Not By Works

[VCO]

Greetings VCO,

I have been saddened by the twisting of scripture.

How does a man or woman condemn their own family? A child, spouse, parent? Or even themselves!?

If there is someone they love or themselves who is unrepentant and frankly disinterested in God or His laws then they have two choices;

Accept the fate of unrepentant sinners,

or

Accept an interpretation that either identifies all as "saved" or possibly "once saved always saved" for those who casually made a possibly coaxed profession of faith at one time.

On top of that if they are the parent how do they reconcile the responsibility that they had to "bring up a child in the way they should go..." but the child did not accept or essentially departed.

Perhaps there should be a discussion breaching these issues, but I'm sure the desperate will infiltrate and insist that a doctrinal position which saves themselves or an unrepentant family member is the only one that can be true otherwise the horror would be too painful to accept.

This is one of the many explanations I have for the deliberate miscommunication and resistance to "clarifying" the terms. Because once the terms are clarified the fallacy can be confronted.

Jesus warned us, He did not come to bring peace;

Luk 12:51-53 KJV Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: (52) For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. (53) The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

He also warned us the cost of discipleship;

Luk 14:26 KJV If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

WE are living in the End Times and False Christs and False Prophets will abound.
It seems you may be even talking about family members. Let me give you some hope for them:

Mark 3:28-29 (NASB)
28 "Truly I say to you, all sins shall be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they utter;
29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin"—

Blaspheming the Holy Spirit is the ONLY SIN THAT WAS NOT PAID IN FULL ON THE CROSS. As long as they do not take what the HOLY SPIRIT HAS BEEN TRYING TO GET THEM TO BELIEVE ABOUT CHRIST, and disavow that truth, or say he did those things by the Power of the Devil, they may be saved, because I cannot see the heart, but Christ can and WILL.

They most certainly will LOSE REWARDS, like CROWNS.

1 Corinthians 3:11-15 (HCSB)
11 For no one can lay any other foundation than what has been laid down. That foundation is Jesus Christ.
12 If anyone builds on that foundation with gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay, or straw,
13 each one’s work will become obvious, for the day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire; the fire will test the quality of each one’s work.
14 If anyone’s work that he has built survives, he will receive a reward.
15 If anyone’s work is burned up, it will be lost, but he will be saved; yet it will be like an escape through fire.

Acts 16:34 (NJB)
34 Afterwards he took them into his house and gave them a meal, and the whole household celebrated their conversion to belief in God.

Acts 16:34 (NJB)
34 Afterwards he took them into his house and gave them a meal, and the whole household celebrated their conversion to belief in God.

the whole household celebrated their conversion to belief in God.

 

[theanointedwinner]

If the pride of life is the most common problem, how can it be dealt with or how can we overcome it?

 

[FollowHisSteps]

well, yes and no. the first sentence is true.

but, sinning is missing the mark, falling short of a standard, which can be done without willfully doing so.

so. we have to be careful not to create " sin categories " . it can give people a false sense of thinking that as long as they are not willfully doing wrong , then they are not sinning, and need no forgiveness.

we all sin, willful or not, and we all need to be willing to ne truthful about it.

Here is the point, or the danger.
We always need to be honest about who and what we are.

The second area is in understanding what Jesus makes us.
He declares us forgiven and holy, though we are flawed and weak.
It is the walk of redemption, the process of sanctification as we are transformed which is important.
If our walk is irrelevant to the Kingdom, why are we saved?

Our walk is a reflection of our hearts. Our hearts are a reflection of the work of God and what He has done
in us.

So there are two sides to this discussion. We have met Christ and He has done a work in us.
Because of this work, the Spirit works to overcome the desires of the flesh. We put off the works of the old
man and put on the works of the Spirit.

In a sense the work God has begun He will complete. The elect are chosen before the beginning of time.
Nothing can shake the work of God. To us though we feel like we can be shaken, that things are fragile,
that we are weak and easily overcome. But our faith is in the wrong things, it is His Holy Spirit that will
bring about what He desires, and we can rest in this.

Our belief in how fragile we are or whether faith can be lost does not change the realities in our hearts.

A false gospel is a gospel that devalues the fruit of the spirit in the believer and the conquering of things
in this world through dwelling in Christ.

I do not think anymore that this argument matters, because the elect will walk and are called, and from
eternity their destiny is assured. Those who wish to sin and be reprobates, will continue as such, because
only the presence of God in our lives makes things different.

Praise the Lord, we will reap what we sow.

6 Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever
sows generously will also reap generously.
7 Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly
or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.
2 Cor 9

8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction;
the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest
if we do not give up.
Gal 6

To those who say to follow Jesus is a false gospel, they will reap what they sow.
In Christ we have salvation, the Kingdom of God, eternity today.

