Not By Works

[PeterJens]

No offence mate but your friend magenta says i should give you some approval... but i am struggling..

A question comes to mind. To know Christ to be in relationship with Him.
Now if one called this fellowship salvation, then using it this way makes sense.
The downside is until after the 2nd death we are not saved. You cannot be saved
from a future event, you can be reasonably certain you are saved from it.

Equally a relationship is always dependent on life, so it survives on this assumption.
As encourages one always says the positive, but if you sow to sin you will fall away.

If one believes a done deal to eternity, then security is safe, and in this view nothing can
break it, which means the language though arrogant reflects the theology.

Not surprisingly we question it!!!! Lol

 

[JIMBO43]

You slander those you do not like on a regular basis. I have witnessed it repeatedly. I don't believe you are as ignorant as you claim you are. Could I be wrong? Maybe I am wrong and you really are as ignorant as you claim to be. But honestly, you make stuff up and pass it off as your truth and now say you would know if you lied? Really just looks like another lie to me, a deliberate hiding of the truth to make yourself appear better than you are.

No I do not i simply share my spiritual knowledge.. This is what slanders them because they haventy seen what i have seen..

This is always something that people become envious of. I have been envious to and i was alwyas like why cant i see you God.. and then one i accepted That God is always there. and God bless you sister..may it rain and shine in your garden soon..

 

[Magenta]

No I do not i simply share my spiritual knowledge.. This is what slanders them because they haventy seen what i have seen..

This is always something that people become envious of. I have been envious to and i was alwyas like why cant i see you God.. and then one i accepted That God is always there. and God bless you sister..may it rain and shine in your garden soon..

More of your lies.

 

[JIMBO43]

A question comes to mind. To know Christ to be in relationship with Him.
Now if one called this fellowship salvation, then using it this way makes sense.
The downside is until after the 2nd death we are not saved. You cannot be saved
from a future event, you can be reasonably certain you are saved from it.

Equally a relationship is always dependent on life, so it survives on this assumption.
As encourages one always says the positive, but if you sow to sin you will fall away.

If one believes a done deal to eternity, then security is safe, and in this view nothing can
break it, which means the language though arrogant reflects the theology.

Not surprisingly we question it!!!! Lol

Hmmm indeed lol... Yes one can think that its a done deal if they know in there hearts they will keep the faith..

I have no problem with this but what i do have is a problem with... people say the done deal has come there way allready..

This to me is like easting dust. i spit it out.. coz i i want to hope for my daily salvation

 

[Grace777x70]

So coming back to the earlier position:

If repentance is required pre-salvation (as per John the Baptist and Jesus commands), and salvation is received through faith in Christ, then what becomes of a man who then changes his mind?

Some things cannot come from a change of mind after things have been put into being as an established truth.

Can someone by an "act of their will" or "changing their mind" un-born themselves from being a human being?

Can they one day say "I don't want to be a human anymore so I as an act of my will by changing my mind - I am un-borning myself" ( we would think there is something wrong with this person's mind and there is.. )

Can some one by "an act of their will" through the "changing of their mind" stop being a son/daughter to someone? Of course not - they will always be the child of their parents once they are born whether they like it or not.

We can no more by "an act of our will" un-born ourselves from God which Peter says we are born again of incorruptible seed which lives and abides forever. We cannot "un-child" ourselves from being God's child because of Jesus Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection.

( we can become sick in our minds as the person that wants to "un-born" themselves as a human but the real us - the inner man of the heart that is in Christ - that inner man has his will entwined with God's perfect will because of union with Christ )This is one of the reasons we need to "renew our mind" to align up with the spiritual truths that are in our new spirit in Christ.

Following God's commandments to us will be a natural result of being in Christ as we grow up in Him.

We are looking at what "we do" when we say that we lose salvation for going to heaven instead of what "Jesus has already done". It is a works-based doctrine that actually denies the work and grace of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Jesus said that the Holy Spirit would be with you and in you forever. Now, is Jesus a liar? That's a question to ask ourselves.

