Not By Works

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gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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1st. Thessalonians 5 - 27 " I charge you before the Lord to have this letter read before all the brethren ".

that verse does not say " chop this letter into pieces and build theology around the pieces "

also note- " I charge you before the Lord " so, what you are doing is in direct violation of that .
 
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Hi MMD,
Thanks for posting your thoughts. For the sake of not making my return posts too long and hard to read I will break your post up into sections for ease of reading.
Originally Posted by LoveGodForever Hello MMD
Do you know the difference between the ceremonial and Levitical laws of Moses which were Shadows of things to come pointing to Jesus and God's Law (10 commandments) which is forever and what their purposes are?
MMD Replied:Yes I do know the difference. Colossians 2:16 - Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— 17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. So why are you so obsessed with the 10 commandments? You have not perfectly obeyed all 10 commandments and that is not the plan of salvation either.
I noticed you did not answer the question. Maybe I did not ask it correctly. What is the difference between the law of Moses and God’s Law (10 commandments) and what is the purpose between them? Scripture please………..
Also just wondering why you continue quoting Colossians 2:16 yet you offer no explanation of the scriptures I provide for you in post # 39356. Maybe you missed this post? I am still waiting for your reply in telling me how it is not correct in your view. If you have read it why in your view is it not correct? Let’s talk scripture I have plenty more to share……….
Originally Posted by LoveGodForever:I am asking because most of the scriptures you quote refer to the annual feast, others have no relevance to the Sabbath and some refer to the civil laws of Israel which ceased at the Roman occupation and the death of Christ and the beginning of the NC. MMD Replied: When God wanted to refer to the whole system of Jewish holy days, rather than name all them, He would refer to the yearly, monthly and weekly as representing the whole system. Sabbatarians argue that the Sabbath Day of Colossians 2:16 is the years Sabbaths. But yearly Sabbaths were already referred to in Colossians 2:16 as "festivals". The "Year, Month, Week" pattern is well established in the Old Testament, that Colossians 2:16 must refer to the weekly Sabbath. Even Galatians 4:10, following this pattern, states the weekly Sabbath.
Already addressed in post # 39356 which you have not replied to or maybe you missed it? If I missed something please let me know and we will discuss it further. I have much more to share on this topic.
 
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Originally Posted by LoveGodForever: Also, who according to God's Word is Israel in your view? MMD Replied: The nation of Israel, the Jews, which is obvious from these OT passages of Scripture that I quoted.
Well that interpretation is not according to God’s Word and there is no scripture to support your view. Let’s talk scripture……..
[FONT=&quot]Who are Israel according to God’s Word?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Israel" [/FONT][FONT=&quot]is only a name given by God himself to represent his people. It has its origin from Gen 32:28 where Jacob wrestled with the Angel and prevailed ...for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. Its meaning is his posterity will rule as God. Jacob had 12 sons representing the 12 tribes of Israel. This is God's people and today anyone who is following Jesus is part of God's spiritual Israel according to God's Word. The same New Covenant is written for God's people who are now spiritual Israel following. Scripture support;[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Let’s talk more scripture…………[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Let God be true and every man a liar that thou might be justified in thy sayings, and might overcome when thou art judged.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He says not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, and to thy seed, which is Christ[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now who is Abraham’s seed? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus and if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Galatians 3:28-29, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There is neither Jew nor Greek[/FONT][FONT=&quot], there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Colossians 3:11,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Where there is neither Greek nor Jew,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Romans 10:11-13,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For the scripture says, whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Romans 2:28-29, [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly;[/FONT][FONT=&quot] neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 31:33-4,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; after those days, says the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Heb 8:10-12,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Heb 10:14-17,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, this is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Gal 3:29, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The New Covenant is for Spiritual Israel which represent God’s followers the believers. If you are not part of spiritual Israel you are not part of the New Covenant (Heb 8:10-12). I believe God’s Word MMD, how about you?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
 
