Is the Jewish God and gentile God the same?

[PS]

The 10 commandments don't say to not punish those who break the commandments.

Numbers 15:32-35
32 And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day.

33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation.

34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him.

35 And the Lord said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.

Of course the penalty for blatantly breaking the commandments would be death. Ordered By God.

You may find the death penalty to be harsh for "minor" offenses, but perhaps God does not.

After the LORD led the Israelites safely out of Egypt, without them harming a single hair of anyone's head, the LORD told them to kill all the inhabitants of the land they were about to take by force. Would Jesus, the I AM, have commanded the people to commit mass genocide worse than Hitler? I always thought God is unchanging, so why the change? Remember Aaron the High Priest, made an idol to the god's who led them out of Egypt. It was a Golden Calf.

Here is Moses and his LORD
And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods. And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire. And they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts. And they brought the captives, and the prey, and the spoil, unto Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and unto the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the camp at the plains of Moab, which are by Jordan near Jericho. And Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and all the princes of the congregation, went forth to meet them without the camp. And Moses was wroth with the officers of the host, with the captains over thousands, and captains over hundreds, which came from the battle. And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD. Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
(Num 31:9-18)

Here are the Israilites worshipping their LORD LINK

This is what Jesus the I AM said about the people and their 613 Mitzvah secular laws
“These people honour me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.” Matthew 15:8-9

“they are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.” Matthew 15:14.

Jesus said to them, “why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?” Matthew 15:3

For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition... Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye. Mar 7:8-13

We need to follow Jesus and not the god of the Jews. Please do not take what they did as your life example. Baal the deceiver, who had many names was their god.

 

[Grandpa]

After the LORD led the Israelites safely out of Egypt, without them harming a single hair of anyone's head, the LORD told them to kill all the inhabitants of the land they were about to take by force. Would Jesus, the I AM, have commanded the people to commit mass genocide worse than Hitler? I always thought God is unchanging, so why the change? Remember Aaron the High Priest, made an idol to the god's who led them out of Egypt. It was a Golden Calf.

Here is Moses and his LORD
And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods. And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire. And they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts. And they brought the captives, and the prey, and the spoil, unto Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and unto the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the camp at the plains of Moab, which are by Jordan near Jericho. And Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and all the princes of the congregation, went forth to meet them without the camp. And Moses was wroth with the officers of the host, with the captains over thousands, and captains over hundreds, which came from the battle. And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD. Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
(Num 31:9-18)

Here are the Israilites worshipping their LORD LINK

This is what Jesus the I AM said about the people and their 613 Mitzvah secular laws
“These people honour me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.” Matthew 15:8-9

“they are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.” Matthew 15:14.

Jesus said to them, “why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?” Matthew 15:3

For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition... Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye. Mar 7:8-13

We need to follow Jesus and not the god of the Jews. Please do not take what they did as your life example. Baal the deceiver, who had many names was their god.

I don't understand. Why do you keep changing the subject?

We're talking about the 10 commandments. You keep trying to change the subject to be about the 613 mitzvah.

What you don't seem to understand about the 613 laws is that everyone who tries to follow the 10 commandments must come up with some sort of rules for the "grey" areas and punishment for breaking the main commandments and then lesser punishments for the "grey" area.

For example, if you forgot it was Saturday and you went to work and do all the things you normally do, then the next day when you remembered you would have to do something about that. Perhaps "repentance" is what you have decided is your "punishment". But let's say you drive to church on Saturday. That's kind of a "grey" area. Does it require punishment? Well since you reject the written rules on EXACTLY how to keep a sabbath then it is up to every individual to decide for themselves what exactly is breaking the sabbath and what isn't.

But I don't care about all that. I was just talking about the 10 commandments. Not about all the punishments and grey areas.

I don't know how legalists get the idea that they can chuck everything except the 10 commandments and then make up their own rules on what is and what is not part of the 10 commandments. Don't people know that was already attempted and it didn't work out so well?

 

[PS]

I don't understand. Why do you keep changing the subject?

