How Old Is The Earth?

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Dec 29, 2013
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lol.. your proper exigesis destroys the literal text of the word. and would make the bible meaningless.
Again, logic and reason tell us that when Cain killed Able his other siblings---were not yet born---and were not therefore already in the land he would be driven to. It was not therefore those of his own family and culture he was afraid of when saying, "...every one that findeth me shall slay me" (Gen. 4:14). Logic, reason (and proper exegesis) tell us that these would have been people of a different race or culture, and already in the land he was driven to. These also, were the people among whom Cain found a wife. He did not have to, as some say, "marry his sister."

You need to read Bible Antiquities: Book I by archaeologist and Bible scholar E. Raymond Capt. His years of research shine new light on many Bible mysteries providing intelligent answers to hard questions. It's available on Amazon. One is not doing themselves a favor by not hearing the other side of the creation story.
 
Dec 29, 2013
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You need to look up the definition of circular reasoning.
As explained, circular reasoning is when some one reads into a text that which is not there. When someone reads into Genesis 4:14 the idea that Cain had other siblings, and who were already in the land he would be driven to, they are using circular reasoning. The problem with young earthers is that are dogmatic, they refuse to look at any other than their side of the story. This will get you nowhere. Atheists and evolutionists like nothing better than a young earth creation interpretation only. They know that if young people are led to believe that the Bible requires a young earth and universal flood that they are likely to reject scripture entirely. This is why your dogmatic young earth, universal flood interpretation is the atheists best friend. It's causing millions of young people to reject (the Bible) what they might otherwise have given serious consideration. Please, therefore, be more open minded.
 
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As I tried to show you Cain knew there would be more people than just him and his parents, and why did they have to find him on that day that he said the words? As I get it he propably lived for 750 years. How many PEOPLE can get him in 750 years? And how many people will be born in 750 years from just two people?

Cain was not scared of just Adam and Eve that can slay him but also his MANY brothers and sisters, and their children and their children etc etc for 750 years. Even HIS OWN siblings might just slay him as he did his own brother... So he was scared of ALL people that will be born and grown up in the 750 years of his life!

Icannot see where the Bible mentions how old Cain got to be, but I will take and average of between 650 to 750 years, if you will accept.

Sorry Historicist, i do not like ganging up. But the Lord would have mentioned other people that was not of Adam. It is not in the Bible. But Cain did marry a sister, and he had PLENTY to choose from. And the reason only Seth is named of the many is becasue the Bible is not about the people that has NOTHING to do with Jesus.... Jesus is the WORD that was made flesh, and the Word was there before the earth was made. The bible is fine and by just continuing from Seth, is to keep it 100% in Truth and focus on Christ Jesus.

My friend so what if there were other people, they all drowned accept Noah and his few people. So the LIFE of all started again from NOah and his family anyway. The most important questions is not what happened BEFORE Jesus but WITH AND AFTER JESUS.

Maybe we should start talking about Him and His will for us that is alive today.... That will be far more productive and building to all reading this.
 
Dec 29, 2013
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As I tried to show you Cain knew there would be more people than just him and his parents, and why did they have to find him on that day that he said the words? As I get it he propably lived for 750 years. How many PEOPLE can get him in 750 years? And how many people will be born in 750 years from just two people?

Cain was not scared of just Adam and Eve that can slay him but also his MANY brothers and sisters, and their children and their children etc etc for 750 years. Even HIS OWN siblings might just slay him as he did his own brother... So he was scared of ALL people that will be born and grown up in the 750 years of his life!

Icannot see where the Bible mentions how old Cain got to be, but I will take and average of between 650 to 750 years, if you will accept.

Sorry Historicist, i do not like ganging up. But the Lord would have mentioned other people that was not of Adam. It is not in the Bible. But Cain did marry a sister, and he had PLENTY to choose from. And the reason only Seth is named of the many is becasue the Bible is not about the people that has NOTHING to do with Jesus.... Jesus is the WORD that was made flesh, and the Word was there before the earth was made. The bible is fine and by just continuing from Seth, is to keep it 100% in Truth and focus on Christ Jesus.

