If a Person Accepts Jesus is the Savior,

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If a person accepts Jesus is the Savior, Does this person also have to believe Jesus?

  • A person who accepts Jesus is the Savior has no need of believing Jesus' doctrine to be saved.

  • A person who accepts Jesus is the Savior has great need of believing Jesus' doctrine to be saved.


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Deuteronomy

Well-known member
Jun 11, 2018
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#21
If a person accepts Jesus, does this person also have to believe Jesus?
Hi Jaden, I'm having trouble figuring out exactly what you are asking in the OP and the title. Would you mind elaborating a bit on what you mean by a person who is willing to "accept Jesus" on the one hand, but not willing to "believe Him" on the other (and why you think a person would want to do one, but not the other)?

Thanks!

~Deut



 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#22
Indeed it is, and just as true as what is written in Mk 11:23-24.
But what you might not be seeing is, God already said what His will is in those two verses.
And not only that, but He also said, "This is a true statement..."
Which means, it's true as is. It doesn't need help from other verses from the bible to make it the whole truth or council of God.
On the contrary, it perverts and twists what is written into a lie.
If it is the truth as it is written, like Jesus said it is, how are you making it more true by adding "the will of God" to it?
Because Jesus prayed that way! luke 22:42 "Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."
New International Version
 
Dec 9, 2011
11,335
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#24
It seem's like a trick question to me. Did the man crucified with Jesus and saw paradise that day know much about the Lords teachings? He started ridiculing the Lord but had a change of heart and humbled himself. It would be far better to me a strict follower but that's not exactly what the scripture says; "If you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved." (Romans 10:9-10) This verse is the bottom line where salvation is concerned.
yes spiritual and physical .It Is with your heart that you BELIEVE and with your mouth you confess In other words a person doesn't believe with their mouth.
 

know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
2,747
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#25
Because Jesus prayed that way! luke 22:42 "Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."
New International Version
Do you pray the same prayer for God to heal someone, as you would over your meal?
There are more than one kind of prayer, even as verse 23 in Mk 11 is not the same kind of prayer as verse 24.
Would you encourage someone to ask God if it was His will for them to be saved, before attempting to receive Him as their lord and savior?
After all, they don't know if it is His will for them to be saved, because for one, they don't know if they are of the goats or sheep, and for another, they don't know if they are predestined to go to heaven or hell.
Like I said, you are warping, perverting, twisting, and making the truth of God's word into a lie, by piecing together scripture out of context.
Please explain to me what faith is and how it works, and what the difference is between faith and hoping/wishing/wondering.
It's one thing to pray the way Jesus did, when you don't know what the will of God is or you don't know what He wants you to do, such as for a job or a move.
So you pray, asking for God to open doors in the direction He might want Him to go, and close the ones He doesn't.
Nothing wrong with that.
But as I stated in my prior post, to take a portion of scripture out of context from one verse and apply it to another, changes the both wording, meaning, and context of that promise, from a guarantee to a wishy-washy, hope it all works out in my favor, kind of statement, at best.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
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#26
Please take note; The Lord said when we prat play like ehis, regarding the Lords prayer he didn't say repeat after me.... The Lords prayer as we know and call it, is really instructions how to pray. "Our father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name...' Give glory honor and praise to the Lord first.
 

know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
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#27
I am amazed at how much goes ignored, only for many to continue propagating this narrative that God's will somehow has to be injected in scripture verses that say, whatsoever WE desire.
It's not in there for a reason, so stop trying to rewrite scripture, and get over your inability to handle a truth you can't explain.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#28
Do you pray the same prayer for God to heal someone, as you would over your meal?
There are more than one kind of prayer, even as verse 23 in Mk 11 is not the same kind of prayer as verse 24.
Would you encourage someone to ask God if it was His will for them to be saved, before attempting to receive Him as their lord and savior?
After all, they don't know if it is His will for them to be saved, because for one, they don't know if they are of the goats or sheep, and for another, they don't know if they are predestined to go to heaven or hell.
Like I said, you are warping, perverting, twisting, and making the truth of God's word into a lie, by piecing together scripture out of context.
Please explain to me what faith is and how it works, and what the difference is between faith and hoping/wishing/wondering.
It's one thing to pray the way Jesus did, when you don't know what the will of God is or you don't know what He wants you to do, such as for a job or a move.
So you pray, asking for God to open doors in the direction He might want Him to go, and close the ones He doesn't.
Nothing wrong with that.
But as I stated in my prior post, to take a portion of scripture out of context from one verse and apply it to another, changes the both wording, meaning, and context of that promise, from a guarantee to a wishy-washy, hope it all works out in my favor, kind of statement, at best.
I pray spontaneously as needs change so do prayers. The Lord even prayed for himself in Gethsemane and although it was not his desire to suffer the way he did he prayed for the Fathers will to be done even though he fully well knew his Fathers will. Jesus set the perfect example! PTL.
 

pottersclay

Senior Member
Aug 13, 2015
3,618
609
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#29
If a person accepts Jesus is the Savior, Does this person also have to believe Jesus?

A person who accepts Jesus is the Savior has great need of believing Jesus' doctrine to be saved.

