Not By Works

[Macabeus]

but, here is the thing.
what you said here is true. but, if you teach that regeneration is instant, and looks the same for everyone, then that is not true.



so, that is why lordship salvation is bad. it will lead to pride ( I did it!!), despair, ( I came to Christ, but still struggle with ….. I guess I am not really saved.), or just being a faker. all bad

You don’t believe regeneration is instant upon believing? How long do you have to believe before God regenerates you.

Are you sure that regeneration is understood here? I had one person ask me if it means being saved again, and another claim I said regeneration is maintained by sin confession

I think the disconnect is a misunderstanding of Gods work of regeneration. You appear to be conflating it with sanctification

A lion’s nature is to eat meat, even though at first it lives on milk. In the same way, a believers nature is to live in obedience to God, even though at first it is only milk obedience.

The grace of God teaches us to deny ungodliness and live soberly and righteously. The regenerate are those who have been taught of God, and being progressively taught of God

My whole argument is that we do not continue in active rebellion when we are regenerated. We struggle, but do not actively rebel.

It has been said here that all things are lawful for believers, even fornication and lying. I think God gave us something better than that

 

[UnderGrace]

but, here is the thing.
what you said here is true. but, if you teach that regeneration is instant, and looks the same for everyone, then that is not true.



so, that is why lordship salvation is bad. it will lead to pride ( I did it!!), despair, ( I came to Christ, but still struggle with ….. I guess I am not really saved.), or just being a faker. all bad

Amen!!

Lordship salvation does not understand the dual nature (the flesh and the righteousness of Christ) of the redeemed man.

 

[Macabeus]

but, here is the thing.
what you said here is true. but, if you teach that regeneration is instant, and looks the same for everyone, then that is not true.



so, that is why lordship salvation is bad. it will lead to pride ( I did it!!), despair, ( I came to Christ, but still struggle with ….. I guess I am not really saved.), or just being a faker. all bad

Oh btw, I never said regeneration was the Same for everyone. If you want to show me where I said that, I’ll be glad to admit I erred on that point

 

[Macabeus]

Amen!!

Lordship salvation does not understand the dual nature (the flesh and the righteousness of Christ) of the redeemed man.

Yes it does.

 

[Macabeus]

Amen!!

Lordship salvation does not understand the dual nature (the flesh and the righteousness of Christ) of the redeemed man.

😂

 

[Macabeus]

Amen! 🙏😎

I told you this numerous times yesterday, but I rejoice that you now see that we are in agreement at least on this.

Just because someone disagrees On one point doesnt mean they disagree on all. The only saving works I believe in are the ones God does from beginning to end. I hope everyone keeps this in mind when they read my posts.

 

[Macabeus]

Lets add this as well..... far more problematic.
107005



Notice believing... in this faulty schema, a person is under compulsory change to prove regeneration, yet we still have the flesh and the flesh is not being redeemed, it is His righteousness we learn to live out...... and learn to lean into and express outwardly!!

This is the failure of "perservance" of the saints doctrine and trying to divide scripture according to descriptive statements which does not work.

And @Budman has the gospel of grace absolutely correct and it is not gnosticism.... and I hope he comes back soon because he is another Grace champion... on the narrow path.

When one comes to understand the severity and grace of God's love with Ananias and Saphira than one has truly found the narrow path

First of all, I never mentioned compulsory change. God changes us. That’s error number one on your part.

Secondly, the fact that it is God who changes us is precisely why it is descriptive, not prescriptive. If I said “ you need to change yourself”. That is prescriptive and wrong. If I say “regenerate people have been changed by God”, that is descriptive and correct. Do you notice how one puts an obligation on you to do it, and the other describes it as an already accomplished work of God.

Number three, I am not speaking of a struggle with sin. I struggle every day. I am talking about a continuance in sin see Romans 6. How shall we who are dead to sin continue therein

Fourthly, where does the text say annanais and Saphira were saved? I looked to check, and it’s not there. It does not say they were believers. Check for yourself and let me know what you find.

Have to go to work. Have a blessed day

 

[Macabeus]

Lets add this as well..... far more problematic.
107005



Notice believing... in this faulty schema, a person is under compulsory change to prove regeneration, yet we still have the flesh and the flesh is not being redeemed, it is His righteousness we learn to live out...... and learn to lean into and express outwardly!!

This is the failure of "perservance" of the saints doctrine and trying to divide scripture according to descriptive statements which does not work.

And @Budman has the gospel of grace absolutely correct and it is not gnosticism.... and I hope he comes back soon because he is another Grace champion... on the narrow path.

When one comes to understand the severity and grace of God's love with Ananias and Saphira than one has truly found the narrow path

BTW, where does that post teach losable salvation. Let me know, I am very curious about what you are reading into the text

Be back at lunch to see if you came up with anything

 

[Macabeus]

BTW, where does that post teach losable salvation. Let me know, I am very curious about what you are reading into the text

Be back at lunch to see if you came up with anything

@UnderGrace

Something to think about.

