How do you Measure?

memyselfi · Feb 22, 2019

Our Lord said the heart is deceitfully wicked who can know it, in in Word by the prophet Jeremiah (17:19); then reiterated it in Romans 13:14.

Now, the Scripture tells us that when we are saved we are filled and lead by the Holy Spirit.

Do you take people "at face value? Do you take confessing Christians and non-confessing Christians word equally? Do you measure differently or is it just if "he/she" said it, it must be true?....

Lanolin · Feb 23, 2019

What do you mean by non-confessing christians....?

memyselfi · Feb 23, 2019

Lanolin said:

People who do ot confess to be Christians....

Dino246 · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

Our Lord said the heart is deceitfully wicked who can know it, in in Word by the prophet Jeremiah (17:19); then reiterated it in Romans 13:14.

Now, the Scripture tells us that when we are saved we are filled and lead by the Holy Spirit.

Do you take people "at face value? Do you take confessing Christians and non-confessing Christians word equally? Do you measure differently or is it just if "he/she" said it, it must be true?....

Perhaps you could flesh out what you mean.

memyselfi · Feb 23, 2019

Dino246 said:

Perhaps I could but I think that would confuse "christians"....

Notice not.... Christians

Dino246 · Feb 23, 2019

Whether I believe what people say depends on how well I know them, in which context, and what they are talking about. That goes for Christians and non-Christians. I've been lied to and cheated by Christians. Salvation doesn't change the heart instantly, unfortunately.

memyselfi · Feb 23, 2019

Dino246 said:

I wanted to make that point exactly, but I did not want to be to impetuous….

memyselfi · Feb 23, 2019

How does this play out as we make judgements as we hear the news as well as our personal lives?

Nehemiah6 · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

Normally everyone takes everyone else at face value until proven otherwise. Not sure what point you are trying to make, but only God knows who is a genuine child of God and who is not. Therefore it is not your place or mine to make that assessment.

However, actions speak louder than words, so everyone must eventually prove themselves as either genuine or fake. The important point is that Christians are not appointed to be assessing others or sitting in judgment, since they need to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling. You need to be busy putting your own house in order.

memyselfi · Feb 23, 2019

Nehemiah6 said:

Normally everyone takes everyone else at face value until proven otherwise. Not sure what point you are trying to make, but only God knows who is a genuine child of God and who is not. Therefore it is not your place or mine to make that assessment.

However, actions speak louder than words, so everyone must eventually prove themselves as either genuine or fake. The important point is that Christians are not appointed to be assessing others or sitting in judgment, since they need to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling. You need to be busy putting your own house in order.

Excellent!!!! So if we hear something we should not jump on the ban wagon, as Christians... ?

Nehemiah6 · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

If by that you mean jump to conclusions, correct. Christians must examine all things (teachings and practices) in the light of the Bible. And then seek the Lord's guidance in order to determine the truth.

memyselfi · Feb 23, 2019

Nehemiah6 said:

Honestly this post is about the actor who faked his own hate crime and so may Christians / non-Christians alike jumped on the bandwagon…. But I don't want this thread to be about "him" per say but a Christian acting "like" a Christian....

posthuman · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

that's weird; i hadn't heard about it at all. i don't understand why he thought faking an attack on himself would get him a raise -- sympathy bonus from his employer? what? but i don't want to talk about him either.

about a Christian acting 'like' a Christian -- a lot of Christians seem to have weird ideas about what a Christian is supposed to act like. i mean, they won't say certain words even tho they get just as angry and spiteful and say other words. and they act like the Kingdom of God is a matter of eating and drinking. or they think you have to be a member & blind supporter of some human political party. they wouldn't steal, but they covet just as much as the world does. the divorce rate among people who regularly go to churches is practically exactly the same as among people who don't. they sit in a pew and stand up on cue to sing some songs, and they listen to 20 or 30 minutes of something-not-entirely-unlike-preaching, then they stand up and all they talk about is where to eat lunch and how many points a football team will score maybe?

for example -
on facebook here's a pastor, he never touches a drop of alcohol or says anything unkind, and all he puts is about playing frisbee golf.
and on facebook here's a rock singer, who drinks and smokes and cusses, but all day puts scripture together with scripture, and wants to talk about nothing but glorifying Jesus Christ and condemning evil.

which one is a Christian? the one man does all the things that are 'like a christian' but he doesn't talk about Jesus, except for 30 minutes on sunday in front of the crowd. the other man does everything 'a christian' supposedly never does, but doesn't want to talk about anything except Jesus.

Dino246 · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

The blame for this incident falls on the perpetrator for arranging the "attack" for selfish reasons. However, there is a secondary problem that is two-fold: the story fit the biases of the popular media; and they didn't wait for the investigation before passing judgment. The popular media believes a certain set of stories, and because the initial reports of the incident aligned closely with their bias, they picked it up and ran with it. When the hoax was exposed, the popular media had egg on their collective faces because they had jumped the bandwagon... not that they would ever admit it.

