Not Associating with a Brother or Sister

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notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
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#21
The church except for me and maybe a couple of others does not know about her relationship issues. The pastor, leadership, etc. do not know. I do not feel it is my position to tell others; I would only do if it is a case of self harm or something legally criminal.
Nothing of this nature stays secret. It is probably more widely known that you think. What happens when she contracts a STD or becomes pregnant? How quite will it be at that time?

Is this how the unsaved in the community should see the church behave?

Christians are to be holy and chaste not fornicators and promiscuous.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Lucy-Pevensie

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2017
9,386
5,725
113
#22
The church except for me and maybe a couple of others does not know about her relationship issues. The pastor, leadership, etc. do not know. I do not feel it is my position to tell others; I would only do if it is a case of self harm or something legally criminal.
It depends how big the church is. Small town gossips can't thrive in big congregations.
I think you should be able to remain friends with the girl without condoning her wrong behaviour.
She might be heartbroken and/or wanting a right relationship as a wife more than anything.
You could perhaps, pray with her that God gives her the ability and opportunity to change her life.
 
Mar 16, 2021
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#23
The very premise that we should avoid interacting with someone who is acting sinful is not a Biblical or Christian response. Paul does talk about casting a sinful person out of the fellowship with the church. If we were to take that to its logical end that means ALL OF US would be removed from the church. No, the point here is when he tells us to treat such people as unbelievers. So, how do we as Christians treat unbelievers? We love them, we encourage them, we invite them into fellowship. Here is the point - we CANNOT know the exact situation that leads a person into sin. The girl that is being referred to above who easily falls into sexual relationships. WHY is this the case? Is it because she is just slutty? Maybe? is it because she has a hard heart? Maybe. But it could also be that she has been wounded in the past by a parent or family member or might be the victim of rape or might have terrible self-esteem and uses sex as a way to try to keep someone around because she things so badly about herself. And don't assume someone who looks like they have it together actually does. They could be hurting very badly and nobody knows. If we, as Christians, turn our backs on such a person and refuse to interact with them we could lead that person AWAY from Christ instead of restoring them. I see WAY too many churches throw around the idea of excommunication without truly understanding the impact on someone and that the basis of Christianity is love and to help people be better and get closer to God. We can't do that when we refuse to interact with them.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,188
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#24
hmm well
when it says such a one do not even eat with....is scripture referring to the Lord's supper or any kind of supper.

I think with sinful men its kind of easier to avoid eating with them, but sinful women might be the ones cooking the meal...?!
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,188
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#25
"Wisdom is better than weapons of war: but one sinner destroyeth much good." (Ecclesiastes 9:18)

Consider Israel.

Joshua chapter 7

[1] But the children of Israel committed a trespass in the accursed thing: for Achan, the son of Carmi, the son of Zabdi, the son of Zerah, of the tribe of Judah, took of the accursed thing: and the anger of the LORD was kindled against the children of Israel.
[2] And Joshua sent men from Jericho to Ai, which is beside Beth-aven, on the east side of Bethel, and spake unto them, saying, Go up and view the country. And the men went up and viewed Ai.
[3] And they returned to Joshua, and said unto him, Let not all the people go up; but let about two or three thousand men go up and smite Ai; and make not all the people to labour thither; for they are but few.
[4] So there went up thither of the people about three thousand men: and they fled before the men of Ai.
[5] And the men of Ai smote of them about thirty and six men: for they chased them from before the gate even unto Shebarim, and smote them in the going down: wherefore the hearts of the people melted, and became as water.
[6] And Joshua rent his clothes, and fell to the earth upon his face before the ark of the LORD until the eventide, he and the elders of Israel, and put dust upon their heads.
[7] And Joshua said, Alas, O Lord GOD, wherefore hast thou at all brought this people over Jordan, to deliver us into the hand of the Amorites, to destroy us? would to God we had been content, and dwelt on the other side Jordan!
[8] O Lord, what shall I say, when Israel turneth their backs before their enemies!
[9] For the Canaanites and all the inhabitants of the land shall hear of it, and shall environ us round, and cut off our name from the earth: and what wilt thou do unto thy great name?
[10] And the LORD said unto Joshua, Get thee up; wherefore liest thou thus upon thy face?
[11] Israel hath sinned, and they have also transgressed my covenant which I commanded them: for they have even taken of the accursed thing, and have also stolen, and dissembled also, and they have put it even among their own stuff.
[12] Therefore the children of Israel could not stand before their enemies, but turned their backs before their enemies, because they were accursed: neither will I be with you any more, except ye destroy the accursed from among you.

The nation of Israel was being defeated in battle BECAUSE OF THE SIN OF ONE INDIVIDUAL, and they didn't experience victory again until that one sinner was dealt with.

Again, "a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump" (I Cor. 5:6).

In my particular case, I gave the example of leaven (yeast) in pizza dough, and how just a "little leaven leaveneth the whole lump".

Have you ever baked bread, a cake, or cookies?