We're talking about the 10 commandments. You keep trying to change the subject to be about the 613 mitzvah.

What you don't seem to understand about the 613 laws is that everyone who tries to follow the 10 commandments must come up with some sort of rules for the "grey" areas and punishment for breaking the main commandments and then lesser punishments for the "grey" area.

For example, if you forgot it was Saturday and you went to work and do all the things you normally do, then the next day when you remembered you would have to do something about that. Perhaps "repentance" is what you have decided is your "punishment". But let's say you drive to church on Saturday. That's kind of a "grey" area. Does it require punishment? Well since you reject the written rules on EXACTLY how to keep a sabbath then it is up to every individual to decide for themselves what exactly is breaking the sabbath and what isn't.

But I don't care about all that. I was just talking about the 10 commandments. Not about all the punishments and grey areas.

I don't know how legalists get the idea that they can chuck everything except the 10 commandments and then make up their own rules on what is and what is not part of the 10 commandments. Don't people know that was already attempted and it didn't work out so well?

I'm sorry, I don't understand the point you are trying to make. I find nothing wrong with the Ten Commandments as a basis on which to establish the law of the land, but as Christians, we need to follow the commandments of Creator God who came down from heavens glory and dwelt among us for 33 years. It is that simple. No way would I wish to abolish the Ten Commandments, I dread to think what might be motivating those who wish to dispense with them. I have never heard of such a thing in all my life. Who wants to do that?

1. Repent—Matthew 4:17, Luke 13:3
2. Let not your heart be troubled—John 14:27, John 16:33, Matthew 6:25-26, Philippians 4:6-7
3. Follow me—Matthew 4:19
4. Rejoice—Matthew 5:12, (Also 2 Corinthians 6:10, 12:10, James 1:2-4)
5. Let your light shine—Matthew 5:16
6. Honor God’s law—Matthew 5:17-19
7. Be reconciled—Matthew 5:24-25
8. Do not commit adultery—Matthew 5:27-30
9. Keep your word—Matthew 5:33-37
10. Go the second mile—Matthew 5:38-42
11. Love your enemies—Matthew 5:44
12. Be perfect—Matthew 5:48
13. Practice secret disciplines (giving, praying, fasting)—Matthew 6:1-18
14. Lay up treasures in heaven—Matthew 6:19-21
15. Seek first the kingdom of God—Matthew 6:33
16. Judge not—Matthew 7:1-2
17. Do not throw your pearls to pigs—Matthew 7:6
18. Ask, seek, and knock—Matthew 7:7-8
19. Do unto others—Matthew 7:12
20. Choose the narrow way—Matthew 7:13-14
21. Beware of false prophets—Matthew 7:15
22. Pray for those who spread the word—Matthew 9:37-38
23. Be as shrewd as serpents—Matthew 10:16. (Also Romans 16:19)
24. Fear God. Do not fear man— Matthew 10:28 (Also Luke 12:4-5)
25. Listen to God’s voice—Matthew 11:15, 13:9, 13:43, Mark 4:23, Luke 14:35, 1 Kings 19:11-13
26.Take my yoke—Matthew 11:29
27. Honor your parents—Matthew 15:4
28. Beware of false teaching—Matthew 16:6, 11-12
29. Deny yourself—Luke 9:23 (Also Matthew 10:38 and Mark 8:34)
30. Do not despise little ones—Matthew 18:10
31. Go to Christians who offend you—Matthew 8:15 (Also Galatians 6:1)
32. Forgive offenders—Matthew 18:21-22 (Also Proverbs 19:11)
33. Beware of covetousness—Luke 12:15
34. Honor marriage—Matthew 19:6, 19:9
35. Lead by being a servant—Matthew 20:26-28
36. Make the church a house of prayer for all nations—Mark 11:17
37. Pray in faith—Matthew 21:21-22, John 15:7
38. Bring in the poor—Luke 14:12-14
39. Render unto Caesar—Matthew 22:19-21
40. Love the Lord—Matthew 22:37-38
41. Love your neighbor—Matthew 22:39
42. Be born again—John 3:7
43. Await my return—Matthew 24:42-44
44. Celebrate the Lord’s supper—Matthew 26:26-
45. Watch and pray—Matthew 26:41
46. Keep my commandments—John 14:15
47. Feed my sheep—John 21:15-16
48. Make and baptize disciples—Matthew 28:19
49. Teach disciples to obey—Matthew 28:20
50. Receive God’s power—Luke 24:49

http://www.swapmeetdave.com/Bible/Commands/index.htm

 

