Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
869
113
I personally find it hard to address FHS because there is a notion that he is a banned member twice...
I have asked him out right if he is originally PeterJens , but have had no answer , just diversion...

If someone was accusing you to be someone that you are not , would you not exclaim it from the rooftops that you are not this banned member that we accuse him to be...

For that reason I cannot take what he says seriously , because all that comes into my mind is banned twice PeterJens , which would make him a deceiver , no matter what he says...

It would be wonderful if he just claimed he is or is not , only God knows...xox...
The Bible says, those who sin all they want are not saved. I know that this may sounds viciously condemning, but still, we can still try to help them out, help them toward the right direction, help them wean from sin.

Faith in what is unseen is difficult, and that is also why I would also encourage others to read my testimony

And also, for those who have abstained from sin for a relatively long time, stay abstained, keep the desire sufficiently mortified

Else, if deciding to sin even once, the desire to sin again will come alive and you will regret ruining the progress of purity (if you see it as a progress)

But still, once saved is always saved, for the same reason that once you hate sin, you will always hate sin

Or, am I wrong about "once you hate sin, you will always hate sin"?
I agree with you up to the "once you hate sin, you will always hate sin". Because if a Christian consciously and willingly chooses sin, he or she is at that moment not hating sin. We sin when our desire to sin is greater than our desire to serve Christ. So if we are consciously and willingly choosing sin, we are in action loving sin and hating Christ.

The biblical definition of love/hate is to choose/despise.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
42,031
14,659
113
The Bible says, those who sin all they want are not saved. I know that this may sounds viciously condemning, but still, we can still try to help them out, help them toward the right direction, help them wean from sin.

Faith in what is unseen is difficult, and that is also why I would also encourage others to read my testimony

And also, for those who have abstained from sin for a relatively long time, stay abstained, keep the desire sufficiently mortified

Else, if deciding to sin even once, the desire to sin again will come alive and you will regret ruining the progress of purity (if you see it as a progress)

But still, once saved is always saved, for the same reason that once you hate sin, you will always hate sin

Or, am I wrong about "once you hate sin, you will always hate sin"?
Ummmmm.....My bible states that those who sin all they want after being saved are whipped, lose reward and maybe even forfeit physical life............but their salvation is secure because it it the SPIRIT that has been born again of INCORRUPTIBLE SEED

Corinthian fornicator comes to mind....he was even bragging about it
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
7,060
2,915
113
I would add sinning and unbelief, and still be saved. Jesus prayed that Peter would not lose faith
when he denied Jesus, so keeping faith is everything.
Same for you.
Name those who teach such things.

Luke 22:31-32

Jesus Predicts Peter’s Denial
(Matt. 26:31–35; Mark 14:27–31; John 13:36–38)
31 And the Lord said, “Simon, Simon! Indeed, Satan has asked for you, that he may sift you as wheat. 32 But I have prayed for you, that your faith should not fail; and when you have returned to Me, strengthen your brethren.”
 

theanointedwinner

Well-known member
Nov 6, 2018
2,058
1,105
113
The Bible says, those who sin all they want are not saved. I know that this may sounds viciously condemning, but still, we can still try to help them out, help them toward the right direction, help them wean from sin.

Faith in what is unseen is difficult, and that is also why I would also encourage others to read my testimony

And also, for those who have abstained from sin for a relatively long time, stay abstained, keep the desire sufficiently mortified

Else, if deciding to sin even once, the desire to sin again will come alive and you will regret ruining the progress of purity (if you see it as a progress)

But still, once saved is always saved, for the same reason that once you hate sin, you will always hate sin

Or, am I wrong about "once you hate sin, you will always hate sin"?
I feel self righteousness for saying all this, I think we need to clarify what self righteousness is, vs standing up for truth
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
42,031
14,659
113
I have asked this of others (with no response) but I will ask you nonetheless.

Who on here teaches that we can sin all we want and still be saved?
I noticed FHS gave you a winner, so maybe he can respond as well.

Who on this thread teaches/preaches that we can sin all we want and still be saved?
He is talking about @Budman as they have been going after it for a few days now.....watch him take my post above and say that I said it.....
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
869
113
I find it interesting that unregenerated people who want/desire sin are typically socio-paths or people with damaged psyche/soul, so all of sudden now, believers who are regenerated become socio-paths wanting to sin??

Scripture is clear the believer is justified, this is a judicial decree by God

If people want/pursue sin after being justified I would remind them who they are in Christ because obviously they need better instruction

I know you ascribe being regenerated as a "behaviour modification program" I do not

I think the better question is how will God deal with a regenerated person who persists in sin, I think scripture can tell us much about this

I find it a very sad statement (not stating you made this statement) when people state "oh they were never saved to begin with" based on someone's outward performance....very sad indeed!!
I never ascribed regeneration as a behavioral modification program. I would say a heart change is a better way of putting it. And heart change does modify one's walk.

Regeneration produces heart change

heart change produces life change

and it is not the outward actions that is the issue. It is all about heart issues. But often, our actions and
I have asked this of others (with no response) but I will ask you nonetheless.

