Not By Works

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Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
33,975
11,730
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Yes another life changing creation from Magenta. It has been years since I recall my battle with the bottle and the only reason I can even talk about this today is because Jesus my Savior won the battle.

And this is the miracle folks; Quote: "He Jesus has commenced to accomplish those things for us which we could never do by ourselves."

Thank you and God bless!

Thank you TruthTalk, and you are welcome! It has been many years for me also. In fact, I am coming up to eight years again... because I relapsed a number of times after my first eight years, the first time in 2002. I originally got clean in 1994 after crying out to God for help... the God I did not believe in at the time. Within days I was clean after 24 years of drug and alcohol abuse. Self abuse. Running from God. I had been going to AA and another 12 step program for years, to listen to people speak the truth, putting into words for me the things I could not articulate for myself. Then started working the steps for real. The whole purpose of the 12 step programs is to help people develop and maintain a personal relationship with God :) I am so grateful that God allowed to me to survive the stupidity of my youth :D



God bless you and yours, also :)
 

Suzy37

Active member
Nov 20, 2018
208
42
28
You are wrong about Abraham, the GOOD WORKS Abraham did, was BELIEVING THAT GOD Could Raise Up Issac OR provide a Substitute Sacrifice, (a picture Type of the Messiah).

Romans 4:17 (GW)
17 as Scripture says: “I have made you a father of many nations.” Abraham believed when he stood in the presence of the God who gives life to dead people and calls into existence things that don't even exist.

Hebrews 11:19 (GW)
19 Abraham believed that God could bring Isaac back from the dead. Abraham did receive Isaac back from the dead in a figurative sense.


You are crediting the perceived WORKS, and it is the FAITH OF ABRAHAM that is counted as Righteousness.[/QUOTE

VCO

it is of course both , faith and works, takes both. James tells us faith without works is dead. We show our faith by our works!
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,259
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Thank you TruthTalk, and you are welcome! It has been many years for me also. In fact, I am coming up to eight years again... because I relapsed a number of times after my first eight years, the first time in 2002. I originally got clean in 1994 after crying out to God for help... the God I did not believe in at the time. Within days I was clean after 24 years of drug and alcohol abuse. Self abuse. Running from God. I had been going to AA and another 12 step program for years, to listen to people speak the truth, putting into words for me the things I could not articulate for myself. Then started working the steps for real. The whole purpose of the 12 step programs is to help people develop and maintain a personal relationship with God :) I am so grateful that God allowed to me to survive the stupidity of my youth :D



God bless you and yours, also :)
And thank you Magenta, during my time at AA my first day, as a matter of fact, I had to borrow the cash from a member to purchase the "Big Book" which I read. I came to the first meeting coming down from a high from the previous days/weeks and forgot to bring some cash. When I found out that it was beneficial to have a sponsor to help you work through the AA program I did so.

Clean and sober for me is 15yrs. My wife made me choose between the booze and getting married. Deep inside my soul I kept hearing my conscious telling me your gonna kill yourself if you do not do something about this terrible habit. I worked a solo job and was able to hide my drunken state in the day time or so I thought. Very happily married 16yrs next February 28th which is also my lovely wife's birthday.

Doing my life sober and committed to Jesus praise God.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
33,975
11,730
113
And thank you Magenta, during my time at AA my first day, as a matter of fact, I had to borrow the cash from a member to purchase the "Big Book" which I read. I came to the first meeting coming down from a high from the previous days/weeks and forgot to bring some cash. When I found out that it was beneficial to have a sponsor to help you work through the AA program I did so.

Clean and sober for me is 15yrs. My wife made me choose between the booze and getting married. Deep inside my soul I kept hearing my conscious telling me your gonna kill yourself if you do not do something about this terrible habit. I worked a solo job and was able to hide my drunken state in the day time or so I thought. Very happily married 16yrs next Febuary 28th also my lovely wife's birthday.

Doing my life sober and committed to Jesus praise God.
Thank you for sharing TruthTalk, God is so good! Hey, your wife's birthday is the day after mine ;) Sixteen years of blessings, I am happy for you! :D:):):)
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
And thank you Magenta, during my time at AA my first day, as a matter of fact, I had to borrow the cash from a member to purchase the "Big Book" which I read. I came to the first meeting coming down from a high from the previous days/weeks and forgot to bring some cash. When I found out that it was beneficial to have a sponsor to help you work through the AA program I did so.

