Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
please refrain , the last time we challenged this with John146, it turned into 20 pages of:

I know I am! but what are you?
Ah, I didn't know that - I can read the previous 20 pages - . . . . Ah, maybe tomorrow . . . !! :)
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
3,758
4,120
113
63
i love you so much rose...

i will pray you get good news
this world is definitely brighter with you in it



(just tried to rep you a secret message but i cant for 24 hours
:p im going to save it instead of pm)
Oh my little brother I love you sooooo much...As I was sitting in the waiting room, I was reading Timothy, do not know why, it was just where I nervously opened my pocket bible, and I read this verse, I am giving this to you right now because it is fitting...1 Timothy 4:12 [FONT=Arimo, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Don't let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in speech, in conduct, in love, in faith and in purity...[/FONT]

[FONT=Arimo, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I am not ashamed to adress how such a young brother in Christ brought an older women ( Young in the LORD ) to such peace yesterday though our pms...1 Thessalonians 5:11 [/FONT]Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing...

I read that and thought of you, you acted through love in the word, you spoke to me through Scripture and not your own throughts...May God bless you my brother, you are a prime example of how we should walk...xox...
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
1,386
54
48
BUT, NO WAY is the works of righteousness, considered as PART of Salvation, EVEN James understood that. It is PROOF that the Holy Spirit is at work in our lives, NOT AN ADDITION TO SALVATION.


Philippians 1:6 (HCSB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

Titus 3:5-7 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.


NOTICE that HE SAVED US is in the past tense.


John 10:27-30 (HCSB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
[SUP]28 [/SUP] I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.
[SUP]29 [/SUP] My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all. No one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.
[SUP]30 [/SUP] The Father and I are one.”
Hebrews 5:7-9 During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could SAVE HIM from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him

OUR LORD JESUS ALTHOUGH HE HAS THE POWER TO GIVE AND TAKE AWAY, WAS SAVED BY GOD WHO IS HIS FATHER.

IN THE SAME WAY, WE DO NOT SAVE OURSELVES BUT JESUS SAVES US THROUGH OUR FAITH AND WE RECEIVED THE HOLY SPIRIT.

DID SALVATION STOP THERE? NO! WE BECOME A PART OF HIS BODY(THE CHURCH) TO DO THE WORK OF SALVATION HE HAS BEGUN BY DOING THE WORK OF SPREADING THE GOSPEL AND DOING EVERYTHING HE HAS DONE OR IN OTHER WORDS WALKING AS HE DID. THESE ARE THE WORKS HE PREPARED IN ADVANCE FOR US TO DO.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are God’s workmanship, created IN Christ Jesus to do good works, which God PREPARED IN ADVANCE FOR US TO DO.

Ephesians 4:11-13 It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, TO PREPARE GOD’S PEOPLE FOR WORKS OF SERVICE, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.

Ephesians 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, OF WHICH HE IS THE SAVIOR.

John 14:12 I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I AM GOING TO THE FATHER.

1 Thessalonians 3:2 We sent Timothy, who is our brother and GOD’S FELLOW WORKER in spreading the gospel of Christ, to strengthen and encourage you in your faith,

Philippians 2:22 But you know that Timothy has proved himself, because as a son with his father he has served with me in the WORK OF THE GOSPEL.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS PERSONAL SALVATION OR PERSONAL SAVIOR BECAUSE IT’S SELFISH BUT THE TRUE MESSAGE OF THE CROSS IS SELFLESS LOVE.( eph 5:23, phil 2:1-11, 1 john 3:16-18)

2 John 1:6 And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.

1 John 3:23-24 And this is his command: TO BELIEVE in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and TO LOVE one another as he commanded us. Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

Romans 10:8-17 But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, “Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame.” For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And HOW CAN THEY HEAR WITHOUT SOMEONE PREACHING TO THEM? And HOW CAN THEY PREACH unless they are SENT? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!”
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
BUT, NO WAY is the works of righteousness, considered as PART of Salvation, EVEN James understood that. It is PROOF that the Holy Spirit is at work in our lives, NOT AN ADDITION TO SALVATION.


Philippians 1:6 (HCSB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

Titus 3:5-7 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.


NOTICE that HE SAVED US is in the past tense.


John 10:27-30 (HCSB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
[SUP]28 [/SUP] I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.
[SUP]29 [/SUP] My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all. No one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.
[SUP]30 [/SUP] The Father and I are one.”
Amen bro...
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
John 10:9, “I am the gate. Whoever enters through Me, he shall be saved, and shall go in and shall go out and find pasture.”

Mat 7:24-27, “Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine, and does them, shall be like a wise man who built his house on the rock, and the rain came down, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, and it did not fall, for it was founded on the rock. And everyone who hears these words of Mine, and does not do them, shall be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand, and the rain came down, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and they beat on that house, and it fell, and great was its fall.”

1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”

John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and
does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."

