Is Paul or Jesus your main guide?
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Now let me ask you some questions.
Did Jesus Christ the Son of God supply everything we need to know to approach the throne of God in faith and receive the free gift of salvation through faith? Did Jesus tell us everything we need to know about how to be children of God?
Did Paul add anything at all essential to the fundamental truths that Jesus already mentioned?
Did Jesus Christ the Son of God supply everything we need to know to approach the throne of God in faith and receive the free gift of salvation through faith? Did Jesus tell us everything we need to know about how to be children of God?
Did Paul add anything at all essential to the fundamental truths that Jesus already mentioned?
I agree. What I think Paul meant was that the law of God is good but it isn’t for the gentiles, who he was an apostle to. Telling them instead to obey the law of Christ which is to love God and your neighbor. While the law of Moses seems to have been eliminated in concept, it is effectually still active due to the law of Christ.
The idea being if you love God and your neighbor then you’ll obey God’s moral and ethical laws - hocus pocus the Law of Moses, especially the 10 Commandments are still in effect up until the present day through necessity of the law of Christ.
Long story short, the moral and ethical laws are still in effect while the rigid laws of organized religion are removed. A big difference now is that there is no need for continual animal sacrifices, a temple, or a priesthood. Much of it has been spiritualized through Christ.
Now back to Paul. Do you think he introduced some organized religion? If yes, why did he do that?
The idea being if you love God and your neighbor then you’ll obey God’s moral and ethical laws - hocus pocus the Law of Moses, especially the 10 Commandments are still in effect up until the present day through necessity of the law of Christ.
Long story short, the moral and ethical laws are still in effect while the rigid laws of organized religion are removed. A big difference now is that there is no need for continual animal sacrifices, a temple, or a priesthood. Much of it has been spiritualized through Christ.
Now back to Paul. Do you think he introduced some organized religion? If yes, why did he do that?
I don't believe that God speaks with one voice to gentiles and another to Jews. God is simply truth.
God created a race to listen to Him and show the world who he was, but anyone who would join the Jews was welcome. God's eyes and thoughts are only on man as a whole to belong to Him. He communicated with man at first through the flesh, but when God became Christ he communicated through the holy spirit and we are not to use the fleshly commands.
I think it is wrong for us to try to divide the truths of the Lord into Jewish truths and gentile truths, saying they are different. Truth is truth.
God created a race to listen to Him and show the world who he was, but anyone who would join the Jews was welcome. God's eyes and thoughts are only on man as a whole to belong to Him. He communicated with man at first through the flesh, but when God became Christ he communicated through the holy spirit and we are not to use the fleshly commands.
I think it is wrong for us to try to divide the truths of the Lord into Jewish truths and gentile truths, saying they are different. Truth is truth.
I agree with that, but God doesn’t force covenants on people. What I mean is they the Jewish people were bound to a covenant they agreed to. The gentiles didn’t agree to any such covenants with the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and therefore weren’t under the same laws as the Jews.
The way gentiles are brought under the law without actually calling it “the law” is by bringing them in through Christ to obey the law of love.
The way gentiles are brought under the law without actually calling it “the law” is by bringing them in through Christ to obey the law of love.
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I also might add to this, the 1st and 2nd greatest commandments are entirely subjective now.
Loving God with all your strength isn’t the same when you’re living in the lap of luxury and aren’t struggling for anything as when you’re broken and going without. Some days all of your strength might be straining out a barely audible “thank you God” while barely hanging on to the will to live by a thread.
Loving your neighbor as yourself changes depending on how much you love yourself, if at all. Ironically, the New Testament teaches people to not love themselves and to not love their life. This isn’t an accident, the ultimate conclusion is that only God will be able to judge your service to Him because the written, codified, law of ink and paper has been removed and replaced by a subjective law of love that God seems to judge using a measuring device that only He can se: the human heart.
Rather than singling out which specific law was broken, people are judged whether they loved others as themselves and used the most of their strength to love God.
Loving God with all your strength isn’t the same when you’re living in the lap of luxury and aren’t struggling for anything as when you’re broken and going without. Some days all of your strength might be straining out a barely audible “thank you God” while barely hanging on to the will to live by a thread.
