"Levels" of reward in Heaven?

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Hevosmies358

Guest
#21
It is even MORE BOTHERSOME to see that some Christians do not believe God and Christ about their heavenly home which is the New Jerusalem.

The earth is NOT for the Church, but for redeemed and restored Israel, and the saved nations after the Second Coming of Christ. The Bible clearly states that for Christians, OUR CITIZENSHIP IS IN HEAVEN. You can either believe God or believe the false doctrines of men.
Hold your horses bro

Dont it say that the Lord comes from heaven with thousands of His saints? Where are they coming to? THE EARTH i'd say.

And during the millennium it says we shall be kings and priests ruling, HOW is that possible if we aint even on earth! Also: Doesnt it say the New Jerusalem DESCENDS and people go into it (gates open and all that)

Maybe you are talking about a time AFTER the millennium? Anyhow: Here is a side question for you brother Nehemiah: Do you happen to know WHO are those people outside of the New Jerusalem? That travel in and out and kings bring their glory there, etc?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#22
Dont it say that the Lord comes from heaven with thousands of His saints? Where are they coming to? THE EARTH i'd say.
Correct. Yes all the saints accompany Christ to earth at His second coming, but we should not assume that they come to dwell on earth. What is perfectly clear is that the New Jerusalem with its mansions (which I take literally) was designed and built by God for the Church, which is the Wife of the Lamb in the future.
And during the millennium it says we shall be kings and priests ruling, HOW is that possible if we aint even on earth!
Since we do not have every detail about this, we could use the analogy that the saints are *visiting officials* of Christ brought to earth to govern the nations (*reign*) on the earth. But since they have *spiritual bodies* they are not confined to earth, but will eventually return to the New Jerusalem, which is their eternal home. Or *commute* back and forth.
Also: Doesnt it say the New Jerusalem DESCENDS and people go into it (gates open and all that)
Correct. Again we do not have all the details, but what we do know is that after the New Jerusalem descends from Heaven (following the creation of the New Heavens and the New Earth) it becomes a heavenly body to replace the sun and give light to the earth. So in fact it remains above the earth.

The New Jerusalem is a cubic city which is the size of a continent. It does not descend to the earth (as some assume) since it could not give light to the whole earth if that were true.

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. (Rev 21:23)

Maybe you are talking about a time AFTER the millennium? Anyhow: Here is a side question for you brother Nehemiah: Do you happen to know WHO are those people outside of the New Jerusalem? That travel in and out and kings bring their glory there, etc?
And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. (Rev 21:24)

As you can see, there will be saved nations on earth during and after the Millennium, surrounding redeemed and restored Israel. As to how and when their kings will have access to the New Jerusalem, we are not told. It could be via teleportation (but that is just a guess). God has not really given us every detail.
 
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Hevosmies358

Guest
#23
As you can see, there will be saved nations on earth during and after the Millennium, surrounding redeemed and restored Israel. As to how and when their kings will have access to the New Jerusalem, we are not told. It could be via teleportation (but that is just a guess). God has not really given us every detail.
You think these saved nations are gentiles that got saved in the millennium? Thats my guess! ( A GUESS THO! )
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
#24
There is this oft-spoken believe in the local churches here that there are "reward tiers" in Heaven depending on what you do here on Earth. I never really got a proper since that's not what the church I go to claim, and the people I talk to are apparently just quoting something their pastor had said.

Basically the story is... if you do many good works for the Kingdom, you will have this grand 5-storey mansion in Heaven. But if you do less good works for the Kingdom, you still go to Heaven but your house is smaller. I've heard someone jokingly say that if you do no good works, "maybe you just get to camp out in Heaven's courtyard" or something.

Does anyone know or ever heard of such a thing? Like, I don't know if it was just a joke one pastor happened to say just for funnies, that somehow kept being repeated to the point that it cemented itself into a part of the theology, or...? I don't recall ever seeing this on other Christian websites online. I remember something in one of Paul's letters, about works being wood and hay and stubble. I thought it might be a weird extrapolation from that, but I've not had a chance to talk to someone who can tell me what verse does this belief come from.