Imo neither apply. The question is do you agree with Jesus that you are a sinner in need of a savior.
 

know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
2,747
109
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#30
I pray spontaneously as needs change so do prayers. The Lord even prayed for himself in Gethsemane and although it was not his desire to suffer the way he did he prayed for the Fathers will to be done even though he fully well knew his Fathers will. Jesus set the perfect example! PTL.
Below is another prayer of Jesus.
Tell me if you find Him asking the Father for His will to be done.
No, He is telling the Father what He Himself want and also asking the Father for certain things.
There is a time and situation where one asks for God's will to be done and there is a time to tell God the Fathrer what you want done, in the name of Jesus.

The High Priestly Prayer
Joh 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
Joh 17:2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Joh 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Joh 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
Joh 17:7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
Joh 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Joh 17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Joh 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
Joh 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
Joh 17:13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
Joh 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
Joh 17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Joh 17:18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
Joh 17:19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
Joh 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Joh 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Joh 17:25 O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#31
I am amazed at how much goes ignored, only for many to continue propagating this narrative that God's will somehow has to be injected in scripture verses that say, whatsoever WE desire.
It's not in there for a reason, so stop trying to rewrite scripture, and get over your inability to handle a truth you can't explain.
Rewrite scripture? That is scripture! Matthew 6:9 Matthew 6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#32
Below is another prayer of Jesus.
Tell me if you find Him asking the Father for His will to be done.
No, He is telling the Father what He Himself want and also asking the Father for certain things.
There is a time and situation where one asks for God's will to be done and there is a time to tell God the Fathrer what you want done, in the name of Jesus.

The High Priestly Prayer
Joh 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
Joh 17:2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Joh 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Joh 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
Joh 17:7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
Joh 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Joh 17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Joh 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
Joh 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
Joh 17:13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
Joh 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
Joh 17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Joh 17:18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
Joh 17:19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
Joh 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Joh 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Joh 17:25 O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Luke 22:41
Context
41And He withdrew from them about a stone’s throw, and He knelt down and began to pray, 42saying, “Father, if You are willing, remove this cup from Me; yet not My will, but Yours be done.” 43Now an angel from heaven appeared to Him, strengthening Him.
Nuff said?
 

know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
2,747
109
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#33
Rewrite scripture? That is scripture! Matthew 6:9 Matthew 6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
Mar 11:22 And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
Mar 11:23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
Mar 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.

WHERE?
WHERE IS, "IF IT BE THE WILL OF THE FATHER", WRITTEN IN THE ABOVE TEXT?
 

jacob_g

Active member
Sep 1, 2019
292
125
43
#34
You should have added this question does not make sense.... !!! He fulfilled the the "doctrine" of the Old Testament... or at least the blood sacrifice for salvation!!!!
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#35
Mar 11:22 And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
Mar 11:23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
Mar 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.

WHERE?
WHERE IS, "IF IT BE THE WILL OF THE FATHER", WRITTEN IN THE ABOVE TEXT?
I wasn't quoting John, I was quoting Luke. But if Luke isn't convincing how about Matthew? 26:39Matthew 26:39 And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt. King James Version

Matthew 26:39 Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, "My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will." New international Version.

Matt 26:39Going a little farther, He fell facedown and prayed, “My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me. Yet not as I will, but as You will.” Berean Study Bible

There are four Gospels and many translations for reasons. You should try and learn more before you comment.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#36
There are four Gospels and many translations for reasons. You should try and learn more before you comment.
I recant. I should have said: You should try and learn more before you comment argue.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
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#37
God is not a fast food resterant. Whe shouldn't expect to receive everything we ask for because we think we know how to ask. There's usually at least 3 possible outcomes yes, no and wait. God is sovereign and he dosn't have to do anything we ask. That was a false teaching carried by the 'Name it and claim it movement' about 4 decades ago. Even Jim Bakker repented it, from prison. He admitted the he never really read the entire bible before he went to prison in 1989.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
5,540
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#38
Does this person also have to believe Jesus?

John 7:17
If any man do the will of him; he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
How can anyone say they are saved followers of Jesus and at the same time disbelieve the teachings of Jesus.. Who is this ""jesus"" that this person is believing in???? Another jesus.. Not the real Jesus of scripture..

We have to believe His Words.. Jesus said::

John 6: KJV
63 "It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life."

And as for another Jesus.. Yes these other Jesus do exist.. People with their own thoughts and traditions create other Jesus's all the time..

2 Corinthians 11: KJV
3 "But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. {4} For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him."

Why do you think on the day of judgement people will call Jesus LORD LORD and tell him that they did many wonderful works in His name but he shall say to them ""I never knew you""..

Matthew 7: KJV
22 "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? {23} And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

Oh they thought they where believing and serving Jesus alright.. But they where believing in and serving another jesus.. Not the One who saves...
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
19,064
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#39
Matthew 7:21 - Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
7,164
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#40
Remove the word disbelieve-. Before I came to believe I never disbelieved. Life didn't make sense to me. I didn't know what to believe, but I hoped he or something like him existed. I didn't believe in hell but I knew I was lost asked him, if he was real to prove it to me. By his amazing grace through the power of the Holy Spirit he did. After that I came to know his word and believe in his power. What Salvation meant and later hell. We can't overlook Grace because he died for us long before we knew or heard about him. And that's what caused me to believe First I wished, then I had hope, then I prayed to a God I wasn't convinced existed.

Then he came to me and I came to believe. with all of my heart. When was I saved? I don't know. When did I come to believe? I mean really believe, as in convinced with all of my heart? On a Saturday night in the late spring of 1977. Just myself and God was there. I've never doubted since. I never denied Christ even before I came to believe. That's all folks!