Our Father will perfect that which concerns us for it is He that is at work in us both to will and to do His good pleasure. I'll trust His love in us to "guide us" through life. Phil. 2:13

There is also discipline of the Lord ( child-training in Greek - not "un-childing" them as children ) This proves that we are legitimate children of God.

Philippians 1:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.

 

[JIMBO43]

More of your lies.

Ok well have your way i though i would just give ya some brotherly love..

as to seek your approval.. but obviously this pain of your is deep...

SOo as the saying goes i will only speak when im spoken to..

 

[slave]

* Anyone want some fresh purified water and freshly made popcorn? I just made it!" I just got here, are we all loving one another and discussing and discovering God together? Or are we still having some living out there prejudices, defending themselves loving God by way of the flesh? Some using human reasoning about heavenly spiritual matters? No, that's not our CC group, we all live by the intuitions of our spirit given to us by God Himself thru the Holy Spirit...right? Awesome ok, then here's the popcorn enjoy - careful it's hot! I'll go get the ice cold fresh water. ..... ...... .......

 

[BillG]

AMEN to that....the sin of unbelief......because SIN has already been dealt with............awesome truth!

AMEN AMEN AND AMEN.

I am almost doing a jig here, I say almost because those that I have asked that question have not responded with what you have answered.

That is all I have asked them, then said ok now let's take it further.

I think life experiences and dodgy theology that is taught cloud the truth.

We have spectacles that we can't see through. paradigms that need dealing with.

Thats how we read the word. We need to take of the glasses we have off and say "Jesus give us a new pair, one that can clearly see you"

With the wrong specs on we can't see.

I really struggled that God loved me, in fact he only loved me because he had to because of Jesus.

Thankfully he took those specs off and gave me new ones.

John 17:23
I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.

God loves me as much as he loves Jesus.

Anyone who doubts the love of God for you read the above.

HE LOVES YOU AS MUCH AS HE LOVES JESUS. YOU ARE SON/DAUGHER TO HIM AS JESUS IS HIS OWN CHILD.

I encourage all to seek God for his wisdom and knowledge, ask to replace clouded glasses with correct glasses

 

[Chris1975]

Chris,

Sorry mate but that did not answer my question

What is the conviction of sin that the Holy Spirit came to convict us off when Jesus went back to heaven.

If you can answer this then talk about your above post.

John 16
[SUP]9 [/SUP]of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

Not of unbelief, like you say. But of sin, because of unbelief. To believe is to stop sinning. Unbelief = continuance in sin.

 

[Magenta]

Ok well have your way i though i would just give ya some brotherly love..

as to seek your approval.. but obviously this pain of your is deep...

SOo as the saying goes i will only speak when im spoken to..

More of your lies. If your idea of brotherly love is to tell me I do not have a heart for God, keep your phony love to yourself. You lie and you lie and you lie some more but people see through it and tell the truth to your lies, and I praise God for them, and hope you stop your nonsense and learn to tell the truth soon.

 

[Grace777x70]

John 16
[SUP]9 [/SUP]of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

Not of unbelief, like you say. But of sin, because of unbelief. To believe is to stop sinning. Unbelief = continuance in sin.

I love those verses in John 16:8-9 but sometimes our religious church teachings have "hi-jacked" some words and they tend to take an a life of their own apart from the text itself.

The word " convict/reprove/convince/expose" in question has many meanings attached to it as well.

It is only used 1 time in KJV as "convict"....it is used more often with the word "to reprove/rebuke/convince/expose"...the word needs to be looked at in the "context" that it is used...

It is a revealing of things.....to the world the Holy Spirit reveals/convinces/expose their sin of unbelief in Jesus.

To the believer He reveals/convinces/expose that they are the righteousness of Christ because He went to the Father to stand as an Advocate.

John 16:8-10 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] "And He, when He comes, will convict the world ( unbelievers ) concerning sin and righteousness and judgment;

[SUP]9 [/SUP] concerning sin, because they ( unbelievers ) do not believe in Me;

[SUP]10 [/SUP] and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you ( believers ) no longer see Me;

1 John 2:1-2 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;

[SUP]2 [/SUP] and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.