Yeah? It'll be something "like" that. Sometimes, "illustrations" for the purposes of interpreting, can be (how can I say) "embellished?"
1 Peter 2
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

That being said? This can, and has, and does, lead to a "slippery slope", whereas, the one, or ones, who are, (by use of the illustration) "living in tents at the KOA" come off like they are the ones in that 5 story mansion.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#25
We all receive the same reward. God is not served by human hands in any way shape or form.

Hebrew 6 reminds us of the better things that accompany salvation (penny) . In so much that our father in heaven will not forget the good works done towards His name or power. The same power spoken of in Philippians 2:12 -13 the work of Christ in us, with us to both will and do the good pleasure. And again reminds of the laborers pennies worth . Don't murmur and debate verse 13. . .rejoice Love is not jealous .Be happy you had an opportunity to do the work yoked with Him

Luke 20:23-25 King James Version (KJV) But he perceived their craftiness, and said unto them, Why tempt ye me? Shew me a penny. Whose image and superscription hath it? They answered and said, Caesar's. And he said unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which be Caesar's, and unto God the things which be God's.

Or like Paul what said in 1 Corinthians, when men were trying to make the apostles an authority that rises above all things written in the law and prophets . Paul asked then after warning them not to puff of men above the word of God as if they had a higher reward or more crowns than a pennies worth . Paul replied what do we have that we have receive freely from the hand of God? And if we have why would we boast as if not?

1 Corinthians 4:6-7 (ERV) Brothers and sisters, I have used Apollos and myself as examples for you. I did this so that you could learn from us the meaning of the words, “Follow what the Scriptures say.” Then you will not brag about one person and criticize another. Who do you think you are? Everything you have was given to you. So, if everything you have was given to you, why do you act as if you got it all by your own power?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#26
You think these saved nations are gentiles that got saved in the millennium? Thats my guess! ( A GUESS THO! )
That would be logical. There are also several OT Scriptures which allude to this.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#27
We all receive the same reward.
That is not what we see in the NT. Rewards will vary depending upon faithfulness in service, and with the right motives. There are several parables which teach this.
God is not served by human hands in any way shape or form.
Now you are just fantasizing. The Bible contradicts that.
And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him: (Rev 22:3)
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#28
That is not what we see in the NT. Rewards will vary depending upon faithfulness in service, and with the right motives. There are several parables which teach this.

Now you are just fantasizing. The Bible contradicts that.
And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him: (Rev 22:3)
Hi thanks for the reply.

I see that a little differently

The parable I used did not seem to reflect what you say parables do? Do they contradict each others?

The reward is a Penny. No hall of fame.

Yes Holy men of old were moved by the Holy Spirit. . . not of their own selves as if they did not freely receive it by his will giving us the power to do through that will. . God is self serving, having no needs he satisfies all. .

“He is the God who made the whole world and everything in it. He is the Lord of the land and the sky. He does not live in temples built by human hands. He is the one who gives people life, breath, and everything else they need. He does not need any help from them. He has everything he needs. Acts17:24-25 EVR

“The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands. And he is not served by human hands, "as If" he needed anything. Rather, he himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else.Acts17:24-25 EVR
 
Aug 22, 2019
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#29
It is even MORE BOTHERSOME to see that some Christians do not believe God and Christ about their heavenly home which is the New Jerusalem.