Clean and sober for me is 15yrs. My wife made me choose between the booze and getting married. Deep inside my soul I kept hearing my conscious telling me your gonna kill yourself if you do not do something about this terrible habit. I worked a solo job and was able to hide my drunken state in the day time or so I thought. Very happily married 16yrs next February 28th which is also my lovely wife's birthday.

Doing my life sober and committed to Jesus praise God.

3rd step : "made a decision to turn our life and will over to the care of God , as we understood Him ."

Pisteuo or how faith in relation to God is defined in the Vines Greek dictionary : "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender ."

Any lights going on yet ?
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,259
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3rd step : "made a decision to turn our life and will over to the care of God , as we understood Him ."

Pisteuo or how faith in relation to God is defined in the Vines Greek dictionary : "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender ."

Any lights going on yet ? (Nope)
Listen dear forum anybody who comes along selling a different gospel, a different Christ, do not listen to them or you can chose like me and just put them on Ignore especially if they keep pestering you.

Bye Bye Mr "faithing" false gospel guy off to "Iggyville" for you, "Lights out for you"
 
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Pisteuo

Guest
Listen dear forum anybody who comes along selling a different gospel, a different Christ, do not listen to them or you can chose like me and just put them on Ignore especially if they keep pestering you.

Bye Bye Mr "faithing" false gospel guy off to "Iggyville" for you, "Lights out for you"
Bye !
 

Suzy37

Active member
Nov 20, 2018
208
42
28
Hello forum I have a question to ask everyone but please do not take this personally;

Is anyone here bothered by long and tedious unbroken paragraphs? Personally it hurts my eyes to trudge through these commentaries. And oh yes almost forgot isn't the worst font of all to read through written in "italics" I mean the whole page written that way, just kills the eye sight don't you agree.

God bless!
Yes , I have been trying to figure out a way of emphasizing a point instead of bold letters which is what I usually do but it seems to be frowned on here. Sometimes italics work but not all the time. I am experimenting so still working on it,
 
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Pisteuo

Guest
Im very fortunate to have been taught at a Stanford University level by a teachers teacher for over 33 years.

The very first thing that he would teach , first day of school , is that pisteuo could not be translated into the English language . And that the words believe , believer , and believing , are mistranslations . It had to be the first thing understood by a student to correctly interpret Scripture . Seeing pisteuo is used 248 times in the NT , it's vital that the students are aware of this or they could end up building an incorrect understanding on those mistranslations . We see this all to often . If this is not understood at the beginning , it seems there's no turning back for those who no fault of their own have been decieved .
 
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Pisteuo

Guest
Pisteuo , the verb form of the noun Faith , is action , based upon a belief , sustained by confidence .

We perform 100 's of acts of faithing or pisteuo every day that have nothing to do with our relationship with Christ . What is the specific act of pisteuo in relation to the living God ? " A personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender ."

Anyone who thinks this can be done without work or effort , had no chance to have that personal relationship with Christ .

The Greek did not allow work or effort to be separated from pisteuo or the application of Faith .
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,619
3,896
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Im very fortunate to have been taught at a Stanford University level by a teachers teacher for over 33 years.

The very first thing that he would teach , first day of school , is that pisteuo could not be translated into the English language . And that the words believe , believer , and believing , are mistranslations . It had to be the first thing understood by a student to correctly interpret Scripture . Seeing pisteuo is used 248 times in the NT , it's vital that the students are aware of this or they could end up building an incorrect understanding on those mistranslations . We see this all to often . If this is not understood at the beginning , it seems there's no turning back for those who no fault of their own have been decieved .
I would not brag about the ultra Leftist Standford Professors if I was you.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,619
3,896
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Jesus contradicts you saying when you are born of the spirit you will have a spirit body! the scripture in Jhn 5 says whatever is born of God overcometh the world, that time is not here yet. these scriptues do not mean what you think !You are still flesh and blood just like we all are .The resurrection has not occured yet!