To those who so easily condemn and speak abuse, beware you do not show the fruits of
your true loyalty for all to see.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

The lack of understanding by some is sickening when it comes to a saved child of God that falters in sin!!!

Take note of anyone who does not obey the instructions we have given in this letter. Do not associate with him, so that he may be ashamed. Yet do not regard him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.

I pray for you.

5 All of you, clothe yourselves with humility toward one another, because,
"God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble."
6 Humble yourselves, therefore, under God's mighty hand, that he may lift you up in due time.
7 Cast all your anxiety on him because he cares for you.
1 Peter 5

6 That is why Scripture says: "God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble."
7 Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and
purify your hearts, you double-minded
James 4

7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.
8 Therefore, he who rejects this instruction does not reject man but God, who gives you his Holy Spirit.
9 Now about brotherly love we do not need to write to you, for you yourselves have been taught by God to love each other.
1 Thess 4

 

[FollowHisSteps]

If the pride of life is the most common problem, how can it be dealt with or how can we overcome it?

Walking with Jesus in His ways.
Often we think of the next issue in our lives or situation, while Jesus sees things
very differently. Most of what we do is because of how we see things.

See things as God sees them, and our reactions start to follow.

 

[gb9]

Walking with Jesus in His ways.
Often we think of the next issue in our lives or situation, while Jesus sees things
very differently. Most of what we do is because of how we see things.

See things as God sees them, and our reactions start to follow.

yep, good way to say it, see things as God sees things ( the pastor at my church says this also).

that would include sin. sin is more than just outright rebellion .

sin is missing the mark, falling short of a standard. we ( you to ) need to understand what sin is before saying others are " unrepentant sinners ).

unless you have confessed and repented from every single sin, under the proper definition of sin, then you are a" unrepentant sinner".

 

[FollowHisSteps]

yep, good way to say it, see things as God sees things ( the pastor at my church says this also).

that would include sin. sin is more than just outright rebellion .

sin is missing the mark, falling short of a standard. we ( you to ) need to understand what sin is before saying others are " unrepentant sinners ).

unless you have confessed and repented from every single sin, under the proper definition of sin, then you are a" unrepentant sinner".

100% agree. We need to understand what we before the King and how He cleanses us.
If we believe He cannot cleanse and purify us, what is the point of salvation and redemption?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

well, yes and no. the first sentence is true.

but, sinning is missing the mark, falling short of a standard, which can be done without willfully doing so.

so. we have to be careful not to create " sin categories " . it can give people a false sense of thinking that as long as they are not willfully doing wrong , then they are not sinning, and need no forgiveness.

we all sin, willful or not, and we all need to be willing to ne truthful about it.

Hence the issue with trying to follow the law.. We think we are more righteous than we really are if we do nt commit certain sins. WHich is a lie. All we do is deceive ourselves.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Greetings VCO,

I have been saddened by the twisting of scripture.

How does a man or woman condemn their own family? A child, spouse, parent? Or even themselves!?

If there is someone they love or themselves who is unrepentant and frankly disinterested in God or His laws then they have two choices;

Accept the fate of unrepentant sinners,

or

Accept an interpretation that either identifies all as "saved" or possibly "once saved always saved" for those who casually made a possibly coaxed profession of faith at one time.

On top of that if they are the parent how do they reconcile the responsibility that they had to "bring up a child in the way they should go..." but the child did not accept or essentially departed.

Perhaps there should be a discussion breaching these issues, but I'm sure the desperate will infiltrate and insist that a doctrinal position which saves themselves or an unrepentant family member is the only one that can be true otherwise the horror would be too painful to accept.

This is one of the many explanations I have for the deliberate miscommunication and resistance to "clarifying" the terms. Because once the terms are clarified the fallacy can be confronted.

Jesus warned us, He did not come to bring peace;

Luk 12:51-53 KJV Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: (52) For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. (53) The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

He also warned us the cost of discipleship;

Luk 14:26 KJV If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

He also told us why he came, not to judge but to save. And he sent us on that same mission.

 

[dcontroversal]

Hence the issue with trying to follow the law.. We think we are more righteous than we really are if we do nt commit certain sins. WHich is a lie. All we do is deceive ourselves.

AMEN.....PAUL was clear....outwardly concerning the law, he could not be convicted as guilty.......and it is hilariously sad.....people will qualify and quantify sin into neat little boxes while disregarding that even the smallest, insignificant sin qualifies one as a law breaking sinner that is deemed guilty and worthy of hell.........