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Originally Posted by LoveGodForever: Also in your view are we free to steal, lie and commit adultery or break any other of God's commandment, according to your Church's teachings? If not why are you now free to break God's 4th commandment which is to Remember the Sabbath day to keep it Holy?
MMD Replied: Straw man argument. Obviously, we are not free to steal, lie and commit adultery or break any other of God's commandments under the New Covenant.
1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - James 5:12
4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3
I have already addressed this post in post # post # 39356. You have not replied to it as yet so I am guessing you have missed this post? I noticed that you have not answered any of my questions above either? Is it because you do not know the answers to my questions? I just ask for clarification as to help the conversation. Thanks in advance…….
In your church's teaching, is man saved through perfectly obeying ALL Ten Commandments (with a heavy emphasis of keeping the Sabbath?) Is that the "different" gospel you are peddling?
For me I follow no man, woman or Church. I only follow he who calls me. He is the Word of God and I know him and am known by him. He dwells in me and I in him. Without him I can do nothing but he in me does all things. I am a sinner but he is my Saviour because I reach out to touch the hem of his garment and by faith alone lay hold of His promises. Now I see him who first loved me. I heard the knocking at the door and opened to let him in. He sups with me and I am free to love him because he first loved me. He bids me come and I follow him. Now because I walk in His Spirit I am free to love all. I looked into the mirror and saw I was blind. I walk by faith and not by sight because narrow is the way and few there be that find it. The mirror shows the way for the blind to see. Many are called but few are chosen. If you have no mirror or your mirror is broken, how can you see the way? If there is no mirror, the blind will lead the blind and they will both fall into a ditch because they say they see. It is hard to kick against the pricks.

Who should we follow God or man?
 
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Jesus rose on the first day of the week not the Sabbath - Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:9. All 6 appearances of Jesus happen on two Sundays, none on Sabbath - Mark 16:9; Matthew 28:5-9; Luke 24:13-15; 24-34 24:33,36; John 20:19, 26. Christians are recorded assembling three times on Sunday after resurrection and before ascension, never on the Sabbath - John 20:19; 20:26 Acts 2:1. The only time Christians are recorded to have assembled together was on a Sunday in Acts 20:7, never does it say the disciples assembled on the Sabbath. The only day ever mentioned when Christians broke bread was on Sunday - Acts 20:7. Christians are commanded every Sunday to give into a common treasury of the church - 1 Corinthians 16:1-2. The church officially began on Pentecost Sunday - Acts 2:1. Jesus was crowned king on a Sunday - Acts 2:33-36. The disciples reception of the promise of the Father on Sunday - Acts 1:4-5; 2:1-4. The Holy Spirit first fell upon the apostles on a Sunday - Acts 2:1-4. The great "Triumphal entry" (also called Palm Sunday) happened on the first day - Luke 13:32. The time between the Lord's resurrection (sheaf waving day) and Pentecost was Sunday to Sunday counting of 50 days. The starting and stopping time was on the 1st day. First time Jesus worshiped after resurrection was on the first day by Thomas (John 20:26). The first time Jesus had communion after his resurrection with His disciples, was on a Sunday - Luke 24:1, 13, 28-35. Pentecost was a Sunday - Sunday duration of 50 days. The starting point and stopping point of counting the 50 days was a Sunday - Sunday period! While the Sabbath was significant to the Jews under the law, there is no significance of the Sabbath in connection with the Church under the New Covenant.
Well that is not true. The word Sabbath or Sabbaths is mentioned 172 times throughout the Bible; 60 of these are found in the New Testament. While the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] day Sabbath is mentioned 60 times in the New Testament, the first day of the week, Sunday, is mentioned only eight times! If Christ had changed the Sabbath day to Sunday, surely He or the apostles who followed in His steps would have explained the change.

Acts 13:14-15 show that the Apostle Paul was teaching in the synagogue on the Sabbath many years after Christ died. In verse 42, after Paul’s Sabbath sermon, many of the Jews who heard him became offended and left. But notice, “The Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath.” The Gentiles, those who had no prior knowledge of Sabbath observance, asked if Paul could come back the next Sabbath.

