Not By Works

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Oct 31, 2015
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Eternity is at stake for those on the fence and or those that have devalued the work of Jesus on our behalf

Yes those born again Christians that believe we don’t need to keep His commandments in which they live in sin, thinking they are righteous will be shocked when they stand before Christ on Judgement Day, to be Judged according to our deeds.



  • eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7



He gave us a new nature empowered by the Spirit to have the ability to walk in righteousness.



Living in unrighteousness is devaluing His work on the cross.





JPT
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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So where does it say that it's IRREVOCABLE?

No one can snatch them out of the Father's hand and I agree to whatever was written to teach us and esp God's Words.

We are in God's hand like a FREE bird that can FREELY fly away if it wishes to. No one can snatch us away from the Father's hand as long as we REMAIN OR ABIDE IN HIM.


The itsy TWISTY spider...

...For certain men whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. THEY ARE GODLESS MEN, WHO CHANGE THE GRACE OF OF OUR GOD INTO A LICENSE FOR IMMORALITY and DENY Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord. Jude 1:4

...They claim to know God, but by THEIR ACTIONS they DENY Him. They are detestable, DISOBEDIENT and UNFIT for doing anything good. Titus 1:16

Look who's talking about HONESTY.

...We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is A LIAR, AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM. But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did. 1 John 2:3-6

Do you not CALL EVIL GOOD and GOOD EVIL? (Isaiah 5:20-24)

Is it RIGHT to OBEY God? Is it GOOD or is it WRONG and EVIL? If it is RIGHT and GOOD, why do you call those who promote OBEDIENCE TO GOD as FALSE or peddlers of a FALSE GOSPEL?

Do you not insult and call the views of those who promote OBEDIENCE to God as IDIOTIC?

It's funny how your group can say that only genuine believers would OBEY God and those who promote OBEDIENCE to God are LOST, UNBELIEVERS, FALSE, DECEIVER, NOT SAVED TO BEGIN WITH and many other discriminating NEGATIVE remarks.

And when you are called out, you will accuse them of SLANDER and start bullying those who disagree with you.

But scriptures fortold of these kind of people and behaviour.

.. Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: “See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him.” These men are grumblers and faultfinders; they follow their own evil desires; they boast about themselves and flatter others for their own advantage. But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold. They said to you, “In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires.” These are the men who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit. Jude 1:14-19

...If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain. 1 Timothy 6:3-5

...Dear children, do not let anyone lead you astray. HE WHO DOES WHAT IS RIGHT IS RIGHTEOUS, just as he is righteous. He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil’s work.

IS IT RIGHT TO OBEY GOD or not?

Are you an instrument of God's righteousness or do you just BELIEVE and let God do everything for you?

Who now is the LORD, you?...and who is your servant, GOD?

....“You have said harsh things against me,” says the Lord. “Yet you ask, ‘What have we said against you?’ “You have said, ‘IT IS FUTILE TO SERVE GOD. What did we gain by CARRYING OUT HIS REQUIREMENTS and going about like mourners before the Lord Almighty? But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.’” Then THOSE WHO FEARED THE LORD talked with each other, and the Lord listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the Lord and honored his name. “They will be mine,” says the Lord Almighty, “in the day when I make up my treasured possession. I WILL SPARE THEM, just as in compassion a man spares HIS SON WHO SERVES HIM. And you will again see the DISTINCTION between the RIGHTEOUS and the WICKED, between those who SERVE GOD and those who do not. Malachi 3:13-18

...God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him WE MIGHT BECOME THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD. 2 Corinthians 5:21
Am not reading all of this post. But will answer your question about irrevocable. It's in the very short word "in". Translated as a fixed position.

If not secure, you will never be a threat to the enemy.
 
Oct 31, 2015
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Our motive is to be used as His instrument.
The Holy Spirit is our helper.
Sometimes, however, we even have to do what we don't want to do.
I don't particularly like some persons in my life, but I always tried to love them and treat them well.
Was this work?

I agree with all you've said,,,,but I also know that work IS part of our salvation and I really fail to understand the problem with this.

Maybe it's called good deeds?
I do think we should obey God....


Hebrews 4:3, 7
“… only we who believe can enter His rest … but those who first heard this good news
failed to enter because they
disobeyed God.”


It’s called the obedience of faith.


But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: Romans 16:26



the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith



These folks are too busy looking for loop holes in God’s word that gives them the right to live immoral lives of disobedience, rather than just reading God’s word.



I feel sad for their family and children who will be taught their perverted Gospel.


All the young Christians as well have grown thinking obedience to His commandments, His doctrine and His gospel is somehow a bad thing.



So sad.



It will be too late when they stand before Him on Judgement Day.






JPT
 
Oct 31, 2015
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You know....I love the truth

You hate the truth and all those of us who promote it.


He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4




  • does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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It’s called the obedience of faith.


But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: Romans 16:26



the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith



These folks are too busy looking for loop holes in God’s word that gives them the right to live immoral lives of disobedience, rather than just reading God’s word.



