Not By Works
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I think for me the issue is not to teach against sin per-se a blanket statement as such.
If a genuine believer really struggles with a sin (s) then we really need to get behind the reasons why.
I have walked with people who fall foul of the sins mentioned in in the NT, like fornicating.
Yes it's a sin.
If they hate it but can't break free of it, then there must be a reason.
But when we dig deeper we start to understand why they struggle with it and as a result it is difficult to yield and be close to God.
Healing is needed.
When that happens then we yield because we can, barriers are removed
If a genuine believer really struggles with a sin (s) then we really need to get behind the reasons why.
I have walked with people who fall foul of the sins mentioned in in the NT, like fornicating.
Yes it's a sin.
If they hate it but can't break free of it, then there must be a reason.
But when we dig deeper we start to understand why they struggle with it and as a result it is difficult to yield and be close to God.
Healing is needed.
When that happens then we yield because we can, barriers are removed
Hi Dave
What I believe about a born again believer having diificulty with a certain sin, is its idolatry. Sounds worse though than what it is. There's something in ones life that one cannot lay down. And what I believe happens, is that God lets us play in the mud until we are sick of it and want cleansed. It's brokenness that keeps one in the Lord, not our Do or die being strong.
When we experience the Lord, His mercy, love, forgiveness, it breaks that stubbornness, which is just rebellion, and its lasting. Seeing Him we become like Him.
Its also how we keep our first love.
Someone who thinks that christianity is just doing by rote, hasn't had a heart change. Religion.
Question, would not the one who says to forgive 70 x7, or as He states in the new commandment, to love others as He has loved us, be even more than what He asks of His creation? He forgave all sin ever committed by the world! Just asks us to believe and receive.
What I believe about a born again believer having diificulty with a certain sin, is its idolatry. Sounds worse though than what it is. There's something in ones life that one cannot lay down. And what I believe happens, is that God lets us play in the mud until we are sick of it and want cleansed. It's brokenness that keeps one in the Lord, not our Do or die being strong.
When we experience the Lord, His mercy, love, forgiveness, it breaks that stubbornness, which is just rebellion, and its lasting. Seeing Him we become like Him.
Its also how we keep our first love.
Someone who thinks that christianity is just doing by rote, hasn't had a heart change. Religion.
Question, would not the one who says to forgive 70 x7, or as He states in the new commandment, to love others as He has loved us, be even more than what He asks of His creation? He forgave all sin ever committed by the world! Just asks us to believe and receive.
I agree nice tune, I'm still crawling back to a normal life from my fall and making good progress, I'm still not able to post to much on "Not By Works." lately. Here's a sermon from Dwight L Moody that maybe some folks may like to read, and maybe VCO will be able to read this as well. Praying for his full recovery. Everybody loves a good sea story.....
[TABLE="class: tr-caption-container, align: center"]
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[TD="class: tr-caption"]Life Boats
[/TD]
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PULL FOR THE SHORE SAILOR
Sermon by: D.L. Moody
1837 - 1899
A vessel was wrecked off the shore. Eager eyes were watching and strong arms manned the life-boat. For hours they tried to reach that vessel through the great breakers that raged and foamed on the sand-bank, but it seemed impossible. The boat appeared to be leaving the crew to perish. But after a while the captain and sixteen men were taken off, and the vessel went down.
"When the life-boat came to you," said a friend, "did you expect it had brought some tools to repair your old ship?" "O, no," was the response; "she was a total wreck. Two of her masts were gone, and if we had stayed mending her, only a few minutes, we must have gone down, sir." "When once off the old wreck, and safe in the life-boat, what remained for you to do?" "Nothing, sir, but just to pull for the shore." "Glory, glory, hallelujah!" pull for the shore.
[TABLE="class: tr-caption-container"]
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[TD="align: center"]
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[TD="class: tr-caption, align: center"]Dwight Lyman Moody[/TD]
[/TR]
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Light in the darkness, sailor, day is at hand!
See o'er the foaming billows fair haven's land,
Drear was the voyage, sailor, now almost o'er,
Safe within the life-boat, sailor, pull for the shore.
Pull for the shore, sailor, pull for the shore!
Heed not the rolling waves, but bend to the oar;
Safe in the life-boat, sailor, cling to self no more!
Leave the poor old stranded wreck, and pull for the shore.
Trust in the life-boat, sailor, all else will fail,
Stronger the surges dash and fiercer the gale,
Heed not the stormy winds, though loudly they roar;
Watch the "bright morning star," and pull for the shore.
Bright gleams the morning, sailor, lift up thy eye;
Clouds and darkness disappearing, glory is nigh!
Safe in the life-boat, sailor, sing evermore;
I agree nice tune, I'm still crawling back to a normal life from my fall and making good progress, I'm still not able to post to much on "Not By Works." lately. Here's a sermon from Dwight L Moody that maybe some folks may like to read, and maybe VCO will be able to read this as well. Praying for his full recovery. Everybody loves a good sea story.....
[TABLE="class: tr-caption-container, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: tr-caption"]Life Boats
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Sermon by: D.L. Moody
1837 - 1899
A vessel was wrecked off the shore. Eager eyes were watching and strong arms manned the life-boat. For hours they tried to reach that vessel through the great breakers that raged and foamed on the sand-bank, but it seemed impossible. The boat appeared to be leaving the crew to perish. But after a while the captain and sixteen men were taken off, and the vessel went down.