 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 12:17, “And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to fight with the remnant of her seed, those guarding the Commands of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]and possessing the Witness of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Messiah."[/FONT]
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
I am afraid for some, it looks easy, like its not that hard. Sadly, I hope they realise it is an impossible climb before its too late.
The reason Jesus called the prostlytes of the Pharisees two fold the children of hell is because not only did they have to get over the fact that they were lost sinners, but they also had to get over their false religion.....the implication is obvious....those who are immersed into a false way or religion have 2 things to get over <--two fold!!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
Please tell. What ARE those works you have done that have shown your faith?
Well.....I have a difficult time seeing it when one

a. Embellishes what people say
b. Changes what people say
c. Denies verb tense, context and scripture
d. Is less than honest about what is being said

etc.........
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 14:23, "Yahshua answered, and said to him: If a man loves Me, he will keep My teachings and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him."[/FONT]
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
Galatians 3:6-9King James Version (KJV)
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.


Romans 4King James Version (KJV)
4 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?

2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin




i think you need to reread james to understand the context....

post human has explained it to you already if you go back
There is another person who used to use the same statement....You probably did not mean to uae the word..........just saying
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
you are pointing your finger saying he doesnt let his light shine

you say i have no growth

but youre lying


so i pointed it out


please ralph

open your eyes
Good luck....even with eyes open when one is in darkness....they cannot see even with eyes open......!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
Sorry, I don't see these working in you. Your bearing false witness against others on here speaks much louder than your empty self praise above.
Somebody else used to boast and brag about all she has done and did......workers for.....I do this, I do that....blah blah blah
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
Is he talking about me again? I am not attacking him,,lol

He is the one attacking people. and that is WHY I have him on ignore.
I got tired of the incessant I save myself crapola because I have 72652636838474 works that prove it...the promise of eternal life given to all who believe is sufficient for me....I trust Jesus to keep his word
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
I just quoted what Paul said about the Pharisees and you rejected his words, along with Jesus and Jeremiah. Choosing instead to take one or two sentences from Paul and use them to make void the rest of the Bible. Why? Because just like the False preachers in Christ's time, the Bible exposes your religion as from man and not from God.

You can't take a couple of sentences from Paul, twist them, then use them to relegate the entire Bible as false and void.

God's Word: Regarding the Pharisees

(Jesus) "But in vain they do worship me, Teaching for Doctrines the Commandments of Men".

(Jesus) "For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders;"

(Jesus) "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do."

(Jesus) "My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves."

(Jesus) "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves."

(Jesus) Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?

(Jeremiah) Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.

(Paul) And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.

(Paul) Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

(Paul) And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

(Paul) Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

(Paul) For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

(Stephen) 51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers: Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.

(Jeremiah) A wonderful and horrible thing is committed in the land; The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?

(Pharisees) "We have a Law, and by our Law He must die"



Decon's word regarding the Pharisees: "Walking in all of God's Commandments, "Blameless".


I love the Salvation God created. We have millions of people like you and "many" of your friends who push some religious doctrine or religious franchise.

But I don't need a degree from "Moody Bible School", nor do I have to choose between one religion who transgresses the Commandments of God by their church traditions from another religion that transgresses the Commandments of God by their church traditions. I have only to "seek" Jesus and follow His instructions and He let's me know who are His and who are not. That is His Promise, and I believe in Him. And you are living proof that this promise is alive and well today.

What a great and merciful God.

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?

23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

So Decon, your preaching that the Pharisees were trying to "earn" salvation by following God's Instructions is a lie, a false teaching. The Bible exposes this lie over and over as I have demonstrated. Will you be corrected? Or will you continue to further what you have been shown is a deception? We will see.
Now you have sunk to lying like your working for buddies. ...try again pal.....and go back and read with understanding my statement was by Paul concerning Paul being blameless concerning the law.....man you guys push works and by your works prove that you are not living what you spew!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
Yep and I love you saying

"Maybe that person isn't really saved"

The emphasis for me is MAYBE.

We cannot judge what is going on in a person's life, what's in their hearts. What is causing them to stumble and not grow in Jesus.
It seems easier for some to write them off because such people 'quantify works and a level of works'
Yet they never desire to come alongside, walk with them, disciple them and pray for them.

If the person had no interest to change and become like Jesus, then leave them to it.
If the person does then it's time to walk the walk with them.
Amen and not to mention works of wood, hay, stubble, the prodigal, the Corinthian fornicator ect....God does not chastise the faithful....he only whips disobedient sons....!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
So you/we are saved as a result of the faith of Jesus and his obedience?

Just so you know I'm not trying to trip you up. I did read the verse you quoted and I found it, if memory serves me in YLT.
So a few pages back I asked questions concerning this and I can't recall any replies.

Can I ask you what do you think is the faith that Jesus had? I understand his obedience.

But your thoughts on his faith?
I replied......and used 4 scriptures employing the words faith and believe and how both are used in connection with salvation