Is it too late?

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Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
1,559
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113
What do you mean by "favorite anti-Christian speaker?" Can you give an example?
Servus Christi is a good example. Always tearing somebody down, never lifting them up.
Neither does he lift up others, either.
The site is only good to find a direction on someone. It shouldn't be considered accurate.
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
8,309
3,617
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The people you say Joshua Chavez tears down don't need someone to lift them up. They're surrounded by sycophants and yes-men who tell them how wonderful they are. That's why they've wandered off the path. They don't have anyone to say to them: "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?" or "Woe to you, blind guides."

Servus Christi one of a growing number of online ministries that has the audacity to call a spade a spade and I'm thankful for it. But no one's above criticism; Chavez isn't perfect and he would be the last to claim he is. He warns repeatedly about idolizing any human being, including himself.

He has plenty of videos on Christian subjects other than exposés, so it's not all about "tearing people down." I've watched all his videos and I haven't heard him say anything demonstrably false about anyone; everything's backed up by video clips, things people have said in their own words or things they've done. I know there are a lot of people who dislike him and have orchestrated smear campaigns against him, like J. D. Hall. But Hall has nothing. He supposedly has emails from someone who claims she was married to Chavez and then he abruptly sent her packing; and he's posted pictures supposedly of the couple together, but her face is blurred and it looks like a cheap Photoshop. Consider the source. People who run Chavez down the most are those he's been critical of.
 

Ogom

Active member
Aug 22, 2020
385
100
43
ogom.co
God stayed, look in the mirror and see Jesus a son of man before he woke up in you. everythink of Gods kingdom is in not the shadow of creation, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: 21Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

yes, notice whenever you 'come alive' -- this is when the Kingdom is coming more to/in you maybe.

notice when you feel dead- ish, de-pressed, or not good generally, this could be when the Kingdom (Spirit) is much further away....

you are drifting or gone backwards, not towards God/Spirit, but instead away or towards self (non-Spirit).
 
Apr 29, 2012
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There are also very professional "praise and worship" leaders there to entertain you. Oftentimes there's not that much difference between these "praise and worship" services and an actual rock concert.
AMEN to that!!!
 
Apr 29, 2012
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Post modernism has taken hold of a lot of parts of christianity, along with materialism and emotionalism.

My brother was talking about a new revival going on.. I am thinking. .. is it another wave of charismania?

Where is this new revival happening?
 
Apr 29, 2012
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wattie, are you and I the only ones who have noticed what's going on? Has everyone else swallowed the Kool-Aid? Is the apostacy upon us?
No - you and wattie are not the only ones
 

Mark47Oz

Active member
Jun 4, 2021
233
86
28
Yes, megachurches grow larger and larger; Christian conferences abound and grow more prolific every year; ecumenicism is on the rise; contemporary Christian music is bigger ($$$) and more popular now than ever. But is it for the good?

People like Rick Warren praise the pope (from "papa," Holy Father
), saying of Catholics in a tweet: "If you love Jesus, we may serve on different teams, but we're in the same league of receiving His grace and forgiveness"; Louie Giglio of Passion Church and his wife meeting and kissing the Pope. This is but the tip of the iceberg.

Church is nothing but big business. No one is accountable for sin. If someone is good for business they're in, regardless of whether they teach heresy or not. Formerly conservative preachers like John MacArthur have apparently swallowed the Kool-Aid.

Have we already gone over the cliff? If so, what should true and faithful believers do? You can't rebuke. People like Rick Warren are above rebuke. You can't rebuke the contemporary Christian music industry or their artists, they don't care, all they want is $$$ and more of it. If you try to warn people they'll tell you you're crazy.

I believe the time has come for worldly christianity (lower case intentional) to be exposed for what it is. Much of what's going on is deliberately designed to cater to the younger generation. A whole generation is growing up thinking this is what Christianity is.

I didn't spend a lot of time on this post so it may not be that eloquent; it's a heartfelt plea that hopefully the Lord will use for some good.
Look around you. Read the signs. Mega Christianity is just another symptom of Satan's infiltration into everything in this world.

Great punishments are coming and so is the last warning. These words from Luke CH 24 are more relevant now than ever.

34 “But take heed to yourselves, lest your hearts be weighed down with [a]carousing, drunkenness, and cares of this life, and that Day come on you unexpectedly. 35 For it will come as a snare on all those who dwell on the face of the whole earth. 36 Watch therefore, and pray always that you may be counted worthy to escape all these things that will come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man.”

