New Age: New Apostolic Reformation

[zone]

what else is Rick Joyner up to?

who else is he holding hands with, and what is he saying?

~


Joint Prophecies of Rick Joyner & Rabbi Cohen

at Messiah'99 ​

Colossians 1:17-19
"And He is before all things, and by Him all things consist. And He is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things He might have the preeminence. For it pleased the Father that in Him should all fulness dwell.​

Hashivenu.org is a Messianic Jewish organization located on the campus of Fuller Theological Seminary. Its president, Stuart Dauermann, a doctoral student and teacher at Fuller, was also a past speaker at the Lausanne Consultation on Jewish Evangelism (LCJE). The first "'Core Principle of Hashivenu" states: "Messianic Judaism is a Judaism, and not a cosmetically altered 'Jewish-style' version of what is extant in the wider Christian community." Among Hashivenu's "Favorite Links" is listed The Messianic Jewish Alliance of America (MJAA).​

In July of 1999, the MJAA sponsored Messiah'99, a conference held in conjunction with the Young Messianic Jewish Alliance and the International Alliance of Messianic Congregations and Synagogues. The Messiah '99 Brochure announced that conference speakers would include Rick Joyner of Morning Star Ministries, Stephen Strang, editor of ‘Charisma’ Magazine and Stephen Katz, a recruiter for Jews for Jesus. These speakers were presented as being among "Over sixty of Messianic Judaism's most respected teachers conducting Workshops, Panels, Teaching, Preaching. . ." ​

In a joint presentation to Messiah '99, MJAA President Rabbi Robert Cohen and Rick Joyner of MorningStar Ministries laid out a prophetic vision for the Messianic Jewish Movement. Highlights of the Prophecies given by Rick Joyner and Rabbi Cohen are as follows:

• The 1970s, when Jerusalem returned to Jewish hands, was the end of the Gentile Age.
  
• The 1990s are moving on the spirit of revival that began with the Jesus Movement, which was the source of the Messianic movement.
  
• The Messianic people are a prophetic righteous remnant, "that are calling the Church back to their Jewish roots" and "they are back to become a prophetic call to the nation of Israel."
  
• Messianic people are, "THE HEAD," meaning, of the Body of Christ and the First Fruits.
  
• Whole communities will come to Y’eshua because of their witness.
  
• Jews and Gentiles will be looking to the Messianics to explain the Word of God.
  
• Joyner expressed a concern that Messianics: ". . .would not be corrupted by too many relationships with the Church" and that they are not supposed to be like the Church nor the Church like them as that would, "mess everything up."
  
• Racism is one of the ultimate enemies.
  
• There is a revolution going on in the Church.
  
• Reconciliation happens when there is restitution, and there’s going to be a lot of restitution for the Messianic people as Jews.
  
• Messianic people will have a better ability to witness, heal, discern and utilize spiritual gifts than others.
  
• Messianics are going to help us (the Church) restore our foundations to where they belong -- and we won’t get where we’re supposed to be without their help.

Rick Joyner, whom Rabbi Cohen considers a friend and a "righteous Gentile," was informed that he was the first Gentile ever to speak at their conference. Joyner, who is also a Knight of the Order of Malta,1 which Joyner states is not a Masonic Order, associates with other modern prophets like James Ryle of Promise Keepers (pastor of Bill McCartney), Andrew Strom, Jack Deere, Francis Frangipane, Dudley Hall, Mike Bickle, Bob Jones, Paul Cain and others who were involved with the original "Kansas City Prophets", the Vineyard, and the Charismatic movement. The End Time Prophetic Visions website provides a current listing of modern prophets which includes all of the above along with Messianic and Catholic prophetic organizations.

The term "righteous gentile" is used by Jews to describe those that have accepted the Noahide Laws and have attained certain other requirements. According to the "Kabbalah and Modern Life -- Jews and Non-Jews: The Seven Principles of Divine Service for Righteous Gentiles," the following describes some of those requirements.