Does someone who hates his brother have eternal life? (1 John 3:15)

Why or why not?

Answers are in 1 John. (1 John 3:14)

If someone can refute this, I would be surprised

 

[Macabeus]

BTW, where does that post teach losable salvation. Let me know, I am very curious about what you are reading into the text

Be back at lunch to see if you came up with anything

Amen! 🙏😎

I do apologize for my part in the fracas yesterday, LS. I should have been more patient. I get frustrated because people accuse me of believing things terrible l I don’t believe, but no excuse for some of the things I said.

The whole disagreement between myself and others has to do with a difference of views on regeneration

107,509 May shed some light on what I have been saying, God willing. If you feel like it, answer the questions there to yourself, and then apply the answers to what I have been saying. I believe there is a truth there that is being missed by some, that is, what is descriptive of one who has been regenerated by God

 

[gb9]

I do apologize for my part in the fracas yesterday, LS. I should have been more patient. I get frustrated because people accuse me of believing things terrible l I don’t believe, but no excuse for some of the things I said.

The whole disagreement between myself and others has to do with a difference of views on regeneration

the disagreement is this-

when time frames are put on regeneration, then it makes it legalism.

grace salvation is negated when men make up their own rules that the Bible does not say.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Lets add this as well..... far more problematic.
107005



Notice believing... in this faulty schema, a person is under compulsory change to prove regeneration, yet we still have the flesh and the flesh is not being redeemed, it is His righteousness we learn to live out...... and learn to lean into and express outwardly!!

This is the failure of "perservance" of the saints doctrine and trying to divide scripture according to descriptive statements which does not work.

And @Budman has the gospel of grace absolutely correct and it is not gnosticism.... and I hope he comes back soon because he is another Grace champion... on the narrow path.

When one comes to understand the severity and grace of God's love with Ananias and Saphira than one has truly found the narrow path

I am confused

If i am a believer and i have sex before marraige, am i no longer a believer?

 

[Macabeus]

I am confused

If i am a believer and i have sex before marraige, am i no longer a believer?

Regenerate people fall and get back up. This is stuff I learned in elementary kid Sunday school

If you say, I’m under grace so I can live in this, you do not understand grace.

The grace of God teaches us to deny ungodliness and live righteously. We are not perfect in it, but it is in our new nature to pursue righteusness

 

[Macabeus]

the disagreement is this-

when time frames are put on regeneration, then it makes it legalism.

grace salvation is negated when men make up their own rules that the Bible does not say.

Define regeneration for me. I think the disconnect between us is there.

 

[Macabeus]

the disagreement is this-

when time frames are put on regeneration, then it makes it legalism.

grace salvation is negated when men make up their own rules that the Bible does not say.

How long does it take God to regenerate us when we believe? What do YOU say?

 

[VCO]

Amen!!

Lordship salvation does not understand the dual nature (the flesh and the righteousness of Christ) of the redeemed man.

So you THINK SO! You do have a VERY TWISTED idea, of what Lordship Salvation Teaches and Believes.
You have bought into yet another lie from the Armenian's about our BELIEFS.

 

[Lightskin]

So you THINK SO! You do have a VERY TWISTED idea, of what Lordship Salvation Teaches and Believes.
You have bought into yet another lie from the Armenian's about our BELIEFS.


View attachment 204127

Armenians? I should’ve known better than to trust the Irish. 😡

 

[Macabeus]

the disagreement is this-

when time frames are put on regeneration, then it makes it legalism.

grace salvation is negated when men make up their own rules that the Bible does not say.

@Lightskin. Do you see anything in GB9’s post that might indicate why some find my posts hard to understand? Who puts time frames on regeneration. I could be wrong, but maybe GB9 is confusing regeneration with something?

How long do you think it takes God to regenerate a believer? I thought it as pretty much instantaneous. Am I wrong?

 

[Macabeus]

So you THINK SO! You do have a VERY TWISTED idea, of what Lordship Salvation Teaches and Believes.
You have bought into yet another lie from the Armenian's about our BELIEFS.


View attachment 204127

It is mostly Arminians that teach anti Lordship. And a lot of fundamental Baptist’s, though I do not think all. But then again, many fundi Baptist’s are Arminian, at least here in Texas

 

[BillG]

@Lightskin. Do you see anything in GB9’s post that might indicate why some find my posts hard to understand? Who puts time frames on regeneration. I could be wrong, but maybe GB9 is confusing regeneration with something?

How long do you think it takes God to regenerate a believer? I thought it as pretty much instantaneous. Am I wrong?

Can you explain to this simple man what you mean by regeneration.
I assume it's not sanctification but possibly justification??