Has this been fulfilled yet about burning the weapons?

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tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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#21
I don't know about that occurring in Israel as I am not familiar with their gun laws.
However, as I recollect in Great Britain when their strict gun laws passed in Parliament people were ordered to turn over personal firearms. Even if they were very valuable antiques.
And supposedly these were then melted down. Though I doubt very much the valuable antiques were.

"All governments are corrupt. It's a matter of degrees that lull a people into thinking that which commands over them is less foul than the rest." Anonymous
Yeah, even their bobbies were disarmed for years but now they are packing automatic machine guns.
 

tourist

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#22
So the seven years in the prophecy is the centuries from the Exile until 1967? Did people in Israel not gather wood to cook over during all that time?
Maybe they burned the cedars of Lebanon to cook their meals.
 

Lillywolf

Well-known member
Aug 29, 2018
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#23
Yeah, even their bobbies were disarmed for years but now they are packing automatic machine guns.
I knew they were disarmed and if needing armed assistance had to call a special branch to come help. Which takes time to arrive. Really bad news when violence is happening and all responding bobbies have are batons and pepper spray.
I had not heard they're now carrying auto-machine guns.
 

tourist

Senior Member
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#24
I knew they were disarmed and if needing armed assistance had to call a special branch to come help. Which takes time to arrive. Really bad news when violence is happening and all responding bobbies have are batons and pepper spray.
I had not heard they're now carrying auto-machine guns.
Actually, it is as you have said, bobbies still do not carry weapons but only members of the special trained firearm police officers. Due the increased level of violence in the UK this policy has to change and fast. In northern Ireland however, all police officers carry firearms.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#25
so I was listening to a podcast of this section while I was out walking this morning and I realized that this passage must have already been fulfilled,
or it's highly symbolic,
or there will be some drastic reduction of technology in the future.

I say that because today we would not burn the weapons of warfare, most of which would not burn anyways, and especially not burn them for cooking fires which seems to be the implication above.
could be a drastic leap in technology. maybe rifles powered by cold fusion batteries, so that people 'burn' them in the sense of to power other tech that cooks or produces food, provides heating/cooling, etc. maybe 'war clubs' have some future equivalence to a Warhammer 40k chainsword or something.

((has read a lot of sci-fi during his brief years))

really interesting question you got here :)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#26
Yes, I grew up with the idea that Ezekiel 38 and 39 were in the future. Strange though to think of people burning modern weapons, like tanks?
i believe Ezekiel 38 is yet to come, too. maybe very soon - the Kurds are the descendants of the Assyrians, integral to the prophecy: "My handiwork" He says of them ((Isaiah 19))..

but one thing striking about this is that it reads as though it's a very large infantry war. that's an oddity given modern military technology, and the fact that it's talking about many powerful nations, esp. Russia, taking part - not like guerrilla armies. modern war is largely about air superiority; when the US invaded Iraq they didn't send in ground troops until after so much bombing. so one might suppose that something happens to take that out of the way, or even to disable most modern hardware. which reminds me of how Damascus is also prophesied to one day be reduced to a wasteland ((Isaiah 17)).
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#27
Yes, I suppose gunpowder could be used for a cooking fire, my wife suggested the explosive C4. Apparently that can be used to cook over if you do it right.

Of course these ideas require stretching the word sword to mean gun, Etc.
yup

like super-sterno hehe


s-l300.jpg
 

Lillywolf

Well-known member
Aug 29, 2018
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#28
Actually, it is as you have said, bobbies still do not carry weapons but only members of the special trained firearm police officers. Due the increased level of violence in the UK this policy has to change and fast. In northern Ireland however, all police officers carry firearms.
Good. Perhaps England will copy that and soon, as you suggest.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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#29
Probably not, but I do know that the weapon of choice of demonstrating Palestinians is a rock. Guess they already burnt all of their weapons.
I think the Palestinians usually use rocks or Rockets.
guns are probably impractical against the vastly superior Israeli military force.

I used to be highly pro-israel, but it's starting to look to me more like they are oppressors.

I think if Israel sees the Westbank as part of itself, then it would make sense to incorporate that into Israel. or forget about it and let the Palestinians have a state.

But holding a population of several million people in a kind of limbo is not right, in my opinion. It's not loving your neighbor as yourself.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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#31
i believe Ezekiel 38 is yet to come, too. maybe very soon - the Kurds are the descendants of the Assyrians, integral to the prophecy: "My handiwork" He says of them ((Isaiah 19))..

but one thing striking about this is that it reads as though it's a very large infantry war. that's an oddity given modern military technology, and the fact that it's talking about many powerful nations, esp. Russia, taking part - not like guerrilla armies. modern war is largely about air superiority; when the US invaded Iraq they didn't send in ground troops until after so much bombing. so one might suppose that something happens to take that out of the way, or even to disable most modern hardware. which reminds me of how Damascus is also prophesied to one day be reduced to a wasteland ((Isaiah 17)).
Yes much of modern war is done from the air... And increasingly with robots, drones.

