Not By Works

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Dec 12, 2013
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Name the person here who does not need Jesus?
ALL who say they have to help JESUS keep themselves saved.......either the emphasis is 100% upon Jesus, his work and his promises or it is not......and if not, MAN is glorified over JESUS.....good luck with that dogma.......
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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Romans 10:10-13
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

Psalms 51:10
10 Create in me a clean heart, O God,
And renew a steadfast spirit within me.

Philippians 4:4-7
4 Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I will say, rejoice!
5 Let your gentleness be known to all men. The Lord is at hand.
6 Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; 7 and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

AND as David, clearly points out, it is GOD doing it in us; we do not get to pat ourselves on the back for any of it.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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Unbelief is in fact the one thing that the power of God can not overcome. That's why so many people are going to be condemned on the Day of Wrath, not saved.
God's Power can overcome anything and everything. Unbelief is choosing to NOT to believe the obvious TRUTH.


Romans 1:19-22 (ESV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Claiming to be wise, they became fools,
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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ALL who say they have to help JESUS keep themselves saved.......either the emphasis is 100% upon Jesus, his work and his promises or it is not......and if not, MAN is glorified over JESUS.....good luck with that dogma.......

His work and Promises are to those that Love and obey Him.. those that believe unto the saving of their souls.. those that have been made new inside to by GOD's Grace to love as they are loved to forgive as they are forgiven.

Faith that worketh by love because GOD loved them first.

When a man does not believe takes hold of scripture he will read but not perceive until he seeks forgiveness and reconciliation with His Creator through Faith in the Son of GOD's Testament.

saints Keep the Commandments of GOD and Have the Testimony of Jesus.

Let us be doers of the Royal law as Taught by the Messiah... believe to be set free by the Truth.

Under Grace using our liberty to obey is following the Good Shepherd home to Heavenly Father.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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God's Power can overcome anything and everything. Unbelief is choosing to NOT to believe the obvious TRUTH.


Romans 1:19-22 (ESV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Claiming to be wise, they became fools,
His view that one can walk away or forfeit faith totally disregards and dismisses the fact that

a. JESUS begins our faith
b. JESUS FINISHES our FAITH
c. JESUS COPMPLETES the good work of faith he BEGAN IN US

IT states clearly that JESUS cannot FINISH what he started and or COMPLETE in us that GOOD WORK he began....it devalues and degrades the POWER and WORK of CHRIST....it makes him INEPT and FALSE in his promise to FINISH and COMPLETE it.....how can one be that BLIND to what they are actually saying when they say YOU can forfeit and walk away from the very GOD of heaven and what he PROMISES to FINISH and COMPLETE...
 
Dec 12, 2013
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His work and Promises are to those that Love and obey Him.. those that believe unto the saving of their souls.. those that have been made new inside to by GOD's Grace to love as they are loved to forgive as they are forgiven.

Faith that worketh by love because GOD loved them first.

When a man does not believe takes hold of scripture he will read but not perceive until he seeks forgiveness and reconciliation with His Creator through Faith in the Son of GOD's Testament.

saints Keep the Commandments of GOD and Have the Testimony of Jesus.

Let us be doers of the Royal law as Taught by the Messiah... believe to be set free by the Truth.

Under Grace using our liberty to obey is following the Good Shepherd home to Heavenly Father.
WRONG......it is not that we loved HIM but that HE LOVED US AND CALLED US WITH A HOLY CALLING....JESUS begins that work of faith in us before we ever level one ounce of LOVE toward GOD and the LOVE of GOD in us is a process of GROWTH and MATURITY.....NICE try, but your premise is wrong.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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Salvation is not free because it requires nothing at all. It is free in that it does not require works of righteousness to earn it. But believing is most certainly the requirement to receive the free gift of eternal life. If you do not satisfy that condition for the free gift you will most certainly lose what you had when you did believe.

. . .