"Though the Torah does not require that all non-Jews convert fully to Judaism, it does require that they undergo a semi-conversion in order to become "righteous gentiles." Non-Jews must accept the seven Noahide laws conveyed to mankind by Moses, the servant of G-d, in the Torah. They thereby become transformed, and acquire a greater level of free will...With regard to the righteous gentile, the Torah states: "and he shall live with you." He may live in the land of Israel, and it is incumbent on the People of Israel to provide for his welfare." Jew and Non-Jews: Victory (Trust)--Self Transformation
​

Joint Prophecies of Rick Joyner & Rabbi Cohen at Messiah '99

~​

The term "righteous gentile" is used by Jews to describe those that have accepted the Noahide Laws and have attained certain other requirements.​

HUH?​

​

Noahide Laws?​

SURPRISE!​

btw:
THIS IS A COMPREHENSIVE RESOURCE:
http://www.seekgod.ca/index.htm​

​

 

[AnandaHya]

BTW, Zone. NOT ONE person was saved from the foundation of the world. Every born again believer can give at least a general date as to when they accepted Christ as their Savior.

Maggie

Yeah I picked on that one too until I did some more research in the Bible and I was shown these verses:


Revelation 17:8
The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is

Matthew 13:35
that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying: “ I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things kept secret from the foundation of the world.”

Ephesians 1:3-5 (New King James Version)
Redemption in Christ
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, 5 having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,

sometimes we just have to pray and allow GOD's will to be done and not our selfish desires and pride to get in the way. Let God be TRUE and all men liars.

 

[AnandaHya]

sigh Noahide laws? do I really want to know. I get the feeling no not really so I'll just post the Bible verses that come to mind instead.

IF they tell you you have to be vegan, not marry, etc to be saved and base salvation on WORKS and not Grace of Christ death on the cross then you are listening to doctrines of demons.If thoughts enter your mind while reading the Bible to the same vein CAST THEM OUT and bind them in the Name of Jesus for we are to take captive every thought into the obedience of Christ. 1st clue: voice tells you NOT to read your Bible, you don't need church or Christian fellowship, etc.


2 Peter 2:17-19 (New King James Version)

17 These are wells without water, clouds[a] carried by a tempest, for whom is reserved the blackness of darkness forever.

Deceptions of False Teachers

18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped[c] from those who live in error. 19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.



i'll research the rest of the list later. sigh....

 

[silverwind]

hey SW
that's a particularly nasty one: but they all end up that way.
whatever that thing is (Kundalini), it is actually, physically passed from one to another...contagious).

its odd how even a little exposure to that stuff seems to create a kind of addiction to it, and an aversion for the scriptures and ordinary ways of christian life. i've read so many testimonials of people who have come out of that......it can happen.

I actually got really creeped out and had to X out. Shivers run down my spine. Stuff like that is never of God.

 

[zone]

she calls upon Allah and asks for the spirits to descend upon the congregation and inhabit those who do not have the protection of God firmly rooted in their hearts to become possessed and has invited them on the church and opens oh my goodness ok i put them on mute. didn't want to hear the full spell or incantation.

She's speaking in tongues alright. tongues of angels to Lucifer's fallen legion. I've seen enough. I'm going back to reading the Bible now...

ok well we have to remember what God tells us about these things... the AntiChrist will be revealed by the mouths of his prophets that are in the world TODAY. if anyone shows up, it will not be Jesus but many will be deceived. Jesus doesn't need a prophet to announce His arrival He has His angels and the destruction of this world to do it. if you see the sun destroyed and the stars falling out of the sky, the earth's foundations moved, etc. you might want to reread your Bible and pray and repent of your sins for your maker is coming....How do you know the new Earth is here? NO WATER, will give you a clue: no seas, no sun. How do people live? by the grace of God by the light of God. Its in Revelations people should read it and listen to people and their dreams less. it is people's responsibility to divide truth from lies...

2 Thessalonians 2

The Great Apostasy

1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ[a] had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God[c] in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He[d] who now restrains will do so until He[e] is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

INDEED!

 

[FireOnTheAltar]

The thing to remember here is that Rick Joyner and his views only represents a very small number of "spirit filled" believers. Because I live about an hour from his base of operations, I have seen Rick Joyner in person and heard him speak. I wasn't impressed at all! I've also seen his ministry on God tv and still am not impressed.

