Not By Works

[mailmandan]

And you missed the point. That verse says Jesus was saved and the question is, how? did He believe the gospel? Did He believe in Christ?

It's you who missed the point. Jesus Christ is God and is without sin (Hebrews 4:15) and did not need to be saved from sin and condemnation as humans do. (Romans 3:23; 6:23) Jesus was facing physical death, not spiritual death. Jesus did not need to believe the gospel in order to become saved, as we do. (Romans 1:16)

 

[UnderGrace]

an innumerable amount


I think it's through fear. They are afraid to let go thinking if they do, they may not make it. Surely it can't be that good or that easy. I'm happy to let go. Thank God for that!!

No amount can add to what Jesus completed.

 

[dcontroversal]

John 15:12This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you.

John 13:34
A new commandment I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so also you must love one another.

John 15:17
This is My command to you: Love one another.

1 John 3:11
This is the message you have heard from the beginning: We should love one another.

Yes, it is faith faith faith but the faith the bible teaches is something different from what you are trying to teach.
Jesus Himself was saved by faith, but did Jesus have faith in Christ for his salvation or, did Jesus believe in Jesus for His salvation?

Jesus was saved by faith <---That reeks of ignorance.....My bible states that he had the AUTHORITY to lay his life down and TAKE IT UP AGAIN....HE HAD nothing To be saved from.....you really have no inkling of the truth do you!

 

[dcontroversal]

amount and time of study doesnt matter. some people have been mormons for all their life dilligently studying and still are wrong

but someone can be saved for 20minutes and have it right.

and it does not help that Mormons study a false book given by a fool and then revised dozens, if not hundreds of times....

 

[UnderGrace]

Sure, you can claim scripture! You can also go down to your local car dealership and claim a new car is yours too. But it's not, unless you have a covenant, a contract first.

A covenant of continual surrender, where salvation must be earned by this ongoing work?

That convenant does not exist in scripture.

 

[calibob]

and what did Jesus say, that we are to obey?

(1) Love the Lord your God with all of our heart, mind and Soul. (2) love our neighbors like we love ourselves.

 

[calibob]

and it does not help that Mormons study a false book given by a fool and then revised dozens, if not hundreds of times....

@Magenta and I have noticed some similarities between Mormonism and Islam. Apologetic's is her specialty not mine so later perhaps later she will share, if we ask. Please?

 

[fredoheaven]

J


Jesus Himself was saved by faith, but did Jesus have faith in Christ for his salvation or, did Jesus believe in Jesus for His salvation?[/QUOTE]
I think you are in reference to Jesus who is called Justus and not Jesus Christ, Jesus the Christ or Christ Jesus, the Saviour.

 

[Noose]

Jesus was saved by faith <---That reeks of ignorance.....My bible states that he had the AUTHORITY to lay his life down and TAKE IT UP AGAIN....HE HAD nothing To be saved from.....you really have no inkling of the truth do you!

There must be something wrong with this passage then:

Heb 5:7During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. 8Son though he was, he learned obedience from what he suffered 9and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him 10and was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek.

It's you who missed the point. Jesus Christ is God and is without sin (Hebrews 4:15) and did not need to be saved from sin and condemnation as humans do. (Romans 3:23; 6:23) Jesus was facing physical death, not spiritual death. Jesus did not need to believe the gospel in order to become saved, as we do. (Romans 1:16)

1. No one is being saved from physical death but salvation is about spiritual death. So God had to be saved from physical death according to you? And was Jesus even saved from this so called physical death according to you?

2. The position, 'without sin/ righteous' is also what men are turned to, for salvation; and i don't mean men are being turned to God. So saying Jesus is God and could not be saved is neither here nor there.

3. Did Zacchaeus need the gospel for his salvation?

 

[Noose]

@fredoheaven
Wasn't Jesus saved from death because He obeyed? and isn't He now the source of salvation for those who obey?

 

[Noose]

It is very simple.

God is love.

It is impossible and not enough for humans to claim that they believe in love or trust in love or have faith in love.

But the one who practices love has already claimed to believe in God/Trust God/have faith through their practice.

Judgement will always be about what people do and never about what they think.

 

[calibob]

@fredoheaven
Wasn't Jesus saved from death because He obeyed? and isn't He now the source of salvation for those who obey?

He wasn't saved from death, he died. He has power over sin, the law and death thats how he arose The mantle of authority was passed from the Levites to him and the laws of sin and death were changed by him. Read Hebrews.

