Hell's Population Clock

[WebersHome]

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It was important to the plan of salvation that humanity be created
susceptible to sin and death because Christ was already assigned the task of
giving his life for the sins of the world before there even was a world (1Pet
1:20, Rev 13:8). In other words: humanity's susceptibility to sin and death
was essential, it was deliberate, and it was designed.

†. Gen 1:31 . . And God saw every thing that He had made, and, behold, it
was very good.

The Hebrew word for "good" in that passage is extremely ambiguous, which
Webster's defines as capable of being understood in two or more possible
senses. Well; in the case of towb (tobe) there's a catalogue of senses to
choose from. However; in context, towb simply means everything turned out
exactly as God planned; including, but not limited to, humanity's
susceptibility to sin and death. That is just a cold, hard fact of life so
everybody might just as well bite the bullet, and get used to it.

Pop Clock Update: 219 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 12,829,239 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Rom 3:4 . .Though everyone else in the world is a liar, God is true. As the
Scriptures say, "He will be proved right in what He says, and He will win His
case in court."

Quite a number of Atheists that I encounter online are convinced that the
Bible's God doesn't know what He's talking about. Well; the day is coming
when they will do a face-to-face with their maker at which time both He and
they will be given an opportunity to debate their differences. When it's over,
God will have defended Himself to such a degree that even His opponents
will have to admit He was right all along.

That's interesting. It tells me that God doesn't insist He's right just because
He says so. It tells me His ways are logical, reasonable, and defensible. I
would really like to be a spectator at some of those face-offs. Should be very
entertaining.

†. Jude 14-16 . . See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of
his holy ones to judge everyone; and to convict all the ungodly of all the
impious acts they have done in an impious way, and of all the harsh words
that impious sinners have spoken against Him.

Pop Clock Update: 223 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 13,635,563 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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The tragedy of the second death is that there are no more lives after that
because according to Dan 12:2, John 5:29, and Rev 20:5-6 there is but one
resurrection allotted per person; which is very serious because according to
Rom 6:23, the wages of sin is death.

Let's say that somebody standing trial at the Great White Throne event
depicted at Rev 20:11-15 told something like 120 lies in their lifetime. Well;
according to the law of sin and death (Rom 6:23) they face capital
punishment for each count of lying, for a grand total of 120 executions.
Well; they won't have 120 lives with which to be executed 120 times; they'll
have just the one; leaving a balance of 119 lies for which the wages of sin is
death. So the reason nobody is coming back from the reservoir of flaming
sulfur is just simple arithmetic; viz: the reservoir can be thought of as a sort
of debtor's prison.

†. Matt 5:25-26 . . Come to terms with your adversary quickly, while you
are in the way with him, lest your adversary deliver you to the judge, the
judge hand you over to the officer, and you be thrown into prison.
Assuredly, I say to you, you will by no means get out of there till you have
paid the last penny.

Well, the wages of sin isn't pennies, or gold, or silver, or fiat currency, or
time behind bars: no; it's capital punishment, so that once people are
executed in the reservoir of flaming sulfur that's where they'll stay because
they'll have no means at their disposal with which to pay their way out of
there.

Pop Clock Update: 227 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 13,297,887 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Rev 14:6-7 . . And I saw another angel flying through the sky, carrying
the everlasting gospel to preach to the people who dwell on the earth-- to
every nation, tribe, language, and people. Fear God! he shouted. Give glory
to Him! For the time has come when He will sit as judge. Worship Him who
made heaven and earth, the sea, and all the springs of water!

Most everybody tends to think of the gospel as depicted in the first four
books of the New Testament. But the everlasting gospel is found in the book
of Genesis too rather than only in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.

"In the beginning God created the Heaven and the earth. And the earth was
without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And
the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."

The everlasting gospel is very elementary. Pretty much all it says is:

1• There's a supreme being.

2• He deserves respect.

3• There's a frightful reckoning looming on the horizon, and

4• The cosmos-- all of its forms of life, matter, and energy --is the product
of intelligent design.

Of particular interest to me is the inclusion of water in the everlasting
gospel. Scientists theorize the origin of the earth's amazing quantity of water
without really knowing exactly where it came from, nor how it got here.

Well; that is one of the things that I like about Genesis. It takes an
essentially unsophisticated, uneducated blue-collar welder like myself and
gives him answers to questions that people much brighter, and better
educated than I cannot answer.