Now if you want to prove you have a spirit body then you can fly ovrr here and show me, then I will belive in being born again in this mortal flesh. A Christan at conversion and receiving the HS is begotten of God, then he grows and overcomes and when he dies and is resurrected he will have a spirit body.Then he will have overcome the world, Satan and His human nature thru Gods power

I received a BORN AGAIN human spirit, after I repented and RECEIVED HIM AS LORD, meaning Master, after 3 attempts at suicide the last week of 1977.

I KNEW HE had CHANGED ME on the inside, I felt the HUNGER in my Heart to understand HIS WORD, and it was like having 2 minds, ONE between my ears and the OTHER ONE was the spiritual Mind in my HEART, and I never felt it before. My spiritual mind was always wanting to do what was Pleasing to my LORD, and my mortal mind kept getting in the way. My human spirit grew leaps and bounds, when I started feeding on the WORD, and eventually the spiritual mind became dominant. Am I sinless? NO! But with my spiritual mind being dominant, is it much easier than it used to be to not give in to my sin nature.

There are Three parts to a human being, but the human spirit was spiritually dead from natural birth and IT HAD TO BE BIRTHED into ETERNAL LIFE, by the The Holy Spirit. NO ONE CAN EVER CONVINCE ME THAT IT WAS NOT REAL.

1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 (NASB)
23 Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 Faithful is He who calls you, and He also will bring it to pass.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
29,629
9,511
113
Hello forum I have a question to ask everyone but please do not take this personally;

Is anyone here bothered by long and tedious unbroken paragraphs? Personally it hurts my eyes to trudge through these commentaries. And oh yes almost forgot isn't the worst font of all to read through written in "italics" I mean the whole page written that way, just kills the eye sight don't you agree.

God bless!
yes

that's why i often skip lines between sentences; i think it's easier to read - plus it indicates a pause between thoughts. having an art background, i've always had in mind at least in some form or other, the thought to pay attention to the visual composition of my posts. taking time to indent scripture, to color quotes in some regular way, choosing a font that's pleasing to the eye & readable. and some years ago on the forum, someone who was getting on in years asked me one day if i could maybe upsize the text in what i wrote, because their eyes had grown weak with age, and they had an hard time reading it, but they ((surprise to me)) considered it valuable to see just what i had to say.

so from then, i started paying more attention to trying to things like walls of text, small print, jumbles of italic or underlined text, etc. my wife laughs at me sometimes seeing me put a lot of effort into a long post with many scripture quotes, because i'm carefully changing colors and indenting and making sure everything is spaced well -- to me it's a labor of love. to respect, especially, my elders in years here, for whom i may only be able to do a little thing like break apart paragraphs and use a large, readable font.

i'm blessed with sharp eyes, myself. for now. i can tell already they aren't as sharp as they once were, and i'm only now middle-aged. but i do love you all, even those of you i argue with often. though i'm not good at showing it - my nicely-formatted posts? if they can be called that haha - they are an expression of love to you, just a small one, you may not even notice :)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
29,629
9,511
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Yes! on these two laws hang all the other , they contain the 10 Commandments as I just said ,love to God and neighbor, as long as we realize that and not try to ignore the ten that's true ! The whole Bible is written around those Ten Commandments!
if all the law hangs on love God and love your neighbor, then the whole Bible is written around those 2 ((neither of which are in Exodus 20)) not those 10 that all hang on those 2.
it's like you've said,
yes! B and 1 are the foundation floors of the whole building! so the whole building is built around floors 10 through 20! -- but Suzy, you just said the foundation is the other two! it's the foundation of all the law, the 10 commandments included.

but the whole Bible is built around one thing, which isn't a law or regulation at all: the revelation of the person of God to man - it's all about Jesus Christ. to know Him - which is to love Him, and to love Him is also to through Him, love one another.
 