My friend so what if there were other people, they all drowned accept Noah and his few people. So the LIFE of all started again from NOah and his family anyway. The most important questions is not what happened BEFORE Jesus but WITH AND AFTER JESUS.

Maybe we should start talking about Him and His will for us that is alive today.... That will be far more productive and building to all reading this.
The atheists and evolutionists have a field day with your dogmatic interpretation, with your reading into the text things which are not there. Do you really think that the Bible requires us to believe that races of people as diverse, and as far away as Eskimos and African Pygmies descended from Noah's three sons a mere few thousand years ago? How naive can one be? Also, this type of belief requires the evolutionary process, that which you oppose. You are not being consistent!

No, the Bible does not require us to believe that all races of people evolved from Noah's three sons, and in just a few generations. The races of people, when an obviously local flood occurred, where already on their respective continents, and had been for thousands of years. Science, history and archaeology prove this, and the Bible, correctly interpreted does not say otherwise.

Stop therefore, this ridiculous universal flood teaching, it's preventing millions of young people from taking an otherwise serious look at the Bible.
 
Dec 18, 2013
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The atheists and evolutionists have a field day with your dogmatic interpretation, with your reading into the text things which are not there. Do you really think that the Bible requires us to believe that races of people as diverse, and as far away as Eskimos and African Pygmies descended from Noah's three sons a mere few thousand years ago? How naive can one be? Also, this type of belief requires the evolutionary process, that which you oppose. You are not being consistent!

No, the Bible does not require us to believe that all races of people evolved from Noah's three sons, and in just a few generations. The races of people, when an obviously local flood occurred, where already on their respective continents, and had been for thousands of years. Science, history and archaeology prove this, and the Bible, correctly interpreted does not say otherwise.

Stop therefore, this ridiculous universal flood teaching, it's preventing millions of young people from taking an otherwise serious look at the Bible.
Lol, how naive could one be to think the flood and the three sons of Noah are not the procreators of the three root races when history archaeology, science, history, and the Bible all prove in man's short space of a few thousand years before the Great Flood and after it that the world has not been the same as when the father's fell asleep, but yet nothing is new under the sun?

As for the Great Flood, behold even the atheists try to cop out on it by saying it was local/regional only. Lol only problem with that is every single ancientmost worldwide culture from the Americas to Africa describes it and the stratification and mixing of the many fossils proves something trully catastrophic and worldwide happened. Genetics has proven that your african pygmy tribes are severely inbred and are descended from Ham and your eskimos are the descendants of Shem. God said the multitude of many different patriarchs would be as the stars of the sky. How many people you figure lived and died in the last 100 years? How about just 6000 gregorian calendar years much less the possibility of longer than that? If earth has had stuff living and dying on it for billions of years your planet be littered lol, think about it.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Again, logic and reason tell us that when Cain killed Able his other siblings---were not yet born---and were not therefore already in the land he would be driven to. It was not therefore those of his own family and culture he was afraid of when saying, "...every one that findeth me shall slay me" (Gen. 4:14). Logic, reason (and proper exegesis) tell us that these would have been people of a different race or culture, and already in the land he was driven to. These also, were the people among whom Cain found a wife. He did not have to, as some say, "marry his sister."

You need to read Bible Antiquities: Book I by archaeologist and Bible scholar E. Raymond Capt. His years of research shine new light on many Bible mysteries providing intelligent answers to hard questions. It's available on Amazon. One is not doing themselves a favor by not hearing the other side of the creation story.

lol. Again, your using circular reasoning. Don't condemn others, then use the same type of reasoning.

There is no logic in your claim.

Logic states adam and eve were created (not born) and the first man and woman alive. Thus if this is true (which scripture states it is true) then the people cain worried about would have had to have been their offspring also.

And do not take me to another book. lets stick to the word of God, anything else is man's opinion.
 
Dec 29, 2013
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As I tried to show you Cain knew there would be more people than just him and his parents, and why did they have to find him on that day that he said the words? As I get it he propably lived for 750 years. How many PEOPLE can get him in 750 years? And how many people will be born in 750 years from just two people?

Cain was not scared of just Adam and Eve that can slay him but also his MANY brothers and sisters, and their children and their children etc etc for 750 years. Even HIS OWN siblings might just slay him as he did his own brother... So he was scared of ALL people that will be born and grown up in the 750 years of his life!