This event described below is coming. And it's coming soonish. Jesus is telling his prophets that were are down to the final hour, not the final day. Matthew 24 described it so. Fatima, Grabandal, Medjugorje and many others call this event 'the warning'

29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory
 

awelight

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2020
1,629
490
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Hello.
Biblical Christian fellowship should be centered around our relationship with Jesus Christ. Doctrine is important. Charles Haddon Spurgeon sensibly said: "I MAY KNOW ALL THE DOCTRINES OF THE BIBLE, BUT UNLESS I KNOW CHRIST, THERE IS NOT ONE OF THEM THAT CAN SAVE ME." Peace and blessings.
There is a simple reply for this: To know Christ fully is to know Biblical Doctrine and to know Biblical Doctrine is to know Christ.

1Co 2:12-14 But we received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is from God; that we might know the things that were freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in words which man's wisdom is teaching, but which the Spirit is teaching; combining spiritual things with spiritual words. Now the natural man can not receive the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The true definition of fellowship is found here:

Acts_2:42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' teaching and fellowship, in the breaking of bread and the prayers.

They continued steadfastly in what? The apostles' teachings - that is Doctrine. Salvation is centered around Jesus Christ but fellowship with other believers is centered around likeminded people and likeminded people are centered on Doctrine.
 

awelight

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2020
1,629
490
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I realized in my post #128, something needed to be expanded upon.

One of the real problems in a lot of the so-called churches today, is the lack of proper doctrinal teaching. When Christ asked Peter: "Who do you say I am?" Peter's answer came from proper revelation and teaching, the teaching of Christ and the revelation of The Father. Peter, having been born from above, understood whom he was looking at. Something the religionist of his day could not and would not except.

The modern so-called churches, that have fallen away, have fallen from true understanding of Biblical Doctrine. Therefore, they have fallen from THE TRUTH. The objective revelation of God, who is TRUTH. These churches do not teach Doctrine and/or distort the truth of doctrine. They teach their congregations that doctrine is not really that important. Some even attack the writings of Paul because he is too doctrinal and not loving enough. Some even claim the Apostle Paul was a woman hater.

These type of arguments are based upon the "subjective" truth as one holds it to be true. Subjectivism - runs rampant in the false churches today and in the higher so-called centers of education. They teach that TRUTH is what you believe it is. There is no "objective" standard. This then being believed by unsaved people and perhaps even leading a few saved ones astray for a season, has lead significantly to the decline of churches and society.

When it comes to Scripture there most certainly is an "OBECTIVE" truth. A Divine standard. The TRUTH of God, as revealed in Scripture, is "objective" fact, not "subjective" suggestion. The Scriptures are NOT open to "subjective" belief. The true church and it's members are commanded to adopt these "objective" Truths. Therefore, the local church, it's God appointed Preacher and every believing member are to struggle in earnest to come to THE TRUTH as revealed in Scripture.

Acts_17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

No believer can come to the absolute Truth of God's revelation but with the assistance of the Holy Spirit and unending doctrinal study, we can come very, very close.

Sadly, most so-called churches today, seem to not only be caught up in Subjectivism but they also seem to be more concerned with the lifting up of the flesh and making one "FEEL" good. They should be concerned with ones eternal soul and positioning it's members for meeting the Lord their God. The more they understand Doctrinally , the more they know about The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. The more they know about Theology, Christology, Soteriology and Eschatology, the more full will be their lives and more confident their faith in Christ.

Have you noticed how modern day preachers of these fallen churches sound more like "self-help" and "motivational" Guru's than they do men of God?????
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
8,309
3,617
113
There is a simple reply for this: To know Christ fully is to know Biblical Doctrine and to know Biblical Doctrine is to know Christ.

1Co 2:12-14 But we received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is from God; that we might know the things that were freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in words which man's wisdom is teaching, but which the Spirit is teaching; combining spiritual things with spiritual words. Now the natural man can not receive the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The true definition of fellowship is found here:

Acts_2:42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' teaching and fellowship, in the breaking of bread and the prayers.

