Is the Great Commission irrelevant for the church now?

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Have you read Hebrews 11 and understood how the OT saints showed their faith?
Your ignoring the point bro

If a work is required to earn salvation, it is a gospel of works. If different works are required for different people. It is different gospels.


Which is what you are professing, yet you deny it. Why??
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Your ignoring the point bro

If a work is required to earn salvation, it is a gospel of works. If different works are required for different people. It is different gospels.

Which is what you are professing, yet you deny it. Why??
Let me ask you more precisely then. How did Noah and Rahab showed faith, according to Hebrews 11? Are you willing to quote the verses here?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Let me ask you more precisely then. How did Noah and Rahab showed faith, according to Hebrews 11? Are you willing to quote the verses here?
Who cares how they showed faith, It had nothing to do with their salvation,
Our discussion is how a person is saved, Not what they do AFTER they are saved. That was your whole argument.
 
Jul 23, 2018
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There was no gog before the dbr of Jesus. In the 4 gospel accounts, there was no gospel for the gentiles as Jesus was only sent to the Jews. The only gospel being proclaimed then was the gok. The bible clearly stares that no dbr was preached then.

Strange that you are making this into such a big deal. If you think about it, it made perfect sense to keep that revelation of the dbr was deliberately kept as a secret, a mystery that only revealed to the Apostle Paul. if that mystery was revealed then, Satan would not have allowed Jesus to be crucified (1 Cor 2:8).

8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

To me, it is clear. If Satan understood the divine exchange when Jesus was on Earth preaching, he would also understood that he could no longer use the law to condemn Christians who believe in the divine exchange, why would he deliberately cause his own permanent defeat by tempting everyone, especially Judas, to set the train in motion for Jesus’s crucifixion?

Isn't God's plan, in making revelation only progressive, great?
""Strange that you are making this into such a big deal. If you think about it, it made perfect sense to keep that revelation of the dbr was deliberately kept as a secret, a mystery that only revealed to the Apostle Paul. if that mystery was revealed then, Satan would not have allowed Jesus to be crucified (1 Cor 2:8). ""
Jesus knew it and wrote the nt.
The apostles knew it as did the early church born ahead of Paul.

The more I dig,the more outlandish you are forced to reply.

I can tell you where the error is. It is in downgrading the non pauline writings.
 
Jul 23, 2018
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we are verging here on the bible being non inspired and in conflict with itself.

This is what I am seeing in the denigration of the OT,the 4 Gospels,and the epistles not written by Paul.

I even doubt revelation of John escapes the denigration.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,067
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If you felt that way, that is unfortunate. But I cannot control how others choose to respond when they read my post.

Here, people have claimed numerous times that I am not truly saved, I am a child of the devil and so on and so forth. If I were to be upset by these remarks, there is really no point in debating in Internet forums. :)
Ok, I do not think that is right for those who claimed you are not saved. I can tell you I was not one of them. I am sorry for those who have said that to you or about you. But it is not upsetting what I have perceived as the language that is subjective to the inferiority of me or others, it's not going to produce any debate.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
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You have a very black and white kind of thinking. Okay, since you don't accept that revelation is progressive, we should not debate further about this topic.
EG's style is his way or you are wrong, not just wrong, but against God.
The idea you discover someone elses logic and interpretation to be able to be empathetic
and love the individual is simply not part of the agenda.

Being in a bunker, fighting the enemy to the end, is more their picture in their hearts. To give
even a little is deemed demonic and defeat. I have seen fanaticism, and this its approach.

It is like talking to flat earthers, you are part of the conspiracy if you do not accept their view,
and you know they are right, and choose to deceive, not that they could actually be simply mistaken,
and self deceived for their own personal reasons. I know always, I can be caught by my own understanding
because we always justify our own understanding, no matter how flawed. We know we are alive when we
are prepared to put that belief on the line, that for me is true faith in Jesus.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
we are verging here on the bible being non inspired and in conflict with itself.

This is what I am seeing in the denigration of the OT,the 4 Gospels,and the epistles not written by Paul.

I even doubt revelation of John escapes the denigration.
Once reprobates start not fearing God, His word means nothing and sinful justification becomes their
gospel. When a preacher can stand up and say, they are a god, or they are Jesus, or dead believers have
messages to speak to living believers, you begin to see how easily man can be truly lost and deceived.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Who cares how they showed faith, It had nothing to do with their salvation,
Our discussion is how a person is saved, Not what they do AFTER they are saved. That was your whole argument.
If they were saved by their faith, my question is. how did they show their faith, based on what God has revealed to them during their lifetime? What is written in Hebrews 11?

Such a simple question and u refuse to answer with scripture.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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we are verging here on the bible being non inspired and in conflict with itself.