Notice what happened: “And the next Sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God” (verse 44). Why didn’t the Gentiles ask him to come back on the following Sunday? Because Paul, like Christ, kept the Sabbath.

Notice Acts 17:2: “And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three Sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures.” This is now 20 years after Christ died, and we see that it was still Paul’s custom to keep the Sabbath, just as it was Christ’s custom (Luke 4:16).

Over 10 years later, Paul wrote the epistle to the Hebrews. In the first few verses of chapter 4, after discussing the spiritual “rest” this world will enjoy after Jesus Christ returns, Paul then explains how our weekly Sabbath observance pictures that millennial rest. “There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God,” Paul wrote (verse 9). The Greek word for rest is sabbatismos, which simply means “keeping of the Sabbath.” Most Bible margins even point this out.

Had the seventh-day Sabbath been changed to Sunday, wouldn’t Paul have explained this to, of all people, the Hebrews in Judea? Instead, Paul reminded them that their weekly Sabbath observance was a very type of the millennial rest to come upon the entire world.

So in summary; your reasoning is that because Jesus appeared on Sunday and Christians met together for a meal on Sunday because Paul was leaving the next day that this means that God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] Day Sabbath is ABOLISHED and this means we are commanded by God to keep Sunday as a Holy day? Good luck with that excuse on the Day of judgement….

James 2:8-12
8, If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well: 9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. 10, For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. 11, For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law. 12, So speak you, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Originally Posted by LoveGodForever: Do you know how the Sabbath commandment was changed from Saturday to Sunday and who officially changed it? MMD Replied: Let me guess, the Roman Catholic church? I hear this all the time from SDA's. I didn't change it. My church did not change it and the Sabbath commandment with all it's rules and regulations was part of a covenant with Israel that is not applicable to Christians under the New Covenant (Colossians 2:16-17). I have talked scripture with you before, but unfortunately, you continue to twist the scriptures and the result is an unholy mixture of law and grace and a "different" gospel.
No you did not change God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment, the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] Day Sabbath to Sunday, neither did your Church. Your mother Church did however make the change and you follow your mother because as the mother so is the daughters (Rev 17:1-7).
If we follow the traditions and teachings of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9) Who should we follow God or man? The Word of God or the traditions and teachings of man?

He that says he knows him and does not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him…..

Who should we follow God or man?
 
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So as a non-Jew not under the law, please explain to me exactly how you keep the Sabbath day with all it's rules and regulations (Exodus 16:23; 31:12-18; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21; 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13).
Romans 2:28-29,
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Let’s look at your questions and scripture…………

Q. Please explain to me exactly how you keep the Sabbath day with all its rules and regulations
Exodus 16:23
And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, Tomorrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.

A. This is called the preparation day to prepare for God’s Sabbath day rest. It can start at the beginning of the week but many people use Friday as the preparation day before the Sabbath to do all shopping and cooking before the Sabbath start. The preparation for the Sabbath makes the Sabbath day a delight. The Sabbath starts at Friday sunset to Saturday sunset according to scripture (Genesis 1:5)

Exodus 31:12-18
12, And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 13, Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you. 14, Ye shall keep the Sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defiles it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. 15, Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. 16, wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the Sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. 17, it is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed. 18, And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

A. Wonderful scriptures. The Sabbath indeed is a sign that God’s people worship and follow the only true God of creation. It is a sign that we are His people and it shows the importance of God’s Sabbath. If someone is knowingly and wilfully breaking God’s Sabbath then they are cut off from His people. Just like anyone else that is practicing known sin because sin is the transgression of God’s Law (1 John 3:4; James 2:11; Romans 7:7). This is a perpetual covenant meaning that it is an everlasting covenant and like the rest of God’s Law which is the work of God v18 is forever (Ecclesiastes 3:14)

Exodus 35:3
You shall kindle no fire throughout your habitations upon the Sabbath day.
A. We do not kindle any fire in our habitations upon the Sabbath.

Leviticus 23:32
It shall be unto you a Sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your Sabbath.

