Is this bishop telling the truth about sun-day? Video less than 4 minutes.

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duewell

Senior Member
Mar 5, 2011
336
9
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does anybody really know what time it is ? does anybody really care? and they don't even know what they are talking about. everyday is sunday for all i care. my heart's like a wheel, head's like a stone. surrounded by people yet nobody's home.

this whole topic is only for those who have never experienced what the bible teaches. spiritless lawyers argue words they have only read yet never heard. cooks argue the recipe they have never made and blame those who starve for being hungry. the dead cant wake the sleeping for they have no light.

duewell
mark 4 v 11-13
 
Aug 15, 2009
9,745
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This is not hard to solve. People make it hard, when they look to men's answers & not God's.
I looked this up on my WordSearch software & finally found it:
Sunday - the first day of the week.
Called the Lord's Day. [SUP]§[/SUP]Revelation 1:10
Christ arose on Sunday. [SUP]§[/SUP]Mark 16:9; [SUP]§[/SUP]Luke 24:13-15; [SUP]§[/SUP]John 20:19
Paul preached on Sunday, the first day of the week. [SUP]§[/SUP]Acts 20:7
The early church worshipped on Sunday. [SUP]§[/SUP]Acts 20:7; [SUP]§[/SUP]1 Cor. 16:1-2
POSB Master Index.

But..... I was lazy, & when I couldn't find it immediately found it on a GOOGLE search..... several sites.

(not particularily to the 2 quoters, but all arguing on here)
Not trying to sound pompous or high-minded, but my goodness, you folks find everything else on the internet, and you couldn't find this? I found it in under 2 minutes, & I don't consider myself a pro on using the internet.

No offense, but some people would rather fight than be a Berean.:rolleyes:
Does it make sense to read the Bible? Follow the Bible? If everyone searched the Bible the way the Bible says to, this thread would be long dead.:)
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
81
48
christians were worshipping on sundays by the end of the first century AD...long before the roman catholic church was even a thing...
It is true that there are records that people had begun to keep Sunday very early. There is however no actual bible evidence of this. So we know for a fact that it was not taught from Scripture.

The records of people keeping Sunday come after the time of the Apostles and thus are totally disconnected from scriptural Doctrine.

It is also common knowledge that Paganism and its teachings began to come into the church. Even Paul warned of this when he said:

Act 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
Act 20:29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
Act 20:30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.


Paul also warned:

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
2Th 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

This power wold oppose God and in fact was already at work in Paul's time.

It is also agreed that the Papal roots run down to at least the second century.

The Church Historian Philip Schaff said, "The first example of the exercise of a sort of papal authority is found towards the close of the first century in the letter of the Roman bishop Clement (d.102) to the bereaved and distracted church of Corinth." History of the Christian Church (8th ed., 1903), vol. 2, p. 157.

He goes on,

"He (Clement) speaks in a tone of authority to a sister church of apostolic foundation, and thus reveals the easy and as yet innocent beginning of the Papacy." p.646.

Paul died a martyr in Rome around A.D 68. Clement, bishop of Rome, was a disciple of Paul and died A.D 102. Schaff describes it this way. "the interval between Clement and Paul" as a "transition from the apostolic to the apocryphal, from faith to superstition"

Yet of the so called Fathers who lived in the two centuries immediately following the apostles Schaff says:

"We seek in vain among them for the evangelical doctrines of the exclusive authority of the scriptures, Justification by faith alone, the universal priesthood of the laity; and we find instead as early as the second century a high estimate of ecclesiastical traditions, meritorious and even overmeritorious works, and strong sacerdotal, sacramentarian, ritualistic, and ascetic tendencies, which gradually matured in the Greek and Roman types of Catholicity. p. 628

So I ask does it make sense that a person who claims to take their doctrine form the word of God would then quote Men who accepted tradition and false teachings. and use them as their proof that the Sabbath had been changed? Should this be ok in light that Paul warned of the lies and false teachings that were already starting to creep in?

The reality is that what the church Fathers say concerning Sabbath provides no help or direction to the question. They are unreliable at best. Plus it is only scripture that gives us truth.

It is also clear that way back to these early days are the roots of the Papal Church which was the inevitable result of the traditions and paganism being accepted into Christianity at the demise of the apostles.

There is evidence in history also of 7th Day Sabbath keeping. The difference is that this evidence lines up with what the bible says. The church fathers line up with tradition and paganistic influence.

It was much later that Constantine played His part in paving the way for Sunday enforcement and persecution of those who kept the bible Sabbath.
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
81
48
I would also add the words of the church Historian Augustus Neander who said:

"The writings of the so-called apostolic Fathers have unhappily, for the most part, come down to us in a condition very little worthy of confidence, partly because under the name of these men, so highly venerated in the church, writings were early forged for the purpose of giving authority to particular opinions or principles; and partly because their own writings which were extant, became interpolated in subservience to a Jewish hierarchical interest, which aimed to crush the free spirit of the gospel." General History of the Christian Religion and Church (1854), vol. 1, Appendix, sec. 4, p. 657

Therefore with this and the above problems it is clear that to rely on the church fathers for any sort of doctrinal position is a bad idea. This should be clear by the fact that all doctrine should come from Gods word and not else where.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
9,022
1,417
113
does anybody really know what time it is ? does anybody really care? and they don't even know what they are talking about. everyday is sunday for all i care. my heart's like a wheel, head's like a stone. surrounded by people yet nobody's home.

this whole topic is only for those who have never experienced what the bible teaches. spiritless lawyers argue words they have only read yet never heard. cooks argue the recipe they have never made and blame those who starve for being hungry. the dead cant wake the sleeping for they have no light.

duewell
mark 4 v 11-13
So what do you say to the "spiritless lawyers" who argue the recipe that they've never "cooked"?

Do you just let them convince people that Christianity really is a bunch of spiritless lawyers cooking the recipe that they've defined?

I'm not 100% sure why they disputed in Acts 15. Why didn't they just leave, say you guys are in error and we will be our own separate body?

I think they loved those guys who meant well but just didn't understand.

Even though we can't lift each others vails we can point them to the One who can...
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
9,022
1,417
113
Acts 15:24-29
[FONT=&quot]24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.


Why is that? Why did the Apostles not agree with the Pharisees that believed about Christians keeping the law?

Todays pharisees want to frame this question as "why was the sabbath changed to sunday"? But that's not what has happened. People don't "keep" sunday as the pharisees accuse.

Christians have received rest from Christ. We can't go back to working at the law in our carnal understanding to show everyone how righteous we are. That's not the way our righteousness works.

We were made Righteous in Christ apart from our carnal understanding and work of the law. In spite of it.

So we have a choice before us. Continue in our faith, in Christ. Or turn back to the law and attempt to establish our own righteousness by our own carnal understanding.

Galatians 3:2-3
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?[/FONT]