Isn't it OBVIOUS that your theory CONTRADICTS what HE said in this portion of Scripture? :


Romans 5:15-21 (ESV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man’s trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And the free gift is not like the result of that one man’s sin. For the judgment following one trespass brought condemnation, but the free gift following many trespasses brought justification.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if, because of one man’s trespass, death reigned through that one man, much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
[SUP]21 [/SUP] so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Titus 3:4-7 (NIV)

[SUP]4 [/SUP] But when the kindness and love of God our Savior appeared,
[SUP]5 [/SUP] he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,
[SUP]6 [/SUP] whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.
 
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Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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Isn't it OBVIOUS that your theory CONTRADICTS what HE said in this portion of Scripture? :


Romans 5:15-21 (ESV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man’s trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And the free gift is not like the result of that one man’s sin. For the judgment following one trespass brought condemnation, but the free gift following many trespasses brought justification.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if, because of one man’s trespass, death reigned through that one man, much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
[SUP]21 [/SUP] so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Titus 3:4-7 (NIV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] But when the kindness and love of God our Savior appeared,
[SUP]5 [/SUP] he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,
[SUP]6 [/SUP] whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.
AMEN...par for the course with him.......
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
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I don't recall the book, chapter or verse but doesn't it say something like "WE love because HE FIRST loved US"? :)


WRONG......it is not that we loved HIM but that HE LOVED US AND CALLED US WITH A HOLY CALLING....JESUS begins that work of faith in us before we ever level one ounce of LOVE toward GOD and the LOVE of GOD in us is a process of GROWTH and MATURITY.....NICE try, but your premise is wrong.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
8,138
218
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WRONG......it is not that we loved HIM but that HE LOVED US AND CALLED US WITH A HOLY CALLING....JESUS begins that work of faith in us before we ever level one ounce of LOVE toward GOD and the LOVE of GOD in us is a process of GROWTH and MATURITY.....NICE try, but your premise is wrong.
Without the love of GOD I would not of been able to share that.. I know very well who does the saving.. a living witness to share the Everlasting Gospel. Your ignore the fact that we are sharing Faith in the Messiah and His Testimony that teaches works, to be perfect and righteous.. He Teaches us to Keep the Commandments He teaches us to Love GOD and each other. We are to be doers of His Royal law. And that is Faith that worketh by love.



All by the Grace of GOD.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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AMEN...par for the course with him.......
No, that is Triple boggy for every hole on the course, because Grace and Mercy is Par, and he is insisting he must ADD his STROKES TO THAT PERFECT PAR, too.

GRACE = RECEIVING WHAT WE DO NOT DESERVE.

MERCY = NOT RECEIVING WHAT WE DO DESERVE.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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I don't recall the book, chapter or verse but doesn't it say something like "WE love because HE FIRST loved US"? :)

1 John 4:19 (ESV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] We love because he first loved us.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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Psalm 32

King James Bible

1{A Psalm of David, Maschil.} Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.
2Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.
3When I kept silence, my bones waxed old through my roaring all the day long.
4For day and night thy hand was heavy upon me: my moisture is turned into the drought of summer. Selah.
5I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the LORD; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah.
6For this shall every one that is godly pray unto thee in a time when thou mayest be found: surely in the floods of great waters they shall not come nigh unto him.
7Thou art my hiding place; thou shalt preserve me from trouble; thou shalt compass me about with songs of deliverance. Selah.
8I will instruct thee and teach thee in the way which thou shalt go: I will guide thee with mine eye.
9Be ye not as the horse, or as the mule, which have no understanding: whose mouth must be held in with bit and bridle, lest they come near unto thee.
10Many sorrows shall be to the wicked: but he that trusteth in the LORD, mercy shall compass him about.
11Be glad in the LORD, and rejoice, ye righteous: and shout for joy, all ye that areupright in heart.




GOD Bless.
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
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Sorry to show y'all my old family pictures, there are more photo's albums on my profile.

1) Photo of my discharge papers called, "DD214", anyone in the military knows what that mean's, "freedom."
Plus Photo of our Division Patch and "Dog Tag" I lost one along the way, the military issues 2 tags to every soldier.

