No trust in Creation...no trust in Genesis....no trust in Scriptures...

[Brother_J_BELGIUM]

You mean YOU say the Bible says that. It actually says nothing of the kind. Just consider the possibility that YOU might be wrong.

Literal days did not come into being before the fourth yom. So how could they be literal days? They are time periods of God.




But all life is not perfect even yet. Why should man's fall have affected the living creatures who had not sinned? Besides man had to 'subdue' the living creatures, which suggests that they were untamed. So the text itself destroys your argument. Your statement is judgmental and absurd. I am not an evolutionist, but I think you make claims that are unjustifiable. No wonder you disillusion people. And in my view your charge is blasphemous.

I suspect the Word of God is on my side in this. He had more sense and compassion than you have.




No one denies that, but in fact He did not. He chose to do things stage by stage on ANY VIEW



well actually it didn't always lol but I'll leave that for you to investigate.




There we can agree.



No one denies that God can do things in an instant. But He doesn't necessarily choose to do so. You will notice that He delayed some time before doing it. And He certainly took long enough giving Israel a chance.



I don't think any Christian denies God's creation. Some just deny YOUR view of it.



What a nonsensical and illogical comment. Who are you to tie God to your ideas? Jesus' ability to perform miracles had no logical connection with how God created human beings. It arose from Him being true God. Many godly Christians who believe that Genesis 1 TEACHES evolution demonstrate how wrong you are. They neither deny His power or His words. What they deny is YOUR words.

I'm sorry but you don't have a clue what you're talking about. So you're telling me that in Genesis 1 it is describing bacteria-to-man-evolution through millions of years? So, according to your view, Adam and Eve coming into existence is only after millions of years of evolution?

Well sir, I've got news for you. Jesus Christ says that when Adam and Eve were living, that was the beginning (creation week). Would you call a millions-of-years-old earth where Adam and Eve live on, "the beginning"?

Let's bring up the witnesses here:

Matthew 19
3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female?
7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.


What part of "from the beginning" do you not understand? It says "from the beginning", not "after ten thousand thousands of years". According to you, "from the beginning" means bacterial life in the sea. Clearly, the Bible states that from the beginning, he has made them male and female, not millions years later. From the beginning, on day six.

Checkmate.

 

[valiant]

I'm sorry but you don't have a clue what you're talking about. So you're telling me that in Genesis 1 it is describing bacteria-to-man-evolution through millions of years? So, according to your view, Adam and Eve coming into existence is only after millions of years of evolution?

Did I tell you that? I don't think so. You are simply jumping to false conclusions. I make no claims as to how old the world is. What I do know is ancient Hebrew, and what the text actually says.

Well sir, I've got news for you. Jesus Christ says that when Adam and Eve were living, that was the beginning (creation week). Would you call a millions-of-years-old earth where Adam and Eve live on, "the beginning"?

I wouldn't call a millions of years old earth more than one theory out of many. But you make a false use of 'in the beginning', He was referring to the beginning of mankind. So yes it was the beginning whenever it was.,

Let's bring up the witnesses here:

you mean the fool who doesn't know what I believe? LOL

]Matthew 19
3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female?
7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

Ye He is talking about the beginning of mankind. It could not be the LITERAL beginning of creation for man was not alive them, and there were no women to divorce.

What part of "from the beginning" do you not understand?

I think its you who has the problem of understanding. The meaning is quite plain, the beginning of mankind.

It says "from the beginning", not "after ten thousand thousands of years".

But it wasn't true from the beginning of creation. It was only true from the beginning of mankind. whenever that was. And even you place that six days after creation.

According to you, "from the beginning" means bacterial life in the sea.

I am not sure where you got that from LOL I don't talk like that. From the beginning in Jesus words meant from the beginning of mankind. If YOU sea bacterial life in the sea as the beginning of mankind that's your problem.

Clearly, the Bible states that from the beginning, he has made them male and female, not millions years later. From the beginning, on day six.

But yom 6, however you interpret it, was not the beginning. It means 'from the beginning of the making of mankind He made them male and female. You seem besotted with this idea of millions LOL

Checkmate.