They continued steadfastly in what? The apostles' teachings - that is Doctrine. Salvation is centered around Jesus Christ but fellowship with other believers is centered around likeminded people and likeminded people are centered on Doctrine.
(y) (y)
 
Feb 16, 2017
1,037
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Since this time, Crowder has appeared at numerous conferences with other people who enthusiastically embrace the Catholic church. Rather than taking part with them, shouldn't he be calling them out? .
Originally, the Catholic Church was titled. .. "The cult of Mary"., in Ephesus about 5ad.
Their bible, the Douay Rheims teaches that water regenerates the spirit, whereas Paul teaches that the Holy Spirit of God does this....
If you ever deal with a Catholic, you'll note they love Mary and they Love Water, and the Sacraments.
If you investigate Catholic Feast Days, you'll learn that there are more feast Days held for Mary then there are held for Jesus.
Here is an interesting Photograph that tells you everything you need to know about the Catholic Church.
Notice their "queen of heaven" on the Throne and their Pope at her feet.
-
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mary pope.jpg
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
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Great image. These are the people that Evangelicals are supposed to join hands with?
 

awelight

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2020
1,629
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Great image. These are the people that Evangelicals are supposed to join hands with?
Yes indeed, this is a telling image. It violates God's Holy Standards.

Exo 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
Exo 20:5a thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them; for I Jehovah thy God am a jealous God,...


How ignorant of Holy Scripture do you have to be not to see this????
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
8,309
3,617
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Have you ever noticed you never see the Pope kissing anyone else's feet or ring. He's always the one people grovel before. I wonder why that is? Yet here he is groveling at the feet of a lifeless idol.
 

Aaron56

Well-known member
Jul 12, 2021
2,841
1,635
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I have a lot of thought s about this subject. However, I would not separate the Roman church from the Evangelical church in matters that relate to structure and administration. I'll simply summarize some of my thoughts here:

Rome, 311AD: After intense and systematic persecution throughout the Roman Empire (led by the Flavian emperors), believers in the Living God and His Christ emerged as one of the largest homogeneous groups in the empire; Perhaps 10% of all Roman citizens were believers. Galarius issues an edict putting an end to Christian persecution.

Rome, 313AD: Constantine, through the Edict of Milan, restored lost property, lost business, lost citizenship, etc. to the Christians.

Rome, 325AD: Constantine, the governmental ruler of Rome, calls an ecumenical religious council meeting. The Council of Nicaea convened with over 300 Christian leaders present from the Roman Empire. Among other things, the government offered to dispose of pagan rituals and sexual practices, convert pagan temples into Christian temples and remove heretical, non-Christian symbology from coinage. Taxes from the empire’s coffers were used to provide for the lodging and travel of the religious rulers and to build a common hall for their meetings.

When a division erupted between the those who supported Arianism (Jesus was created) and those who opposed it (Jesus was divine) Constantine leveraged secular, civil powers to carry out the wishes of the council majority: The followers of Arius were summarily excommunicated.

Lastly, in exchange for the good will and support of the government, the church agreed to uphold the idea that the Roman Emperor was God's chosen leader (this is the origin of the "Divine Right of Kings"). They agreed to become the religious administration of the earthly, Roman Empire.

The issues are these:
The church already had a kingdom: The Kingdom of God
The church already had a king: Christ Jesus.
The church had no earthly, national or racial identity; they were comprised of all races and languages. They were "strangers in a strange land".

When the church substituted their divine mandates for those of Rome, they exchanged their divine source of authority for that of the Roman government. From then on, the church would be mired in the political whims of the rulers they recognized and they would use civil and legal action (the tools of the world) to further their religious mandates. Instead of power from High, they would seek power from the consent of the governed.

This scheme of the enemy continues to this day.
 

awelight

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2020
1,629
490
83
69
I have a lot of thought s about this subject. However, I would not separate the Roman church from the Evangelical church in matters that relate to structure and administration. I'll simply summarize some of my thoughts here:

Rome, 311AD: After intense and systematic persecution throughout the Roman Empire (led by the Flavian emperors), believers in the Living God and His Christ emerged as one of the largest homogeneous groups in the empire; Perhaps 10% of all Roman citizens were believers. Galarius issues an edict putting an end to Christian persecution.

Rome, 313AD: Constantine, through the Edict of Milan, restored lost property, lost business, lost citizenship, etc. to the Christians.