Giving "glory" to God simply indicates giving someone credit where credit is
due; and "worship" basically just simply means admiration.

It's quite natural to admire celebrities, pro athletes, and super achievers-- to
give them credit where credit is due --but not quite so natural to do the
same for their creator.

Anyway, point being: people either believe in intelligent design, or they
don't. If they do believe, then they will admire both the originator's genius
and His handiwork. If they don't believe; then they won't admire anything
about Him: simple as that.

Pop Clock Update: 230 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 13,473,630 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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Human life is fragile; so much so that even something as thin as the air can
snuff it out.

†. Isa 40:6-7 . . All flesh is grass, and all its kindness is like the blossom of
the field. The grass shall dry out, the blossom shall wilt, for a wind from the
Lord has blown upon it; behold the people is grass.

According to a report released on March 25, 2014 by the World Health
Organization; air pollution kills, on average, seven million people per
annum; and is linked to one in eight deaths (12½%) world-wide. Think of it.
That percentage represents 907,460,500 deaths linked to air pollution per
annum out of a currently estimated 7,259,684,000 people.

An estimated 4.3 million people died in 2012 as a result of indoor air
pollution, mostly from cooking inside with coal or wood stoves in developing
countries, according to a report by the public health agency of the United
Nations.

Air pollution is so lethal because it exacerbates other conditions like cardio
vascular diseases, cancer, and respiratory illnesses. Were people with those
conditions permitted to breathe clean air free of hazardous chemicals and
toxic particulates, they would live longer.

Pop Clock Update: 233 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 13,649,373 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

=================================

 

[WebersHome]

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†. Rev 21:8 . . But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers,
sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in
the lake which burns with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.

The koiné Greek word for "brimstone" is theion (thi'-on) which means sulfur,
which Webster's defines as a nonmetallic element that occurs either free or
combined esp. in sulfides and sulfates, is a constituent of proteins, exists in
several allotropic forms including yellow orthorhombic crystals, resembles
oxygen chemically but is less active and more acidic, and is used esp. in the
chemical and paper industries, in rubber vulcanization, and in medicine for
treating skin diseases.

Whenever sulfur is mentioned as a tool of judgment in the Bible, it's always
in combination with fire since sulfur doesn't exist in nature as a flaming
substance like lava and/or magma. Sulfur is flammable, yes, but then so is
an oak log and/or a lady's handkerchief.

One of the purposes for setting sulfur on fire is the fumes that it gives off are
quite useful for fumigation. Personally I wouldn't want to fumigate my house
with sulfur if perchance it might leave behind a rather unpleasant odor. In
point of fact, sulfur is one of the ingredients found in skunk scent and we all
know just how stubborn the odor of that stuff is.

I don't know exactly why God prefers using ignited sulfur in some
applications (e.g. Sodom and Gomorrah; Luke 17:29) but one thing's for
sure: if the conflagration doesn't get you, the fumes surely will without
respiratory protection.

Perhaps the impoundment of fire and sulfur depicted at Rev 20:11-15 and
Rev 21:8 is some sort of super-lethal weapon of mass destruction; viz: first
the fumes terminate your life, and then the fire cooks your corpse. Pretty
grisly thought.

However, though the corpses of the lost will be cooked, they won't be
cremated to oblivion. According to the Bible; the corpses will be preserved
as perpetual nourishment for a curious species of fire-proof worm. And
they'll also be on public display like the remains of those prehistoric animals
in the museum of the La Brea Tar Pits in Los Angeles.

†. Isa 66:22-24 . . All humanity will come to worship me from week to week
and from month to month. And as they go out, they will see the dead bodies
of those who have rebelled against me. For the worms that devour them will
never die, and the fire that burns them will never go out. All who pass by
will view them with utter loathing.

†. Mark 9:47-48 . . If your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out. It is better to
enter the kingdom of God half blind than to have two eyes and be thrown
into hell; where the worm never dies and the fire never goes out.

Pop Clock Update: 236 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 13,825,116 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

=================================

 

[WebersHome]

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Jeffrey Lionel Dahmer, a.k.a. the Milwaukee Cannibal (May 21, 1960
November 28, 1994) murdered upwards of 18 males. I won't go into the
grisly details of those incidents other than to say that he cannibalized,
lobotomized, dismembered, beheaded, eviscerated, and performed
unspeakable acts of necrophilia with their remains.