LOL I think you are playing the wrong opponent. Who have you checkmated? God?

 

[JackRT]

Just so you are aware, GPS is based on a low earth orbit satellite network that covers the entire globe. It works just as well over oceanic regions as it does over land.

 

[Truthfinder55]

Just so you are aware, GPS is based on a low earth orbit satellite network that covers the entire globe. It works just as well over oceanic regions as it does over land.

Then why do they turn them off when they fly over the ocean

 

[tanach]

The basic point of the Creation account is as follows 1 Everything was created/originated from God 2 Mankind is seperated from God through sin. That is what we are supposed to believe. Getting hung up over the age of the earth, talking snakes and
where Cain got his wife from just causes confusion and division. as Lizathrose has said the account is written as an allegory
It would have been pointless for God to have written a scientific acount of it all because it would have taken centuries for anyone to understand it. In fact we still would probably scratching our heads today because for all our scietific knowledge there is a lot we are still discoverinf about the universe.

 

[flob]

if it's an allegory, then allegorize it.
Actually it is a reality allegory.
Just like real created things, the sun, the lamb,
the good land,
are themselves pictures of Christ. Everything in the OT,
written concerning Me, says the Lord in Lk.
Christ and the church

 

[Tintin]

The basic point of the Creation account is as follows 1 Everything was created/originated from God 2 Mankind is seperated from God through sin. That is what we are supposed to believe. Getting hung up over the age of the earth, talking snakes and
where Cain got his wife from just causes confusion and division. as Lizathrose has said the account is written as an allegory
It would have been pointless for God to have written a scientific acount of it all because it would have taken centuries for anyone to understand it. In fact we still would probably scratching our heads today because for all our scietific knowledge there is a lot we are still discoverinf about the universe.

You're agreeing with Lizathrose about Genesis? Dude, she's an atheist! Also, while the Bible isn't a science textbook, it certainly contains science facts. And it's absolutely important that it's historical. The Bible has no value if it's just some lardy-dar spiritual wisdom. God must also be concerned with the physical world in which we live. Don't give ground to those who don't believe in Christ.

 

[Brother_J_BELGIUM]

Did I tell you that? I don't think so. You are simply jumping to false conclusions. I make no claims as to how old the world is. What I do know is ancient Hebrew, and what the text actually says.



I wouldn't call a millions of years old earth more than one theory out of many. But you make a false use of 'in the beginning', He was referring to the beginning of mankind. So yes it was the beginning whenever it was.,



you mean the fool who doesn't know what I believe? LOL



Ye He is talking about the beginning of mankind. It could not be the LITERAL beginning of creation for man was not alive them, and there were no women to divorce.



I think its you who has the problem of understanding. The meaning is quite plain, the beginning of mankind.



But it wasn't true from the beginning of creation. It was only true from the beginning of mankind. whenever that was. And even you place that six days after creation.



I am not sure where you got that from LOL I don't talk like that. From the beginning in Jesus words meant from the beginning of mankind. If YOU sea bacterial life in the sea as the beginning of mankind that's your problem.



But yom 6, however you interpret it, was not the beginning. It means 'from the beginning of the making of mankind He made them male and female. You seem besotted with this idea of millions LOL



LOL I think you are playing the wrong opponent. Who have you checkmated? God?

Maybe you should take a look at this:


There doesn't have to be a sun to have day and night, because Scripture tells us that it became evening and then it was morning. What part of all the millions of years represents the day and what part represents the evening?

This is a really good article about the six literal days of creation:
https://answersingenesis.org/days-of-creation/could-god-really-have-created-everything-in-six-days/

 

[Brother_J_BELGIUM]

Maybe you should take a look at this:
View attachment 125118

There doesn't have to be a sun to have day and night, because Scripture tells us that it became evening and then it was morning. What part of all the millions of years represents the day and what part represents the evening?

This is a really good article about the six literal days of creation:
https://answersingenesis.org/days-of-creation/could-god-really-have-created-everything-in-six-days/

Once again, read very carefully:
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female?

He has made Adam and Eve at the beginning.