I feel sad for their family and children who will be taught their perverted Gospel.


All the young Christians as well have grown thinking obedience to His commandments, His doctrine and His gospel is somehow a bad thing.



So sad.



It will be too late when they stand before Him on Judgement Day.






JPT
what is the Gospel?

believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.

what commands are we to obey?

believe in the name of the Son and love one another.

so, to believe is to obey.

belief- obtains salvation.

obey- what one does after one believes. does not cause nor maintain salvation.

and, I wish you and others would stop jumping to the conclusion that we who tell the truth about salvation through grace and faith alone are somehow saying " just believe and you behave however you want, does not matter."

no one is saying that.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
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Am not reading all of this post. But will answer your question about irrevocable. It's in the very short word "in". Translated as a fixed position.
If not secure, you will never be a threat to the enemy.
I agree with you, sister. If we are not secure in the Kingdom and in the love of Jesus, we are vulnerable.
But our security comes from knowing Gods nature and His love, not superficially, like a distant equation,
but knowing the flesh that they ripped from His back when He was flogged, that He did this for us, and
nothing will separate us from Him who believe in His name and trust He will transform us as He is doing
everyday, day in, day out, 24/7 to His glory, Amen.

When I reach out my hand, I know Jesus reached out His. When I hurt, I know Jesus hurt more.
When I flinch because the pain is too much or I might get hurt, I know Jesus did not flinch but walked
into death from evil corrupt men who knew not what they were doing, but still killed the Lord of All.

It is in knowing this love in which we abide always, that the enemy hates, and will do his best to discourage
us in, here and in every way he can, but Jesus has always, forever defeated him.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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You hate the truth and all those of us who promote it.


He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4




  • does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
and the lying about Scripture goes on and on.

same man, same letter, " the commands are believe in the name of the Son and love one another "

you can fight against truth all you want, it does not nullify Scripture.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Amen! Besides perverting the gospel, twisting the scriptures, sowing seeds of doubt and deception, along with attacking those in the OSAS camp and resorting to slander, what is his purpose here? Apparently, that is his purpose here. :cautious:
I think some just like to argue, and see if they get a rise out of others.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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"whenever we do anything for God"

Here is the standing back approach to our walk in Christ.
We are Christ on earth, His body, His witness, His presence.
Everything we do is for God, not just occasional acts or efforts, everything.

Do everything in love.
1 Cor 16:14
Morning bro. Hope your staying warm, we are back in deep freeze again!!
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
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It’s called the obedience of faith.


But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: Romans 16:26



the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith



These folks are too busy looking for loop holes in God’s word that gives them the right to live immoral lives of disobedience, rather than just reading God’s word.



I feel sad for their family and children who will be taught their perverted Gospel.


All the young Christians as well have grown thinking obedience to His commandments, His doctrine and His gospel is somehow a bad thing.



So sad.



It will be too late when they stand before Him on Judgement Day.



JPT
In Mathew 5:16 Jesus said to let our light shine before men.
When we have faith in Jesus and this faith produces obedience....
this obedience allows our light to shine before men....

Some here believe this gives glory to MAN....
instead it gives glory to God, by showing the love that Christians have for Him...
enough to want to obey Him.

When a person speaks against obedience, he is speaking against faith in God.
The Holy Spirit gives us the strength to produce the obedience to God that comes from faith.
It's something to be joyful about....not something to disclaim because "it gives glory to man".

Romans 1:5
through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name's sake,
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4



The liar is the one who claims born again Christians don’t need to keep His commandments.



“I know Him” is the biblical definition of eternal life.




JPT
With this mindset you are canceling out the body of Jesus the Christ on earth. Commands from the Head to each individual, His members. Using scripture and/or His Voice of Holy Spirit within our spirit. Led by Him....or sometimes just knowing the right thing to do.

But, if you teach obedience just to the scriptures, where is your personal walk with Him? That's my issue with the use of laws. No different than the Jews. Jesus is the living Torah and makes His will known to each of us.

So believe He has spoken and step out in confidence of His working His power. His Acts. Good deeds are just that. Anyone can do them. And it doesn't require a change of "nature".

However, two natures cannot be unified. One has to die.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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Yes those born again Christians that believe we don’t need to keep His commandments in which they live in sin, thinking they are righteous will be shocked when they stand before Christ on Judgement Day, to be Judged according to our deeds.
  • eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7
JPT
Why the continued false accusations against born again Christians? 1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (demonstrative evidence) if we keep His commandments. Who is teaching otherwise? BTW the Greek word for "keep" is "tereo" (Strong's #5083) which means to (guard, observe, watch over) His commandments. It does not mean sinless, perfect obedience 100% of the time, as sinless perfectionists teach.

When we stand before Christ on Judgment Day, works will evidences for or against a man being in a state of righteousness, yet we are still saved through FAITH and NOT by works (Romans 4:2-6; 10:1-4; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9 etc..).

So patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (vs. 7) is not at all set forth as the means of believers procuring eternal life, but is a description of those to whom God does render life eternal. *Notice that ALL who receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does good (vs. 10). Good deeds flow from a heart that is saved and evil deeds flow from a heart that is unsaved. Verse 8 - but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness--indignation and wrath. *Notice that ALL who do not receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does evil (vs. 9).

He gave us a new nature empowered by the Spirit to have the ability to walk in righteousness.

Living in unrighteousness is devaluing His work on the cross.
Yes He did give us a new nature empowered by the Holy Spirit to have the ability to walk in righteousness. 1 John 3:7 - Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; 8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil. 9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

Living in unrighteousness is descriptive of the unrighteous (1 Corinthians 6:9-10). Continual living in unrighteousness is a symptom that one has not yet received forgiveness of sins based on Christ's finished work on the cross or a new nature. Trusting in works for salvation is another symptom and renders Christ an IN-sufficient Savior.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
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what is the Gospel?
believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.
what commands are we to obey?
believe in the name of the Son and love one another.
so, to believe is to obey.
belief- obtains salvation.
obey- what one does after one believes. does not cause nor maintain salvation.
and, I wish you and others would stop jumping to the conclusion that we who tell the truth about salvation through grace and faith alone are somehow saying " just believe and you behave however you want, does not matter."
no one is saying that.
You miss-understand us. Without a cleansed heart how can you please God?
For out of this unclean heart come everything that pollutes and defiles us, making us unacceptable to the
Father and worthy of judgement.

So of course trying to be good is pointless, actually being good because the law is written on your heart
is totally different, because ones inheritance is from the Lord himself.

But I read time and again people saying they abide in sin and refuse to repent or resolve the issues they
declare they know about. And then others says no one in the flesh can be righteous, no matter how spiritually
cleansed because the flesh is evil.

However it is explained, bottom line is sin dominates and rules.
Jesus proclaims freedom. But these words to a hard unclean heart mean nothing, because until they
are experienced personally, they are like delusion and insanity, a different Kingdom.

So I have to ask, do you believe He who rose Jesus from the dead can achieve this in you?
Not hyper cleansing, but real cleansing and love from your heart to others, even me?

Take the most irritating, disfunctional person you know, God can show you with His love how
to love Him. Do you believe this?
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
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and the lying about Scripture goes on and on.

same man, same letter, " the commands are believe in the name of the Son and love one another "

you can fight against truth all you want, it does not nullify Scripture.
This was posted by the other member,,,@justpassinthrough :

He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4

What is a lie about the above?
It's just plain and simple scripture.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,653
1,815
113
It’s called the obedience of faith.


But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: Romans 16:26



the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith



These folks are too busy looking for loop holes in God’s word that gives them the right to live immoral lives of disobedience, rather than just reading God’s word.



I feel sad for their family and children who will be taught their perverted Gospel.


All the young Christians as well have grown thinking obedience to His commandments, His doctrine and His gospel is somehow a bad thing.



So sad.



It will be too late when they stand before Him on Judgement Day.






JPT
The obedience of faith is not what you are peddling.

What commandment was Abraham obeying when he left his home not knowing where he was going?

What commandment was he following when he took his only natural born son, his heir who which would be the ancestry of the "seed" of faith to the altar of sacrifice?

Commands. He was hearing...fellow shipping with God. And following.

We are an army. One body carrying out His functions. By faith or believing our commander against the enemy. And the enemy lies. So we make a choice of who we will believe in the garden of our heart.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
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Morning bro. Hope your staying warm, we are back in deep freeze again!!
Good morning Eternally-gratefull, I hope you are having the Lords blessing and know His will in everything you do.

It warms my heart to know He has called us to be His ambassadors of the gospel, His good news of the door to heaven,
to transform us into the likeness of His son, as a blameless, pure, perfect bride ready for the bridegroom, Halleluyah,

I long to see that day, when we all can know His joy and His blessing in heaven and in the eternal love not at a distance,
but face to face, when we can express our worship, praise and adoration of His and His ways, Glory to the Lamb who was
slain, to sit at the right hand of the Father on High and to reign forever and ever Amen, Praise Him

 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
9,336
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This was posted by the other member,,,@justpassinthrough :

He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4

What is a lie about the above?
It's just plain and simple scripture.
the lie is this-
the same man , in the same letter, after he stated keep the commands , went on to lay out what the commands are.

so, to just snip out one thing that John said, and use it point anywhere one wants , is a deceptive lie, because John stated what the Commands are.

but, coming from one who thinks " believe " and " obey " are the same word ( they are not ). you would not see my point.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
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The obedience of faith is not what you are peddling.

What commandment was Abraham obeying when he left his home not knowing where he was going?

What commandment was he following when he took his only natural born son, his heir who which would be the ancestry of the "seed" of faith to the altar of sacrifice?

Commands. He was hearing...fellow shipping with God. And following.

We are an army. One body carrying out His functions. By faith or believing our commander against the enemy. And the enemy lies. So we make a choice of who we will believe in the garden of our heart.
You're against God's commandments??
You believe the Moral Law is abolished??

Abraham had faith....
That's why he obeyed.
Obedience of Faith.