Who on here teaches that we can sin all we want and still be saved?
I noticed FHS gave you a winner, so maybe he can respond as well.

Who on this thread teaches/preaches that we can sin all we want and still be saved?

Budman said it and DC and others defended it. Scroll up a little bit. It has been discussed today and yesterday
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
7,060
2,915
113
I get fed up with people accusing fellow brothers/sisters on here teaching that we can sin all we want and still be saved.
They obviously mean sinning without regard.

So to such people who accuse either put up or shut up.
If anyone here does teach such a thing then they need to be bought to task.

Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone or throw it the floor.
 

Limey410v2

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2017
414
76
28
Ummmmm.....My bible states that those who sin all they want after being saved are whipped, lose reward and maybe even forfeit physical life............but their salvation is secure because it it the SPIRIT that has been born again of INCORRUPTIBLE SEED

Corinthian fornicator comes to mind....he was even bragging about it
Amen, The sin issue between man and God was resolved on the cross. The death issue between man and God is resolved by the indwelling spirit if you choose to accept. People always talking about sin control as if they don't know how to sin anymore. That their meager attempts at trying to keep their flesh under control trumps the magnificent sacrifice of Christ.
It actually is scorning the events of that day and telling Jesus that His sacrifice didn't quite cut the mustard.
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
869
113
I find it interesting that unregenerated people who want/desire sin are typically socio-paths or people with damaged psyche/soul, so all of sudden now, believers who are regenerated become socio-paths wanting to sin??

Scripture is clear the believer is justified, this is a judicial decree by God

If people want/pursue sin after being justified I would remind them who they are in Christ because obviously they need better instruction

I know you ascribe being regenerated as a "behaviour modification program" I do not

I think the better question is how will God deal with a regenerated person who persists in sin, I think scripture can tell us much about this

I find it a very sad statement (not stating you made this statement) when people state "oh they were never saved to begin with" based on someone's outward performance....very sad indeed!!
I never said regeneration is a behavioural modification program. But it does involve a HEART CHANGE. And it involves a change in nature. And these things affect our actions.

Also, 1 John 3:3 and other verses give descriptive statements about what a Christian is and does.
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
869
113
I get fed up with people accusing fellow brothers/sisters on here teaching that we can sin all we want and still be saved.
They obviously mean sinning without regard.

So to such people who accuse either put up or shut up.
If anyone here does teach such a thing then they need to be bought to task.

Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone or throw it the floor.
Budman taught it. Post forthcoming.
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
7,060
2,915
113
I never ascribed regeneration as a behavioral modification program. I would say a heart change is a better way of putting it. And heart change does modify one's walk.

Regeneration produces heart change

heart change produces life change

and it is not the outward actions that is the issue. It is all about heart issues. But often, our actions and



Budman said it and DC and others defended it. Scroll up a little bit. It has been discussed today and yesterday
I have read the posts over the last few days.

Where have either said "We can sin all we want and still be saved?
Paul addressed this in Romans. I'm sure my brother's have read it and agree with it.

There is a difference between grace outbounding our sin and using grace as a license to sin.

Have either said this?
 

Limey410v2

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2017
414
76
28
I feel self righteousness for saying all this, I think we need to clarify what self righteousness is, vs standing up for truth
Self Righteousness is taking the imputed righteousness of Christ that comes from above, and believing that you can create it from within.
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
I never ascribed regeneration as a behavioral modification program. I would say a heart change is a better way of putting it. And heart change does modify one's walk.

Regeneration produces heart change

heart change produces life change

and it is not the outward actions that is the issue. It is all about heart issues. But often, our actions and



Budman said it and DC and others defended it. Scroll up a little bit. It has been discussed today and yesterday
We are either /new creations in Christ/placed in Christ or we are not.

It is the righteousness of Christ that is imputed to us...we have no righteousness of our own to merit being deemed right with God.

There is no "heart" issue
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
869
113
I have read the posts over the last few days.

Where have either said "We can sin all we want and still be saved?
Paul addressed this in Romans. I'm sure my brother's have read it and agree with it.

There is a difference between grace outbounding our sin and using grace as a license to sin.

Have either said this?
OOps, it's in the Faith/works, how much faith and how much works.

start at post 734 and read forward.
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
869
113
I have read the posts over the last few days.

Where have either said "We can sin all we want and still be saved?
Paul addressed this in Romans. I'm sure my brother's have read it and agree with it.

There is a difference between grace outbounding our sin and using grace as a license to sin.

Have either said this?

OOps, it's in the Faith/works, how much faith and how much works thread

start at post 734 and read forward.
 

theanointedwinner

Well-known member
Nov 6, 2018
2,058
1,105
113
Self Righteousness is taking the imputed righteousness of Christ that comes from above, and believing that you can create it from within.
Limey amen, preach to many thick skulled, um ... I mean, hard of hearing, well anyway, this is the truth that everyone needs to see

And I hope people can see why I give this guy a medal, and it's very hard to earn a medal from me, infact, when was the last time I gave someone a medal?

I don't remember

And also, no amount of medals you can earn from me can earn salvation, and be thankful that you don't have to earn a gift

If someone pass out candies, did you earn it or was it a free gift?