What you must understand is that Joyner and the majority of those who associate with him are hyperspirituals. They emphasize much on the leading of the Holy Spirit as well as the gifts of the Spirit however, they are very liberal and soft in their stance on sin (ie. the Todd Bentley ordeal) and tend to neglect the fact that the Holy Spirit's primary role is to purify us in order to make us Christ-like.

I'm going to make a comparison here that some of you will not like but it's very true. Rick Joyner's group is to Pentecostal and Spirit Filled believers as licentous, Antimonian once saved always saved people are to Calvinists. Both both being so soft in their stances on sin they are being led by the flesh and not the Holy Spirit.

 

[zone]

I actually got really creeped out and had to X out. Shivers run down my spine. Stuff like that is never of God.

ya.
there's a guy (or used to be) on YouTube called LocalPastor who did a lot of early vids exposing those guys.
another guy at the time (who i see has a channel still going) is Godsplumbline

back then some of us were working together compling data, etc...those guys made the vids.

we got flak like you would not believe from the charismatics: wow. they just hated us for saying that stuff was demonic. the comments sections of the Pensacola exposes shows how aggressively the bentleys and bill johnson et al were defended.

its not those guys that bother me as much as the fact that thousands and thousands gathered night after night and just LOVE IT! that's what's scary....the crowds!

 

[zone]

The thing to remember here is that Rick Joyner and his views only represents a very small number of "spirit filled" believers. Because I live about an hour from his base of operations, I have seen Rick Joyner in person and heard him speak. I wasn't impressed at all! I've also seen his ministry on God tv and still am not impressed..

the spirit that is filling Joyner is not The Holy Spirit.


2 Corinthians 11
7 Was it a sin for me to lower myself in order to elevate you by preaching the gospel of God to you free of charge? 8 I robbed other churches by receiving support from them so as to serve you. 9 And when I was with you and needed something, I was not a burden to anyone, for the brothers who came from Macedonia supplied what I needed. I have kept myself from being a burden to you in any way, and will continue to do so. 10 As surely as the truth of Christ is in me, nobody in the regions of Achaia will stop this boasting of mine. 11 Why? Because I do not love you? God knows I do! 12 And I will keep on doing what I am doing in order to cut the ground from under those who want an opportunity to be considered equal with us in the things they boast about.

13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15 It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.

 

[zone]

1st clue: voice tells you NOT to read your Bible, you don't need church or Christian fellowship, etc..

exactly!
voice says "just listen to your (sinful) heart"..."don't be a pharisee with head knowledge"..."the bible is only a book"....."all churches are bad".

i say, let's get our doctrine right, and then help get our churches right: get rid of these creeps.

 

[FireOnTheAltar]

By the way, Rick Joyner's ministry merely boasts of "signs and wonders". They see about as much authentic salvations and healing a year as the next average church. As I said, they are hyperspirituals. For them a faint draft in the room could blow the pages of a calendar that's hanging on the wall and they would believe an angel is trying to show them a specific date on the calendar.

I do agree that it's crazy however, anyone who even attempts to push his views on all Pentecostal and Spirit filled believers is going too far. Most Pentcostals think Joyner is a rather "odd duck" if you catch my draft.

 

[AnandaHya]

By the way, Rick Joyner's ministry merely boasts of "signs and wonders". They see about as much authentic salvations and healing a year as the next average church. As I said, they are hyperspirituals. For them a faint draft in the room could blow the pages of a calendar that's hanging on the wall and they would believe an angel is trying to show them a specific date on the calendar.

I do agree that it's crazy however, anyone who even attempts to push his views on all Pentecostal and Spirit filled believers is going too far. Most Pentcostals think Joyner is a rather "odd duck" if you catch my draft.

yeah you can't demonize a whole demonination based upon the actions of one person claiming to be part of the group, he claims to be Christian but that has shown to not be Bible based through his fruit. God will judge him in the end but God tells us not to follow anyone teaching things that go against the Bible.