Loving your neighbor as yourself changes depending on how much you love yourself, if at all. Ironically, the New Testament teaches people to not love themselves and to not love their life. This isn’t an accident, the ultimate conclusion is that only God will be able to judge your service to Him because the written, codified, law of ink and paper has been removed and replaced by a subjective law of love that God seems to judge using a measuring device that only He can se: the human heart.
Rather than singling out which specific law was broken, people are judged whether they loved others as themselves and used the most of their strength to love God.
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“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.”
John 8:31-32, 34, 36 KJV
When the apostles received the spirit they began to operate this role
“Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.”
John 16:13-14
so Paul was taking from what Jesus preached and making it more understood Tom people who had believed the gospel
“What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”
Romans 6:15-18 KJV
“If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free”
I agree there aren’t contradictions at all between Jesus and any of his apostles Jesus was speaking the gospel d they were preaching it to the world making it more plain and explaining things from it ( taking from his and making it known )
“Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.”
2 John 1:9 KJV
John 8:31-32, 34, 36 KJV
When the apostles received the spirit they began to operate this role
“Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.”
John 16:13-14
so Paul was taking from what Jesus preached and making it more understood Tom people who had believed the gospel
“What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”
Romans 6:15-18 KJV
“If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free”
I agree there aren’t contradictions at all between Jesus and any of his apostles Jesus was speaking the gospel d they were preaching it to the world making it more plain and explaining things from it ( taking from his and making it known )
“Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.”
2 John 1:9 KJV
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I think that the covenant was for all people, gentiles were to be shown the true God, God wanted them to leave their idols and come to him--all people.
It was the belief of the nations that they each had their personal God, those gods were not the truth but idols. When gentiles accepted the true God, they usually accepted the nation of Israel as Ruth shows us.
When God gave the law in stone, and when God communicated with man through fleshly illustrations or commands to lead them to the law it was for all men who would listen. When the law was put in hearts and all received the holy spirit, it wasn't a jew/gentile thing. It was the truth.
It was the belief of the nations that they each had their personal God, those gods were not the truth but idols. When gentiles accepted the true God, they usually accepted the nation of Israel as Ruth shows us.
When God gave the law in stone, and when God communicated with man through fleshly illustrations or commands to lead them to the law it was for all men who would listen. When the law was put in hearts and all received the holy spirit, it wasn't a jew/gentile thing. It was the truth.
Maybe eventually the gentiles were going to get some attention at some point down the line, but not immediately or even for a long time unless they were proselytized.
From the perspective of each individual nation, their god is the true god. The only thing that was convincing for gentiles was signs and miracles.
Not really at first. There was some pretty strict qualifications for being a gentile Jewish proselyte. If a gentile didn't meet the qualifications to be a Jewish convert then too bad they weren't welcome into the Lord's congregation under any circumstances. Look at Deuteronomy 23 for example.
From the perspective of each individual nation, their god is the true god. The only thing that was convincing for gentiles was signs and miracles.
Not really at first. There was some pretty strict qualifications for being a gentile Jewish proselyte. If a gentile didn't meet the qualifications to be a Jewish convert then too bad they weren't welcome into the Lord's congregation under any circumstances. Look at Deuteronomy 23 for example.
This is looking at events from the point of view of the flesh, not from how God looks at the same thing.
God is no respector of persons, God blessed the Jew--not because they were Jewish--God blessed them for the work he gave them to do. Proverbs 28: 21 "To have respect of persons is not good. "
God does not look at man as Jewish or gentile except to give thanks to Jews for what he had given them to do. After Christ, many gentiles accepted God, that is what God sees.
Because so many proselytes went back to their pagan ways and took the Jewish friends they had made with them, the Jews made 18 laws the proselytes had to follow. We read about it in Acts and learn what the Christian church did about it.
God is no respector of persons, God blessed the Jew--not because they were Jewish--God blessed them for the work he gave them to do. Proverbs 28: 21 "To have respect of persons is not good. "
God does not look at man as Jewish or gentile except to give thanks to Jews for what he had given them to do. After Christ, many gentiles accepted God, that is what God sees.
Because so many proselytes went back to their pagan ways and took the Jewish friends they had made with them, the Jews made 18 laws the proselytes had to follow. We read about it in Acts and learn what the Christian church did about it.
