Mark 10:9 what GOD has joined together.....even for bad marriages?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

JohnB

Well-known member
Jul 31, 2022
2,078
456
83
Calif
#82
I don’t doubt you have studied it, perhaps that’s the reason we’re talking now.

“Jesus says bluntly that the passage in Deuteronomy was put in there by Moses for the hardness of their hearts.”

Think for a second my friend, is Deuteronomy the inspired word of God? Does Deuteronomy allow for divorce and remarriage for reasons other than fornication?

“Jesus goes on to say that divorce is not permissible excepting for fornication.”

If Deuteronomy allows for divorce and remarriage for reasons other than fornication then why would Jesus contradict that in Matthew, Mark and Luke?

He wouldn’t of course. There’s a problem with the English translation.
Wonderful study I hope you take on.
Paul also gave other reasons for divorce and remarriage.
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
#83
Paul also gave other reasons for divorce and remarriage.
Paul confirms Jesus' teachings in many ways on the subject of sex and marriage. In fact Paul goes so far as to say if they are committing adultery and fornication and these things, don't even eat with them, do not company with them at all, in effect they are excommunicated from the holy body of Christ. Paul even went so far as to turn some of these egregious offenders over to Satan.
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#84
Deuteronomy is the word of Moses. The question asked to Jesus is; why Moses permitted divorce for any cause and remarriage? Jesus answers this directly saying that Moses put it in there for the hardness of their hearts. Which of course Jesus would know as he is the same Word of God that came to Moses. Jesus then clarifies that it was not so always, but cites the book of Genesis how it is one man and one woman for life. Jesus further explicitly states with no ambiguity or room for misinterpretation that divorce is only permissible for fornications. Jesus elaborates on this that if you commit divorce you are causing your spouse to commit adultery and furthermore that if you marry such a one that is put away you are committing adultery. It is clear from these verses, as well as many others in the New Testament, particularly the Book of Revelation, that God hates divorce, remarriage is totally prohibitted, and that anyone that does these things should be regarded as an adulterer which is a high sin, a sin unto death and worthy of all excommunication from the holy body of Christ, in Jesus name, amen.
“Deuteronomy is the word of Moses.”

Deuteronomy is the inspired word of God.

I’m too tired to continue. I hope you look back at our conversation and eventually come to an understanding of Christ’s words in Matthew, Mark and Luke.

In the meantime I recommend you refrain from speaking to the doctrine of divorce and remarriage.
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
#85
“Deuteronomy is the word of Moses.”

Deuteronomy is the inspired word of God.

I’m too tired to continue. I hope you look back at our conversation and eventually come to an understanding of Christ’s words in Matthew, Mark and Luke.

In the meantime I recommend you refrain from speaking to the doctrine of divorce and remarriage.
I understand the words of Jesus already, they are written plainly enough.
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#86
I understand the words of Jesus already, they are written plainly enough.
Well then you can surely tell me how many times Jesus spoke the word apostasion/divorce according to our inspired scripture.

I’ll save you and our viewers the suspense, never.

As I said, dig deeper, and until you do refrain from speaking on the topic.
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
#87
Well then you can surely tell me how many times Jesus spoke the word apostasion/divorce according to our inspired scripture.
Well I could just copy paste what Jesus said so that there is no room at all to make misinterpretation. So now the question is do I believe Jesus or do I believe a fallen society that does those things contrary to what Jesus said and are themselves the enemies of Jesus? The answer is I believe Jesus because he is the Word of God and the Word of God is infallible.

Mark 10:1-12

1 And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again.

2 And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.

3 And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?

4 And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.

5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.

6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;

8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.

9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

10 And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.

11 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.

12 And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#88
Well I could just copy paste what Jesus said so that there is no room at all to make misinterpretation. So now the question is do I believe Jesus or do I believe a fallen society that does those things contrary to what Jesus said and are themselves the enemies of Jesus? The answer is I believe Jesus because he is the Word of God and the Word of God is infallible.

Mark 10:1-12

1 And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again.

2 And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.

3 And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?

4 And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.

5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.

6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;

8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.

9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

10 And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.

11 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.