Prophecy is not about the FUTURE. It is about how to live day by day in OBEDIENCE to GOD through the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Why have even devote Christians forgotten the true meaning of Prophecy and think it speaks of the FUTURE?

Deuteronomy 18:9-14 (New King James Version)

Avoid Wicked Customs


9 “When you come into the land which the LORD your God is giving you, you shall not learn to follow the abominations of those nations. 10 There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, 11 or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. 12 For all who do these things are an abomination to the LORD, and because of these abominations the LORD your God drives them out from before you. 13 You shall be blameless before the LORD your God. 14 For these nations which you will dispossess listened to soothsayers and diviners; but as for you, the LORD your God has not appointed such for you.

2 Kings 21:5-7 (New King James Version)

5 And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD. 6 Also he made his son pass through the fire, practiced soothsaying, used witchcraft, and consulted spiritists and mediums. He did much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke Him to anger. 7 He even set a carved image of Asherah[a] that he had made, in the house of which the LORD had said to David and to Solomon his son, “In this house and in Jerusalem, which I have chosen out of all the tribes of Israel, I will put My name forever

 

[FireOnTheAltar]

yeah you can't demonize a whole demonination based upon the actions of one person claiming to be part of the group, he claims to be Christian but that has shown to not be Bible based through his fruit. God will judge him in the end but God tells us not to follow anyone teaching things that go against the Bible.

Prophecy is not about the FUTURE. It is about how to live day by day in OBEDIENCE to GOD through the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Why have even devote Christians forgotten the true meaning of Prophecy and think it speaks of the FUTURE?

Deuteronomy 18:9-14 (New King James Version)

Avoid Wicked Customs


9 “When you come into the land which the LORD your God is giving you, you shall not learn to follow the abominations of those nations. 10 There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, 11 or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. 12 For all who do these things are an abomination to the LORD, and because of these abominations the LORD your God drives them out from before you. 13 You shall be blameless before the LORD your God. 14 For these nations which you will dispossess listened to soothsayers and diviners; but as for you, the LORD your God has not appointed such for you.

2 Kings 21:5-7 (New King James Version)

5 And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD. 6 Also he made his son pass through the fire, practiced soothsaying, used witchcraft, and consulted spiritists and mediums. He did much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke Him to anger. 7 He even set a carved image of Asherah[a] that he had made, in the house of which the LORD had said to David and to Solomon his son, “In this house and in Jerusalem, which I have chosen out of all the tribes of Israel, I will put My name forever

Exactly. I'm not into the whole Chuck Pierce - Cindy Jacobs prophetic movement and if Zone lives in or around the Toronta area which has been a hub for hyperspiritualism over the last couple of decades, I can understand why she feels the way she does. However, it is my hope and prayer that she realizes that not all are like that, and that when we feel so strongly about an injustice that we have seen, while God may be calling us to sound the alarm, ultimately He is both the judge and the dispenser of justice not us.

There's huge difference in exposing a faulty belief or doctrine and attacking people. I applaud Zone for wanting to expose a doctrine that she feels is faulty. However, we shouldn't presume that everyone of a certain belief system has fallen for the lie. I have met some awesome people of God who believe in both Once Saved Always Saved and Calvinism, two belief systems I do not agree with at all. I've come to realize it is one's personal realationship with God not their theology which transforms lives.

 

[zone]

Exactly. I'm not into the whole Chuck Pierce - Cindy Jacobs prophetic movement and if Zone lives in or around the Toronta area which has been a hub for hyperspiritualism over the last couple of decades, I can understand why she feels the way she does. However, it is my hope and prayer that she realizes that not all are like that, and that when we feel so strongly about an injustice that we have seen, while God may be calling us to sound the alarm, ultimately He is both the judge and the dispenser of justice not us.

