

ishtar was actually worshipped on the seventh day of every month...and she presided over late august and early september...not the spring time...

because ishtar was worshipped on the seventh day of every lunar month...she was worshipped around the day of the first quarter moon...not the full moon...

easter is not the holiday mentioned in acts 12...the holiday was passover...'pascha' in the greek...'easter' was a mistranslation...


to make a long story short...'this guy' you quoted plagiarized from a book by alexander hislop...who basically -made all of this stuff up- from whole cloth...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
You have yet to prove three days and three nights means a day and a half to me.
i proved from acts 10 that partial days were counted as days...

so the remaining hours of friday were one day...the entire twenty-four hours of saturday were the second day...the first several hours of sunday were the third day...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
OK So how do you reconcile these verses in which John clearly says the Passover HAS NOT YET TAKEN PLACE?

John 13

13 It was just before the Passover Festival. Jesus knew that the hour had come for him to leave this world and go to the Father. Having loved his own who were in the world, he loved them to the end.

2 The evening meal was in progress, and the devil had already prompted Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot, to betray Jesus.3 Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and that he had come from God and was returning to God;4 so he got up from the meal, took off his outer clothing, and wrapped a towel around his waist.5 After that, he poured water into a basin and began to wash his disciples’ feet, drying them with the towel that was wrapped around him.

21 After he had said this, Jesus was troubled in spirit and testified, “Very truly I tell you, one of you is going to betray me.”
22 His disciples stared at one another, at a loss to know which of them he meant. 23 One of them, the disciple whom Jesus loved, was reclining next to him. 24 Simon Peter motioned to this disciple and said, “Ask him which one he means.”
25 Leaning back against Jesus, he asked him, “Lord, who is it?”
26 Jesus answered, “It is the one to whom I will give this piece of bread when I have dipped it in the dish.” Then, dipping the piece of bread, he gave it to Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot.27 As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him.
So Jesus told him, “What you are about to do, do quickly.” 28 But no one at the meal understood why Jesus said this to him. 29 Since Judas had charge of the money, some thought Jesus was telling him to buy what was needed for the festival, or to give something to the poor. 30 As soon as Judas had taken the bread, he went out. And it was night.

John 18

28 Then the Jewish leaders took Jesus from Caiaphas to the palace of the Roman governor. By now it was early morning, and to avoid ceremonial uncleanness they did not enter the palace,because they wanted to be able to eat the Passover. 29 So Pilate came out to them and asked, “What charges are you bringing against this man?”

John 19


12 From then on, Pilate tried to set Jesus free, but the Jewish leaders kept shouting, “If you let this man go, you are no friend of Caesar. Anyone who claims to be a king opposes Caesar.”
13 When Pilate heard this, he brought Jesus out and sat down on the judge’s seat at a place known as the Stone Pavement (which in Aramaic is Gabbatha). 14 It was the day of Preparation of the Passover; it was about noon.
“Here is your king,” Pilate said to the Jews.
15 But they shouted, “Take him away! Take him away! Crucify him!”
“Shall I crucify your king?” Pilate asked.
“We have no king but Caesar,” the chief priests answered.

16 Finally Pilate handed him over to them to be crucified.

John very clearly does NOT say it was the preparation day for the Sabbath but that it was the preparation day of the PASSOVER.
first of all i already proved that jesus had eaten the passover seder from the following...

matthew 26:17..."Now on the first day of Unleavened Bread the disciples came to Jesus and asked, 'Where do You want us to prepare for You to eat the Passover?'"
mark 14:12..."On the first day of Unleavened Bread, when the Passover lamb was being sacrificed, His disciples *said to Him, 'Where do You want us to go and prepare for You to eat the Passover?'"
luke 22:7..."Then came the first day of Unleavened Bread on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed."

the statements from three gospel writers are pretty definitive...since we as christians don't believe scripture is in hopeless contradiction with itself...there must be something wrong with your interpretation of john that produces a contradiction...