A. This is talking about the annual Jewish festival of the Day of Atonement under the ceremonial laws of Moses (see earlier verses in Lev 23:27-28). This is not part of the 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment of God’s Law (Exodus 20:8-11) so not relevant to weekly Sabbath keeping.

Jeremiah 17:21
Thus says the LORD; Take heed to yourselves, and bear no burden on the Sabbath day, nor bring it in by the gates of Jerusalem;

A. Just as the scripture says we are to do no work on the Sabbath unless it is to help someone for a greater good through love as Jesus taught in the New Testament.

Jeremiah 19:30

A. There is no Jeremiah 19:30

Jeremiah 23:2-3
Therefore thus says the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; you have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, says the LORD. And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase.

A. This has nothing to do with God’s Sabbath

Numbers 15:32-36
32, And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the Sabbath day. 33, and they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. 34, and they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. 35, And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. 36, And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.

A. These death penalties were not unique to the Sabbath but to most of God’s 10 commandments and were a part of the civil laws of Moses to help teach God’s people that the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23) The same death penalty was given to anyone who was caught breaking 1[SUP]st[/SUP] . Commandment, Thou shalt have no other gods before me (Ex 20:3; Deut 17:1-5; 14:6-10; Exodus 22:20); 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] Commandment, Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any idols (Ex 20:4; Deut 27: 15); 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] Commandment, Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord in vain (Ex 20:7; Lev 24:16); 4[SUP]th[/SUP] yep; 5[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment and cursing there Mother and farther (Exodus 20:12; Exodus 21:15-17); 6[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment thou shalt not kill (Exodus 20: 13; Leviticus 24:17; Num. 35:31-33); 7[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment thou shalt not commit Adultery (Ex 20:14; Lev 20:10; John 8:3-5) etc. This ceased at during the time of Christ when Israel was under Roman law and at the death of Christ bringing in the NC. The death penalty is still in force for those that do not repent at the time of judgement (Romans 6:23; James 2:8-12)

Numbers 28:1-10

1, And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2, Command the children of Israel, and say unto them, My offering, and my bread for my sacrifices made by fire, for a sweet savour unto me, shall ye observe to offer unto me in their due season. 3, and thou shalt say unto them, this is the offering made by fire which ye shall offer unto the LORD; two lambs of the first year without spot day by day, for a continual burnt offering. 4, The one lamb shalt thou offer in the morning, and the other lamb shalt thou offer at even; 5, And a tenth part of an ephah of flour for a meat offering, mingled with the fourth part of an hin of beaten oil. 6, it is a continual burnt offering, which was ordained in Mount Sinai for a sweet savour, a sacrifice made by fire unto the LORD. 7, and the drink offering thereof shall be the fourth part of a hin for the one lamb: in the holy place shalt thou cause the strong wine to be poured unto the LORD for a drink offering. 8, And the other lamb shalt thou offer at even: as the meat offering of the morning, and as the drink offering thereof, thou shalt offer it, a sacrifice made by fire, of a sweet savour unto the LORD. 9, And on the Sabbath day two lambs of the first year without spot, and two tenth deals of flour for a meat offering, mingled with oil, and the drink offering thereof: 10, This is the burnt offering of every Sabbath, beside the continual burnt offering, and his drink offering.

A. All the above is not God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment from God’s Law it is part of the ceremonial laws of Moses referring to the annual festivals including the New Moon sabbaths and Holy convocations in relation to various sin offerings which were shadows pointing to Jesus and fulfilled at the cross (John 1:29; 36; Rev 7:17; 14:10; 15:3; 19:9 etc.) Please read whole Chapter for context. Not applicable

Numbers 29:39-40
39, These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts, beside your vows, and your freewill offerings, for your burnt offerings, and for your meat offerings, and for your drink offerings, and for your peace offerings. 40, And Moses told the children of Israel according to all that the LORD commanded Moses.