Icannot see where the Bible mentions how old Cain got to be, but I will take and average of between 650 to 750 years, if you will accept.

Sorry Historicist, i do not like ganging up. But the Lord would have mentioned other people that was not of Adam. It is not in the Bible. But Cain did marry a sister, and he had PLENTY to choose from. And the reason only Seth is named of the many is becasue the Bible is not about the people that has NOTHING to do with Jesus.... Jesus is the WORD that was made flesh, and the Word was there before the earth was made. The bible is fine and by just continuing from Seth, is to keep it 100% in Truth and focus on Christ Jesus.

My friend so what if there were other people, they all drowned accept Noah and his few people. So the LIFE of all started again from NOah and his family anyway. The most important questions is not what happened BEFORE Jesus but WITH AND AFTER JESUS.

Maybe we should start talking about Him and His will for us that is alive today.... That will be far more productive and building to all reading this.
The atheists and evolutionists have a field day with your dogmatic interpretation, with your reading into the text things which are not there. Do you really think that the Bible requires us to believe that races of people as diverse, and as far away as Eskimos and African Pygmies descended from Noah's three sons a mere few thousand years ago? How naive can one be? Also, this type of belief requires the evolutionary process, that which you oppose. You are not being consistent!

No, the Bible does not require us to believe that all races of people evolved from Noah's three sons, and in just a few generations. The races of people, when an obviously local flood occurred, where already on their respective continents, and had been for thousands of years. Science, history and archaeology prove this, and the Bible, correctly interpreted does not say otherwise.

Stop therefore, this ridiculous universal flood teaching, it's preventing millions of young people from taking an otherwise serious look at the Bible.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,144
613
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Alabama
As explained, circular reasoning is when some one reads into a text that which is not there. When someone reads into Genesis 4:14 the idea that Cain had other siblings, and who were already in the land he would be driven to, they are using circular reasoning. The problem with young earthers is that are dogmatic, they refuse to look at any other than their side of the story. This will get you nowhere. Atheists and evolutionists like nothing better than a young earth creation interpretation only. They know that if young people are led to believe that the Bible requires a young earth and universal flood that they are likely to reject scripture entirely. This is why your dogmatic young earth, universal flood interpretation is the atheists best friend. It's causing millions of young people to reject (the Bible) what they might otherwise have given serious consideration. Please, therefore, be more open minded.
Here are the simple facts from Genesis.
1. Adam and Eve had an unspecified number of sons and daughters.
2. We are not told in what order these children were born. We are only given the names of three of the sons and none of the daughters.
3. We are only told that Cain is older than Able and that Seth was not born until Adam and Eve were 130 years old.
4. It is only assumed that Cain was the first born child simply because his name is first mentioned. This does not mean that there were not other children born prior to this, especially if they were daughters since the birth of daughters were not customarily recorded except in a few instances. The only reason Cain is mention at all is because he played a pivotal role in the history of the seed line. The only reason Seth is mentioned is because he is the new seed line in the place of Cain.
5. When Cain is driven from the land and ends up in Nod, he is already married.

The only dogmatism seems to be coming from you in the insistence that none of these children could have possibly been living at the time of the murder. By what rule of logic can you possibly make such a careless determination from the text when even the simplest exercise of logic would suggest otherwise?
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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Based upon Bible chronology Adam and Eve do seem to have been created about 6000 years ago. After years of studying this subject I've concluded that the humans in chapter one were around thousands of years before Adam.
Then why does Jesus tell us that the creation and union of Adam and Eve represented the beginning?
 

sc81

Senior Member
Dec 17, 2013
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a world wide flood never occurred, a mis-translation of the word in genesis means area of land not the entire earth. Christians have been so insistent on saying it was a global flood for so long that they can't admit they were wrong because then it would seem like the whole Bible is wrong.

I was brought up believing in a global flood but upon research it's easy to disprove it didn't, you don't even need to look at geological evidence.