'it was just before the passover festival' and 'the evening meal was in progress' in john 13:1-2 refer to the fact that there was a meal associated with the passover seder...nowdays the meal is always held towards the end of the seder...but in earlier times they had not yet settled on such exacting seder traditions...evidently jesus had his evening meal before the seder...

john 13:29 and and john 18:28 are explained by the fact that the passover and feast of unleavened bread were terms that referred to the same seven day festival...there were still several more days in the feast...the disciples may have thought that more supplies were needed for the rest of the feast...and certainly it was still necessary for the priests to remain clean for the rest of the feast...

the 'day of preparation' was always the day before the sabbath...because you couldn't work on the sabbath you had to obtain and prepare whatever food you were going to eat the day before...making it a preparation day... it was the preparation day of the passover because it took place during the passover feast...and it was extra important because many people would have been preparing their firstfruit offerings at this time as well...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Actually you haven't really 'proven' anything. . . . Rachel - 72 hours is not a concept that was just contrived . . . I never assumed the days were counted differently - you told me the days were not 24 hour days and that I shouldn't assume that the days then were the same as now.

I would just like to ask - if a day is 12 hours and a night is 12 hours - then stands to reason that what is considered a "day" is 24 hours. Now - if someone is supposed to be in the belly of a whale (or in the heart of the earth) for 3 days (3x12=36hrs) and 3 nights (3x12=36hrs) wouldn't that be 72 hours? AND how is that concept just invented in the past few decades? John 11:9-10 - does he not only urge us to walk in the day (light) so that we don't stumble; he even lets us know how many hours are in a day . . . . . and no one has a stopwatch out - but the word of God is pure and true - the words are placed where they are placed and say what they say in order to provide a truth - And I do apologize but could you please reference Acts 10 - where 4 days are 72 hours? I have read and re-read and I can't see it.

And excuse me but yes there were High Sabbaths or High holy days that occured in the middle of the week (would have been the 15th Nisan) and were not considered the weekly sabbath. John 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,)] - What is 'the preparation' speaking about; i.e. the preparation for the high day, special sabbath. . . . . .

the idea that a 'day and night' means exactly twenty-four hours is a modern concept...in biblical times it also referred to just a part of the twenty-four hour period...

the point of jesus' statement was to urge his disciples to walk in the day so that they wouldn't stumble...he was not trying to make any statement about timekeeping...in fact if you pay attention to the seasons...a day is usually -not- exactly twelve hours...so if jesus was talking about timekeeping as you and another are insisting...then he made a totally ignorant mistake...

and i don't believe jesus made mistakes...so clearly he -wasn't- telling us that we should count a day as exactly twelve hours...

i proved from acts 10 how -scripture- does its own timekeeping in the second post in this thread...maybe you should have read the thread before commenting...

yes there are sabbaths specifically associated with the passover feast...but you -can't- just put them wherever you want as some people seem to think they can do in order to justify the wednesday myth...the passover sabbaths were -only- on the fifteenth and the twenty-first days of the month... and as i showed in my first post...jesus died and was buried on the fifteenth day...the following day was the -sixteenth- day of the month...and there is no passover sabbath on the sixteenth day ...so a sixteenth day sabbath could only have been the regular weekly sabbath...

the preparation was the preparation for the weekly sabbath...you couldn't do work on the weekly sabbath so you had to do all of your food gathering and cooking the day before...it was a preparation for the sabbath...

the weekly sabbath during the passover feast was a 'high sabbath' because it determined the day of firstfruits...which took place on the following day...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Well although scripture says this, it must be incorrect because it doesn't fit a Good Friday, Ishtar Sunday myth?

So the authority for the truth is what the Jews did in Christ's day not what the scripture says?

Ok, then explain to me about being taken down from the stake before the high day while being crucified on the high day.