There's huge difference in exposing a faulty belief or doctrine and attacking people. I applaud Zone for wanting to expose a doctrine that she feels is faulty. However, we shouldn't presume that everyone of a certain belief system has fallen for the lie. I have met some awesome people of God who believe in both Once Saved Always Saved and Calvinism, two belief systems I do not agree with at all. I've come to realize it is one's personal realationship with God not their theology which transforms lives.

hey cool! thanks!
but.....anybody who calls thmselves an apostle, and says they have authority accordingly, or calls themselves a prophet through whom God is speaking is:

1) pretending in order to feel accepted (peer pressure)
2) demon possessed
3) outright lying
4) deceived by a wicked spirit.

so,,,,since its that serious, i'll keep posting attacking? what attacking?

Joyner's a devil. people who say amen and follow him around are duped. what attacking?
um.....this stuff has spread to almost all congregations: some refuse to let it in still....that's one i'm looking for: a good solid Lutheran or Reformed Covenant with lectionary, sacraments, real worship music....and GOD'S WORD...the gospel, too: every Sunday. no waving arms, no running around waving flags....nobody standing up to "give a word".....sigh.................suweet.

 

[silverwind]

hey cool! thanks!
but.....anybody who calls thmselves an apostle, and says they have authority accordingly, or calls themselves a prophet through whom God is speaking is:

1) pretending in order to feel accepted (peer pressure)
2) demon possessed
3) outright lying
4) deceived by a wicked spirit.

so,,,,since its that serious, i'll keep posting attacking? what attacking?

Joyner's a devil. people who say amen and follow him around are duped. what attacking?
um.....this stuff has spread to almost all congregations: some refuse to let it in still....that's one i'm looking for: a good solid Lutheran or Reformed Covenant with lectionary, sacraments, real worship music....and GOD'S WORD...the gospel, too: every Sunday. no waving arms, no running around waving flags....nobody standing up to "give a word".....sigh.................suweet.

Come to Cedar Grove Baptist Church we offer coffee Sunday mornings (_)^

 

[zone]

Come to Cedar Grove Baptist Church we offer coffee Sunday mornings (_)^

way cool.......does your church put their sermons online?
maybe i could listen to a couple.

i think i found a church for me north of hereEXCITED!

 

[silverwind]

way cool.......does your church put their sermons online?
maybe i could listen to a couple.

i think i found a church for me north of hereEXCITED!

they do, zone...
Cedar Grove Church
men's retreat this weekend, so i told my hubby to go.

glad you found a place, i hope it works out for you

 

[unclefester]

they do, zone...
Cedar Grove Church
men's retreat this weekend, so i told my hubby to go.

glad you found a place, i hope it works out for you

Lol....and he's telling his buddies......."I got the missus to think it was her idea". That's what we do ya know

 

[FireOnTheAltar]

BTW - Zone I have never professed to have any kind of "office" while God has used me to help pastor young people as well as to teach new believers, I'm not a fan of titles at all. I believe that any man who boasts to be some sort of Apostle then requires others "beneath" him to call him Apostle So & So has a problem with pride & a huge ego.

I personally believe that as we approach the end times, regardless of your view of the rapture, the way we do church today will change. Over the years churches have grown into huge organizations that operate like businesses rather than true churches. Lot's of money are funneled through these organizations and I believe as economies begin to fall in western society, governments will begin to change laws in order to tap into these religious money making machines. We will begin to see the rise of government controlled churches as you see in the far east. In turn, we will begin to see certain beliefs and / or factions outlawed and in the process Christians will face serious persecution. Superficial Christianity will begin to disappear as the dangers increase for true believers. Because of this churches will not only be forced to operate more like they did in the first century we will begin to see God move just as He did in those days because people will begin to rely on him more because they will not have the resources they have now at their disposal (regular paying jobs, health insurance, medical care, affordable food & housing, etc.).

In my eyes the modern church over all is a joke in light of scripture and, while see things somewhat differently, I can understand your frustration.

 

[silverwind]

Lol....and he's telling his buddies......."I got the missus to think it was her idea". That's what we do ya know

haha! actually it was his idea at first and then he backed out; so i said... nope you're going. No getting out of it now! I think men's retreats are a great opportunity to get away from the missus

 

[FireOnTheAltar]

haha! actually it was his idea at first and then he backed out; so i said... nope you're going. No getting out of it now! I think men's retreats are a great opportunity to get away from the missus

*lol* I hope he hid the credit cards! j/k