Rome, 325AD: Constantine, the governmental ruler of Rome, calls an ecumenical religious council meeting. The Council of Nicaea convened with over 300 Christian leaders present from the Roman Empire. Among other things, the government offered to dispose of pagan rituals and sexual practices, convert pagan temples into Christian temples and remove heretical, non-Christian symbology from coinage. Taxes from the empire’s coffers were used to provide for the lodging and travel of the religious rulers and to build a common hall for their meetings.

When a division erupted between the those who supported Arianism (Jesus was created) and those who opposed it (Jesus was divine) Constantine leveraged secular, civil powers to carry out the wishes of the council majority: The followers of Arius were summarily excommunicated.

Lastly, in exchange for the good will and support of the government, the church agreed to uphold the idea that the Roman Emperor was God's chosen leader (this is the origin of the "Divine Right of Kings"). They agreed to become the religious administration of the earthly, Roman Empire.

The issues are these:
The church already had a kingdom: The Kingdom of God
The church already had a king: Christ Jesus.
The church had no earthly, national or racial identity; they were comprised of all races and languages. They were "strangers in a strange land".

When the church substituted their divine mandates for those of Rome, they exchanged their divine source of authority for that of the Roman government. From then on, the church would be mired in the political whims of the rulers they recognized and they would use civil and legal action (the tools of the world) to further their religious mandates. Instead of power from High, they would seek power from the consent of the governed.

This scheme of the enemy continues to this day.
Your post, is well thought out and is very useful for putting everyone in remembrance of these historical events.

In talking with folks over the years, many felt what Constantine did was a great thing. Recognizing Christianity as the one true religion. Thus, ending persecution by the Roman Empire.

However, what seems to have gone unrecognized by many, is that Constantine created a "State" religion. For the first time, Christianity is forced upon the common citizenry. This of course was repeated several times throughout history. Such as Jews being forced into Christianity are face death by Spain. There was nothing good about these practices and they were Anti-God at best.

As we know, the true church is made up of Regenerated believers out of the good pleasure and mercy of God. This "State" sponsored religion forced into the local assemblies those who have not been "regenerated" by the Spirit and mixed worldly minded people with spiritually minded believers. Constantine started a "fad" by using Government powers. It was now the "thing" to be called a Christian. Sadly, the end results of these kind of edicts or laws leads to the local destruction of many assemblies.

What Constantine did, was without doubt, one of the darkest hours in early church history. A foretaste, of what is yet to come; the Great Harlot being used and manipulated to position the Anti-Christ. This would only be possible because The Truth has become a famine in the land.
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
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Every day this rabbit hole gets a little deeper.

In 1999 the Catholic Church's Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity (PCPCU) and the Lutheran World Federation got together and came up with something called the Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification (JDDJ). I'd never heard of this and I suspect neither have many of you.

In the first video watch as Kenneth Copeland holds the audience spellbound while he confidently asserts the Protestant reformation is now over. Copeland reads parts of the document but has no idea what he's reading because of its clever wording. He also proclaims the JDDJ was agreed upon by the Pope and the Lutheran World Federation; however, the Pope wasn't involved. Pope John the XIII established the PCPCU but the Pope isn't part of the governing structure. It has a President, Secretary and Under-Secretary. We're dealing with people who are serious and committed to an agenda and for whom truth can only get in the way.


The next video is a radio broadcast which seeks to explain the JDDJ for evangelicals and those, like Copeland, who are easily baffled by the document's wording. It's 45 minutes but well worth a listen.

 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
Yes, megachurches grow larger and larger; Christian conferences abound and grow more prolific every year; ecumenicism is on the rise; contemporary Christian music is bigger ($$$) and more popular now than ever. But is it for the good?

People like Rick Warren praise the pope (from "papa," Holy Father
), saying of Catholics in a tweet: "If you love Jesus, we may serve on different teams, but we're in the same league of receiving His grace and forgiveness"; Louie Giglio of Passion Church and his wife meeting and kissing the Pope. This is but the tip of the iceberg.

Church is nothing but big business. No one is accountable for sin. If someone is good for business they're in, regardless of whether they teach heresy or not. Formerly conservative preachers like John MacArthur have apparently swallowed the Kool-Aid.

Have we already gone over the cliff? If so, what should true and faithful believers do? You can't rebuke. People like Rick Warren are above rebuke. You can't rebuke the contemporary Christian music industry or their artists, they don't care, all they want is $$$ and more of it. If you try to warn people they'll tell you you're crazy.