Suzy37

Active member
Nov 20, 2018
208
42
28
if all the law hangs on love God and love your neighbor, then the whole Bible is written around those 2 ((neither of which are in Exodus 20)) not those 10 that all hang on those 2.
it's like you've said,
yes! B and 1 are the foundation floors of the whole building! so the whole building is built around floors 10 through 20! -- but Suzy, you just said the foundation is the other two! it's the foundation of all the law, the 10 commandments included.

but the whole Bible is built around one thing, which isn't a law or regulation at all: the revelation of the person of God to man - it's all about Jesus Christ. to know Him - which is to love Him, and to love Him is also to through Him, love one another.
Sorry if thats the way it sounded, what I meant to say is the 2 LAWS INCLUDE AND ARE A SUMMARY OF THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.love toward God and neighbor all summed up neatly. The ten being the foundation of love and actually the whole Bible and the Plan of savation. Is it semantics? or am I missing what you mean ?

yes Christ is the ultimate in love that God gave His only companion to come and die for mankind who does not deserve it and that Christ did so voluntarily, that is LOVE to the jltimate
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
29,629
9,511
113
Sorry if thats the way it sounded, what I meant to say is the 2 LAWS INCLUDE AND ARE A SUMMARY OF THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.love toward God and neighbor all summed up neatly. The ten being the foundation of love and actually the whole Bible and the Plan of savation. Is it semantics? or am I missing what you mean ?

yes Christ is the ultimate in love that God gave His only companion to come and die for mankind who does not deserve it and that Christ did so voluntarily, that is LOVE to the jltimate
yes

sorry, probably i have PTSD from sabbath threads haha
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
29,629
9,511
113
yes

sorry, probably i have PTSD from sabbath threads haha
i think this can be reduced even further to love the Lord - because if i love Him, isn't expressing that to love those He has created and loved, Himself, too? if i hate my brother or sister that God has made and put into my life, how can i say i love Him?

it is like it is all about knowing Him, which is life, and living Him, which is living :)
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
21,185
9,919
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Pisteuo , the verb form of the noun Faith , is action , based upon a belief , sustained by confidence .

We perform 100 's of acts of faithing or pisteuo every day that have nothing to do with our relationship with Christ . What is the specific act of pisteuo in relation to the living God ? " A personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender ."

Anyone who thinks this can be done without work or effort , had no chance to have that personal relationship with Christ .

The Greek did not allow work or effort to be separated from pisteuo or the application of Faith .
I see that everything I explained to you in post #76,738 apparently just went right over your head. It's very unfortunate that you have been duped by a Stanford University level teacher and have turned Pisteuo into salvation by works. :(

I see that you also continue to dodge my question in post #76,729. As I mentioned before, prior to my conversion, while still attending the Roman Catholic church several years ago, I was also confused about Believe - "Pisteuo" and Faith - "Pistis" and basically "defined" faith "as" obedience/works, just as you are doing now and the Roman Catholic from post #76,561 is also doing, which results in the fatal error of teaching salvation by faith + works. :( (Romans 4:5-6; 11:6; Ephesians 2:8,9)

If you were standing at the gates of heaven right now and Jesus Christ asked you why He should let you into heaven, what would be your exact answer? Your answer to this question will demonstrate exactly what you are trusting in for salvation.

I am trusting 100% in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of my salvation. :) Christ's finished work of redemption is sufficient and complete to save believers. No supplements needed. (Romans 3:24-28) (y)
 

Argueless

Active member
Oct 21, 2018
658
161
43
...If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either. Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. Romans 11:17-22

...Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day. In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire. In the very same way, these dreamers pollute their own bodies, reject authority and slander celestial beings. But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!” Yet these men speak abusively against whatever they do not understand; and what things they do understand by instinct, like unreasoning animals—these are the very things that destroy them. Woe to them! They have taken the way of Cain; they have rushed for profit into Balaam’s error; they have been destroyed in Korah’s rebellion. These men are blemishes at your love feasts, eating with you without the slightest qualm—shepherds who feed only themselves. They are clouds without rain, blown along by the wind; autumn trees, without fruit and uprooted—twice dead. They are wild waves of the sea, foaming up their shame; wandering stars, for whom blackest darkness has been reserved forever. Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: “See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him.” These men are grumblers and faultfinders; they follow their own evil desires; they boast about themselves and flatter others for their own advantage.

A Call to Persevere
... But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold. They said to you, “In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires.” These are the men who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit. Jude 1:5-19