[Grandpa]

I'm sorry, I don't understand the point you are trying to make. I find nothing wrong with the Ten Commandments as a basis on which to establish the law of the land, but as Christians, we need to follow the commandments of Creator God who came down from heavens glory and dwelt among us for 33 years. It is that simple. No way would I wish to abolish the Ten Commandments, I dread to think what might be motivating those who wish to dispense with them. I have never heard of such a thing in all my life. Who wants to do that?

1. Repent—Matthew 4:17, Luke 13:3
2. Let not your heart be troubled—John 14:27, John 16:33, Matthew 6:25-26, Philippians 4:6-7
3. Follow me—Matthew 4:19
4. Rejoice—Matthew 5:12, (Also 2 Corinthians 6:10, 12:10, James 1:2-4)
5. Let your light shine—Matthew 5:16
6. Honor God’s law—Matthew 5:17-19
7. Be reconciled—Matthew 5:24-25
8. Do not commit adultery—Matthew 5:27-30
9. Keep your word—Matthew 5:33-37
10. Go the second mile—Matthew 5:38-42
11. Love your enemies—Matthew 5:44
12. Be perfect—Matthew 5:48
13. Practice secret disciplines (giving, praying, fasting)—Matthew 6:1-18
14. Lay up treasures in heaven—Matthew 6:19-21
15. Seek first the kingdom of God—Matthew 6:33
16. Judge not—Matthew 7:1-2
17. Do not throw your pearls to pigs—Matthew 7:6
18. Ask, seek, and knock—Matthew 7:7-8
19. Do unto others—Matthew 7:12
20. Choose the narrow way—Matthew 7:13-14
21. Beware of false prophets—Matthew 7:15
22. Pray for those who spread the word—Matthew 9:37-38
23. Be as shrewd as serpents—Matthew 10:16. (Also Romans 16:19)
24. Fear God. Do not fear man— Matthew 10:28 (Also Luke 12:4-5)
25. Listen to God’s voice—Matthew 11:15, 13:9, 13:43, Mark 4:23, Luke 14:35, 1 Kings 19:11-13
26.Take my yoke—Matthew 11:29
27. Honor your parents—Matthew 15:4
28. Beware of false teaching—Matthew 16:6, 11-12
29. Deny yourself—Luke 9:23 (Also Matthew 10:38 and Mark 8:34)
30. Do not despise little ones—Matthew 18:10
31. Go to Christians who offend you—Matthew 8:15 (Also Galatians 6:1)
32. Forgive offenders—Matthew 18:21-22 (Also Proverbs 19:11)
33. Beware of covetousness—Luke 12:15
34. Honor marriage—Matthew 19:6, 19:9
35. Lead by being a servant—Matthew 20:26-28
36. Make the church a house of prayer for all nations—Mark 11:17
37. Pray in faith—Matthew 21:21-22, John 15:7
38. Bring in the poor—Luke 14:12-14
39. Render unto Caesar—Matthew 22:19-21
40. Love the Lord—Matthew 22:37-38
41. Love your neighbor—Matthew 22:39
42. Be born again—John 3:7
43. Await my return—Matthew 24:42-44
44. Celebrate the Lord’s supper—Matthew 26:26-
45. Watch and pray—Matthew 26:41
46. Keep my commandments—John 14:15
47. Feed my sheep—John 21:15-16
48. Make and baptize disciples—Matthew 28:19
49. Teach disciples to obey—Matthew 28:20
50. Receive God’s power—Luke 24:49

http://www.swapmeetdave.com/Bible/Commands/index.htm

Its actually pretty simple.

