Not By Works

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#97,841
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#97,841
Macabeus said:
Not what I said.

I said that fruit bearing is evidence in general. My point in the post you just quoted was that I never inspected any individuals fruit, while you all have constantly been trying to inspect mine.

...and as usual, you are ignoring clear scripture

Matthew 7:19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

Luke 6:44- For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

Jude 12- These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots
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TWICE DEAD -->LOST, NEVER SAVED

And the comparison is made and applied to THREE false teachers

CAIN --->works
Balaam-->MONEY
Korah-->STOOD against the one CALLED by GOD
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
#97,842
#97,842
Macabeus said:
Not what I said.

I said that fruit bearing is evidence in general. My point in the post you just quoted was that I never inspected any individuals fruit, while you all have constantly been trying to inspect mine.

...and as usual, you are ignoring clear scripture

Matthew 7:19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

Luke 6:44- For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

Jude 12- These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots
Click to expand...
I think the underlying point is why are we (believers) looking for evidence, because John Calvin taught no evidence no salvation?

I would disagree with that position, the evidence, serves a function indeed, to bear witness, build up the church, provide testimony to an unbelieving world.

Is it automatic, NO ....are we encouraged and exhorted to bear fruit, of course

Over a lifetime that will be very different to each individual person.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#97,843
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
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#97,843
UnderGrace said:
I think the underlying point is why are we (believers) looking for evidence, because John Calvin taught no evidence no salvation?

I would disagree with that position, the evidence, serves a function indeed, to bear witness, build up the church, provide testimony to an unbelieving world.

Is it automatic, NO ....are we encouraged and exhorted to bear fruit, of course

Over a lifetime that will be very different to each individual person.
Click to expand...
I have said and will say again...the benefit of works and fruit is directed at unbelievers.....God looks for faith and that is what he is impressed with.....and as proof I cite the Roman soldier....HE DID NOT DO ONE THING except say....I am not worthy that you should come under my roof, .....just speak the word and he my servant will be healed....

JESUS marveled at this and said he had NOT SEEN so great a faith in ALL of ISRAEL
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
#97,845
#97,845
Macabeus said:
Not what I said.

I said that fruit bearing is evidence in general. My point in the post you just quoted was that I never inspected any individuals fruit, while you all have constantly been trying to inspect mine.

...and as usual, you are ignoring clear scripture

Matthew 7:19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

Luke 6:44- For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

Jude 12- These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots
Click to expand...
May I also add that this fruit is about false teachers, we know false teachers by their fruit...."doctrine" and people who follow them.

Bad doctrine, or false doctrine, will not produce for the kingdom.

Therefore, we need to abide in Jesus (correct doctrine) to produce fruit (converts) for the kingdom.
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
#97,846
#97,846
dcontroversal said:
I have said and will say again...the benefit of works and fruit is directed at unbelievers.....God looks for faith and that is what he is impressed with.....and as proof I cite the Roman soldier....HE DID NOT DO ONE THING except say....I am not worthy that you should come under my roof, .....just speak the word and he my servant will be healed....

JESUS marveled at this and said he had NOT SEEN so great a faith in ALL of ISRAEL
Click to expand...
Amen and Amen!!
 
Melach

Melach

Well-known member
#97,854
Mar 28, 2019
2,026
1,512
113
#97,854
eternally-gratefull said:
Sure I think there are a few already started just not active, It can get heated
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brethren. i think its wise we control our tongues in the heat of disagreements, so we dont offend the ones with a tender conscieus.

its wise to communicate in love and understanding. never to misrepresent the other person and remain calm.

i myself can take harsh words but i think of the brethren who are only recently in Christ. lets hope the new thread is going to be more constructive. tell me if you start it dear friend.
 
FollowHisSteps

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
#97,855
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
#97,855
BillG said:
You seem to not know what I believe.
Maybe ask before making an assumption.
The lost are not saved.
The broken who seek are saved?

Peter had faith that Jesus would save him?
Bible verse to back this up please.

You wont find it?
He fled in tears, denied him.
HAD TO BE RESTORED,

Peter do you Agape me?
What was his response?
Truth is you do not know the elect.
If you did then you are God and playing God.
Given you are not then don't play games with people's lives.
You will answer for this.

You need to understand people and where they are at.
You talk the talk but I think you are not willing to walk the walk with what you preach.

That's why I don't think you are PJ.

Your posts make me very sad.
No love or compassion.
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I have compassion and love. It is centred on Jesus and faith in Him.
That is where our salvation is centred and all the promises.

My opinion will neither save or lose people. In your view they are saved
because they have believed. My view cannot cause them loss because nothing
can in your view.

But as far as my reading of scripture, our hope is based on our belief in Jesus.
So it is core to my view to warn the reality in Christ. And why would a cleansed,
purified child of God not walk in this?
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#97,858
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#97,858
Melach said:
brethren. i think its wise we control our tongues in the heat of disagreements, so we dont offend the ones with a tender conscieus.

its wise to communicate in love and understanding. never to misrepresent the other person and remain calm.

i myself can take harsh words but i think of the brethren who are only recently in Christ. lets hope the new thread is going to be more constructive. tell me if you start it dear friend.
Click to expand...
While I agree...I will also say.....some people are dead set on being offended......Jesus, John, Paul spoke truth and people were offended on every hand....THE truth cuts, and divides asunder..........
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#97,860
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#97,860
Rosemaryx said:
That`s exactly what I wanted to do , because I thought it was to do with the fruit inspector :oops::ROFL:
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Laughter is good medicine.........and good for the soul...... especially a good gut buster that causes the stomach muscles to ache from laughing to hard and long ;)
 
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