Jesus as King?

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J

John146

Senior Member
#143
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
3,702
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#143
Dave-L said:
Check out Acts 2.
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Where in Acts 2? Peter described how they crucified their promised messiah. But nothing about eternal salvation through belting in the d,b,r. Peter preached a national message to Israel trying to get them to repent of what they have done, and be baptized for the remission of sins. Paul never preached this.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#144
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
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#144
John146 said:
Where in Acts 2? Peter described how they crucified their promised messiah. But nothing about eternal salvation through belting in the d,b,r. Peter preached a national message to Israel trying to get them to repent of what they have done, and be baptized for the remission of sins. Paul never preached this.
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Spend more time on it, you might see it.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#145
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
3,702
113
#145
Dave-L said:
Spend more time on it, you might see it.
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Still waiting on a verse showing the disciples preaching the d,b,r for sins before the cross (even though they had no clue about it).
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#146
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#146
John146 said:
Still waiting on a verse showing the disciples preaching the d,b,r for sins before the cross (even though they had no clue about it).
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The gospel unfolded since Eden. All who believed were born again (saved). It was known as the gospel of the kingdom by Jesus and preached as the gospel of the kingdom by Peter at Pentecost which included Christ's death, burial, and resurrection.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#147
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
3,702
113
#147
Dave-L said:
The gospel unfolded since Eden. All who believed were born again (saved). It was known as the gospel of the kingdom by Jesus and preached as the gospel of the kingdom by Peter at Pentecost which included Christ's death, burial, and resurrection.
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If You were to speak the exact message the disciples preached before the cross...what would that be?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#148
Jan 17, 2020
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#148
John146 said:
If You were to speak the exact message the disciples preached before the cross...what would that be?
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The gospel as then known which includes the kingdom all expected to arrive. Complimented by redefining the kingdom as spiritual only. Only the born again would accept the kingdom and Christ as king.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#149
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
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#149
Dave-L said:
The gospel as then known which includes the kingdom all expected to arrive. Complimented by redefining the kingdom as spiritual only. Only the born again would accept the kingdom and Christ as king.
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Can’t find one verse?
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#151
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
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#151
Dave-L said:
They won't make sense to you anymore more than they did to others expecting a physical kingdom.
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If I preach exactly what the disciples preached before the cross, would anybody get saved today?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#152
Jan 17, 2020
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#152
John146 said:
If I preach exactly what the disciples preached before the cross, would anybody get saved today?
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Salvation is not about knowledge. God saves whom he will in the New Birth. And then tells them about it through the gospel. Those who believed the Kingdom came were born again. It fulfilled the gospel Abraham believed. Those who believed it was physical concluded Daniel was wrong saying it would come in the days of the Roman Empire.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#153
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
3,702
113
#153
Dave-L said:
Salvation is not about knowledge. God saves whom he will in the New Birth. And then tells them about it through the gospel. Those who believed the Kingdom came were born again. It fulfilled the gospel Abraham believed. Those who believed it was physical concluded Daniel was wrong saying it would come in the days of the Roman Empire.
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Just asking for one verse from the gospel before the crossfires the message th3 disciples preached. Paul says, we preach Christ crucified. Is that what the disciples before the cross preached?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#154
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
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#154
John146 said:
Just asking for one verse from the gospel before the crossfires the message th3 disciples preached. Paul says, we preach Christ crucified. Is that what the disciples before the cross preached?
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Jesus also preached it. Peter preached it at Pentecost. But the gospel like any prophecy cannot be understood until after fulfillment.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#155
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
3,702
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#155
Dave-L said:
Jesus also preached it. Peter preached it at Pentecost. But the gospel like any prophecy cannot be understood until after fulfillment.
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Can you post scripture where the disciples preached the “prophecy” of the cross? The d,b,r of Jesus for sins? Thanks.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#156
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
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#156
John146 said:
Can you post scripture where the disciples preached the “prophecy” of the cross? The d,b,r of Jesus for sins? Thanks.
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It was all prophecy beginning in the OT and understood like most prophecy after God fulfilled it.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#157
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
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#157
Dave-L said:
It was all prophecy beginning in the OT and understood like most prophecy after God fulfilled it.
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My point, nobody before the cross was “looking forward” to the cross. It was hid in mystery form. What the Jews were looking for rightly, was their promised messiah to become King and restore the kingdom of Israel in Jerusalem. This is a real prophecy promise to God’s physical people Israel.

Before the physical could be given, the Jews would have to receive the spiritual kingdom of God through the d,b,r of Jesus. Since they did not receive this, the physical kingdom was postponed and the gospel of the d,b,r was taken to the Gentiles.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#158
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
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#158
John146 said:
My point, nobody before the cross was “looking forward” to the cross. It was hid in mystery form. What the Jews were looking for rightly, was their promised messiah to become King and restore the kingdom of Israel in Jerusalem. This is a real prophecy promise to God’s physical people Israel.

Before the physical could be given, the Jews would have to receive the spiritual kingdom of God through the d,b,r of Jesus. Since they did not receive this, the physical kingdom was postponed and the gospel of the d,b,r was taken to the Gentiles.
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Knowledge cannot save. Only God saves. And many saved Jews greeted and some worshipped Jesus.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#159
Jan 13, 2016
17,185
3,702
113
#159
Dave-L said:
Knowledge cannot save. Only God saves. And many saved Jews greeted and some worshipped Jesus.
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Preaching the kingdom is not saving anyone. The message of the cross is specific. Nobody before the cross was born again. Only the shed blood of Jesus can save, not the prophecies thereof. John 3 is clear.
 
Jimbone

Jimbone

Senior Member
#160
Aug 22, 2014
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#160
biker said:
My KJV Bible claims Stephen said He was standing upon the right hand, not seated.

55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus [standing on the right hand] of God,

56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man [standing on the right hand] of God.
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These are the only two times it says He was standing and you're suggesting this means pre-trib rapture? Plus it blows my mind you WANT to deny Jesus is King right now. Just wow. I'm sorry brother but He is King right now!!! Read Mat. 28 a little closer, read our final marching orders, it's in my signature

“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

He is King right now, and all being born again does is open our eyes to the truth of it. Jesus is reigning King right now ruling until all enemies have been made a footstool for His feet. He is seated, the work is done. You take this 1 verse where it says "standing" and cling to it like there's not at least 3 times as many that say He's seated. In this verse Jesus may have stood up off His throne to welcome His child being martyred right then. Who knows, it only says that here.

I don't know man, even if I disagreed with this view I'd have to find another "hill to die on" rather than argue "Jesus is not King", just because of the words coming out of my mouth. There is no other point you could make here, nothing else to debate other than, "Jesus isn't King". He is my King right now, as a matter of FACT He is everyone's King right now. They're just blind to it, this is what being born again is, having our spiritual eyes and ears resurrected and open to the TRUTH. I know the way you see it and it robs our Lord of so much glory and power. It breaks my heart.
 
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