Now count three days AND three nights from Friday sunset to before dawn on Sunday.
scripture -doesn't- say jesus died while the passover lambs were being slaughtered...and it says much to the contrary...but you seem willing to ignore scripture when it goes against your erroneous tradition...

i should also point out to everyone reading this thread that you have made the exact -opposite- argument in the 'passover/unleavened countdown' thread...now maybe you can tell us all what you -actually- believe and what you are just -dishonestly- advocating for the sake of your argument?

and what is this about a 'stake'? you must be a jehovah's witness or a member of one of those cults that believe in that sort of thing...christians have always believed jesus died on a -cross-
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Since this discussion has become sidetracked from our discussion and it doesn't appear that I'll get any response about the reliability of the source material (the gospels), let's assume for the moment that they are true. Even granting their truth, they still don't establish what you think they did about the time of Jesus' rising.

Consider what the bible says about the time of Jesus' resurrection -- nothing! Sure, there are 4 stories about what happened after it, but none of them pinpoint the time that Jesus rose. By the time the women arrived, Jesus was already "resurrected"... it didn't happen in their presence. If Jesus had risen on Friday night around midnight, the narratives still could have gone exactly the same way.

"But the stone was rolled away in their presence!" you gasp desperately. So what? A man who could walk through walls wasn't stopped by a stone. And the angel in that same gospel even said that Jesus was no longer there. So why would you claim the time of the visitation by the women as the time of Jesus' resurrection?

I guess if you were still clinging to faith and needed to prove your point (and I assume you are), you might point to the gospel of John in which Jesus appeared to Mary right there at the tomb. So what? He couldn't have left and come back? That's how it would have had to worked for the angel to be telling the truth in Matthew where he claimed "He is not here". So I ask yet again, why do you think this was the time for the resurrection?
for the record...the discussion you initiated was a sidetracking from the original point of the thread... :rolleyes:

and actually the bible -does- indicate at least that jesus' resurrection was on sunday...

mark 16:9..."Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons."

this does not give us an exact time...but it does narrow things down...especially with regard to the topic of this thread...where as i noted some people have even argued that jesus rose on saturday...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Funny, Easter isn't mentioned in the Bible AT ALL, and itself is a "post new testament invention."

If you're going to criticize Passover for some of its un-Biblical traditions, you better be criticizing Easter by the exact same standard.
but i -don't- criticize passover...you can have your own extrabiblical traditions that you are free to do at passover...i just want people to be -aware- of the fact that they are extrabiblical...

especially if those people who practice extrabiblical passover traditions are hypocritically attacking christians who celebrate extrabiblical christmas and easter holidays...
 
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scripture -doesn't- say jesus died while the passover lambs were being slaughtered...and it says much to the contrary...but you seem willing to ignore scripture when it goes against your erroneous tradition...

i should also point out to everyone reading this thread that you have made the exact -opposite- argument in the 'passover/unleavened countdown' thread...now maybe you can tell us all what you -actually- believe and what you are just -dishonestly- advocating for the sake of your argument?

and what is this about a 'stake'? you must be a jehovah's witness or a member of one of those cults that believe in that sort of thing...christians have always believed jesus died on a -cross-
i noticed all that as well.
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Yes, we mustn't let facts get in the way must we? The timekeeping you say is unbiblical. Where do you think my source is that I arrive at my deductions? All you wrote is correct except for the absolute fact that the Hebrew idiom ceases to be when including the night as well as the day, which is a 24hr period, Ah, which changes things. Because you have never heard of certain things, or bothered to seek out truth because the majority is on your side - well I would have been among the minority when the majority was slathering the golden calf with more gold. I have more to say about "Easter" and you will not like it, because it will rain on your parade. Keep daubing the wall. I know you do not know what I meant by that, which is why I said it.
the 'three days and three nights' is equated with 'three days' and 'third day' in the parallel passages of scripture...meaning they are saying the same thing...

and as i already proved from acts 10 where the biblical timekeeping convention is used...'three days' can include partial days...which is essential to understand since the biblical chronology of the crucifixion and resurrection absolutely -rules out- the modernist seventy-two hour interpretation...

i don't know what else you have to say about easter...but if it is on the same level as the 'pagan origin' misinformation posted earlier in this thread...then know that it is just a combination of fake history and blatant fiction...
 