The earth is NOT for the Church, but for redeemed and restored Israel, and the saved nations after the Second Coming of Christ. The Bible clearly states that for Christians, OUR CITIZENSHIP IS IN HEAVEN. You can either believe God or believe the false doctrines of men.
Wait, please explain this. I've never heard of this teaching before.
Do you mean that the Church (Christians) will reside in Heaven, but there are other nations who gets to live on Earth? Who are these"saved nations" and how are they different from the Chruch?
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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#30
Luke 19:11 As they heard these things, he proceeded to tell a parable, because he was near to Jerusalem, and because they supposed that the kingdom of God was to appear immediately. 12 He said therefore, “A nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and then return. 13 Calling ten of his servants, he gave them ten minas, and said to them, ‘Engage in business until I come.’ 14 But his citizens hated him and sent a delegation after him, saying, ‘We do not want this man to reign over us.’ 15 When he returned, having received the kingdom, he ordered these servants to whom he had given the money to be called to him, that he might know what they had gained by doing business. 16 The first came before him, saying, ‘Lord, your mina has made ten minas more.’ 17 And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant! Because you have been faithful in very little, you shall have authority over ten cities.’ 18 And the second came, saying, ‘Lord, your mina has made five minas.’ 19 And he said to him, ‘And you are to be over five cities.’ 20 Then another came, saying, ‘Lord, here is your mina, which I kept laid away in a handkerchief; 21 for I was afraid of you, because you are a severe man. You take what you did not deposit, and reap what you did not sow.’ 22 He said to him, ‘I will condemn you with your own words, you wicked servant! You knew that I was a severe man, taking what I did not deposit and reaping what I did not sow? 23 Why then did you not put my money in the bank, and at my coming I might have collected it with interest?’ 24 And he said to those who stood by, ‘Take the mina from him, and give it to the one who has the ten minas.’ 25 And they said to him, ‘Lord, he has ten minas!’ 26 ‘I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away. 27 But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slaughter them before me.’”

Could levels of reward also involve roles and responsibilities in the kingdom? We see that one of the good servants above will be given authority over 10 cities and the other over 5 cities. Yet the wicked servant will be counted as an enemy to Christ, which just goes to show you that the wicked servant was not saved. The Israelites were referred to by God as "My servant whom I have chosen" (Isaiah 43:10) even though not all of the Israelites were saved. In Leviticus 25:55, we also read - For the children of Israel are servants to Me; they are My servants whom I brought out of the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.
 

Lightskin

Well-known member
Aug 16, 2019
3,165
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#31
No disagreements with anyone, but I lean on Matthew 20, the workers in the vineyard, regarding Salvation and rewards.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
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#32
There is only one group of people left on earth to go into eternity in their physical bodies - those who were true to Jesus Christ and served Him during His millennial kingdom. They go into eternity after the Millennium with physical glorified bodies, not spiritual glorified bodies like we will have, because they did not experience death and resurrection.
Why would God leave anyone in the flesh? Is this not in direct opposition to

1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

1 Corinthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed (236)

1 Corinthians 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1 Corinthians 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.


236 allasso to change
I change, alter, exchange, transform
 
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morefaithrequired

Guest
#33
Im counting on really nice accomodation in a northerly direction ie. Heaven.
Here is just a taste of the good works I do here on Earth. God is indeed well-pleased with this beloved:
smile at my boss
take my dog for a walk at least once a week
do the dishes for my wife every now and then
take out the pegs for my wife when she does the laundry
show gratitude to the Lord when He gives me what I want
make my bed to the best of my ability
pray up to twice a week sometimes as long as 5 minutes
never miss Church on Sunday unless I feel tired and sleep in
 

TheLearner

Well-known member
Jan 14, 2019
7,856
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Brighton, MI
#34
There is this oft-spoken believe in the local churches here that there are "reward tiers" in Heaven depending on what you do here on Earth. I never really got a proper since that's not what the church I go to claim, and the people I talk to are apparently just quoting something their pastor had said.

Basically the story is... if you do many good works for the Kingdom, you will have this grand 5-storey mansion in Heaven. But if you do less good works for the Kingdom, you still go to Heaven but your house is smaller. I've heard someone jokingly say that if you do no good works, "maybe you just get to camp out in Heaven's courtyard" or something.