The Law (10 commandments) is the Ministry of Death and Condemnation.
The Law (10 commandments) is spiritual but we are carnal.
The Letter (10 commandments) is unto Death but the Spirit (Christ) is unto Life.
The Law (10 commandments) does not impart any righteousness to us. Our Righteousness is in Christ.
The Law (10 commandments) does not give us any ability to obey. Our obedience comes from Christ.
Our Blessing and Salvation does not come from the Law (10 commandments). They come from Christ.


Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Rest from what? Labour and heavy laden from what? From 613 mitzvahs?? Where does it say anywhere in the bible that the law can be separated into parts and you get to choose which ones you will follow and which ones you won't?

The point is that there isn't any. The law is a whole. Not one jot or tittle will fall away from any of the law until all is fulfilled. That is pretty specific. That means you don't get to say that some of the law is done away but some other parts of the law aren't. If one jot or one tittle is fulfilled and you are no longer under it then ALL jots and ALL tittles are fulfilled and you are under none of it.

You know, like the bible actually says.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

If you work at the law then you aren't under Grace. Grace is much better than your work at the law.

 

[PS]

Its actually pretty simple.

The Law (10 commandments) is the Ministry of Death and Condemnation.
The Law (10 commandments) is spiritual but we are carnal.
The Letter (10 commandments) is unto Death but the Spirit (Christ) is unto Life.
The Law (10 commandments) does not impart any righteousness to us. Our Righteousness is in Christ.
The Law (10 commandments) does not give us any ability to obey. Our obedience comes from Christ.
Our Blessing and Salvation does not come from the Law (10 commandments). They come from Christ.


Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Rest from what? Labour and heavy laden from what? From 613 mitzvahs?? Where does it say anywhere in the bible that the law can be separated into parts and you get to choose which ones you will follow and which ones you won't?

The point is that there isn't any. The law is a whole. Not one jot or tittle will fall away from any of the law until all is fulfilled. That is pretty specific. That means you don't get to say that some of the law is done away but some other parts of the law aren't. If one jot or one tittle is fulfilled and you are no longer under it then ALL jots and ALL tittles are fulfilled and you are under none of it.

You know, like the bible actually says.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

If you work at the law then you aren't under Grace. Grace is much better than your work at the law.

I have said it before and I will say it again, if we live according to Christ we are above the law. Why? Because we have no desire to kill, steal or commit adultery etc.

This means the law is irrelevant to those who are in Christ, but it is very relevant to those who are under law and therefore the Ten Commandments need to stay in Holy writ.

The 613 Mitzvot laws only apply to Jews, and like Christians, they too become obsolete for those who are baptised into Christ.

 

[PS]

I have said it before and I will say it again, if we live according to Christ we are above the law. Why? Because we have no desire to kill, steal or commit adultery etc.

This means the law is irrelevant to those who are in Christ, but it is very relevant to those who are under law and therefore the Ten Commandments need to stay in Holy writ.

The 613 Mitzvot laws only apply to Jews, and like Christians, they too become obsolete for those who are baptised into Christ.

Even so, we still need to be a light unto others, so that Christ can be seen for good in our daily life.

(Five minute rule)

 

[unclesilas]

Jesus said he came to fulfil the law, he did not say he came to fulfil the Commandments.

You said about 2 Cor. 3 that is simply saying the law on stones has been transferred to the flesh of our hearts, meaning it is forever engraved on our hearts till our dying day i.e. not ended.

When the law is fulfilled, it is ended. So be it Lord. But the commandments still stand.

I have to take the dog for a walk and will get back to you when I get home.

It is simple to know which law is written in your mind and placed on your heart. Anything you do, or could do, which would make you conscious of sin if you did it, is law written in your mind and placed on your heart, for: Through the law we become conscious of sin Romans3:20

 

[Grandpa]

I have said it before and I will say it again, if we live according to Christ we are above the law. Why? Because we have no desire to kill, steal or commit adultery etc.

This means the law is irrelevant to those who are in Christ, but it is very relevant to those who are under law and therefore the Ten Commandments need to stay in Holy writ.

