Know that summer is near - we are now living in the last of the last days

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KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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Yes, the future restoration will be physical and spiritual and the blindness will be lifted from Israel. :)
Not according to Amos.

Amo 8:2 (KJV) And he said, Amos, what seest thou? And I said, A basket of summer fruit. Then said the LORD unto me, The end is come upon my people of Israel; I will not again pass by them any more.
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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It’s pretty clear as to what the verse is talking about when you look at Luke’s account.

Luk 17:37 (KJV) And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

When they said “Where Lord?”, they are referring back to verse 30 and asking Jesus WHERE would the son of man reveal himself after his return.

Luk 17:30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.-

The only place that could possibly be talking about is at the tomb when Christ rose from the dead.
Great reference! Verses 31-36 are the verses that actually explain verse 37 means
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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Not according to Amos.

Amo 8:2 (KJV) And he said, Amos, what seest thou? And I said, A basket of summer fruit. Then said the LORD unto me, The end is come upon my people of Israel; I will not again pass by them any more.
Passage means temporal judgement was imminent, not that God was eternally closing the book on them. Remember, Jesus was sent first to the Jews, and that was after Amos. Also, Paul says that God can and will restore them in Romans 11
 

Deade

Called of God
Dec 17, 2017
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Not according to Amos.

Amo 8:2 (KJV) And he said, Amos, what seest thou? And I said, A basket of summer fruit. Then said the LORD unto me, The end is come upon my people of Israel; I will not again pass by them any more.
Yes, you are telling of God's punishment the "end" is a goal and leads to very much destruction. But if you keep reading in Amos we see God stopping short of completely destroying Israel. In fact, we see a restoration.

Amos 9:8-15 "Behold, the eyes of the Lord GOD are upon the sinful kingdom, and I will destroy it from off the face of the earth; saving that I will not utterly destroy the house of Jacob, saith the LORD. For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth. All the sinners of my people shall die by the sword, which say, The evil shall not overtake nor prevent us. In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old: That they may possess the remnant of Edom, and of all the heathen, which are called by my name, saith the LORD that doeth this.

Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the plowman shall overtake the reaper, and the treader of grapes him that soweth seed; and the mountains shall drop sweet wine, and all the hills shall melt. And I will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and drink the wine thereof; they shall also make gardens, and eat the fruit of them. And I will plant them upon their land, and they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God." :cool::cool:
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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Yes, you are telling of God's punishment the "end" is a goal and leads to very much destruction. But if you keep reading in Amos we see God stopping short of completely destroying Israel. In fact, we see a restoration.

Amos 9:8-15 "Behold, the eyes of the Lord GOD are upon the sinful kingdom, and I will destroy it from off the face of the earth; saving that I will not utterly destroy the house of Jacob, saith the LORD. For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth. All the sinners of my people shall die by the sword, which say, The evil shall not overtake nor prevent us. In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old: That they may possess the remnant of Edom, and of all the heathen, which are called by my name, saith the LORD that doeth this.

Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the plowman shall overtake the reaper, and the treader of grapes him that soweth seed; and the mountains shall drop sweet wine, and all the hills shall melt. And I will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and drink the wine thereof; they shall also make gardens, and eat the fruit of them. And I will plant them upon their land, and they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God." :cool::cool:
See also Zechariah 14
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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Passage means temporal judgement was imminent, not that God was eternally closing the book on them. Remember, Jesus was sent first to the Jews, and that was after Amos. Also, Paul says that God can and will restore them in Romans 11
Amos 8 was a prophecy about Christ’s first coming. When the Jews rejected Christ God was done with them.

Paul doesn’t say that God can and will restore them, but that gets into who the elect are and according to scripture the flesh descendants aren’t his children of the promise.

Let’s agree to disagree on this one... if been through that discussion way too many times.😊
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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Can you elaborate?
Well I don't understand all the details, but the question "where, Lord?" Is in reference to "one taken, one left". The where Lord is referring probably to where the ones are taken are taken to, as the ones who are left would remain where they are. As to what Jesus was saying, I'm not certain, but it definitely is in reference to verses immediately proceeding, I think vs 35-36, I don't have a Bible handy
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
9,906
253
83
Yes, you are telling of God's punishment the "end" is a goal and leads to very much destruction. But if you keep reading in Amos we see God stopping short of completely destroying Israel. In fact, we see a restoration.

Amos 9:8-15 "Behold, the eyes of the Lord GOD are upon the sinful kingdom, and I will destroy it from off the face of the earth; saving that I will not utterly destroy the house of Jacob, saith the LORD. For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth. All the sinners of my people shall die by the sword, which say, The evil shall not overtake nor prevent us. In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old: That they may possess the remnant of Edom, and of all the heathen, which are called by my name, saith the LORD that doeth this.

Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the plowman shall overtake the reaper, and the treader of grapes him that soweth seed; and the mountains shall drop sweet wine, and all the hills shall melt. And I will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and drink the wine thereof; they shall also make gardens, and eat the fruit of them. And I will plant them upon their land, and they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God." :cool::cool:
Yes I’m aware of what it says and the first part of Amos doesn’t contradict the last part.

There has always been two Israel’s in the Bible. One is the children of the promise, the elect. The other is the flesh descendants, the enemies of the gospel, the ones that God used to demonstrate his ways for mankind.

The later ones are the ones that God made an end of when Christ came.
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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Well I don't understand all the details, but the question "where, Lord?" Is in reference to "one taken, one left". The where Lord is referring probably to where the ones are taken are taken to, as the ones who are left would remain where they are. As to what Jesus was saying, I'm not certain, but it definitely is in reference to verses immediately proceeding, I think vs 35-36, I don't have a Bible handy
Good catch! This is why I do this, there’s always someone who sees things differently and ties things together in other ways that I have not thought of.... even when we don’t see eye to eye on things.
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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Amos 8 was a prophecy about Christ’s first coming. When the Jews rejected Christ God was done with them.

Paul doesn’t say that God can and will restore them, but that gets into who the elect are and according to scripture the flesh descendants aren’t his children of the promise.

Let’s agree to disagree on this one... if been through that discussion way too many times.😊
Amos 9 says that a day would come when Israel will be planted in their land and never again be uprooted. This prophecy was yet unfulfilled in Jesus' day, as they were uprooted by the Romans after Jesus. Therefore, this prophecy of Israel's restoration has a fulfillment long after Christs first advent.
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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Amos 9 says that a day would come when Israel will be planted in their land and never again be uprooted. This prophecy was yet unfulfilled in Jesus' day, as they were uprooted by the Romans after Jesus. Therefore, this prophecy of Israel's restoration has a fulfillment long after Christs first advent.
That land was heavenly Jerusalem - the tabernacle of David.... fulfilled here:

Act 15:16 (KJV) After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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Yes I’m aware of what it says and the first part of Amos doesn’t contradict the last part.

There has always been two Israel’s in the Bible. One is the children of the promise, the elect. The other is the flesh descendants, the enemies of the gospel, the ones that God used to demonstrate his ways for mankind.

The later ones are the ones that God made an end of when Christ came.
God did not make an end of them. They were preserved for thousand years and still exist. And blindness in part does not refer to spiritual Israel, and it refers to physical Israel, and it says blindness inpart until the fulness of the Gentiles. The until part indicates the blindness is temporary, not permanent. 🙂
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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God did not make an end of them. They were preserved for thousand years and still exist. And blindness in part does not refer to spiritual Israel, and it refers to physical Israel, and it says blindness inpart until the fulness of the Gentiles. The until part indicates the blindness is temporary, not permanent. 🙂
This a discussion for another thread. 😊
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
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That land was heavenly Jerusalem - the tabernacle of David.... fulfilled here:

Act 15:16 (KJV) After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
That land was heavenly Jerusalem - the tabernacle of David.... fulfilled here:

Act 15:16 (KJV) After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
This passage from Acts was fulfilled in Christ, the eternal King from theline of David, whom Isaiah said would-be a Light to the Gentiles and the Glory of His people Israel. To this I think we can agree

Nice chatting with you. Might not be back on for a couple days, but enjoyed the discussion. Peace
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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This was fulfilled in Christ, the eternal King from theline of David, whom Isaiah said would-be a Light to the Gentiles and the Glory of His people Israel. To this I think we can agree

Nice chatting with you. Might not be back on for a couple days, but enjoyed the discussion. Peace
Have a good night, thanks for the info on the taken ones. 👍
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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Strange view considering that all the statements in that passage stem from the kingdom of God that comes WITHOUT observation.

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:


Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Do you think the kingdom of God was in the Pharisees?
 

Deade

Called of God
Dec 17, 2017
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That land was heavenly Jerusalem - the tabernacle of David.... fulfilled here:

Act 15:16 (KJV) After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
No, no, no, the physical promise to Abraham is not a kingdom in heaven. Christ is not already ruling. You come up with this and say you are not a preterist. That is their main dogma. Christ already ruling and Satan already bound. No, no, on earth is where Christ will ascend the throne of David, one that is already established. Then a literal, physical kingdom of all 12 tribes of Israel will be established in the Promised Land.
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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No, no, no, the physical promise to Abraham is not a kingdom in heaven. Christ is not already ruling. You come up with this and say you are not a preterist. That is their main dogma. Christ already ruling and Satan already bound. No, no, on earth is where Christ will ascend the throne of David, one that is already established. Then a literal, physical kingdom of all 12 tribes of Israel will be established in the Promised Land.
Deade earthly things are only shadows of the heavenly things. Again we are so far off on this matter that it can’t be discussed.

But for the record yes I believe Christ is in charge and ruling but I don’t think Satan is bound.