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and what is this about a 'stake'? you must be a jehovah's witness or a member of one of those cults that believe in that sort of thing...christians have always believed jesus died on a -cross-

CONCLUSION
So this is what we have here: A full cross would be too heavy for a man to carry all the way to Calvary, whereas a singular beam would be much more manageable. Scientific evidence also supports the use of a simple stake instead of a cross in the case of Jesus Christ’s murder. Since a cross would take days to kill, and Scripture states that death happened within mere hours, this also points to a simple stake or pole. Couple these things with the original language used in Scripture, the evidence shows clearly that the true instrument of the Messiah’s execution was a simple stake or pole.

Was a CROSS or a STAKE used in Christ's Crucifixion

"We adhere to the basic doctrines of the Bible that Mr. Herbert W. Armstrong was so capably used of God to bring back to the worlds awareness"
 
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first of all i already proved that jesus had eaten the passover seder from the following...

matthew 26:17..."Now on the first day of Unleavened Bread the disciples came to Jesus and asked, 'Where do You want us to prepare for You to eat the Passover?'"
mark 14:12..."On the first day of Unleavened Bread, when the Passover lamb was being sacrificed, His disciples *said to Him, 'Where do You want us to go and prepare for You to eat the Passover?'"
luke 22:7..."Then came the first day of Unleavened Bread on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed."

the statements from three gospel writers are pretty definitive...since we as christians don't believe scripture is in hopeless contradiction with itself...there must be something wrong with your interpretation of john that produces a contradiction...

'it was just before the passover festival' and 'the evening meal was in progress' in john 13:1-2 refer to the fact that there was a meal associated with the passover seder...nowdays the meal is always held towards the end of the seder...but in earlier times they had not yet settled on such exacting seder traditions...evidently jesus had his evening meal before the seder...

john 13:29 and and john 18:28 are explained by the fact that the passover and feast of unleavened bread were terms that referred to the same seven day festival...there were still several more days in the feast...the disciples may have thought that more supplies were needed for the rest of the feast...and certainly it was still necessary for the priests to remain clean for the rest of the feast...

the 'day of preparation' was always the day before the sabbath...because you couldn't work on the sabbath you had to obtain and prepare whatever food you were going to eat the day before...making it a preparation day... it was the preparation day of the passover because it took place during the passover feast...and it was extra important because many people would have been preparing their firstfruit offerings at this time as well...
First you HAVE NOT PROVEN that they ate the Passover meal from the text. All the text says is that they were to PREPARE the room on the same day that the Passover lambs were to be killed. Second the First day of the Feast of Unleaven Bread is a HIGH SABBATH DAY in which NO WORK IS TO BE DONE. What then you have happening is that Jesus trial,death and burial is all on A HIGH SABBATH.

Exodus 12

15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.
16 And in the first day there shall be an holy convocation, and in the seventh day there shall be an holy convocation to you; no manner of work shall be done in them, save that which every man must eat, that only may be done of you.
17 And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.


Two add to that that the translators made errors in translation in those passages


THE “FIRST DAY” OF UNLEAVENED BREAD

Mat 26:17 Now the
first (#4413) day (not in original) of the feast of (not in original) unleavened
bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare for thee to eat
the Passover?

Mark 14:12 And the
first (#4413) day (#2250) of unleavened bread, when they killed the Passover,
his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the
Passover?

Luke 22:7 Then came the
day (#2250) of unleavened bread, when the Passover must be killed.

The translators have grossly mistranslated these three verses in regards to the words
“first” and “day”. They knew that the Greek used both of these words generally, as well
as specifically. They chose to translate these words specifically – creating a contradiction
in the scriptures. Moreover, nothing in the immediate context requires a specific
translation. In fact, a perusal understanding of the Passover and the Days of Unleavened
Bread reveals that a specific rendition of these words creates a contradiction. Because of
this mistranslation, commentators have stumbled over the intent of these verses for
centuries!

http://www.truthsearch.org/ContentsFirstDayofUnleavenedBread.html

Cont
 
Dec 26, 2012
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137
0
Let us look at the word <first> in Matthew 26:17. 2Peter 2:20 uses the same word.
There the KJV translates it as
beginning.