The 613 Mitzvot laws only apply to Jews, and like Christians, they too become obsolete for those who are baptised into Christ.

Yes. I think I can agree with this.

I was not arguing to take anything out of the bible. Not sure if you thought I was.

 

[Guojing]

Yes. I think I can agree with this.

I was not arguing to take anything out of the bible. Not sure if you thought I was.

In case you have not realized, there are Christians who deliberately separate the term Law into the Law of God and the Law of Moses.

To them, the 10 commandments fall under the former and they believe in their hearts that those 10 are not part of the Law that Paul talks about that we have died to, strengthens sin, ministry of death etc etc.

PS belongs to that category.

 

[PS]

In case you have not realized, there are Christians who deliberately separate the term Law into the Law of God and the Law of Moses.

To them, the 10 commandments fall under the former and they believe in their hearts that those 10 are not part of the Law that Paul talks about that we have died to, strengthens sin, ministry of death etc etc.

PS belongs to that category.

To nail my colours to the mast, I am not OSAS and I believe the commandments that are engraved on our hearts are those that were previously carved onto stone tablets.

 

[unclesilas]

To nail my colours to the mast, I am not OSAS and I believe the commandments that are engraved on our hearts are those that were previously carved onto stone tablets.

Would you also agree more than those laws are written in our minds and placed on our hearts? If I got drunk, or partook in witchcraft for example I would consider that sin as it were also.
The law Paul referred to specifically in romans chapter 7 that relates to sin being strengthened in us through the law/commandment was: Thou shalt not covet, one of the ten commandments. However, that related to the commandments as written on stone, and that law was the ministry of death and condemnation, the letter that kills. A law written on stone has been abolished for the believer. The law written in the heart, part of which was written on stone is not the ministry of death and condemnation for the believer has a saviour from their sin. Those who lived under the law as written on stone did not. If you remove death and condemnation from the law, it is no longer a law which strengthens sin. Christ died for the believers sins

 

[PS]

Would you also agree more than those laws are written in our minds and placed on our hearts? If I got drunk, or partook in witchcraft for example I would consider that sin as it were also.
The law Paul referred to specifically in romans chapter 7 that relates to sin being strengthened in us through the law/commandment was: Thou shalt not covet, one of the ten commandments. However, that related to the commandments as written on stone, and that law was the ministry of death and condemnation, the letter that kills. A law written on stone has been abolished for the believer. The law written in the heart, part of which was written on stone is not the ministry of death and condemnation for the believer has a saviour from their sin. Those who lived under the law as written on stone did not. If you remove death and condemnation from the law, it is no longer a law which strengthens sin. Christ died for the believers sins

Paul admits he is drawn two ways, as we all are when we are tempted. But he is able to gain the victory over sin, hate, death, and all evil when he looks to Jesus who not only cleansed us from sin but lives within us so that we might gain the victory by turning to Him.

So before we give into temptation, look to Jesus for the strength to resist, and allow Him to work through us and in this way we will gain the victory over whatever it is that is tempting us. In a nutshell when we have Jesus, we have the whole armour of God, just never take it off. Keep looking to Jesus is what he is saying, "The LORD is my strength and my shield; my heart trusted in him, and I am helped: therefore my heart greatly rejoiceth; and with my song will I praise him." (Psa 28:7 KJV)

 

[Grandpa]

To nail my colours to the mast, I am not OSAS and I believe the commandments that are engraved on our hearts are those that were previously carved onto stone tablets.

Well, that's completely wrong. 2 Corinthians 3 tells us so.

2 Corinthians 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

It is the epistle of Christ written in our hearts.

Is the epistle of Christ the 10 commandments? No. 2 Corinthians 3 tells us what the epistle of Christ is.

2 Corinthians 3:6-9
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

Its not the Letter that is written on our hearts. The Letter kills.
Its not the Ministration of Death that is written on our hearts. The Ministration of Death kills.
Its no the Ministration of Condemnation that is written on our hearts. The Ministration of Condemnation kills.
Its not the 10 commandments that is written on our hearts. The 10 commandments kill.