Does anyone know or ever heard of such a thing? Like, I don't know if it was just a joke one pastor happened to say just for funnies, that somehow kept being repeated to the point that it cemented itself into a part of the theology, or...? I don't recall ever seeing this on other Christian websites online. I remember something in one of Paul's letters, about works being wood and hay and stubble. I thought it might be a weird extrapolation from that, but I've not had a chance to talk to someone who can tell me what verse does this belief come from.
The only difference I know of is Crowns and rooms by denomination for those who don't want to face the truth.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
113
#35
A couple examples


Ezekiel 28:2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God
Ezekiel 28:3 Behold, thou art wiser than Daniel; there is no secret that they can hide from thee:
Ezekiel 28:4 With thy wisdom and with thine understanding thou hast gotten thee riches, and hast gotten gold and silver into thy treasures
Ezekiel 28:5 By thy great wisdom and by thy traffick hast thou increased thy riches, and thine heart is lifted up because of thy riches:
Ezekiel 28:6 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God;
Ezekiel 28:7 Behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.
Ezekiel 28:8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.
Ezekiel 28:9 Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou shalt be a man, and no God, in the hand of him that slayeth thee.
Ezekiel 28:10 Thou shalt die the deaths of the uncircumcised by the hand of strangers: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD.
Ezekiel 28:11 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Ezekiel 28:12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.

Notice the progression from "prince to king"

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Revelation 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Revelation 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

Revelation 19:8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints. (your righteousness will be the fine linen your clothes are made of, no righteousness, no clothes)

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Revelation 14:13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them. (why would your works follow you?)
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
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#36
Wait, please explain this. I've never heard of this teaching before.
Do you mean that the Church (Christians) will reside in Heaven, but there are other nations who gets to live on Earth? Who are these"saved nations" and how are they different from the Chruch?
After the second coming of Christ He will establish (1) redeemed and restored Israel on earth, and (2) the saved nations where people will be saved prior to the Millennium.

ZECHARIAH 14
9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.
10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, andfrom the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.
11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited...
14 And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance...
16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles...
20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD'S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.
21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,243
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Tennessee
#37
Im counting on really nice accomodation in a northerly direction ie. Heaven.
Here is just a taste of the good works I do here on Earth. God is indeed well-pleased with this beloved:
smile at my boss
take my dog for a walk at least once a week
do the dishes for my wife every now and then
take out the pegs for my wife when she does the laundry
show gratitude to the Lord when He gives me what I want
make my bed to the best of my ability
pray up to twice a week sometimes as long as 5 minutes
never miss Church on Sunday unless I feel tired and sleep in
I'm the full-time dishwasher for my wife. Also take out the trash, get the mail, and do most of the grocery shopping. Don't make bed. No dog but I do feed our two cats each morning. On laundry day I bring down all the dirty laundry from the upstairs. I show gratitude also to the Lord, not so much for getting what I want but providing what I need. Haven't attended church for 3 years due to working each weekend. I feel tired too but never sleep in. I do take the occasional nap though on my 2 days off a week. What are pegs that you take out on laundry day for your wife? Oh, rarely smile at work especially at my boss but I do say good morning occasionally.
 
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morefaithrequired

Guest
#38
I'm the full-time dishwasher for my wife. Also take out the trash, get the mail, and do most of the grocery shopping. Don't make bed. No dog but I do feed our two cats each morning. On laundry day I bring down all the dirty laundry from the upstairs. I show gratitude also to the Lord, not so much for getting what I want but providing what I need. Haven't attended church for 3 years due to working each weekend. I feel tired too but never sleep in. I do take the occasional nap though on my 2 days off a week. What are pegs that you take out on laundry day for your wife? Oh, rarely smile at work especially at my boss but I do say good morning occasionally.
Pegs are used to fasten clothes to a clothes line
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
9,261
2,386
113
#40
Levels...

The first time I talked to a Mormon he said heaven had different levels.
I said, "Does that have anything to do with rescuing a princess?"