2Peter 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the
Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse
with them
than the beginning (#4413).

Realizing that the word <day> and <feast of> are not in the original in Matthew 26:17,
the verse should be translated as follows:

Matthew 26:17, Now at (toward) the beginning of unleavened bread the disciples came to Jesus
(Yahshua - Joshua), saying to Him, Where will you that we prepare for you to eat the Passover?

This is a correct translation because the 15th of Nisan is the first day of unleavened
bread. As the evidence points out that the time of this verse was earlier than the 15th
Nisan, the KJV translators made an error in translating this verse as though it was
already the 15th, when the Greek did not require this narrow translation.

Now let us look at Mark 14:12. This verse uses the same word for <first> (#4413). We
have already shown how one should translate this word. This verse does include the word
<day> (#2250), in the original. Notice how the following passages translates this word day
(#2250):

Acts 20:6 And we sailed away from Philippi after the days <2250> of unleavened bread, and came
unto them to Troas in five days <2250>; where we abode seven days <2250>.

Lu 1:5 There was in the days <2250> of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named
Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was
Elisabeth.

Lu 1:18 And Zacharias said unto the angel, Whereby shall I know this? For I am an old man, and my
wife well stricken in years <2250>.

Lu 9:51 And it came to pass, when the time <2250> was come that he should be received up, he
stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem,

As we see from above scriptures, the word <day> #2250 is general. It can be specific, if
the context requires specific information. By translating this verse as they have, the KJV
translators made the day specific. The problem is that the translation is in error because
the first day of unleavened bread is on the 15th and the Romans put the Messiah on the
tree on the 14th! Therefore, we have an impossible translation – it does not agree with
the facts. The 14th is not the first day of unleavened bread!

The word <day> #2250 is many times translated as <days> in a general sort of way as in
Luke 1:5 above. A correct translation of Mark 14:12 follows:

Mark 14:12, At the beginning of the season of unleavened bread, when they killed the Passover, His
disciples said to Him, Where will you that we go and prepare that you may eat the Passover.

It was at or toward the beginning of the time or season of unleavened bread that this took
place. Moreover, we all know that it was during the season of unleavened bread when the
Passover was slain.

The disciples came to Jesus (Yahshua – Joshua) before the evening began, and when the
evening came, they sit down together; therefore, this had to be no later than the 13th
Nisan. Consequently, if anyone wants to call the 14th the first day of unleavened bread,
which it is not, the translation is still in error – for the day in question was earlier than the
14th Nisan!

The thrust of the time is the beginning days or season of unleavened bread, which began,
directly, on the 10th of Nisan. The Jews did prepare roads, reconstruct bridges, and
whitewash tombs – among other activities – before the 10th Nisan, but the penning of the
lambs specifically for the Passover began on the 10th Nisan. We will see that it had to be
even earlier than the 13th when the disciples came to Christ for instructions to prepare
for the Passover!

Luke 22:7 is even more revealing. The Greek word <day> is Strong’s #2250. We have
seen a correct translation using that word. Moreover, unless one translates it, as we have
shown, we have a gross error. The day the Passover was slain was not a day of
unleavened bread! The Festival of Unleavened Bread encompassed only 7 days. If we
include the 14th Nisan, the day for slaying the Passover lambs, as a day of unleavened
bread, we have 8 days of unleavened bread. This would be an impossible translation –
even if one accepted the erroneous idea that the day involved was the 14th Nisan! Here
is a correct way to translate this verse:

Luke 22:7 Then came the season of unleavened bread, when the Passover must be killed.

A correct translation of these scriptures must reveal that the writers referred to the
season of unleavened bread, rather than a specific day of unleavened bread – otherwise
we have a contradiction. Additionally, the above translation is well within the meaning of
the Greek.

The "First Day" of Unleavened Bread
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
Funny, Easter isn't mentioned in the Bible AT ALL, and itself is a "post new testament invention."