Feedback: Timeline for the Flood - Answers in Genesis

according to global flood christians the flood was in 2348 BC yet you end up with a serious problem there because cultures that already existed at that time and who kept records like the chinese and other ancient cultures neither record a global flood and were most importantly not wiped out either as civilizations but continued right through that time period to the present.

Teaching the global flood probably has been one of the things that has turned millions away from believing christianity. Although the intention of christians to teach the word of God is infallible might have good intentions it would be less harmful to admit we might have misunderstood a word that is from a language thousands of years old that no one speaks anymore, then to continue to teach something wrong because we have been doing it for long and cause it to be a stumbling block for unbelievers
 
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Dec 29, 2013
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Lol, how naive could one be to think the flood and the three sons of Noah are not the procreators of the three root races when history archaeology, science, history, and the Bible all prove in man's short space of a few thousand years before the Great Flood and after it that the world has not been the same as when the father's fell asleep, but yet nothing is new under the sun?

As for the Great Flood, behold even the atheists try to cop out on it by saying it was local/regional only. Lol only problem with that is every single ancientmost worldwide culture from the Americas to Africa describes it and the stratification and mixing of the many fossils proves something trully catastrophic and worldwide happened. Genetics has proven that your african pygmy tribes are severely inbred and are descended from Ham and your eskimos are the descendants of Shem. God said the multitude of many different patriarchs would be as the stars of the sky. How many people you figure lived and died in the last 100 years? How about just 6000 gregorian calendar years much less the possibility of longer than that? If earth has had stuff living and dying on it for billions of years your planet be littered lol, think about it.
When and where was a genetic study done proving that African Pygmies evolved out of Ham? Where, in scripture (or elsewhere) do you find evidence that a DNA sample was taken from Ham? Where? Please tell me where.

Five hundred years ago it was people of your mindset who insisted that the Bible required every one to believe that the sun revolved around the earth.
 
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Dec 29, 2013
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He will not be willing to do this because he has no regard for scripture as an inspired and inerrant document.
One could easily get the impression that you equate your interpretations as having the authority of scripture.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
a world wide flood never occurred, a mis-translation of the word in genesis means area of land not the entire earth. Christians have been so insistent on saying it was a global flood for so long that they can't admit they were wrong because then it would seem like the whole Bible is wrong.

I was brought up believing in a global flood but upon research it's easy to disprove it didn't, you don't even need to look at geological evidence.

Feedback: Timeline for the Flood - Answers in Genesis

according to global flood christians the flood was in 2348 BC yet you end up with a serious problem there because cultures that already existed at that time and who kept records like the chinese and other ancient cultures neither record a global flood and were most importantly not wiped out either as civilizations but continued right through that time period to the present.

Teaching the global flood probably has been one of the things that has turned millions away from believing christianity. Although the intention of christians to teach the word of God is infallible might have good intentions it would be less harmful to admit we might have misunderstood a word that is from a language thousands of years old that no one speaks anymore, then to continue to teach something wrong because we have been doing it for long and cause it to be a stumbling block for unbelievers

So tell all us stupid Christians. How could the highest mountain be covered with water, and the entire earth not be flooded?

Sometimes I do not think you people think when you come up with these ideas. Water can not just cover the highest mountain without covering the whole earth. water and gravity do not work that way now does it?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
The beginning of Adam and Eve?

No the beginning of mankind.

WHy would God create adam out of the dust, when there were already humans around who could birth him, same with eve.

your logic is no logic whatsoever.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,144
613
113
70
Alabama
a world wide flood never occurred, a mis-translation of the word in genesis means area of land not the entire earth. Christians have been so insistent on saying it was a global flood for so long that they can't admit they were wrong because then it would seem like the whole Bible is wrong.

I was brought up believing in a global flood but upon research it's easy to disprove it didn't, you don't even need to look at geological evidence. Much of this information taken from the book "The Genesis Flood" written by Whitcomb and Morris?

Feedback: Timeline for the Flood - Answers in Genesis

according to global flood christians the flood was in 2348 BC yet you end up with a serious problem there because cultures that already existed at that time and who kept records like the chinese and other ancient cultures neither record a global flood and were most importantly not wiped out either as civilizations but continued right through that time period to the present.

