Is the Gospel a job offer? Or good news aimed at those who believe?

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Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
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Babies are not sinners.

Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Does the bible say babies are born sinless?

Or perfectly Righteous before God?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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Does the bible say babies are born sinless?

Or perfectly Righteous before God?
These little ones, who had no knowledge of good and evil, were permitted into the promise land.

Deuteronomy 1:39 Moreover your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, and your children, which in that day had no knowledge between good and evil, they shall go in thither, and unto them will I give it, and they shall possess it.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
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These little ones, who had no knowledge of good and evil, were permitted into the promise land.

Deuteronomy 1:39 Moreover your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, and your children, which in that day had no knowledge between good and evil, they shall go in thither, and unto them will I give it, and they shall possess it.
Does that mean they are sinless and perfectly righteous before God?

Or does it mean that God already had His Plan for their lives?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,111
3,687
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Does that mean they are sinless and perfectly righteous before God?

Or does it mean that God already had His Plan for their lives?
I would say they are innocent before God, sinless, only capable of sinning when they know the difference between good and evil.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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I would say they are innocent before God, sinless, only capable of sinning when they know the difference between good and evil.
I know that's what you say.

But does the bible say it?
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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You don't know that. You wish for that.

Is there proof from the bible?
Numerous. Judgement is as per what one has done (works), whether good or bad.

Matt 19:13Then the little children were brought to Jesus for Him to place His hands on them and pray for them. And the disciples rebuked those who brought them. 14But Jesus said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not hinder them! For the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” 15And after He had placed His hands on them, He went on from there.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,111
3,687
113
I know that's what you say.

But does the bible say it?
I think the Deuteronomy passage is pretty clear.

What say you? Is there a clear passage that babies go to hell? Are all aborted babies bound for hell?
 
Mar 28, 2016
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Jesus says whoever believes has eternal life. This is a passage that is normally understood in one of two ways. Most see it as a job offer leading to salvation. For whoever chooses to believe and accepts the terms. Some see it as an announcement aimed at those who believe as they hear, providing directions for holy living.

I would suggest it is more like the parable of workers of the field. All paid the same reward 1 cent = eternal life. Some worked little and some worked more And like the manna to be used of the Sabbath everyone had just enough even though some murmured and called it a unfair reward

Mathew 20:9-11 And when they came that were hired about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny. But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny. And when they had received it, they murmured against the goodman of the house,
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
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I think the Deuteronomy passage is pretty clear.

What say you? Is there a clear passage that babies go to hell? Are all aborted babies bound for hell?
The Deuteronomy passage is clear but its not supporting what you are trying to make it support.

No. There are no clear passages either way.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
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Numerous. Judgement is as per what one has done (works), whether good or bad.

Matt 19:13Then the little children were brought to Jesus for Him to place His hands on them and pray for them. And the disciples rebuked those who brought them. 14But Jesus said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not hinder them! For the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” 15And after He had placed His hands on them, He went on from there.
You think that says infants are saved?
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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Yes, you think it does.

But no, it doesn't.

That is talking about children. Not infants.

You know there is a difference?
It does plus many more verses to support including David's own son. There's nothing to argue about here.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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It does plus many more verses to support including David's own son. There's nothing to argue about here.
Why didn't you just use one of the many more conclusive verses to begin with?

The ones that state that all infants are saved.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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Why didn't you just use one of the many more conclusive verses to begin with?

The ones that state that all infants are saved.
This is what David said after his son's death:
Why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he will not return to me.” 2 Samuel 12: 22-23.

And this is one of the many conclusive verses:

Rom 2:6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” a 7To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger.

Judgement is by works.