This is what I am seeing in the denigration of the OT,the 4 Gospels,and the epistles not written by Paul.

I even doubt revelation of John escapes the denigration.
Once you can accept that not all scripture is written TO you, there is no conflict. If you insist everything is for your instruction then yes, conflicts are plenty.

Mark 16:16 is a perfect example of this. Is water baptism required for salvation? Who is it written to?
 
Jan 12, 2019
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""Strange that you are making this into such a big deal. If you think about it, it made perfect sense to keep that revelation of the dbr was deliberately kept as a secret, a mystery that only revealed to the Apostle Paul. if that mystery was revealed then, Satan would not have allowed Jesus to be crucified (1 Cor 2:8). ""
Jesus knew it and wrote the nt.
The apostles knew it as did the early church born ahead of Paul.

The more I dig,the more outlandish you are forced to reply.

I can tell you where the error is. It is in downgrading the non pauline writings.
Progressive revelation is indeed not an easy topic to accept. I realised that from the debate with you.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Ok, I do not think that is right for those who claimed you are not saved. I can tell you I was not one of them. I am sorry for those who have said that to you or about you. But it is not upsetting what I have perceived as the language that is subjective to the inferiority of me or others, it's not going to produce any debate.
No worries, debates on Internet forums are like that. One good thing about engaging with strangers over the Internet is this, you get to interact with people with very different views of life. Often the friends you meet in your daily life either think very much the same as you, for example church friends, or are unwilling to engage you in any deep intellectual topics. Furthermore, because you know one another in real life, the conversation is often very polite and you won’t really know what the other person really thinks.

But on the Internet, you solve both problems. First, you get to engage with people who think very differently from you. Second, because you will not meet each other in real life, you often get very frank opinions being shared.

There is a flip side to that second point of course, when you know for sure you will never meet them in real life, its much easier for some of them to start insulting you and making other personal remarks while debating, that is unfortunate but is something that is beyond your control.

What is under your control is your own response and I can see the silver lining behind it, it teaches you not to repay like for like, but rather, trains you to truly understand that, you can only control your response to whatever life throws at you.

But the good thing of course, is that only with debating others, that you have an incentive to understand more the other party’s view of the issue, and whether or not you agree with them in the end, your knowledge base expands.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
No worries, debates on Internet forums are like that. One good thing about engaging with strangers over the Internet is this, you get to interact with people with very different views of life. Often the friends you meet in your daily life either think very much the same as you, for example church friends, or are unwilling to engage you in any deep intellectual topics. Furthermore, because you know one another in real life, the conversation is often very polite and you won’t really know what the other person really thinks.

But on the Internet, you solve both problems. First, you get to engage with people who think very differently from you. Second, because you will not meet each other in real life, you often get very frank opinions being shared.

There is a flip side to that second point of course, when you know for sure you will never meet them in real life, its much easier for some of them to start insulting you and making other personal remarks while debating, that is unfortunate but is something that is beyond your control.

What is under your control is your own response and I can see the silver lining behind it, it teaches you not to repay like for like, but rather, trains you to truly understand that, you can only control your response to whatever life throws at you.

But the good thing of course, is that only with debating others, that you have an incentive to understand more the other party’s view of the issue, and whether or not you agree with them in the end, your knowledge base expands.
I like this environment, because what is at stake is only my perspective. After interactions, the other
parties are only going to be effected in their positions. It is not like there are other interactions I have
with anyone here. So I can explore positions with people who sincerely hold them, and test to see how
robust or otherwise they are.

This truly shows how much faith one has and how well you can explore the dynamics of ideas. The more
open and accepting, the more one shows confidence in ones foundations. Rooted and grounded in Christ,
with good fruit, a loving heart, nothing can cause one to stumble.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
If they were saved by their faith, my question is. how did they show their faith, based on what God has revealed to them during their lifetime? What is written in Hebrews 11?

Such a simple question and u refuse to answer with scripture.
You miss the picture.

1. NO ONE has to prove their faith. So why are you asking?
2. James said ANY work or action is enough to prove ones faith
3. As scripture also says, You know them by their deeds.

So in any dispensation in any time, People who have true faith (and this are saved by that FAITH ALONE, will be known because they do not live like the world. Not because they do some religious function. Anyone can do those things, they do not prove anything.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Once you can accept that not all scripture is written TO you, there is no conflict. If you insist everything is for your instruction then yes, conflicts are plenty.

Mark 16:16 is a perfect example of this. Is water baptism required for salvation? Who is it written to?
Mark 16: 16 is not even proven to be part of scripture. It contradict other parts.. so you would be better off looking at matt or the other accounts of the great commission. Which agree.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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You miss the picture.