I believe the time has come for worldly christianity (lower case intentional) to be exposed for what it is. Much of what's going on is deliberately designed to cater to the younger generation. A whole generation is growing up thinking this is what Christianity is.

I didn't spend a lot of time on this post so it may not be that eloquent; it's a heartfelt plea that hopefully the Lord will use for some good.
We are at the beginning parts of the era of the "Prostitute of Babylon" Rev 17. At the center is Roman Catholicism, but Prostitute is and will go much deeper where more and more churches and denominations either are already or will get in bed with every other denomination and therefore in bed with Roman Catholicism itself.

The era of Church and State ( which was the era of 1st Beast of Rev working with 2nd Beast of Revelation) was a previous era that took place in the middle ages for over a thousand years. It wasn't the reformation that ended Church and State but the radical reformation.

Key historical events which brought about the ending of the era of Church and State was

1- the founding of the Colony of Rhode Island by Roger Williams creating the first colony with separation of church and state and thus freedom of religion.

2 - The Tolerance Act of 1689 The act of British Parliament granting freedom of worship to Nonconformists (i.e., dissenting Protestants such as Baptists and Congregationalists).
 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
Yes, megachurches grow larger and larger; Christian conferences abound and grow more prolific every year; ecumenicism is on the rise; contemporary Christian music is bigger ($$$) and more popular now than ever. But is it for the good?

People like Rick Warren praise the pope (from "papa," Holy Father
), saying of Catholics in a tweet: "If you love Jesus, we may serve on different teams, but we're in the same league of receiving His grace and forgiveness"; Louie Giglio of Passion Church and his wife meeting and kissing the Pope. This is but the tip of the iceberg.

Church is nothing but big business. No one is accountable for sin. If someone is good for business they're in, regardless of whether they teach heresy or not. Formerly conservative preachers like John MacArthur have apparently swallowed the Kool-Aid.

Have we already gone over the cliff? If so, what should true and faithful believers do? You can't rebuke. People like Rick Warren are above rebuke. You can't rebuke the contemporary Christian music industry or their artists, they don't care, all they want is $$$ and more of it. If you try to warn people they'll tell you you're crazy.

I believe the time has come for worldly christianity (lower case intentional) to be exposed for what it is. Much of what's going on is deliberately designed to cater to the younger generation. A whole generation is growing up thinking this is what Christianity is.

I didn't spend a lot of time on this post so it may not be that eloquent; it's a heartfelt plea that hopefully the Lord will use for some good.
Good post! But how do we combat this? Answer: With Love.
We Love God 1st and we love others 2nd.

We must not be fearful of these things that are happening in true churches and in apostate churches. At this point I see that we cannot triumph over this with judgement. Instead we can triumph over this with love - a Godly love..
For Love covers over a multitude of sins.

And what remains is faith, hope and love. but the greatest of these is love.
 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
Yes, megachurches grow larger and larger; Christian conferences abound and grow more prolific every year; ecumenicism is on the rise; contemporary Christian music is bigger ($$$) and more popular now than ever. But is it for the good?

People like Rick Warren praise the pope (from "papa," Holy Father
), saying of Catholics in a tweet: "If you love Jesus, we may serve on different teams, but we're in the same league of receiving His grace and forgiveness"; Louie Giglio of Passion Church and his wife meeting and kissing the Pope. This is but the tip of the iceberg.

Church is nothing but big business. No one is accountable for sin. If someone is good for business they're in, regardless of whether they teach heresy or not. Formerly conservative preachers like John MacArthur have apparently swallowed the Kool-Aid.

Have we already gone over the cliff? If so, what should true and faithful believers do? You can't rebuke. People like Rick Warren are above rebuke. You can't rebuke the contemporary Christian music industry or their artists, they don't care, all they want is $$$ and more of it. If you try to warn people they'll tell you you're crazy.

I believe the time has come for worldly christianity (lower case intentional) to be exposed for what it is. Much of what's going on is deliberately designed to cater to the younger generation. A whole generation is growing up thinking this is what Christianity is.

I didn't spend a lot of time on this post so it may not be that eloquent; it's a heartfelt plea that hopefully the Lord will use for some good.
One last point I'd like to make. All these things you point out are true, but then what do we do? These things you point out can create fear for the believer. And yet we are not to fear.

And so how do we battle and stand against these fearful things you point out?

1 John 4:18
There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.