 

[eternally-gratefull]

AMEN.....PAUL was clear....outwardly concerning the law, he could not be convicted as guilty.......and it is hilariously sad.....people will qualify and quantify sin into neat little boxes while disregarding that even the smallest, insignificant sin qualifies one as a law breaking sinner that is deemed guilty and worthy of hell.........

When you have pharisees telling Jesus they deserve eternal life, when he asks them if they obeyed the law. And they say yes, and he does not correct them.

You see how deceived people can be.

They rejected grace because they did not think they needed it. Sadly, we see this far to often today in the church

 

[dcontroversal]

When you have pharisees telling Jesus they deserve eternal life, when he asks them if they obeyed the law. And they say yes, and he does not correct them.

You see how deceived people can be.

They rejected grace because they did not think they needed it. Sadly, we see this far to often today in the church

AMEN.....GRACE or WORKS of the LAW...........going to be a sad day for ALL that think in their minds they have something to do with their salvation beyond belief.........

 

[eternally-gratefull]

AMEN.....GRACE or WORKS of the LAW...........going to be a sad day for ALL that think in their minds they have something to do with their salvation beyond belief.........

Its gonna be worse for those who know truth, yet went around being to busy judging adulterers, murderers and the like, while refusing to look at their own sin, and never truly repenting. Because they think they are ok.

 

[dcontroversal]

Its gonna be worse for those who know truth, yet went around being to busy judging adulterers, murderers and the like, while refusing to look at their own sin, and never truly repenting. Because they think they are ok.

AMEN........I am like PAUL......I know I am the chief sinner among men and unworthy of the least of God's mercies........like the guy that beats on his chest....be merciful unto me a sinner..........I plead the blood, grace and mercy........I have nothing else to offer

 

[dcontroversal]

The Anti-Christ/BEAST will make war against the saints and prevail against them for 3.5 years...whoops.....cannot be Titus.....his war against Jerusalem last 4 months, 3 weeks and 4 days

The Siege of Jerusalem in the year 70 CE was the decisive event of the First Jewish–Roman War, in which the Romanarmy captured the city of Jerusalem and destroyed both the city and its Temple. The Roman army, led by the future Emperor Titus, with Tiberius Julius Alexander as his second-in-command, besieged and conquered the city of Jerusalem, which had been controlled by Judean rebel factions since 66 CE, following the Jerusalem riots of 66, when the Judean provisional government was formed in Jerusalem.

The siege of the city began on 14 April 70 CE, three days before the beginning of Passover that year.[3][4] The siege lasted for over four months, with the battle for the city lasting for close to another week after that. The siege ended on 30 August 70 CE,[5] with the burning and destruction of the Second Temple, and the Romans entered and sacked the Lower City. The destruction of both the First and Second Temples is still mourned annually during the Jewish fast on Tisha B'Av. The Arch of Titus, celebrating the Roman sack of Jerusalem and the Temple, still stands in Rome. The conquest of the city was complete on 8 September 70 CE.


Date 14 April – 8 September 70 CE
(4 months, 3 weeks and 4 days)

 

[dcontroversal]

The 2nd BEAST which points ALL to the 1st BEAST will cause ALL to receive a MARK to buy and or sell......so.....IF TITUS was the man and 1st CENTURY AD was the time frame....who was the second BEAST and when did this system come on LINE......NOTE GOD send delusion that ALL the world MIGHT be damned......WORLD is not centralized to JERUSALEM and ISRAEL.......so was the 2nd beast the 2nd in Command......?? NOPE not TITUS and NOT 1st Century A.D.

The second beast was permitted to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship it to be killed. And the second beast required all people small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark—the name of the beast or the number of its name.…

 

[dcontroversal]

Interesting.......any history of a IMAGE or STATUE being given breath to SPEAK in the 1st Century A.D.....and when did some man identified as the 2nd beast erect a statue of TITUS.......why not Caesar.........wow I bet TITUS was crapping in his uniform.....that would be treason and death to elevate oneself above Caesar

The second beast was permitted to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship it to be killed. And the second beast required all people small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark—the name of the beast or the number of its name.…

 

[dcontroversal]

When did the heavens get rolled up as a scroll and or ripped open in the 1st Century A.D. so that ALL the people of the world HIDE in dens, caves, etc. while seeking to HIDE from the wrath of the one sitting on the throne in heaven????

Surely that would be recorded in the annals of history

 

[dcontroversal]

Rome crucified ALL non ROMANS......they only beheaded citizens of ROME.........when did ROME enforce a system of buying and selling with a mark and behead mass groups of people in the 1st century for not taking the mark...........most of the conquered territory held NON ROMAN citizens.......

 

[dcontroversal]

WHOOPS ahahahhahah rolling along posting....wrong thread HAH Oh WELL.....no coffee yet