His primary motivation? Well; none of those murders were done in a spirit of
malice; nor were they kill-for-thrill murders either. His primary motivation
was actually very practical. You see; Dahmer was a lonely gay man plagued
with some serious abandonment issues. So in order to prevent his lovers
from dumping him, he simply killed them so they couldn't. His attempts to
lobotomize some of the males and turn them into love zombies resulted in
their demise.

Now what really interests me the most about Dahmer is that it's reported he
became a born-again Christian while in prison. If that report is true, then
according to John 3:3-18 and John 5:24, Jeffry didn't go to hell. Well; I
wouldn't be surprised if a number of conscientious church-goers, who had
been model citizens all their entire lives; will be very resentful over Mr.
Dahmer's unqualified acceptance into the heaven they worked so hard to
obtain.

Pop Clock Update: 239 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,000,859 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

=================================

 

[WebersHome]

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It's ironic that many of North America's Indian tribes, whom European
missionaries sought to convert to Christianity, were already believing in the
existence of a creator before the Europeans arrived. You know why? Well;
that's very easy. North America's Natives were far more in tune with nature
than the very Europeans who sought to convert them.

If you ask me; peoples like the Mohawk and the Seneca should have been
sending missionaries over to Europe rather than the other way around.
Europeans got their belief in a creator from a book; while America's
indigenous peoples got their belief in a creator from the very source that the
creator provided for all peoples the world over, both American and
European.

†. Ps 19:1-4 . .The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the
work of his hands. Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night
they display knowledge. There is no speech or language where their voice is
not heard. Their voice goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of
the world.

God says there is no excuse for refusing to believe that nature proves the
existence of a supreme being and that intelligent design is the truth.

†. Rom 1:18-20 . .The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against
all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their
wickedness, since what may be known about God is plain to them, because
God has made it plain to them. For since the creation of the world God's
invisible qualities-- his eternal power and divine nature --have been clearly
seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without
excuse.

NOTE: Speaking of Native Americans. Who were the first slaves in this
country? Blacks? No, Native Americans were the first slaves in this country.
When the Spaniards began settling in California, they right away captured
and made slaves of the indigenous peoples. Spaniards did the very same
thing to the Pueblo people in New Mexico and Arizona.

And then little by little, the Christian hordes from Europe began taking land
away from all Native Americans by dishonesty, by theft, by cruelty, by
murder, and by force. The White Man's religion remains to this day one of
the worst things that ever came to this country.

Pop Clock Update: 242 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,176,602 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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There are no people buried in cemeteries; only people's remains.

We call a corpse "remains" because it's no more sentient than a bikini-clad
Barbie doll. Corpses look like human persons; and that's because at one
time they were human persons; but that's over. Once the breath of life is
gone out them, corpses become no more a human person than a stick of Old
Spice deodorant.

When my father-in-law passed a while back, we all went to the hospital to
view the body. Well; I was very impressed that the frozen figure the hospital
staff brought up from the morgue on a portable slab wasn't my father-in
law, rather it was wooden mannequin that resembled my father-in-law. He
was gone; and the rigid, stone-cold statue lying in repose was what was left
of him. Very disturbing.

Death is depicted in the Bible as a pit. But not a grave pit: it's a hole dug in
the ground to trap wildlife. In other words: a hunting device from which an
animal is helpless to escape.

In life my father-in-law was a war hero-- a pipeline engineer in Burma on
Stilwell's' Road and flew The Hump into China. He was also a senior vice
president with Safeco Title. But in death, my father-in-law was trapped and
just as helpless to do anything about his circumstances as a sidewalk or a
lump of coal.

Pop Clock Update: 245 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,352,345 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Ecc 1:2-4 . . Meaningless! Futile! complains the Teacher. Utterly
meaningless! Everything is meaningless. What does a man gain from all his
labor at which he toils under the sun? Generations come and generations go,
but the earth remains forever.

The earth is dumber than a spatula; yet easily outlives its human potentate
whose IQ is infinitely greater. Take for example the great granite
monuments in Yosemite Valley. Tourists to the valley come, and tourists to
the valley go; and one day old age catches up with those tourists and
they're gone; yet Yosemite's great stones abide decade after decade;
century after century. Most children born this day will be dead in 100 years;
and those stones won't even notice. Though a child born today may be
intelligent enough to eventually understand orbital mechanics and string
theory; the stones-- stupid, mute, and uneducated --will easily outlast it.