Teaching the global flood probably has been one of the things that has turned millions away from believing Christianity. Although the intention of christians to teach the word of God is infallible might have good intentions it would be less harmful to admit we might have misunderstood a word that is from a language thousands of years old that no one speaks anymore, then to continue to teach something wrong because we have been doing it for long and cause it to be a stumbling block for unbelievers
To set the stage for this discussion, I would like to first review some of the statements in Genesis regarding the scope and duration of the flood. While I am no scientist, I do have some understanding of the biblical text.

Gen. 7:19-20 says, “The water prevailed more and more upon the earth, so that all the high mountains everywhere under the heavens were covered. The water prevailed fifteen cubits (22 ft) higher, and the mountains were covered.”

The only standard of measurement we have for the comparing the depth of the water is “all the high mountains under all the heavens.” Now, only one of these expressions would be sufficient to convey the absolute universality of the flood - “all the high mountains.” However, since the therm “all” is known to be used in the relative sense, any possible ambiguity is removed by the phrase “under all the heavens.” The reason for the 22 ft of water covering the highest mountains would have certainly been sufficient to adjust for the drought of the fully loaded ark. The height of the ark was thirty cubits according to Gen. 6:15, so the 15 cubits, or 22 ft in Gen 7:20 must certainly refer to drought of the ark. In other words the ark sank to a depth of 22 ft while it was afloat.

Now, let's look at the duration of the flood. In chapters 7 and 8 we learn that the flood lasted 371 days. This would certainly be consistent with the idea of a universal flood. While many Christian scholars may debate the actual depth of the flood, there can be no question of its duration when one factors the rate of evaporation. It would seem that the waters reached their maximum height in the first 40 days and according to 8:24, that maximum height was maintained for an additional 110 days before beginning to subside.

Now, to the question of where all of this water came from and where did it go?

In Gen. 1, we are told that the earth was already created in a state of deluge. Water covered the entire surface of the planet at that time, although we are not told to what depth. Then, it says that God separated the waters. Now, you and I both know that mater does not just disappear. Mater is not destroyed, it only changes form. So where did these waters go during this separation? In verses 6-8, it says that God separated the waters into two different groups. Notice, even after he separated the waters and assigned a large portion of that water to the heavens or the firmament (this is what many scholars regard as the canopy of waters that shrouded the earth and we can discuss the implications of this further if you like), the surface of the earth was still covered in water. Then, on the third day, he separated the terrestrial waters into seas and then the dry land appeared. So, even if one discounted the waters of the firmament there was still sufficient water on the earth to cover all the dry ground and this does not even seem to refer to the massive subterranean deposits of water.

During the flood, God simply reverses the process. But this time, he not only opens the firmament to re-deposit all of that water back on the earth, but he also breaks open the “fountains of the deep” or the subterranean waters as well. Such geological upheavals that would be required to bring all of this water to the surface would also result in a dramatic rise of the sea floors spilling the oceans out over the face of the earth as well.

After the flood, God restores this process of water separation through two methods. One method was the evaporation process that was aided by the use of the "wind God caused to pass over the earth." The other process was drainage as the waters of the subterranean chambers drained back into their reservoirs.

Is this sufficient to answer your first question or would you like me to elaborate further on this point?

Just a side point: If the surface of the earth were completely smooth, it is estimated that there is enough water ON the earth to cover the surface of the earth to a depth of two feet. (I looked for this statistic in all of my old notes but could not find it nor could I remember its source).
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,144
613
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Alabama
The beginning of Adam and Eve?
No, Jesus simply said in the beginning. There was only one.

3Some Pharisees came to Jesus, testing Him and asking, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any reason at all?” 4And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, 5and said, ‘FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH’?

This declaration was made in the garden in connection with the union of Adam and Eve. Jesus places the creation of Adam and Eve as the beginning.
 

sc81

Senior Member
Dec 17, 2013
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So tell all us stupid Christians. How could the highest mountain be covered with water, and the entire earth not be flooded?

Sometimes I do not think you people think when you come up with these ideas. Water can not just cover the highest mountain without covering the whole earth. water and gravity do not work that way now does it?
well no one is stupid, but if water covered the top of mount everest there would be no low point for it to run off to. The entire earth would have been permanently turned into a water world.