I suppose it's possible that a technology will be developed that will make the use of electronics, or even steal based weapons, impractical. Much like the machine gun made Cavalry Charges impractical.
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
9,017
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#32
9 “ ‘ “At that time those who live in the towns of Israel will go out and light a fire. They will use it to burn up the weapons. That includes small and large shields. It also includes bows and arrows, war clubs and spears. It will take seven years to burn all of them up. 10 People will not gather wood from the fields. They will not cut down the forests. Instead, they will burn the weapons. And they will rob those who robbed them. They will steal from those who stole from them,” announces the Lord and King.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ezekiel+39&version=NIRV

so I was listening to a podcast of this section while I was out walking this morning and I realized that this passage must have already been fulfilled,
or it's highly symbolic,
or there will be some drastic reduction of technology in the future.

I say that because today we would not burn the weapons of warfare, most of which would not burn anyways, and especially not burn them for cooking fires which seems to be the implication above.

Or maybe there's another option?
Hello Dan,

The burning of weapons for seven years, is directly related to the Gog and Magog war of Ezekiel 39-39. Therefore, since that event has not yet taken place and is yet future, then the reference to Israel burning their weapons for fuel also could not have taken place.

There is nothing symbolic about when God puts hooks in the jaw of Gog, Magog and all of the nations with them who go down towards Jerusalem to plunder it. God is going turn every man's sword against his brother, without Israel lifting a finger and then all the nations will no that it was God who did it. Only one sixth will be left, with everyone else being killed by God himself.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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#33
I think the Palestinians usually use rocks or Rockets.
guns are probably impractical against the vastly superior Israeli military force.

I used to be highly pro-israel, but it's starting to look to me more like they are oppressors.

I think if Israel sees the Westbank as part of itself, then it would make sense to incorporate that into Israel. or forget about it and let the Palestinians have a state.

But holding a population of several million people in a kind of limbo is not right, in my opinion. It's not loving your neighbor as yourself.
I believe that Israel once offered the Palestinians citizenship with full rights but the offer was refused.
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
2,809
106
63
#34
I think the Palestinians usually use rocks or Rockets.
guns are probably impractical against the vastly superior Israeli military force.
If the swords, spears, etc. are literal we know that it cannot be future.

The reasons people think this is future is the term "latter years" Ezek 38:8, which only means later from that time when it was written.

And the mentioning of Magog which is people to the relative north of Israel who are also seen in Rev 20:8, which there is no connection to the 2 events described except the name. To say that the 2 events are the same, is an assumption which cannot be confirmed by scripture.


I used to be highly pro-israel, but it's starting to look to me more like they are oppressors.
I believe that these problems would have been resolved long ago if it wasn't for the interference from Iran. And there are radical Israelites also. But understand that the government of Israel is human and facing an enemy of worldly power. Israel is 1/2 the size of the Netherlands, 1/2 the size of Belgium, tiny.

The war for the survival of Israel and Jerusalem has already begun, it's just in the somewhat early stages The situation could explode at any time. The resolve of Iran and the gentile nations to destroy Israel will, be fulfilled.


I think if Israel sees the Westbank as part of itself, then it would make sense to incorporate that into Israel. or forget about it and let the Palestinians have a state.
The land seized in Jerusalem in 1967 belonged to Jordan and never was independent in any way. The Sinai was returned to Egypt and the Golan Hts. to Syria.

But it doesn't matter to Israel's enemies how much Israel concedes, because they will never stop until Israel is destroyed.


But holding a population of several million people in a kind of limbo is not right, in my opinion. It's not loving your neighbor as yourself.
I agree. All they have to do is acknowledge Israel's right to exist as a nation and seek peace. But that isn't going to happen.

Egypt could open it's borders but the flow of weapons into Gaza would cause the Israelite military to take action. Egypt knows that the end is to destroy Israel.

-------
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
2,809
106
63
#35
i believe Ezekiel 38 is yet to come, too. maybe very soon - the Kurds are the descendants of the Assyrians, integral to the prophecy: "My handiwork" He says of them ((Isaiah 19))..


I have noticed from reading the old books and maps how the position of Magog has changed over the years.

Somehow it went from the Kurds to being Russia.

I believe that the change was done by certain groups to make history agree with their teachings of prophecy.

Also the location of the cities Meshech and Tubal. In the older maps they are cities on the black sea. In the modern times Meshech has become Moscow.

----------
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
9,017
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#36
If the swords, spears, etc. are literal we know that it cannot be future.