If you're going to criticize Passover for some of its un-Biblical traditions, you better be criticizing Easter by the exact same standard.
Yes it is mentioned in the Bible, but some dummy re-named it.

It is called First Fruits and it is always celebrated on a SUNDAY, or if you had to re-name it, Resurrection Sunday would be appropriate.

Leviticus 23:15-21 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] 'You shall also count for yourselves from the day after the sabbath, from the day when you brought in the sheaf of the wave offering; there shall be seven complete sabbaths.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] ~'You shall count fifty days to the day after the seventh sabbath; then you shall present a new grain offering to the LORD.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] ~'You shall bring in from your dwelling places two loaves of bread for a wave offering, made of two-tenths of an ephah; they shall be of a fine flour, baked with leaven as first fruits to the LORD.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] ~'Along with the bread you shall present seven one year old male lambs without defect, and a bull of the herd and two rams; they are to be a burnt offering to the LORD, with their grain offering and their drink offerings, an offering by fire of a soothing aroma to the LORD.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] ~'You shall also offer one male goat for a sin offering and two male lambs one year old for a sacrifice of peace offerings.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] ~'The priest shall then wave them with the bread of the first fruits for a wave offering with two lambs before the LORD; they are to be holy to the LORD for the priest.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] ~'On this same day you shall make a proclamation as well; you are to have a holy convocation. You shall do no laborious work. It is to be a perpetual statute in all your dwelling places throughout your generations.

1 Corinthians 15:20-23 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
[SUP]23 [/SUP] But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming,

First Fruits and The Seven Feasts of Israel

ZLM Video: “First Fruits — The Resurrection”
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
First you HAVE NOT PROVEN that they ate the Passover meal from the text. All the text says is that they were to PREPARE the room on the same day that the Passover lambs were to be killed. Second the First day of the Feast of Unleaven Bread is a HIGH SABBATH DAY in which NO WORK IS TO BE DONE. What then you have happening is that Jesus trial,death and burial is all on A HIGH SABBATH.

Exodus 12

15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.
16 And in the first day there shall be an holy convocation, and in the seventh day there shall be an holy convocation to you; no manner of work shall be done in them, save that which every man must eat, that only may be done of you.
17 And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.


Two add to that that the translators made errors in translation in those passages


THE “FIRST DAY” OF UNLEAVENED BREAD

Mat 26:17 Now the
first (#4413) day (not in original) of the feast of (not in original) unleavened
bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare for thee to eat
the Passover?

Mark 14:12 And the
first (#4413) day (#2250) of unleavened bread, when they killed the Passover,
his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the
Passover?

Luke 22:7 Then came the
day (#2250) of unleavened bread, when the Passover must be killed.

The translators have grossly mistranslated these three verses in regards to the words
“first” and “day”. They knew that the Greek used both of these words generally, as well
as specifically. They chose to translate these words specifically – creating a contradiction
in the scriptures. Moreover, nothing in the immediate context requires a specific
translation. In fact, a perusal understanding of the Passover and the Days of Unleavened
Bread reveals that a specific rendition of these words creates a contradiction. Because of
this mistranslation, commentators have stumbled over the intent of these verses for
centuries!

http://www.truthsearch.org/ContentsFirstDayofUnleavenedBread.html

Cont
mark 14:12 and luke 22:7 both indicate that jesus' disciples acquired the upper room for the passover seder on the day the passover lambs were sacrificed...

and the source of this 'translator error' article turns out to be an armstrong cultist...among other dubious things i found on that site is the claim that the scapegoat on the day of atonement is satan instead of christ...
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
by the way...if anyone still doubts that passover is exactly the same day as the first day of the feast of unleavened bread...

deuteronomy 16:4..."For seven days no leaven shall be seen with you in all your territory, and none of the flesh which you sacrifice on the evening of the first day shall remain overnight until morning."
 

And

Banned
Apr 10, 2014
364
2
0
There is nothing good about friday when they killed Jesus


ignore Good friday
the Bible says nothing about Good friday

it says GOOD SABBATH is the day to worship on.