"When the life-boat came to you," said a friend, "did you expect it had brought some tools to repair your old ship?" "O, no," was the response; "she was a total wreck. Two of her masts were gone, and if we had stayed mending her, only a few minutes, we must have gone down, sir." "When once off the old wreck, and safe in the life-boat, what remained for you to do?" "Nothing, sir, but just to pull for the shore." "Glory, glory, hallelujah!" pull for the shore.
[TABLE="class: tr-caption-container"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: tr-caption, align: center"]Dwight Lyman Moody[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Light in the darkness, sailor, day is at hand!
See o'er the foaming billows fair haven's land,
Drear was the voyage, sailor, now almost o'er,
Safe within the life-boat, sailor, pull for the shore.
Pull for the shore, sailor, pull for the shore!
Heed not the rolling waves, but bend to the oar;
Safe in the life-boat, sailor, cling to self no more!
Leave the poor old stranded wreck, and pull for the shore.
Trust in the life-boat, sailor, all else will fail,
Stronger the surges dash and fiercer the gale,
Heed not the stormy winds, though loudly they roar;
Watch the "bright morning star," and pull for the shore.
Bright gleams the morning, sailor, lift up thy eye;
Clouds and darkness disappearing, glory is nigh!
Safe in the life-boat, sailor, sing evermore;
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Thanks Preacher, VCO had a stroke last week and lost control of his speech which we are praying for a full recovery and I pinched my sciatic nerve after a fall in the shower. The no slip mat went one way and I went the other, poor construct of the mat I suppose. The Decon say's I need to stop doing back flips in the shower, hahahaha!...."I'm on the mend praise God!"
Appreciate your concern many thanks.
Appreciate your concern many thanks.
N
romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
__________
i bet this ones been posted 100 times
(._.')
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
__________
i bet this ones been posted 100 times
(._.')
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You seem to have a very harsh view of people who keep sinning after accepting Jesus. I suggest you take into consideration what Paul said in Romans. Especially starting at verse 14.
Romans 7
The Law and Sin
7 What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, produced in me every kind of coveting. For apart from the law, sin was dead. 9 Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. 10 I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. 11 For sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, deceived me, and through the commandment put me to death. 12 So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy, righteous and good.
13 Did that which is good, then, become death to me? By no means! Nevertheless, in order that sin might be recognized as sin, it used what is good to bring about my death, so that through the commandment sin might become utterly sinful.
14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.
Romans 7
The Law and Sin
7 What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, produced in me every kind of coveting. For apart from the law, sin was dead. 9 Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. 10 I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. 11 For sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, deceived me, and through the commandment put me to death. 12 So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy, righteous and good.
13 Did that which is good, then, become death to me? By no means! Nevertheless, in order that sin might be recognized as sin, it used what is good to bring about my death, so that through the commandment sin might become utterly sinful.
14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.
Soon enough for you? This is the first day that I have have my mind makes since to me. I don't want to push it though, because it still has a long ways to go. Still I have lot of vocabulary to work threw. So keep praying for me.
Thanks for all of you praying. Hopefully I will make a total recovery.
Thanks for all of you praying. Hopefully I will make a total recovery.
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I agree nice tune, I'm still crawling back to a normal life from my fall and making good progress, I'm still not able to post to much on "Not By Works." lately. Here's a sermon from Dwight L Moody that maybe some folks may like to read, and maybe VCO will be able to read this as well. Praying for his full recovery. Everybody loves a good sea story.....
[TABLE="class: tr-caption-container, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: tr-caption"]Life Boats[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
PULL FOR THE SHORE SAILOR
Sermon by: D.L. Moody
1837 - 1899
A vessel was wrecked off the shore. Eager eyes were watching and strong arms manned the life-boat. For hours they tried to reach that vessel through the great breakers that raged and foamed on the sand-bank, but it seemed impossible. The boat appeared to be leaving the crew to perish. But after a while the captain and sixteen men were taken off, and the vessel went down.
"When the life-boat came to you," said a friend, "did you expect it had brought some tools to repair your old ship?" "O, no," was the response; "she was a total wreck. Two of her masts were gone, and if we had stayed mending her, only a few minutes, we must have gone down, sir." "When once off the old wreck, and safe in the life-boat, what remained for you to do?" "Nothing, sir, but just to pull for the shore." "Glory, glory, hallelujah!" pull for the shore.
[TABLE="class: tr-caption-container"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: tr-caption, align: center"]Dwight Lyman Moody[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Light in the darkness, sailor, day is at hand!
See o'er the foaming billows fair haven's land,
Drear was the voyage, sailor, now almost o'er,
Safe within the life-boat, sailor, pull for the shore.
Pull for the shore, sailor, pull for the shore!
Heed not the rolling waves, but bend to the oar;
Safe in the life-boat, sailor, cling to self no more!
Leave the poor old stranded wreck, and pull for the shore.
Trust in the life-boat, sailor, all else will fail,
Stronger the surges dash and fiercer the gale,
Heed not the stormy winds, though loudly they roar;
Watch the "bright morning star," and pull for the shore.
Bright gleams the morning, sailor, lift up thy eye;
Clouds and darkness disappearing, glory is nigh!
Safe in the life-boat, sailor, sing evermore;
I am reading it slowly, but the at least it makes sense now. Keep up the prayers.
I am surprised that there are so many posts on this subject. To me it is as simple as: we have faith that Jesus is God's son, sent to earth to save mankind, and we need to show our faith by loving others enough to try to bring them to a belief, without being embarrassed by our God and saviour so that we can. Thereby: Faith in God and Jesus' salvation and faith shown by our brave faithful testimony equals SAVED BY FAITH ALONE.