If you have, and if you've added "leaven" to the mix, then that is precisely what caused the bread, cake, or cookies to become "puffed up" (I Cor. 5:2).

"Puffed up" is not used in a positive light in scripture.

Instead, it's symbolic of PRIDE or whenever we exalt our own ways above God's ways.

Your entire church is quite possibly/probably suffering defeats because of the sins of members within the congregation which have not yet been repented of. These members need to be confronted. If they repent, then they can stay. If they don't repent, then they need to removed from the congregation until they do repent.

This isn't a game. It's a war.

As Christians, if we've truly partaken of Christ as our Passover lamb (I Cor. 5:7), then we need to "purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened" (I Cor. 5:7) or remove anything from our midst that is going to cause us to be "puffed up" (I Cor. 5:2) or PROUD in rebellion against God.

Unless we do the same, we can kiss victory in battle good-bye.
Im sure MOST people have done some baking at least once in their lifetime lol

If they havent maybe they just dont know how to bake and need to learn.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#26
Could you explain this?
What are we to judge?

We are told in Luke 6: 37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

Romans 12:9 tells us: Hate what is evil; cling to what is good". How can we do that if we don't first judge what is good and what is evil? So, we must make judgments about what is right and what is wrong so that we can live according to God's commands.

Conclusion then is that we need to listen to the Lord as the Lord tells us not to judge others, but still to be able to judge sin from righteousness. Even God who is our rightful judge allows us to choose our own way, loving us no matter what.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,131
3,689
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#27
What are we to judge?

We are told in Luke 6: 37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

Romans 12:9 tells us: Hate what is evil; cling to what is good". How can we do that if we don't first judge what is good and what is evil? So, we must make judgments about what is right and what is wrong so that we can live according to God's commands.

Conclusion then is that we need to listen to the Lord as the Lord tells us not to judge others, but still to be able to judge sin from righteousness. Even God who is our rightful judge allows us to choose our own way, loving us no matter what.
Looks like to me we are to judge the person according to his acts.

1 Corinthians 5
12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
 
Mar 16, 2021
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#28
It is funny how certain verses are pulled out of scripture which sustain a belief that isn't Biblical. The very idea' judge not lest you be judged' is true but, in context, does not mean that we as Christians aren't to judge. Christians are COMMANDED to judge. The 1 Corinthians 5 citation above is but one example of this fact. Do Christians judge because we are perfect? Not at all. We judge because we know the standard God calls us to. We fail all the time but through loving judgement we not only correct ourselves but are able to identify sin and lovingly work to intervene and help people step away from it. Luke 6:37-45 is another example where we see Christians admonished about judging. How can we who have a log in our own eye see clearly to remove the speck in our brothers eye. This verse does NOT tell us not to judge but to take stock of your own sin before you approach your brother to admonish them. Essentially, approach any such discussion with appropriate love and humility.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,430
6,707
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#29
We are to judge for ourselves what is right. The teaching, judge not lest you be judged, is in reference e to judgment to damnation. We are never to do this in this age.
 

EternalFire

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2019
659
352
63
#30
The church except for me and maybe a couple of others does not know about her relationship issues. The pastor, leadership, etc. do not know. I do not feel it is my position to tell others; I would only do if it is a case of self harm or something legally criminal.
I encourage you to meditate upon what James is communicating concerning the people in your church who are committing such evil deeds. It is way beyond self-harm what they are doing.

"My brothers and sisters, if one of you should wander from the truth and someone should bring that person back, remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of their way will save them from death and cover over a multitude of sins" (James 5:19-20).
 
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
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#31
One of my friends at church is sexually immoral, but she still comes to church every Sunday. The guy drops her off sometimes. She volunteers in a variety of ways in church and is very kind to the elderly. She meets guys online hoping for a long-term relationship/marriage but she ends up sleeping with the guy within a few dates and the relationship only lasts a few months. Once the relationship is over, she never fully breaks up with the guys either as they text eachother/"meet-up". Her grandma has repeatedly told her not to date trash. However, now her behavior doesn't faze me. I also remind her frequently she needs to stop. I don't think banning her from church is a good idea, since I believe she is still getting some positive influence from church.
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you are so very sweet and loving, hub and I love this about you - but,
dear one, we simply cannot allow such a one into a fold where our innocent children and naïve are subject to them -
if you think that you have a calling to teach or help', then of course find a way to help them, but you can NOT bring them
into The Church itself!!!
for it is written:
1COR. 6:9.
Know you not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the Kingdom of God? Be not deceived:
neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10.
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the Kingdom of God.
HEB. 5:14.
But strong meat belongs to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses
exercised to discern both good and evil.
our point is, no matter how much 'good you mix with 'evil, the evil is NEVER nullified, or put out of the picture,
it's THERE! and this is the basic 'lesson of the FALL', and partaking of the fruit of the 'TREE of good and evil'...
our job is to 'walk in The Light', and to not accept any kind of darkness into the FOLD!
for it is written:
GAL. 5:9.
A little leaven leavens the whole lump.