†. Ecc 2:15-16 . . I thought in my heart,: The fate of the fool will overtake
me also. What then do I gain by being intelligent? I said in my heart: This is
meaningless For the intelligent man, like the fool, will not be long
remembered-- in days to come both will be forgotten. Like the fool, the
intelligent man too must die.

Pop Clock Update: 248 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,528,088 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

=================================

 

[skylove7]

Nooooo Weber
Aww man!
Not the clock again!
I haven't had my caramel cappuccino with 5,000 shots of espresso yet *rollseyes*

Sigh

 

[WebersHome]

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The only hell known to be fueled by sulfur is the fiery impoundment
described by John at Rev 20:11-15. The chemistry of the material fueling
the hell depicted at Luke 16:19-31 isn't stated. However, it appears that the
rich man isn't afloat in an impoundment; but rather, warehoused in
something more like a large furnace where he's at liberty to walk around a
bit and chat with his neighbors.

Alighieri Dante's Divine Comedy depicts a variety of punishments. For one
thing: his hell isn't strictly fire. In point of fact, the very lowest tier is ice. On
a higher tier; people are inserted head down in socket holes bored in solid
rock. On another tier, people are being dismembered over and over again by
demons with big swords. On yet another, people are submerged in boiling
pitch. On another, a guy is pinned down on a path where people repeatedly
walk on him. On another tier, people are continually pelted by embers. And
of course everybody on every tier is stark naked and afforded no protection
for their skin whatsoever.

It wasn't Dante's intention to provide an accurate picture of hell; but to
illustrate the wish of justice to administer punishment that fits the crime. It's
a common complaint that hell isn't fair. Everyone pays the same no matter
what they've done. Well; I'm not so sure; because that wouldn't be justice;
but would in fact be injustice. I think it's safe to assume that some people
will pay more than others in ways we cannot even imagine.

†. Ps 89:14 . . Righteousness and justice are the foundation of Thy throne

Pop Clock Update: 251 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,703,831 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Gen 2:8-9 . .The Lord God planted a garden in Eden, and placed there the
man whom He had formed. And from the ground the Lord God caused to
grow every tree that was pleasing to the sight and good for food, with the
tree of life in the middle of the garden,

The tree of life doesn't give life; but rather, according to Gen 3:22 has
something in it that sustains life: indefinitely. Exactly how the chemistry of
any plant could be so rich in nourishment as to stop the human body from
getting old and falling apart is currently unknown. A very active field of
modern scientific research in our own time is gerontology-- the study of the
phenomena of the aging process. As yet, gerontologists have no significant
understanding of the aging process, and therefore no clue as to what
treatments, or nutrients, might be employed to stop it.

The tree shows up again in the book of Revelation at 22:2. In the future, the
tree won't be utilized to keep the resurrected righteous forever young
because according to 1Cor 15:50-54 their bodies will be impervious to death
and the aging process. However; though their bodies will be impervious to
death and the aging process; to my knowledge they won't be impervious to
injury; hence, the tree's leaves will be utilized for First Aid treatments. For
really serious injuries-- e.g. broken teeth, dismemberment, disemboweling,
crushing, loss of an eye, and the like --Christ has already proven himself up
to the task of fixing things like that so people won't have to worry about
going through eternity handicapped and/or disfigured.

Pop Clock Update: 254 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,879,574 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Eph 1:15-18 . . I do not cease giving thanks for you, while making
mention of you in my prayers; that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the
Father of glory, may give to you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the
knowledge of Him. I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened

The eyes of one's heart are different than the eyes of one's intelligence.
What we're looking at in that passage isn't mentality; but rather: intuition;
which Webster's defines as the power or faculty of attaining to direct
knowledge or cognition without evident rational thought and inference. I'm
not talking about Gnosticism here. I'm talking about knowing what the Bible
means without it having to be explicit.

For example: in the 45th chapter of Genesis; Joseph broke down sobbing
during the reunion with his wicked brothers. Genesis makes no attempt to
explain Joseph's feelings because you're supposed to know things like that
without someone having to try and explain them to you. That's intuition; viz:
people discussing Christianity on internet forums sans the special intuition
spoken of in Eph 1:15-18, are like blind men in a dark room looking for a
black cat that isn't there; resulting in perpetual debates and endless bull
sessions about heaven and hell that never get to the bottom of anything.