1. NO ONE has to prove their faith. So why are you asking?
2. James said ANY work or action is enough to prove ones faith
3. As scripture also says, You know them by their deeds.


So in any dispensation in any time, People who have true faith (and this are saved by that FAITH ALONE, will be known because they do not live like the world. Not because they do some religious function. Anyone can do those things, they do not prove anything.
If you believe that salvation is always by grace thru faith, like me, I am actually asking you a very simple question, that I don't see why you are refusing to answer. I even provided the scripture for you.

How did Rahab put her faith in God's grace as stated in Hebrews 11? Was it

by trusting in Jesus's DBR, or
by hiding the spies?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
If you believe that salvation is always by grace thru faith, like me, I am actually asking you a very simple question, that I don't see why you are refusing to answer. I even provided the scripture for you.

How did Rahab put her faith in God's grace as stated in Hebrews 11? Was it

by trusting in Jesus's DBR, or
by hiding the spies?
She trusted God first.

THEN her actions followed. As they will for all of us.

You are losing people. Because your whole argument that the great commission is not for us today are based on these things,

Lets get back to that. Because as MANY have showed you, your wrong there.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,067
4,349
113
No worries, debates on Internet forums are like that. One good thing about engaging with strangers over the Internet is this, you get to interact with people with very different views of life. Often the friends you meet in your daily life either think very much the same as you, for example church friends, or are unwilling to engage you in any deep intellectual topics. Furthermore, because you know one another in real life, the conversation is often very polite and you won’t really know what the other person really thinks.

But on the Internet, you solve both problems. First, you get to engage with people who think very differently from you. Second, because you will not meet each other in real life, you often get very frank opinions being shared.

There is a flip side to that second point of course, when you know for sure you will never meet them in real life, its much easier for some of them to start insulting you and making other personal remarks while debating, that is unfortunate but is something that is beyond your control.

What is under your control is your own response and I can see the silver lining behind it, it teaches you not to repay like for like, but rather, trains you to truly understand that, you can only control your response to whatever life throws at you.

But the good thing of course, is that only with debating others, that you have an incentive to understand more the other party’s view of the issue, and whether or not you agree with them in the end, your knowledge base expands.
I disagree they are like that some choose to make it that way because they know they will not see the person, that emboldens them to be more confrontational.
If you believe that salvation is always by grace thru faith, like me, I am actually asking you a very simple question, that I don't see why you are refusing to answer. I even provided the scripture for you.

How did Rahab put her faith in God's grace as stated in Hebrews 11? Was it

by trusting in Jesus's DBR, or
by hiding the spies?
Rahab fears the Lord God helped the spies out of faith in the God of Israel. I think she even said that. remember me. I will bless those who bless you? Rehab without knowing the God of Isreal still would be saved from destruction because she helped the People of God.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Rahab fears the Lord God helped the spies out of faith in the God of Israel. I think she even said that. remember me. I will bless those who bless you? Rehab without knowing the God of Isreal still would be saved from destruction because she helped the People of God.
So when the Lord commanded water baptism for salvation thru John the Baptist and Peter in the 4 Gospels and early Acts, how does one show faith in the Lord? Get water baptized out of faith in God's word. Rahab could not have shown faith by getting water baptized because that revelation has not been revealed to her yet. There was only one way she could have showed her faith, that is to hide the spies.

Why is it so difficult to accept that, under the GOK, water baptism is required for salvation? Not that water can save you, but it shows you put your faith in God. Mark 16:16 is repeated by Peter in Acts 2:38

But now under the GOG, you put your faith in God by resting from all works and trust in Jesus completed work at the cross to make you righteous.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
EG's style is his way or you are wrong, not just wrong, but against God.
The idea you discover someone elses logic and interpretation to be able to be empathetic
and love the individual is simply not part of the agenda.

Being in a bunker, fighting the enemy to the end, is more their picture in their hearts. To give
even a little is deemed demonic and defeat. I have seen fanaticism, and this its approach.

It is like talking to flat earthers, you are part of the conspiracy if you do not accept their view,
and you know they are right, and choose to deceive, not that they could actually be simply mistaken,
and self deceived for their own personal reasons. I know always, I can be caught by my own understanding
because we always justify our own understanding, no matter how flawed. We know we are alive when we
are prepared to put that belief on the line, that for me is true faith in Jesus.
The OP is saying there are two different Gospels, that is flat out false doctrine. Case closed, period. One Gospel,One way to be saved for all. Any other way is false. EG is not wrong and he and I totally disagree on certain subjects yet we have still remained friends the entire time I've been here. I respect EG and there are many things we agree on. The OP is flat out wrong in this case.