 

[Noose]

He wasn't saved from death, he died. He has power over sin, the law and death thats how he arose The mantle of authority was passed from the Levites to him and the laws of sin and death were changed by him. Read Hebrews.

I'm reading Hebrews:

Heb 5:7During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard

 

[mailmandan]

1. No one is being saved from physical death but salvation is about spiritual death. So God had to be saved from physical death according to you? And was Jesus even saved from this so called physical death according to you?

2. The position, 'without sin/ righteous' is also what men are turned to, for salvation; and i don't mean men are being turned to God. So saying Jesus is God and could not be saved is neither here nor there.

3. Did Zacchaeus need the gospel for his salvation?

For mankind, salvation is about being saved from spiritual death. (Romans 6:23) In Matthew 26:38, Jesus said: "My soul is deeply grieved, to the point of death." Jesus was not saying that His soul was deeply grieved to the point of spiritual death, Rather, Jesus was talking about physical death, his human life. Jesus was not saved from physical death, but was obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. (Philippians 2:8)

Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.

Was Zacchaeus exempt from the gospel? In Mark 1:15, Jesus said repent and believe in the gospel.

This is not difficult to understand, but you like to make it complicated.

 

[Noose]

For mankind, salvation is about being saved from spiritual death. (Romans 6:23) In Matthew 26:38, Jesus said: "My soul is deeply grieved, to the point of death." Jesus was not saying that His soul was deeply grieved to the point of spiritual death, Rather, Jesus was talking about physical death, his human life. Jesus was not saved from physical death, but was obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. (Philippians 2:8)

Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.

Was Zacchaeus exempt from the gospel? In Mark 1:15, Jesus said repent and believe in the gospel.

This is not difficult to understand, but you like to make it complicated.

Thanks for backtracking on your earlier comment.

1. What exactly was Jesus being saved from and how? because i'm very sure in the same manner we are also saved

2. Did Zacchaeus believe in the gospel for his salvation? Yes, but not in the manner you and others are teaching here. The kind of faith you are teaching is not what Jesus and the Apostles taught. Zacchaeus only had a change of heart towards fellow humans and that's it. Or do you want to explain salvation by faith (the faith that you teach) and tell us how it applies to Zacchaeus?

 

[calibob]

I'm reading Hebrews:

Heb 5:7During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard

New International Version
For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

Hebrews 8:13 13By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

Hebrews 9:15 15For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance-now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

 

[Pisteuo]

and what did Jesus say, that we are to obey?

believe in Him, and love one another. and what does believing in Him require? faith. faith In Him.


and, just for you, no Sabbath keeping required for Christ followers. no N.T. command to do so.

No such thing as"believing" in Him for salvation. The word in the Greek is "pisteuo". Pisteuo is defined as"a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender."

Now that you've been warned, you'll be held accountable for spreading this false path!

 

[Pisteuo]

It makes clearer, how subtlely you use some terminology, your Vines definition has been exposed, so "surrender" is no longer in the scene. Now you are trying to go to "works salvation". Your Vine source of defining a word such as "pisteou" actually comes from a Nazi Theologian Gerhard Kittel of his "Theological Dictionary of the NT" as translated by Geoffrey W. Bromiley. On p. 768 it is all there coming with "obedience" and I disagree with its definition of pisteou as "to obey" which is a heretical view.

Misrepresentation, what I consider one of the most evil acts one can do in this world. Whether it be misrepresenting someone else as something they are not, or misrepresenting yourself as something your not.

 

[Pisteuo]

amount and time of study doesnt matter. some people have been mormons for all their life dilligently studying and still are wrong

but someone can be saved for 20minutes and have it right.

And how does that salvation happen?
None of your group here wants to present it.

How about you?

 

[Pisteuo]

For mankind, salvation is about being saved from spiritual death. (Romans 6:23) In Matthew 26:38, Jesus said: "My soul is deeply grieved, to the point of death." Jesus was not saying that His soul was deeply grieved to the point of spiritual death, Rather, Jesus was talking about physical death, his human life. Jesus was not saved from physical death, but was obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. (Philippians 2:8)

Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.

Was Zacchaeus exempt from the gospel? In Mark 1:15, Jesus said repent and believe in the gospel.

This is not difficult to understand, but you like to make it complicated.

Repent and personally surrender your life to me,living a life inspired by such surrender."

That's the true meaning of Mark 1:15

No such thing as " believe in the Gospel" for salvation.

Stop spreading a false narrative!