A. As above for Numbers 28:1-10. This is in reference to the ceremonial laws of Moses referring to the annual festivals including the New Moon sabbaths and Holy convocations in relation to various sin offerings which were shadows pointing to Jesus and fulfilled at the cross (John 1:29; 36; Rev 7:17; 14:10; 15:3; 19:9 etc.) Please read whole Chapter for context. Not applicable

I Chronicles. 23:30-31
31, And to offer all burnt sacrifices unto the LORD in the sabbaths, in the new moons, and on the set feasts, by number, according to the order commanded unto them, continually before the LORD: 32, And that they should keep the charge of the tabernacle of the congregation, and the charge of the holy place, and the charge of the sons of Aaron their brethren, in the service of the house of the LORD.

A. As above for Numbers 28 and 29. This is in reference to the ceremonial laws of Moses referring to the annual festivals including the New Moon sabbaths and Holy convocations in relation to various sin offerings which were shadows pointing to Jesus and fulfilled at the cross (John 1:29; 36; Rev 7:17; 14:10; 15:3; 19:9 etc.) Please read whole Chapter for context. Not applicable

2 Chronicles 31:2-4
2, And Hezekiah appointed the courses of the priests and the Levites after their courses, every man according to his service, the priests and Levites for burnt offerings and for peace offerings, to minister, and to give thanks, and to praise in the gates of the tents of the LORD. 3, He appointed also the king's portion of his substance for the burnt offerings, to wit, for the morning and evening burnt offerings, and the burnt offerings for the sabbaths, and for the new moons, and for the set feasts, as it is written in the law of the LORD. 4, Moreover he commanded the people that dwelt in Jerusalem to give the portion of the priests and the Levites, that they might be encouraged in the law of the LORD.

A. As above for Numbers 28 and 29 and Chronicles. This is in reference to the ceremonial laws of Moses referring to the annual festivals including the New Moon sabbaths and Holy convocations in relation to various sin offerings which were shadows pointing to Jesus and fulfilled at the cross (John 1:29; 36; Rev 7:17; 14:10; 15:3; 19:9 etc.) Please read whole Chapter for context. Not applicable

Isaiah 1:13-14
13, Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and Sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, 8 even the solemn meeting. 14, your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hates: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

A. As above for Numbers 28 and 29 and Chronicles. This is in reference to the ceremonial laws of Moses referring to the annual festivals including the New Moon sabbaths and Holy convocations in relation to various sin offerings which were shadows pointing to Jesus and fulfilled at the cross (John 1:29; 36; Rev 7:17; 14:10; 15:3; 19:9 etc.) Please read whole Chapter for context. Not applicable

So there we go answered all of your scriptures and no not one of them suggest that God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment is ABOLISHED today and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day.

Sunday worship is a teaching and tradition of man breaking the commandment of God. If we follow the traditions and teachings of man over the Word of God then the Word of God says we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9).

Who should we obey God or man?
 

crossnote

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LoveGodForever last 5 loooong posts were all done within 5 min. hmm
...and on the Sabbath to boot. LOL
 
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I see the self justified, working for, law pushers still fail to understand exactly what the law was for and how it jas been dealt with in Christ......keep laboring to enter and see where you end up!!
 
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No, it was made for the righteous, too:

"...from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 2:15-17 NASB)

What scriptures do you think he was talking about?
The law is for the lawless.........and the workers for, self saved, sinless perfectionists and all who believe they MUST KEEP THEMSELVES SAVED.....
 

Hizikyah

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Aug 25, 2013
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1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”
 

gb9

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Jan 18, 2011
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1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”
John goes on to explain in chapter 3 of the same letter that the command is " believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as he commanded us " v. 22-24 , that being 23.

so, John was not speaking of the Torah. so another Hebrew roots deception exposed.
 
Sep 6, 2014
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Isaiah 58:4-7
Behold, ye fast for strife and debate, and to smite with the fist of wickedness: ye shall not fast as ye do this day, to make your voice to be heard on high.
5Is it such a fast that I have chosen? a day for a man to afflict his soul? is it to bow down his head as a bulrush, and to spread sackcloth and ashes under him? wilt thou call this a fast, and an acceptable day to the LORD?
6Is not this the fast that I have chosen? to loose the bands of wickedness, to undo the heavy burdens, and to let the oppressed go free, and that ye break every yoke?
7Is it not to deal thy bread to the hungry, and that thou bring the poor that are cast out to thy house? when thou seest the naked, that thou cover him; and that thou hide not thyself from thine own flesh?