It is the Spirit of God that is written on our hearts. The Spirit gives Life.
It is the Ministration of Righteousness that is written on our hearts. The Ministration of Righteousness gives Life.
It is Christ who writes Peace, Joy, Love and all the fruit of the Holy Spirit on our hearts. Christ gives Life.

 

[Grandpa]

In case you have not realized, there are Christians who deliberately separate the term Law into the Law of God and the Law of Moses.

To them, the 10 commandments fall under the former and they believe in their hearts that those 10 are not part of the Law that Paul talks about that we have died to, strengthens sin, ministry of death etc etc.

PS belongs to that category.

I guess I need to be more specific and say 10 commandments instead of law.

Shouldn't have to.

The 10 commandments are the basis for all the law. You can't have the law without them.

 

[PS]

Well, that's completely wrong. 2 Corinthians 3 tells us so.

2 Corinthians 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

It is the epistle of Christ written in our hearts.

Is the epistle of Christ the 10 commandments? No. 2 Corinthians 3 tells us what the epistle of Christ is.

2 Corinthians 3:6-9
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

Its not the Letter that is written on our hearts. The Letter kills.
Its not the Ministration of Death that is written on our hearts. The Ministration of Death kills.
Its no the Ministration of Condemnation that is written on our hearts. The Ministration of Condemnation kills.
Its not the 10 commandments that is written on our hearts. The 10 commandments kill.

It is the Spirit of God that is written on our hearts. The Spirit gives Life.
It is the Ministration of Righteousness that is written on our hearts. The Ministration of Righteousness gives Life.
It is Christ who writes Peace, Joy, Love and all the fruit of the Holy Spirit on our hearts. Christ gives Life.

Correct. I accept it is the epistle of Christ that is written on our hearts.

So, do you still want to do away with the law?

 

[Grandpa]

Correct. I accept it is the epistle of Christ that is written on our hearts.

So, do you still want to do away with the law?

The 10 commandments aren't done away. They just aren't for the Christian. And they AREN'T written on the Christians Heart.

The 10 commandments are for those who have not come to Christ.

 

[unclesilas]

Correct. I accept it is the epistle of Christ that is written on our hearts.

So, do you still want to do away with the law?

Its so simple really

1) The law did not have to be abolished in order to end it being the ministry of death and condemnation/the letter that kills. Jesus died for ALL a believers sins. Therefore, everytime they transgress the law in their hearts, they cannot be condemned for doing so, for the price has been paid for that sin and every other one too.

2) One of the most basic biblical facts is: Through the law we become conscious of sin Romans3:20 You can only be conscious of sin through the law. In the real world, and away from rather strange theology in some peoples minds, if a believer stole, committed adultery, coveted, took the Lords name in vain they would be conscious of sin by doing so. So that law must be in their heart and mind.

3) The law in your heart, simply means in your heart you want to live according to that law, in your heart you do not want to bear false witness, murder, commit adultery, steal, covet. I can only repeat, you wanting not to do those things in your heart cannot bring condemnation to you when you slip up concerningthem, for, Jesus died for all your sins, transgressions of that law. Under the old covenant, where the law was written on stone, they had no saviour who had died for all their sins, therefore, the law written on stone was the ministry of death and condemnation/the letter that kills. And a law written on stone was abolished for the believer.

4) Under the new covenant, Jesus died for all your sins/transgressions of the law, and by doing that he removed the true power of sin from your life. So the believer, who in their heart wants to live as God desires them to live(for that is where the law has been placed) can now see this come to fruition. For the power of sin has been removed from them, if they trust and believe Jesus is their rightstanding before the Father, he died for all their sins, and therefore ended the laws ability to bring condemnation under it. In this sense, those who accept this covenant, are a letter-or Epistle from Christ, the result of the true ministry, a ministry where the law is not written on stone but tablets of human hearts, with the true power of sin removed from the believer, which brings victory in their lives, and obedience. A true letter from Christ. Victory over sin by the covenant he died to usher in

 

[Grandpa]

Its so simple really

1) The law did not have to be abolished in order to end it being the ministry of death and condemnation/the letter that kills. Jesus died for ALL a believers sins. Therefore, everytime they transgress the law in their hearts, they cannot be condemned for doing so, for the price has been paid for that sin and every other one too.