 

[p_rehbein]

I'm looking at the Poll results and can't believe what I am seeing there..........well, I can, but just can't ...... sigh

Has anyone even read John 3:16 with understanding? (by anyone, I mean the 11 that don't associate belief in Creation to belief in the One by Whom all things were created)

How does one profess to "believe in" Jesus Christ, BY WHOM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED, which is required for salvation, and not see that to deny Creation is part of believing in Him?

Weird

 

[Pottyone]

I'm looking at the Poll results and can't believe what I am seeing there..........well, I can, but just can't ...... sigh

Has anyone even read John 3:16 with understanding? (by anyone, I mean the 11 that don't associate belief in Creation to belief in the One by Whom all things were created)

How does one profess to "believe in" Jesus Christ, BY WHOM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED, which is required for salvation, and not see that to deny Creation is part of believing in Him?

Weird

I'm not sure if Truthfinder is actually just trying to wind us all up or not, it all seems a bit bizarre but it does actually. Pose an interesting concept.
so many Atheists and evolutionist types talk about creation as an unprovable myth and if they want to be dogmatic about it, since it is a one time unrepeatable event at which non of us where present we must then surely apply the same principles to evolution too. They talk about only believing what can be scientifically proven and yet I wonder upon what basis they actually believe that man landed on the moon. Could it not simply be an elaborate hoax, concocted up by those who want to perpetuate the myth. ( I don't subscribe to this theory myself).
afterall non of them were ever there and none of them have actually experienced being there and yet they excercise faith in those who say they have. They believe the TV pictures, they believe the testimonies of those who say they were there. They believe the results produced by machines which cannot be empirically tested by them to prove they are not false.....and yet they believe, because of the evidence....not the proof but the evidence......
why oh why then are so many unprepared to examine the evidence of intelligent design in the creation, where there is more evidence than there is for men on the moon?

 

[valiant]

I'm looking at the Poll results and can't believe what I am seeing there..........well, I can, but just can't ...... sigh

Has anyone even read John 3:16 with understanding? (by anyone, I mean the 11 that don't associate belief in Creation to belief in the One by Whom all things were created)

How does one profess to "believe in" Jesus Christ, BY WHOM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED, which is required for salvation, and not see that to deny Creation is part of believing in Him?

Weird

I think the poll results reflect the loaded question. that's why I don't take them seriously. it depends what you mean by 'creation'. many of the nos believe in creation but not in 7 literal day creation.

 

[valiant]

Maybe you should take a look at this:
View attachment 125118

There doesn't have to be a sun to have day and night, because Scripture tells us that it became evening and then it was morning. What part of all the millions of years represents the day and what part represents the evening?

This is a really good article about the six literal days of creation:
https://answersingenesis.org/days-of-creation/could-god-really-have-created-everything-in-six-days/

LOL you haven't even read what I said. all you prove yourself to be is an ignoramus. I'm afraid I'm not impressed by answersingenesis, I prefer to believe Genesis as it really is.

but sun determines the length of day and night. before the sun there was nothing to limit it. the suggestion that God simply chose to do it is pathetic in its folly

A creation can be 'very good' for what it is intended for, without being 'perfect' by our standards. Adam was appointed to rule the living creatures. Why? Because the NEEDED ruling.

 

[valiant]

Once again, read very carefully:
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female?

He has made Adam and Eve at the beginning.

yes at the beginning of mankind. He did not make them at the beginning. He made light at the beginning.

 

[Pottyone]

yes at the beginning of mankind. He did not make them at the beginning. He made light at the beginning.

I am not a believer in much of the evidence for a billions of years old earth however I'm not sure that the bible gives us a definitive answer on the age of the earth either.
for example, before Adam sinned and death entered the world was there any measure of the age of man....
we are not told any information about the length of time that Adam was on the earth walking in the garden with God in fellowship with Him, before the fall. As nothing was "ageing" or growing old, lifespan was not an issue for anything in God's unspoilt creation. It only became an issue after the fall. As in the age to come in eternity post The Second coming of Christ there will be no "time" so too prior to the fall of Adam, why would there be "time" as we understand it either? Was Adam not created into eternal life, only broken by the entry of sin into his life and that of creation too, which are all subject to Adams curse?
Perhaps Adam had walked with God in the garden for millennia before the fatal fall and all the associated degradation of creation? Perhaps? It's just that we don't know and maybe this accounts for some of the observed age of earthly objects?