2) Plus a bonus photo of my wife and her family in Thailand, dear Mom is in the middle she is 78yrs old. And a Presidential award given to me for making it home from a war zone. It is called the Presidential Accommodation Metal and is given to all veteran's who finish their duty honorably, it is a common award to all vets, in a hostile war zone.

Oh and my wife is standing to the left of her Mom

God bless






 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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Without the love of GOD I would not of been able to share that.. I know very well who does the saving.. a living witness to share the Everlasting Gospel. Your ignore the fact that we are sharing Faith in the Messiah and His Testimony that teaches works, to be perfect and righteous.. He Teaches us to Keep the Commandments He teaches us to Love GOD and each other. We are to be doers of His Royal law. And that is Faith that worketh by love.



All by the Grace of GOD.
You missed the point......God called us, saved us eternally out of LOVE BEFORE we could LOVE HIM........
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,920
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TruthT, you don't have anything to prove to us regarding your military background. :)



Sorry to show y'all my old family pictures, there are more photo's albums on my profile.

1) Photo of my discharge papers called, "DD214", anyone in the military knows what that mean's, "freedom."
Plus Photo of our Division Patch and "Dog Tag" I lost one along the way, the military issues 2 tags to every soldier.

2) Plus a bonus photo of my wife and her family in Thailand, dear Mom is in the middle she is 78yrs old. And a Presidential award given to me for making it home from a war zone. It is called the Presidential Accommodation Metal and is given to all veteran's who finish their duty honorably, it is a common award to all vets, in a hostile war zone.

Oh and my wife is standing to the left of her Mom

God bless






 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
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0
Sorry to show y'all my old family pictures, there are more photo's albums on my profile.

1) Photo of my discharge papers called, "DD214", anyone in the military knows what that mean's, "freedom."
Plus Photo of our Division Patch and "Dog Tag" I lost one along the way, the military issues 2 tags to every soldier.

2) Plus a bonus photo of my wife and her family in Thailand, dear Mom is in the middle she is 78yrs old. And a Presidential award given to me for making it home from a war zone. It is called the Presidential Accommodation Metal and is given to all veteran's who finish their duty honorably, it is a common award to all vets, in a hostile war zone.

Oh and my wife is standing to the left of her Mom

God bless






You are a great guy, God bless you.

I knew a guy who had served in the marines in the UK and been invalided out. He had been in
a parachute accident on mission. Those types of things change you, because you see so much
that in civilian life are not there. My approach is to believe people rather than doubt them.

Hope you find the Lords rest through it all.
 
Feb 24, 2015
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WRONG......it is not that we loved HIM but that HE LOVED US AND CALLED US WITH A HOLY CALLING....JESUS begins that work of faith in us before we ever level one ounce of LOVE toward GOD and the LOVE of GOD in us is a process of GROWTH and MATURITY.....NICE try, but your premise is wrong.
This is so forceful. What foundation is this based on. You did not read what was written and are denying what
you agree with. If this is how you correct it is just presumption on your part without grace.
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
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Can someone please help me to understand this verse in relation to OSAS? 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.


My question is then, if a person is these things (a thief, a drunk, a fornicator, etc) will they inherit the kingdom of God? Now I know the immediate excuse is that a true genuine believer wouldn't be such things, but instead of using circular reasoning consider for a moment if a Christian were practicing these things. No difference between their old self and the new in Christ, are they simply receiving their free ticket to Heaven and staying as they were? Or is this evidence of a false conversion (how convenient an excuse)?

The point being, is it possible for a Christian to be these things and what is the consequence? Simply a loss of rewards at the Bema seat? How shameful such an existence, you would agree? Nevertheless, are we so sure that there is no out once in? Cannot a man have his name written in the Book of Life and choose to erase it? Regardless of how terrible a decision that is? I can already see the response, mind you, God wouldn't elect a person to be in the Book of Life who would then choose to erase their name. Sigh... give me scripture, show me the truth.

PS: No offense intended here, I am asking for help in understanding.