2) One of the most basic biblical facts is: Through the law we become conscious of sin Romans3:20 You can only be conscious of sin through the law. In the real world, and away from rather strange theology in some peoples minds, if a believer stole, committed adultery, coveted, took the Lords name in vain they would be conscious of sin by doing so. So that law must be in their heart and mind.

3) The law in your heart, simply means in your heart you want to live according to that law, in your heart you do not want to bear false witness, murder, commit adultery, steal, covet. I can only repeat, you wanting not to do those things in your heart cannot bring condemnation to you when you slip up concerningthem, for, Jesus died for all your sins, transgressions of that law. Under the old covenant, where the law was written on stone, they had no saviour who had died for all their sins, therefore, the law written on stone was the ministry of death and condemnation/the letter that kills. And a law written on stone was abolished for the believer.

4) Under the new covenant, Jesus died for all your sins/transgressions of the law, and by doing that he removed the true power of sin from your life. So the believer, who in their heart wants to live as God desires them to live(for that is where the law has been placed) can now see this come to fruition. For the power of sin has been removed from them, if they trust and believe Jesus is their rightstanding before the Father, he died for all their sins, and therefore ended the laws ability to bring condemnation under it. In this sense, those who accept this covenant, are a letter-or Epistle from Christ, the result of the true ministry, a ministry where the law is not written on stone but tablets of human hearts, with the true power of sin removed from the believer, which brings victory in their lives, and obedience. A true letter from Christ. Victory over sin by the covenant he died to usher in

That's simple?

God has placed the Ministry of Condemnation on the believers heart because they know what sin is?

No. The Ministry of Death and Condemnation USED TO BE on the Believers heart before they came to Christ. Now a NEW Thing has been written there.

New Covenant. New Testament. New High Priest.

How can a person NOT be under the law if it is written on their heart? If we are under Grace wouldn't it be Grace that is written on our hearts?

 

[unclesilas]

That's simple?

God has placed the Ministry of Condemnation on the believers heart because they know what sin is?

No. The Ministry of Death and Condemnation USED TO BE on the Believers heart before they came to Christ. Now a NEW Thing has been written there.

New Covenant. New Testament. New High Priest.

How can a person NOT be under the law if it is written on their heart? If we are under Grace wouldn't it be Grace that is written on our hearts?

You need to grasp the basics of the Christian faith. To be under law is to be under its condemnation. The believer cannot be under the condemnation of the law if Jesus died for all their sins. No more condemnation, that is not possible.
Besides which, you have to ignore one of the most basic, fundamental scrtiptural truths. Through the law we become conscious of sin. In the real world, believers would be conscious they sinned if they stole, committed adultery, took the Lords name in vain

 

[Grandpa]

You need to grasp the basics of the Christian faith. To be under law is to be under its condemnation. The believer cannot be under the condemnation of the law if Jesus died for all their sins. No more condemnation, that is not possible.
Besides which, you have to ignore one of the most basic, fundamental scrtiptural truths. Through the law we become conscious of sin. In the real world, believers would be conscious they sinned if they stole, committed adultery, took the Lords name in vain

You need to grasp the basics of the law.

Those who work at the law ARE under its condemnation.

The Lord Jesus died for our sins so we would turn to HIM and not to our works of the law.

A person doesn't really believe in the Lord if they are working at the law.

In the real world sin is condemnation. To be conscious of sin is to be conscious of condemnation.

A person is conscious of condemnation when they turn to their carnal self. When a person abides in Christ there is NO CONDEMNATION.


Romans 8:1-6
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

What does the carnal mind do? Works at the 10 commandments. The law of sin and death.

What does the Spiritually minded do? Abides in Christ. The Spirit of Life and peace.