 

[fredjames]

Recently I have been doing some street work with young folks and a constant theme with them, is that they are bombarded in school, college and the media in general ( see EVERY NATURAL HISTORY PROGRAM ON THE TV) with the theory that the world evolved. This leads them then to diss any idea of a creation based history of the world and therefore a disbelief in the book of Genesis as the truth of God's word. Once you compromise on Genesis, you compromise on the basic principles of our faith....sin entering the world as a result of man's disobedience, death as a result of sin, mans separation from God and the need for salvation, Satan as a reality, marriage between a man and a women etc.
In My opinion a rejection of creation is possibly Satan's greatest achievement and one which he has successfully propagated throughout history......
Many Christians state that A belief in Creation is not something to get too "worked up about" as it is not really a "salvation matter"......I beg to differ. It is possibly the biggest stumbling block to the non christians ability to see their need for Salvation ......
evolution is Satanic in origin and must be tackled everywhere it is encountered!!

First of all brethren, that is only their 'believe' based on only, as the saying goes, 'only scratch the surface', researched and knowledge 'theory' doctrine of men.

But 'ours brethren', is spiritually written and taught and is 'justified by faith', and 'faith in hearing the Word/CHRIST of GOD'.

Actually it is very 'simple' brethren, they do not have the beginning because they do not have GOD and would not listen to GOD and they are 'stuck' with only about the 'nature evolved and is evolving' since from a 'big bang', again based on only theory claims.

But in 'spiritual knowledge faith', we have the 'beginning', with GOD, SON and the HOLY SPIRIT, as written in the first chapter of Genesis, HE as the 'creator' of everything in the Heavens first, even HIS 'invisible spiritual government'. And then the earth and everything in it. And brethren, didn't HE upon seeing all of them HE created were 'Good', didn't HE not blessed them all according to their created nature, therefore naturally 'evolve on their own according to it;s kind', even all creatures?

Here is a 'hint', that mostly everything went 'bad' when 'mankind' and the 'fallen angels' perverted the naturally created things, not allowing them to 'evolve' according to it's kind, which was initially created to evolve naturally and ordained by GOD Himself from the beginning'. Doubting, ignoring and forgetting GOD, they 'intervene' and with 'fallen angels' have 'adulterated' many created thing's natural 'processes'.

They all refuse to 'start' from the 'basic' and HE is GOD, but rather with the aid of the fallen angels, go ahead and make a mess and cover up and make a mess again and cover up again and again and again and again and until now, with no heart of repentance yet.

But GOD is still 'hoping' or them to have a change of 'heart' to 'turn back' and make 'peace with HIM', before it is too late. That is why HE is asking those who 'believe', that;

"Who would go for me to preach and teach My unpopular Gospel still and lay down their lives?"

Or we rather 'prefer' to be like a bunch of 'prostitutes' having a evening tea party as gathered together and rather 'complain' about 'worldly things' and 'busybody their doings'?

As it is written;

"Ever learning and never come to the knowledge of the truth."

 

[Tintin]

First of all brethren, that is only their 'believe' based on only, as the saying goes, 'only scratch the surface', researched and knowledge 'theory' doctrine of men.

But 'ours brethren', is spiritually written and taught and is 'justified by faith', and 'faith in hearing the Word/CHRIST of GOD'.

Actually it is very 'simple' brethren, they do not have the beginning because they do not have GOD and would not listen to GOD and they are 'stuck' with only about the 'nature evolved and is evolving' since from a 'big bang', again based on only theory claims.

But in 'spiritual knowledge faith', we have the 'beginning', with GOD, SON and the HOLY SPIRIT, as written in the first chapter of Genesis, HE as the 'creator' of everything in the Heavens first, even HIS 'invisible spiritual government'. And then the earth and everything in it. And brethren, didn't HE upon seeing all of them HE created were 'Good', didn't HE not blessed them all according to their created nature, therefore naturally 'evolve on their own according to it;s kind', even all creatures?