Generally, we are wise to take everything in the media with a large grain of salt. That's nothing new though; both storytellers and snake oil salesmen have been around since before the Gibeonites (see Joshua 9). As Nehemiah6 wrote, let them prove themselves.

One more thought: if someone makes a claim, especially one that sounds in any way outrageous, the onus is on the claimant to provide evidence, and that evidence is subject to investigation. Nobody is obligated (nor should anyone be pressured) to believe a story on the basis of one witness. That's a biblical principle presented in the Law and echoed in the NT (Deut. 17:6 and 19:15; Mt 18:16; 1 Tim 5:19).

kaylagrl · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

Seems like the young actor has a lot of personal problems. He really doesn't sit in a place to judge others right now. I think people who are trying to get away with a scam usually blame others and don't take responsibility for their actions. Much of the media believe him and ran with the false story. I think the people who he was trying to get at that weren't believing his attack were white Trump supporters,since that is who he made the false story about. The thing is,even the president empathized with him at first. He really is in a heap of trouble,I think he needs to worry about that.

As far as believing people I don't,for the most part. I take my time to get to know a person before I trust them and their word. Anyone can call themselves a Christian,but unfortunately people also know Christians are easy to scam and they use that. Every scammer that stands and holds a sign asking for money has "God Bless" on it. That irks me. There is a reason why the do it. We must be wise and use discernment.

MessageOfTheCross · Feb 23, 2019

memyselfi said:

But he that is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. 1 Cor. 2:15

Lanolin · Feb 23, 2019

Um.
Your post is confusing, do you mean do we take people that tell the truth and people that lie, do we take them at face value.
How do we know someone is a believer or an unbeliever, is that what you mean?

The thing is we dont, we cant take anyone at face value, we need to take them at heart value. How, the holy spirit discerns the intents and purposes of the heart. Thats why we ned the holy spirit to help is pray for the said person.

Because if one confesses with ones MOUTH and believes in ones HEART the Lord Jesus then they will be saved, one cant just confess with ones mouth and not believe in ones heart....that would make that person a liar.

Wolves in sheeps clothing...you need discermentment and as said before its the holy spirit that gives discenrment. You can ask for this gift, its the spiritual gift of discernement.

MessageOfTheCross · Feb 23, 2019

Lanolin said:

False Prophets and Deceptions - Matthew 7:15-20

“15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves (“beware of false prophets” is said in the sternest of measures! there will be and are false prophets, and are some of Satan’s greatest weapons).

16 You shall know them by their fruits (this is the test as given by Christ as it regards identification of false prophets and false apostles). Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? (It is impossible for false doctrine, generated by false prophets, to bring forth good fruit.)

17 Even so every good tree brings forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree brings forth evil fruit (the good fruit is Christlikeness, while the evil fruit is self-likeness).”

“18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit (the “good tree” is the Cross, while the “corrupt tree” pertains to all of that which is other than the Cross).

19 Every tree that brings not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire (Judgment will ultimately come on all so-called gospel, other than the Cross [Rom. 1:18]).

20 Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them (the acid test).”

Excerpt From
The Expositor's Study Bible
Jimmy Swaggart
https://itunes.apple.com/us/book/the-expositors-study-bible/id399697870?mt=11
This material may be protected by copyright.

garee · Feb 24, 2019

memyselfi said:

We take it at his face value in respect to His knowledge that he has given us . (face to face)

Walking by faith the unseen spiritual. Comparing the spiritual unseen understanding to the same spirit of understanding. (faith to faith)

He measures things differently than the measure of men or the witness therefore as the witness of God (the golden reed. . We are not born with any familiarity of spirit . Manna the hidden mana in Revelation 2. It plays a great part in searching for the hidden understanding. Manna literally means . What is it? or what is it that we taste and see? Manna taste like honey a metaphor to describe the sweet fellowship with the word. Its color like that of a pearl as description of the 12 gates of the city as the bride of Christ represented by tribes.

Again manna. What is it? Does it represent the a golden reed to measure parables?

The words or thoughts of another person should seem foreign or strange to us. In that way opposites to attract and sparks can fly as iron sharpens iron...

And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof. And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal. And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel .Revelation 21: 15-17

According to the measure of a man, in so much that is, of the angel. It is different then men measuring themselves by themselves comparing inch to inch and not thought to thought.

The literal understanding does not provide the signified needed to understand the hidden Manna .What is it as we are led to search the scriptures daily to see if we can find the understanding of the golden reed. Which converts the witness of men the literal to the witness of God the spiritual understanding as it is written and "signified"

Revelation 1 King James Version (KJV) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and "signified it" by his angel unto his servant John:

Dino246 · Feb 24, 2019

garee said:

We take it at his face value in respect to His knowledge that he has given us . (face to face)

Walking by faith the unseen spiritual. Comparing the spiritual unseen understanding to the same spirit of understanding. (faith to faith)

The words or thoughts of another person should seem foreign or strange to us.

Well, you said it yourself.

How do you Measure?

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