The reasons people think this is future is the term "latter years" Ezek 38:8, which only means later from that time when it was written.
Hello abcdef,

Do you actually think that when Ezekiel wrote the prophecy regarding the future wipe-out of Gog and Magog 2600 years ago, that Ezekiel would call the weapons laser guided missiles, automatic weapons, drones and whatever other technological weapons will be present? No! Ezekiel would not have anything to compare to what he was seeing in his vision. Therefore, the closest he would be to come to comparing those future weapons to would be to what was existing, i.e. swords, spears, bows, arrows, etc. He wouldn't have any comparison of the technology to be able to explain them. Likewise, another good example of this would be when Jesus returns to end the age where the people will beat their swords and spears into plowshares and pruning hooks, respectively. When Isaiah received this information, he would have nothing to compare to the technological weapons that we have today. Therefore, they are listed as swords, spears, bows and arrows, which are representing weapons of war.

This event is still future, as the world has not seen God alone wipe out five sixth of the Gog, Magog, tubal, Meshech, Put, Gomer and the rest. Further more, one of the purposes of this event will be for the following:

"I will show my greatness and my holiness, and I will make myself known in the sight of many nations. Then they will know that I am the Lord.’

God has not single handedly, by His own power, wiped out five sixths of Gog, Magog and their hordes so that that nations know that God is the One who was responsible. It's still a future event.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
7,943
887
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#37
Hello Dan,

The burning of weapons for seven years, is directly related to the Gog and Magog war of Ezekiel 39-39. Therefore, since that event has not yet taken place and is yet future, then the reference to Israel burning their weapons for fuel also could not have taken place.

There is nothing symbolic about when God puts hooks in the jaw of Gog, Magog and all of the nations with them who go down towards Jerusalem to plunder it. God is going turn every man's sword against his brother, without Israel lifting a finger and then all the nations will no that it was God who did it. Only one sixth will be left, with everyone else being killed by God himself.
Sounds like at some point then technology will have to go backwards for some reason similar to how it did in the Middle Ages in order for it to make sense to attack Israel with bows and arrows and shields.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
7,943
887
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#38
I believe that Israel once offered the Palestinians citizenship with full rights but the offer was refused.
Yes that sounds familiar I think you're correct on that.

Since Israel is the occupying power, in the end it's really Israel's decision. Is the West Bank part of Israel or not?

Or if Israel is to remain a long-term occupying power, then I think it's reasonable for Israel to abide by international law regarding military occupation, including the treaties that they signed on to as I understand it.

That would mean that the settlements would be illegal.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
7,943
887
113
#39
If the swords, spears, etc. are literal we know that it cannot be future.

The reasons people think this is future is the term "latter years" Ezek 38:8, which only means later from that time when it was written.

And the mentioning of Magog which is people to the relative north of Israel who are also seen in Rev 20:8, which there is no connection to the 2 events described except the name. To say that the 2 events are the same, is an assumption which cannot be confirmed by scripture.




I believe that these problems would have been resolved long ago if it wasn't for the interference from Iran. And there are radical Israelites also. But understand that the government of Israel is human and facing an enemy of worldly power. Israel is 1/2 the size of the Netherlands, 1/2 the size of Belgium, tiny.

The war for the survival of Israel and Jerusalem has already begun, it's just in the somewhat early stages The situation could explode at any time. The resolve of Iran and the gentile nations to destroy Israel will, be fulfilled.




The land seized in Jerusalem in 1967 belonged to Jordan and never was independent in any way. The Sinai was returned to Egypt and the Golan Hts. to Syria.

But it doesn't matter to Israel's enemies how much Israel concedes, because they will never stop until Israel is destroyed.




I agree. All they have to do is acknowledge Israel's right to exist as a nation and seek peace. But that isn't going to happen.

Egypt could open it's borders but the flow of weapons into Gaza would cause the Israelite military to take action. Egypt knows that the end is to destroy Israel.

-------
Lots of good points there

I think that if Israel is a Jewish Nation, and the people of God, then it can only Survive by following God's way, which is to love your neighbor as yourself, regardless of what other nations or influences there are. Israel clearly is not treating the populations of the occupied territories that way, in my opinion.

If his real is not the people of God, not a Jewish Nation, then it really doesn't matter if they rise or fall, they are just like any other Nation.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
7,943
887
113
#40
Lots of good points there

I think that if Israel is a Jewish Nation, and the people of God, then it can only Survive by following God's way, which is to love your neighbor as yourself, regardless of what other nations or influences there are. Israel clearly is not treating the populations of the occupied territories that way, in my opinion.

If his real is not the people of God, not a Jewish Nation, then it really doesn't matter if they rise or fall, they are just like any other Nation.
Oops

Where it says his real
Should be Israel.