12 And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
How many? Do you have a lexicon?
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
#91
The correct answer is ZERO. As I said, you’re mistaken. Please look back on our conversation and dive into the study, Lord willing it’ll be a blessing.
Well that's obviously not true as Mark 10 already proves.

So the question to you is: do i believe Jesus or should I believe a fallen society that are the enemies of Jesus and does all these evil things and tries to justify it?
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#92
Well that's obviously not true as Mark 10 already proves.

So the question to you is: do i believe Jesus or should I believe a fallen society that are the enemies of Jesus and does all these evil things and tries to justify it?
IMG_7590.jpeg
Used 3 times in the entire New Testament, not once by Jesus.
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#94
In Matthew, Mark and Luke Jesus was addressing the practice of putting away a wife without a divorce certificate.

As I said earlier, research agunah: the chained wife. Sadly a practice that continues to this very day. Where Jewish men PUT AWAY their wives without a divorce certificate then mary another woman, leaving the original wife unable to marry. Jesus said the only reason to do this is fornication.
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
#95
In Matthew, Mark and Luke Jesus was addressing the practice of putting away a wife without a divorce certificate.

As I said earlier, research agunah: the chained wife. Sadly a practice that continues to this very day. Where Jewish men PUT AWAY their wives without a divorce certificate then mary another woman, leaving the original wife unable to marry. Jesus said the only reason to do this is fornication.
Just because the men commit adultery does not mean that the answer is to allow the woman to commit adultery. As it is said; two wrongs do not make a right. The ideal answer is to not commit adultery, but work out any issues and preserve the marriage.
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#96
Pharisees: Is it lawful to put away a wife without a divorce certificate for any cause?

Jesus: What did Moses (Deuteronomy) command?

Pharisees: To put away with a divorce certificate.

Jesus: If you put away without a divorce certificate and remarry for reasons other than fornication it is adultery. And, if you marry someone that is put away without a divorce certificate it is adultery.

Perhaps this paraphrase will help. 👆

It’s really quite simple.

Jesus wasn’t making a new doctrine on divorce and remarriage, he wasn’t changing His words in Deuteronomy.

Jesus was addressing the practice of putting away without a divorce certificate, something that still occurs today in Jewish communities.
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
5,119
2,588
113
London
christianchat.com
#97
Mark 10:9 "Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.”....even for bad marriages? I can understand any physical abuse, but if you just cannot stand the other person? Or their attitudes and habits are destroying the family? I know in the Old Testament there are protections for the wife, if she is being treated badly.
why would you marry a person you can't stand? God does not arrange any bad marriages.
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
#98
Pharisees: Is it lawful to put away a wife without a divorce certificate for any cause?

Jesus: What did Moses (Deuteronomy) command?

Pharisees: To put away with a divorce certificate.

Jesus: If you put away without a divorce certificate and remarry for reasons other than fornication it is adultery. And, if you marry someone that is put away without a divorce certificate it is adultery.

Perhaps this paraphrase will help. 👆

It’s really quite simple.

Jesus wasn’t making a new doctrine on divorce and remarriage, he wasn’t changing His words in Deuteronomy.

Jesus was addressing the practice of putting away without a divorce certificate, something that still occurs today in Jewish communities.
Pharisees: Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife? (tempting him!)

Jesus: What did Moses command you?

Pharisees: Moses suffered us to divorce our wives for any reason (Deuteronomy reference)

Jesus: Moses put that in the Law because of the hardness of your hearts. But from the beginning God made them male and female, and so a man leaves his father and mother and cleaves to his wife and the two flesh become one. (Genesis reference). "What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder."

Later the disciples ask Jesus of the same matter

Jesus: Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her. If a woman divorces her husband and marries another she commits adultery.
 

NOV25

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2019
977
385
63
#99
Luke 16

[17] But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one dot of the Law to become void.

[18] “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery.

If Jesus made this statement in verse 18 then He is voiding the law He gave to Moses laid out in Deuteronomy 24 which allows for divorce and remarriage, right after He states not one dot of the law given to Moses will be voided.

Not sure how the ESV crew missed that glaring contradiction. Just goes to show how the doctrines of men can blind even the most learned theologians.

Apoluo ≠ divorce
 
May 24, 2023
573
111
43
Romans 7:2-3

2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.

3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.