Here are a few examples of the same exact word used in scripture...as one can clearly see....this word has many uses depending on the context.

1 Corinthians 14:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:

Titus 1:9 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

Matthew 18:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

John 8:46 (KJV)
[SUP]46 [/SUP] Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?

So, we can clearly seen the Greek word translated once in the KJV as "convict" really means to expose, reveal, convince people of something.

 

[BillG]

* Anyone want some fresh purified water and freshly made popcorn? I just made it!" I just got here, are we all loving one another and discussing and discovering God together? Or are we still having some living out there prejudices, defending themselves loving God by way of the flesh? Some using human reasoning about heavenly spiritual matters? No, that's not our CC group, we all live by the intuitions of our spirit given to us by God Himself thru the Holy Spirit...right? Awesome ok, then here's the popcorn enjoy - careful it's hot! I'll go get the ice cold fresh water. ..... ...... .......

Any chance of a coke and a Bakewell tart?

 

[Magenta]

Any chance of a coke and a Bakewell tart?

I just had breakfast, and when I went to pay bills at the bank, they had free scones! So I helped myself to a chocolate one, and ate it on the way home But thank you Dan, for your lovely offer

 

[BillG]

John 16
[SUP]9 [/SUP]of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

Not of unbelief, like you say. But of sin, because of unbelief. To believe is to stop sinning. Unbelief = continuance in sin.

Thanks for responding.

Not sure why you think I said "Not of unbelief" so if you can post my quote that led you to believe I was saying that then I can look at it and clarify.

It does seem like we are both saying the same thing though.

God bless you brother

 

[BillG]

I just had breakfast, and when I went to pay bills at the bank, they had free scones! So I helped myself to a chocolate one, and ate it on the way home But thank you Dan, for your lovely offer

Now can the lovely Magenta make/contrive a purple Bakewell tart?

 

[limey410]

Take Up the Cross and Follow Him

[SUP]23 [/SUP]Then He said to them all, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily,[SUP][a][/SUP] and follow Me.

Jesus said that. So I don't think the concept stinks to Him.

How is that Christ being crucified daily?

 

[dcontroversal]

John 16
[SUP]9 [/SUP]of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

Not of unbelief, like you say. But of sin, because of unbelief. To believe is to stop sinning. Unbelief = continuance in sin.

One of the biggest embellishments and denials of simple verbiage here..wow....this takes the cake for contrdictions...

NOT OF UNBELIEF LIKE YOU SAY hahahaha wow....

of SIN, BECAUSE THEY DO NOT BELIEVE IN ME<----ONE WHO DOES NOT BELIEVE THEY CANNOT BE FORGIVEN AND SAVED....wow.....

I have seen a new low to push a sinless working for dogma here!

 

[JIMBO43]

More of your lies. If your idea of brotherly love is to tell me I do not have a heart for God, keep your phony love to yourself. You lie and you lie and you lie some more but people see through it and tell the truth to your lies, and I praise God for them, and hope you stop your nonsense and learn to tell the truth soon.

i agrre with this that nobody should tell a sister this... and where have i said that to you... or is it you think i implied you have.. ?

However if i have made you feel like this i do apolagize.. and please stop calling me a liar its just insuting as bullies use to call me a liar and it opens up my trauma..

 

[limey410]

AMEN to that....the sin of unbelief......because SIN has already been dealt with............awesome truth!

YES. Unbelief that Christ actually did what He said He came to do, died for the forgiveness of sin, and then invoked the New Covenant by His resurrection, so that we could live after we are resurrected by His gift of the Spirit.

The sin issue has been resolved. God can now have an individual personal relationship with us. When you go back and focus on your sin, you are not focused on your life in Christ, a life in which God truly loves us, and does not hold our sin against us (by His choice and action, not ours).

Reduction of sin is a side effect of that relationship, not the primary focus.

 

[Magenta]

Now can the lovely Magenta make/contrive a purple Bakewell tart?

I can post a picture of one