Grace alone or grace plus works?
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Yes, we wouldn't want to convolute our answer with something as insignificant as scripture.
The premise of your question is flawed. Your definition of faith doesn't include honor or obedience. Abraham obeyed God (believed) and it was accounted unto him as Faith.
God told Abraham to do something and he did it. The Bible calls that Faith.
Did Abraham do as most other men, and make excuses why he can't do as he is told? Did he create his own version of God, his own path, his own instruction, his own festivals and high days?
No Billy, he did what the creator God of the Universe told him to do, and it was accounted unto him as Faith.
So given the Word's definition of Faith given us through examples in the Bible, the answer to your question is:**********
YES!
The premise of your question is flawed. Your definition of faith doesn't include honor or obedience. Abraham obeyed God (believed) and it was accounted unto him as Faith.
God told Abraham to do something and he did it. The Bible calls that Faith.
Did Abraham do as most other men, and make excuses why he can't do as he is told? Did he create his own version of God, his own path, his own instruction, his own festivals and high days?
No Billy, he did what the creator God of the Universe told him to do, and it was accounted unto him as Faith.
So given the Word's definition of Faith given us through examples in the Bible, the answer to your question is:**********
YES!
you are welcome.
I'm not sure of your point here. Did Abraham believe in God before obeying Him? Certainly, that is the point is it not?
I mean God tells us to do something. We all have 2 choices. We can believe in God and do what He says. Or we can believe in our own instructions and reject what He says.
Abraham's "WORKS" showed us which of these choices he made.
He believed in God and his obedience turned his belief into Faith.
Isn't that the true difference between claiming belief in God and having Faith in God?
I'm not sure of your point here. Did Abraham believe in God before obeying Him? Certainly, that is the point is it not?
I mean God tells us to do something. We all have 2 choices. We can believe in God and do what He says. Or we can believe in our own instructions and reject what He says.
Abraham's "WORKS" showed us which of these choices he made.
He believed in God and his obedience turned his belief into Faith.
Isn't that the true difference between claiming belief in God and having Faith in God?
Mcdonalds Christianity, the american kind as I mentioned. It shows in your avatar too hey!
The part in red: This is part of the false idea that all sin is equal, you get this from James. The problem is that in reality all sin is not equal, thats why sins have a different punishment in the OT.
Are you equating vile sins of the flesh such as adultery with something like knowing to do good and not doing it, or saying something mean to somebody? Thats ridicilous. No one is walking down the street and all of a sudden "falls" into adultery. But one CAN however sin unwillfully because no one is perfect in knowledge. There is a difference between wilfull and unwillful sins. This is made evident in both OT and NT, Hebrews 10:26 and Numbers 15:30
Galatians 5:19-21 and 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is a good start to see whats up.
The part in red: This is part of the false idea that all sin is equal, you get this from James. The problem is that in reality all sin is not equal, thats why sins have a different punishment in the OT.
Are you equating vile sins of the flesh such as adultery with something like knowing to do good and not doing it, or saying something mean to somebody? Thats ridicilous. No one is walking down the street and all of a sudden "falls" into adultery. But one CAN however sin unwillfully because no one is perfect in knowledge. There is a difference between wilfull and unwillful sins. This is made evident in both OT and NT, Hebrews 10:26 and Numbers 15:30
Galatians 5:19-21 and 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is a good start to see whats up.
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That goes to the root of the problem, and why you and people who try to follow law. And not serve in love have, They think there is differences in sin WHEN IT COMES TO A HOLY GOD.
You forget that Adam ate a peace of fruit, and because of that one smal sin, The fall of mankind, the fall of society, and great spiritual war. And the eventual destruction of this earth is the result.
yes. Murder is a greater sin, On society, it can not be allowed to continue, it does not have the same effect as a lie, and thus a greater punishment is needed because of its effect on SOCIETY.
However, As james makes it clear. Even the smallest of sin causes us to be guilty of the whole law.
The smallest white lie makes us guilty, what is the penalty? Death
Knowing to do right, yet not doing it (the sin of omission) causes us to fall short of Gods glory, The penalty is death
Any time we place our needs above the needs of other (failing to love) is a sin, the penalty is death
The fact is, the penalty of sin (all sin, not just the great sins) is death, the gift of God is eternal life.
Your K-Mart blue light special salvation via watered down obedience and ignoring you own sin, is not the gospel fo God.
You forget that Adam ate a peace of fruit, and because of that one smal sin, The fall of mankind, the fall of society, and great spiritual war. And the eventual destruction of this earth is the result.
yes. Murder is a greater sin, On society, it can not be allowed to continue, it does not have the same effect as a lie, and thus a greater punishment is needed because of its effect on SOCIETY.
However, As james makes it clear. Even the smallest of sin causes us to be guilty of the whole law.
The smallest white lie makes us guilty, what is the penalty? Death
Knowing to do right, yet not doing it (the sin of omission) causes us to fall short of Gods glory, The penalty is death
Any time we place our needs above the needs of other (failing to love) is a sin, the penalty is death
The fact is, the penalty of sin (all sin, not just the great sins) is death, the gift of God is eternal life.
Your K-Mart blue light special salvation via watered down obedience and ignoring you own sin, is not the gospel fo God.
John 6:60 ¶ Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
70 Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
71 He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
Hearing and believing the word of God produces faith.
Romans 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.
19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.
20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.
21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
70 Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
71 He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
Hearing and believing the word of God produces faith.
Romans 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.
19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.
20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.
21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
ive heard some say that these are like descriptive and not prescriptive if those are the right words of how a saved person is to be. its God's work.
some say its talking about rewards in the kingdom like romans 14:17. but the problem i got with this interpretation is that those verses in galatians corinthians say wont inherit meaning in the future.
some say its talking about rewards in the kingdom like romans 14:17. but the problem i got with this interpretation is that those verses in galatians corinthians say wont inherit meaning in the future.