Here is a 'hint', that mostly everything went 'bad' when 'mankind' and the 'fallen angels' perverted the naturally created things, not allowing them to 'evolve' according to it's kind, which was initially created to evolve naturally and ordained by GOD Himself from the beginning'. Doubting, ignoring and forgetting GOD, they 'intervene' and with 'fallen angels' have 'adulterated' many created thing's natural 'processes'.

They all refuse to 'start' from the 'basic' and HE is GOD, but rather with the aid of the fallen angels, go ahead and make a mess and cover up and make a mess again and cover up again and again and again and again and until now, with no heart of repentance yet.

But GOD is still 'hoping' or them to have a change of 'heart' to 'turn back' and make 'peace with HIM', before it is too late. That is why HE is asking those who 'believe', that;

"Who would go for me to preach and teach My unpopular Gospel still and lay down their lives?"

Or we rather 'prefer' to be like a bunch of 'prostitutes' having a evening tea party as gathered together and rather '*****' about 'worldly things' and 'busybody their doings'?

As it is written;

"Ever learning and never come to the knowledge of the truth."

Good gravy, Fred. You might want to do some research on creation and evolution before saying such things.

 

[valiant]

God's purpose in giving us Genesis 1 was to demonstrate that He had created and prepared the earth in readiness to receive living creatures and man (yoms 1-3), and then that He had set over it those who would rule it and use it.

Thus in yom 1 God created light and defined it as yom, and then in yom 4 God set rulers over light so as to determine the length of 'yoms' for mankind and living creatures. This in itself makes clear that God's yoms are not limited in time (they were unruled in an earthly sense). In yom 2 God prepared atmosphere and sea, and in yom 5 He populated atmosphere and sea, in yom 3 He made the land appear and provided vegetation, and in yom 6 He created life which would live on the land and partake of the vegetation. God's blessing of the living creatures and man in His own words resulted in their procreation. It is all presented in a carefully laid out pattern. The pattern is not to be overpressed. Birds and fish needed vegetation, and birds needed dry land. But the idea of God providing, and then establishing rule over, is clear.

Having matched everything up He then declared it 'very good' for its purpose. The purpose of the seventh yom was to indicate that all was completed. And there is no mention of its cessation. God's creative work was finished. There would be no eighth yom. This in itself confirms that we are not to see this as an earthly 'week'. It is in terms of God's yoms, unruled by earthly phenomena, carried out in accord with His purpose. It is not scientific. It is not mythical. It is practical.

Indeed the folly of trying to make it fit man's view of time is that we do know that time is not fixed except to those living on earth. When there was no earth it was not fixed. Time is totally different to any who move at the speed of light. God's yoms are His own length determined by Himself. They bear no relation to man's yoms. Thus to God a yom is as a thousand years, and a thousand years is as a yom. Thus it is as foolish to call a yom a 24 hour period, as it is to call it 1000 years. To God it is both and neither.

 

[Eva1218]

Yes satan is behind any and all confusion. The main objective satan has is to bring division, causing division regarding Truth and questioning what is truth. Once a person begans to question GOD's Truth. It opens them up to rely on their own understanding as well as giving satan access to flood their mind with nonsense. GOD Revealing to us how HE began Creating life as we know, goes against everything evolution. why in all these years has there never been another combustion? While everything is still bearing seed as GOD has so Creatively designed. One must first believe HE is Hebrews 11:6. The CREATOR Created Salvation.

Blessings!!!!!!!

 

[Eva1218]

Genesis 2:2 hasn't happened yet, and won't happen until Jesus Christ returns to end the Tribulation and begin the Millenium.
In other words, we are STILL in the 6th Day of Creation, which has lasted for MANY millions of years.
To believe that the universe is ONLY 6,000 years old, is ignorant nonsense.
God created the universe and He can take as long as He likes to make it evolve.

BTW - Genesis 2:2 states - ... and on the 7th Day, God rested.

This is speaking on GOD Creating. Everything that was made was made by HIM and for HIM. We are way past Genesis. Actually we are in Revelation. If we were still in Genesis we would not be waitingon JESUS 2nd Return but HIS 1st.

Blessings!!!!!!!