Romans 2:23

Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
 
Dec 12, 2013
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John goes on to explain in chapter 3 of the same letter that the command is " believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as he commanded us " v. 22-24 , that being 23.

so, John was not speaking of the Torah. so another Hebrew roots deception exposed.
Exactly......and one who is not really a Hebrew....in claim only to boot.......
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
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John goes on to explain in chapter 3 of the same letter that the command is " believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as he commanded us " v. 22-24 , that being 23.

so, John was not speaking of the Torah. so another Hebrew roots deception exposed.
So I dont have to obey Yahshua? Or are you isolating a single verse?

John 12:26, “26 Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”



John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."


Luke 6:46, "And why call Me; Ruler! Ruler! and do not the things which I say?"


Luke 11:28, But He said, “Blessed rather are those hearing the Word of Yah and watching over it!”


Luke 8:21, “And He answering, said to them, “My mother and My brothers are those who are hearing the Word of Yah and doing it.”

John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”


John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."


John/Yahanan 5:24, "Most certainly I tell you, he who hears my word, and believes him who sent me, has eternal life, and doesn't come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life."

Matthew 12:50, “For whoever does the desire of My Father who is in the heavens is My brother and sister and mother.”




John/Yahanan 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."


Revelation 22:12-15, "And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."


John/Yahanan 8:31, "...If you continue in My doctrine, then you are truly My disciples."





John/Yahanan 14:23, "Yahshua answered, and said to him: If a man loves Me, he will keep My teachings and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him."


John/Yahanan 14:16-21, “And I shall ask the Father, and He shall give you another Helper, to stay with you forever. the Spirit of the Truth, whom the world is unable to receive, because it does not see Him or know Him. But you know Him, for He stays with you and shall be in you. I shall not leave you orphans – I am coming to you. Yet a little while, and the world no longer sees Me, but you shall see Me, because I live, and you shall live. In that day you shall know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. He who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”


Mat 16:27, “For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His Malakim; and then He will reward every man according to his works.”


Mat 28:20, “Teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you. And lo, I am with you always, to the end of the age."


Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”


John/Yahanan 14:26, "But the Comforter – the Holy Spirit which YHWH will send in My Name will teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I (Yahshua/Jesus) have said to you."


John/Yahanan 6:63, "It is the Spirit that gives life; the flesh is useless. The words (Instructions) that I (Yahshua/Jesus) speak to you, they are Spirit, and they are life everlasting."



John/Yahanan 6:27, John 6:27, “Do not labor for the food that is perishing, but for the food that is remaining to everlasting life, which the Son of Aḏam shall give you, for the Father, Yah, has set His seal on Him.”


John/Yahanan 14:26, "But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you."

Mat 7:21-23, "Not everyone who says to Me; Teacher! Teacher! Will enter into the Kingdom of YHWH, but only he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day; Teacher! Teacher! Have we not prophesied in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and in Your Name performed many wonderful works? But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity."


iniquity” is word # G0458 - anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459, Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law, 1a) because ignorant of it, 1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness


Mat 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."



John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you."
 
P

PHart

Guest
I see the self justified, working for, law pushers still fail to understand exactly what the law was for and how it jas been dealt with in Christ......keep laboring to enter and see where you end up!!
They believe in Christ for justification. According to your OSAS doctrine, which you are sure is correct, they will end up in the kingdom regardless of their law keeping, and you will end up in the kingdom regardless of your lack of law keeping. So what's really bothering you about all this?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
They believe in Christ for justification. According to your OSAS doctrine they will end up in the kingdom regardless of their law keeping. And you will end up in the kingdom regardless of your lack of law keeping. So what's really bothering you about all this?

Neither they not DC will be able to keep the law as God requires. So they will both be "cursed" according to the law.

So who gets into heaven

Those trying to get their by obedience, or those trying to get their by faith in the promise of God.