The kind of intuition that Eph 1:15-18 is talking about is a very special kind
of intuition that comes from God only; and it's not easy to obtain; for
example:

†. Deut 29:2-4 . . Moses summoned all the Israelites and said to them: Your
eyes have seen all that The Lord did in Egypt to Pharaoh, to all his officials
and to all his land. With your own eyes you saw those great trials, those
miraculous signs and great wonders. But to this day The Lord has not given
you a mind that understands or eyes that see or ears that hear.

Pop Clock Update: 257 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 14,879,574 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Gen 2:16-17 . . And the Lord God commanded the man, saying: From any
tree of the garden you may eat freely; but from the tree of the knowledge of
good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you shall
surely die.

That passage has always been an embarrassment for Bible thumpers
because Adam didn't drop dead when he tasted the forbidden fruit. In point
of fact, he continued to live outside the garden of Eden for another 800
years after the birth of his son Seth. (Gen 5:4)

So; is there a reasonable explanation for this apparent discrepancy?

Well; first off let me point out that in order for the threat to resonate in
Adam's thinking; it had to be related to death as Adam understood death in
his day, not as the Bible thumpers understand death in their day. In other
words; Adam didn't expect to die spiritually. No, he expected to die
normally; viz: physically; like as in pass away.

The trick is: Adam wasn't told he would die the instant he tasted the fruit.
God's exact words were "in the day"

Well; according to Gen 2:4, the Hebrew word for "day" is a bit ambiguous. It
can easily indicate a period of time much, much longer than 24 hours' viz;
the "day" of Adam's death began the moment he ate the fruit.

That was a milestone in human history. Up till Adam tasted the fruit, the
only days on record were the six of creation, and the one when God ceased
creating. Adam inaugurated a new day by tasting the fruit-- the day of
death.

"Sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this
way death came to all men" (Rom 5:12)

Well; like Jack Palance's character Curly in the movie City Slickers said: "The
day ain't over yet"

†. Ecc 7:2 . . It is better to go to a house of mourning than to go to a house
of gaiety, for death is the destiny of every man; the living should take this
seriously.

Pop Clock Update: 260 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 15,231,060 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[Magenta]

Well; first off let me point out that in order for the threat to resonate in
Adam's thinking; it had to be related to death as Adam understood death in
his day, not as the Bible thumpers understand death in their day. In other
words; Adam didn't expect to die spiritually. No, he expected to die
normally; viz: physically; like as in pass away.

How do you know that Adam understood physical death?

 

[WebersHome]

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How do you know that Adam understood physical death?

The answer to your question is located in post #215.

Now; ask me how I know God meant physical death in Gen 2:16-17.

The answer to that isn't located in post #215; instead, it's located in
Gen 3:19 and Gen 3:22-24.

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[WebersHome]

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†. Gen 2:7 . .Then the Lord God formed man of dust from the ground, and
breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

That almost appears to be through-the-nose artificial respiration; but even if
it was, the attempt would have been futile. Pumping air into a corpse doesn't
work. It's been tried and failed. The "breath of life" then, has to be
something far more powerful seeing as how it has the ability to make
something alive and sentient that on its own would normally remain quite
still-- just as still as a bucket of stagnant water.

To this day, no one really knows what life is. Man knows how to keep things
alive for a time; but he doesn't as yet know how to make anything come to
life. Only in man's fantasies can a little wooden puppet like Pinocchio
transform into a real boy.

Pop Clock Update: 263 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 15,406,803 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

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[WebersHome]

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Lord, save me!

Those three words are reputed to be the shortest prayer in the Bible. It's
located at Mtt 14:30.

You know; it's a good thing that the length of one's prayer is unimportant
seeing as how Peter might have been ten feet under before he finished
reciting even one Our Father or a Hail Mary.

†. Mtt 6:7-8 . .When you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they
think they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them,
for your Father knows what you need before you ask Him.

Pop Clock Update: 266 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 15,582,546 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

=================================

 

[tourist]

-
Lord, save me!

Those three words are reputed to be the shortest prayer in the Bible. It's
located at Mtt 14:30.

You know; it's a good thing that the length of one's prayer is unimportant
seeing as how Peter might have been ten feet under before he finished
reciting even one Our Father or a Hail Mary.

†. Mtt 6:7-8 . .When you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they
think they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them,
for your Father knows what you need before you ask Him.

Pop Clock Update: 266 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 15,582,546 new
arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since December 10,
2014.

=================================

I believe that "Help!" may be the shortest prayer.